Ayatollah: Kill all Jews, annihilate Israel, page 39
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ATS Members have flagged this thread 52 times


reply posted on 9-2-2012 @ 05:23 PM by casenately
reply to post by jennybee35


did you look it up....ANYWHERE?????

please do, I will wait.

what does (marg bar Esraiil) mean?


reply posted on 9-2-2012 @ 06:25 PM by Xcathdra
reply to post by jennybee35


Its all they have left when they can no longer defend those they revere because of their genocidal position. If we go back and look throughout this thread and others on similar topics its always a diversion / excuse and somehow always comes back to the idiotic position that somehow the US or Israel intelligence agencies are somehow behind it all.

Its like the thread dealing with Hamas intentionally targeting and attacking a school bus with a laser guided missile. That thread devolved into accusations that Hamas is actually created funded and controlled by Mossad.

This is no different and as you can see they are employing the same techniques in this thread. They show no facts to support their positions nor do they show facts that refute the ones that have already been posted.

I asked 4 simple questions and all I got back were vague answers that didnt answer the questions at all.

quivering mass of indecision.

Did the Ayatollah from 1979 create the doctrine that is quoted in the Farsnews article, calling for the destruction of Israel and death to Jewish people all over the world? - Yes he did.

Did Ahmadinejad give speeches that quoted the Ayatollah from 1979? Yes he did

Did Ahmadinejad call for wiping Israel off the map? Yes he did by quoting the Ayatollah and his doctrine.

Did Ahmadinejad ever take the time to clarify his statements, differentiating between Israel and Zionism? No he did not.

Did the current Ayatollah state Israel should be cut out like a caner? Yes he did.
Did he make the distinction between the Zionist regime and the people of Israel? No he did not.

When confronted with facts, they still deny it, just like Ahmadinejad does with the holocaust. - Ironic and yet the irony is lost on some.


reply posted on 9-2-2012 @ 08:02 PM by jennybee35
reply to post by Xcathdra


Yeah, I see that. I guess I have got to stick to my word and stay away from these threads. There is never any headway made, and the Iranian supporters can go on endlessly with the circular arguments and insults.

I think they must be very young and gung-ho..... blinded by their ideology and able to completely block out any evidence contrary to their unflagging ##snipped## support. Their ideas are so firmly entrenched that it seems they were raised steeped in hatred for Israel.
edit on Fri Feb 10 2012 by DontTreadOnMe because: Reaffirming Our Desire For Productive Political Debate (REVISED)



reply posted on 10-2-2012 @ 01:57 AM by casenately

This is no different and as you can see they are employing the same techniques in this thread. They show no facts to support their positions nor do they show facts that refute the ones that have already been posted.

I have shown MANY facts, all of which you HAVE NOT addressed. When you answer MY points, I will consider this a conversation. Until then you seem like a propaganda machine.
Techniques, still trying to project a sense of what? That I have some sort of agenda, Like for example demonizing a people trying to rid themselves of a corrupt government that does not represent them? Like you try to do in every thread? Are you an ANTI-MUSLIM? If so why should we even consider the opinion of some one who has written off an entire people? You talk like a skinhead.


Did the Ayatollah from 1979 create the doctrine that is quoted in the Farsnews article, calling for the destruction of Israel and death to Jewish people all over the world? - Yes he did.


I have repeatedly asked you to show me ANOTHER source. If this is indeed the case, then there can be at least ONE other source for your rhetoric. Yet you still can't provide another source. I have given you many. The site owner is an Iraqi/ Iranian that is not very well received in Iran since he is trying to push religious extremism upon a people that want democracy. He is not the voice of Iran. If you can find ANOTHER source, I would retract my statements. It is like saying the end all point of view in the USA is catholic America Press, or the national inquirer.
Not to mention that Iraq is Irans mortal enemy. Why should his opinion be given any weight? He is an enemy of the country to MOST IRANIANS.

Did Ahmadinejad give speeches that quoted the Ayatollah from 1979? Yes he did

YES, so what. The revolution that ousted CIA controlled government was hailed as a milestone in Irans independence from foreign influence. It has been quoted by many people, not just Iranians.

Did Ahmadinejad call for wiping Israel off the map? Yes he did by quoting the Ayatollah and his doctrine.


NO, since there is no expression in Persian to express that sentiment. The quote is referring to a REGIME and the PAGES OF HISTORY. They are openly against ZIONISM. If you look to any scholarly translation, as that is the standard we set for any translation, it does not say this. To try and say that the entire academic community world wide is trying to cover this up makes you seem like a lunatic. It is accepted far and wide that this is a misquote. Have you even tried to find another source besides 1 internet site? Use the THOUSANDS of others that negate this critical point to your argument. Unless you are so deeply entrenched in your hate of Muslims that you can't even consider that your ONE source is wrong. It is just common sense to get at least a second opinion. You have shown everyone here your ignorance in not even trying to find a scholarly translation. Are we to assume you are incapable of doing this? Or that you do not wish to? Please indulge us, is there another translation by a linguist, or scholar? Yes, they all refute your claim. Are you blind or just trying to blind us. DO not insult our intelligence by making us seem unwilling to compromise, since you have not given us reason to reconsider. You have lied to us. 1 internet site is not proof, if there are hundreds if not thousands that negate its mistranslation. Are you saying THE WORLD IS WRONG???? that makes you crazy.

Did Ahmadinejad ever take the time to clarify his statements, differentiating between Israel and Zionism? No he did not.

He did not need to, He never said that. It would be like Osama validating the claim he is not a US citizen by talking about a KNOWN FACT. He does not even try to argue against this. It is insane, and the world KNOWS IT.

Did the current Ayatollah state Israel should be cut out like a cancer? Yes he did.
Did he make the distinction between the Zionist regime and the people of Israel? No he did not.

He is always calling for the removal of Zionism. He is not alone in referring to this political entity as a cancer. The Zionist regime is not the people. That is the distinction. A political system is by definition already distinct from any people that may believe in it. If I am a Hispanic democrat, do you refer to Hispanics when speaking about democrats? would you need to clarify that? NO!

When you have scholarly translation, a new source, and the ability to refute my FACTS, and not me personally, you will seem a little less insane for going against WORLD OPINION. Is the world flat as well?


reply posted on 12-2-2012 @ 08:01 AM by Kokatsi
Problem is, I cannot argue with a person if they will not concede ONE SINGLE point after being PROVEN WRONG almost one hundred times during the past two weeks (incidentally, that is the timeframe when certain people have been whipping up a totalitarian anti-Islam hysteria to justify their bombing plans).

I guess it is like arguing with a spider that has a computer interface.
There will be arguments in verbal form, but that is deceptive.
IT simply wants to EAT.
That is all.

Now if the REAL problem would be discussed here (not this "wipe off the map" bull which discredits honest criticism of Iranian extremists), we would ask why Syrian murderer-tyrant Assad is supported by Iran's rulers as well as Russia? And, ditto for two terrorist organizations on the borders of Israel?

What I see is that certain people here against Iran's leaders are just as rabid and dogmatic as the Islamist terrorists are.
There is a miserly equality sign between some foaming pro-Zionist posters here, and their alleged bitter enemies, the extremist Islamic movements.
In fact, they both are very, very similar.

Which is a HUGE DISSERVICE to the people of Israel, many of whom do not approve their leaders' Zionist rhetoric - they were simply born in a country that many hate and wage war against. (So how exactly are they repsonsible for that? And how exactly is a Pal responsible for being born in a refugee camp where his parents lived all their lives? Can we start anew or is it all going to be this religious craziness?)

But I can see the point now.
Some people just want these two parties to be bitterly polarized and hate each other without limits, and even go as far as to wage a nuclear war - without regard to the rest of us on this planet.
They would not stop at LIES like the "wipe off the map."
They would not stop at Fascist marches and burning flags.

(Which is actually a sign of a collective madness - taking a symbol literally for what it means...)

Tell you what.

I would lock all of them hatemongers up all on an empty island, and let them fight it out among themselves.
Think Boy Scouts and Lord of the Flies...
but then, Roger Waters had the same idea back in 1983:

Floyd song

"Did they expect us to treat them with any respect?"
edit on 2/12/2012 by Kokatsi because: (no reason given)
edit on 2/12/2012 by Kokatsi because: spelling - add one question



reply posted on 12-2-2012 @ 08:16 AM by rottensociety
reply to post by nightbringr


Stormfront??!!! Oh please.... you obviously didn't read all my post before your ridiculous knee-jerk reaction - and it obviously was a knee-jerk reaction because you say "simply naming Trotsky as a jew" and I said no such thing!

But for your information, yes, about 95% of the Bolsheviks were Jewish. It's a fact. Go read a book published before the Second World War instead of all the false drivel you've filled your brain with.


reply posted on 12-2-2012 @ 08:21 AM by GogoVicMorrow
reply to post by Xcathdra


I really don't think they are intending to go after Israel. If they were to get the bomb, it might be for protection against Israel, but I think the real reason and the real fight they want is to return to dominance in a sunni/shia war. That is why they are backing Syria. Even though Assad is and Alawite.
edit on 12-2-2012 by GogoVicMorrow because: (no reason given)




reply posted on 15-2-2012 @ 04:17 PM by nightbringr
reply to post by rottensociety


Nice spin.

Here is a little article showing just how rediculous your claims of Bolsheviks being jews.

en.wikipedia.org...

Isnt it nice? Your accusation was used by the Nazis to forment anger towards the Jews and the Nazis idological enemies, the communists. Hence, Stormfront. Your brown shirt and jackboots are showing son.

You asked me to read some books written about it before world war 2. Might I ask you to provide a source? When i google "jewish bolsheviks", i come up with nothing but articles debunking your theory or blatant anti-semetic articles.


reply posted on 18-2-2012 @ 07:09 AM by Xcathdra
reply to post by SayonaraJupiter


In the speech he gave, he was quoting the first Ayatollah (1979).

So yes, Ahmadinejad as well as the first Ayatollah said wipe Israel off the map.

The current Ayatollah described Israel as a cancer that must be removed. <-- Explain to us what he meant by this comment.


Originally posted by The time lord
Wow what an irony, they don't find weapons of mass destruction in Iraq but their neighbours Iran is flaunting it along with mass destruction talk and army parades while shouting death to America and yet no one is going do do anything about it.


US did find Iraq WMD
There were weapons of mass destruction in Iraq after all.

The massive cache of almost 400,000 Iraq war documents released by the WikiLeaks Web site revealed that small amounts of chemical weapons were found in Iraq and continued to surface for years after the 2003 US invasion, Wired magazine reported.

The documents showed that US troops continued to find chemical weapons and labs for years after the invasion, including remnants of Saddam Hussein's chemical weapons arsenal -- most of which had been destroyed following the Gulf War.

In August 2004, American troops were able to buy containers from locals of what they thought was liquid sulfur mustard, a blister agent, the documents revealed. The chemicals were triple-sealed and taken to a secure site.

Also in 2004, troops discovered a chemical lab in a house in Fallujah during a battle with insurgents. A chemical cache was also found in the city.



Wikileaks released the information.. Or is Assange only trustworthy when the info harms rather that helps the US?
edit on 18-2-2012 by Xcathdra because: (no reason given)



reply posted on 27-2-2012 @ 02:47 PM by SayonaraJupiter
Originally posted by Xcathdra
reply to post by SayonaraJupiter


In the speech he gave, he was quoting the first Ayatollah (1979).

So yes, Ahmadinejad as well as the first Ayatollah said wipe Israel off the map.


What is the Persian word for 'map'? Can you find the Persian word for 'map' in the quoted text?

Here is the quote again:


Juan Cole, a University of Michigan Professor of Modern Middle East and South Asian History, agrees that Ahmadinejad's statement should be translated as, "the Imam said that this regime occupying Jerusalem (een rezhim-e eshghalgar-e qods) must [vanish from] the page of time (bayad az safheh-ye ruzgar mahv shavad).[12] According to Cole, "Ahmadinejad did not say he was going to 'wipe Israel off the map' because no such idiom exists in Persian." Instead, "he did say he hoped its regime, i.e., a Jewish-Zionist state occupying Jerusalem, would collapse."

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