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What is the best form of interstellar communication?

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posted on Feb, 6 2012 @ 11:40 AM
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Originally posted by Brother Stormhammer

Originally posted by artistpoet
reply to post by cloudyday
 


I guess I just see it differently:-
If a more intelectually advanced civilisation came across us - Maybe they would want to help us.
To mereley want to overun another beings space and spread one's own goes against Intelligence in my book
But heck what do I know



Have you looked at history? Or at nature in general? "Merely wanting to overrun another being's space and spread one's own" is something that every single species on Earth that's been accused of having even the most rudimentary intelligence (Parrots, Primates, Whales, Humans, Politicians...) does exactly that. Empire building isn't "against" intelligence, you can make a fairly good argument that it's one of the signs of intelligence. Any alien race that we encounter (at least any comprehensible alien race) will probably behave similarly.


Yes I have read history - seems empire building always fails at some point - Empire building most usually uses the tools of aggresion and dominanace but name one historical empire that is still around today.
Nature has a way of creating balance is all I see.




posted on Feb, 6 2012 @ 11:42 AM
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reply to post by cloudyday
 


Graviton laser.

Gravity can go almost limitless, and best of all you can track its source.

We invented photon lasers some time ago, and we are on the verge of Electro magnetic ones, "monopoles". Why shouldn't gravity be the same?
edit on 6-2-2012 by Gorman91 because: (no reason given)



posted on Feb, 6 2012 @ 12:01 PM
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Originally posted by artistpoet
reply to post by cloudyday
 


I guess I just see it differently:-
If a more intelectually advanced civilisation came across us - Maybe they would want to help us.
To mereley want to overun another beings space and spread one's own goes against Intelligence in my book
But heck what do I know



There is another possibility - "the body snatcher colonization plan". The aliens find these stupid backwards humans on a rare habitable planet only 20 light years from the home star. They want to have more creative minds to contribute to their own cultural growth. So instead of exterminating the humans and starting an alien colony, it might be more practical to slowly and surreptitiously genetically engineer the humans to be more intelligent so eventually they will be intellectually and culturally alien while still being physically human and adapted to life on Earth. Maybe that's what is going on with these abductions on Earth.



posted on Feb, 6 2012 @ 12:08 PM
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reply to post by cloudyday
 


Your making my head spin you sure are not lacking in imagination

:



posted on Feb, 6 2012 @ 12:13 PM
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Originally posted by cloudyday
What would it take for say 100 Mbit/sec? Could a laser send this information in a focused beam that would not spread beyond the receiver so it would not attract unwanted attention from hostile alien civilizations?


This is the problem with this and many other threads around here lately. The topic starter seems not to know the difference between science fiction and science. Why 100Mbit/sec? Are you planning on streaming YouTube from Alpha Centari? Even at the ancient 14kb rates we suffered at in the mid 90's, that would be more than sufficient to have a transfer of knowledge. Next, WHY would they need the connection? They are going with what I would assume to be an exhaustive knowledge database. I'm sure the new colonists do not care about what the futuristic Kardashians are doing...they are simply trying to survive and make their own civilization. By the time we are at planetary colonization levels of tech and knowledge, I doubt there would be too many breakthroughs that the colonists would need. It's not like they will be setting with baited breath for the new IPhone 100's schematics.
But the biggest thing wrong with this statement is the aliens. Why do you assume aliens would be living that close to us? Why assume they could even understand the way we transmit data and what it says? And why assume they may be hostile?

Even though I wish it were all possible, sorry this is all science fiction. And if we ever do see some super lightspeed or beyond communication, you better believe it's going to be Quantum Speed by Comcast and not for free use.



posted on Feb, 6 2012 @ 12:14 PM
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I mean seriously, can we get this thread moved to the Fan Fiction section or something. Body snatchers....really?



posted on Feb, 6 2012 @ 12:24 PM
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In FTL comms, wouldnt relativity be a problem?

Would you recieve a message two years before it was sent??

How do you overcome relativity?



posted on Feb, 6 2012 @ 12:27 PM
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Originally posted by artistpoet
reply to post by cloudyday
 


Your making my head spin you sure are not lacking in imagination

:


My therapist told me something similar but I don't think she was complementing me.


The main assumption is this: the only resource in an interstellar empire is an intelligent being that can generate a new idea for the imperial culture. Travel between stars will be too expensive for anything like trading products or normal warfare. So trade will be laser beams sending ideas between stars at the speed of light.
edit on 6-2-2012 by cloudyday because: (no reason given)



posted on Feb, 6 2012 @ 12:32 PM
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Originally posted by cloudyday

Originally posted by artistpoet
reply to post by cloudyday
 


Your making my head spin you sure are not lacking in imagination

:


My therapist told me something similar but I don't think she was complementing me.


The main assumption is this: the only resource in an interstellar empire is an intelligent being that can generate a new idea for the imperial culture. Travel between stars will be too expensive for anything like trading products or normal warfare. So trade will be laser beams sending ideas between stars at the speed of light.
edit on 6-2-2012 by cloudyday because: (no reason given)


I love imagination - I use it a lot in my art - Yes trading ideas across space with other beings would be marvelous.
I have not got the foggiest idea of how to achieve such a thing but that does not mean it is not possible it just shows my own limitations..



posted on Feb, 6 2012 @ 12:42 PM
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Originally posted by rom12345
reply to post by remembering
 


Originally posted by remembering
In one of the books by Stephen Hawkings he states that gravity is the one force that is felt everywhere in the universe instantaneously. This would mean that the delay problem would not be an issue.

Not sure if it's true(according to known sceince) that gravity is experience instantaneously throughout the Universe.


The speed of gravitational waves in the general theory of relativity is equal to the speed of light in vacuum, c.[1] Within the theory of special relativity, the constant c is not exclusively about light; instead it is the highest possible speed for any physical interaction in nature.



Einstein is proving to be real pain in a$$. This speed limit thing really puts the breaks on so many cool ideas.
edit on 5-2-2012 by rom12345 because: (no reason given)


The problem of FTLT drove Albert crazy. Google "spooky interaction at a distance". QM took the "spooky" out and gave a scientific explanation for it.

Check this out: davidjarvis.ca...
edit on 6-2-2012 by AllIsOne because: added link



posted on Feb, 6 2012 @ 12:43 PM
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Originally posted by gymbeau2000

Originally posted by cloudyday
What would it take for say 100 Mbit/sec? Could a laser send this information in a focused beam that would not spread beyond the receiver so it would not attract unwanted attention from hostile alien civilizations?


This is the problem with this and many other threads around here lately. The topic starter seems not to know the difference between science fiction and science. Why 100Mbit/sec? Are you planning on streaming YouTube from Alpha Centari? Even at the ancient 14kb rates we suffered at in the mid 90's, that would be more than sufficient to have a transfer of knowledge. Next, WHY would they need the connection? They are going with what I would assume to be an exhaustive knowledge database. I'm sure the new colonists do not care about what the futuristic Kardashians are doing...they are simply trying to survive and make their own civilization. By the time we are at planetary colonization levels of tech and knowledge, I doubt there would be too many breakthroughs that the colonists would need. It's not like they will be setting with baited breath for the new IPhone 100's schematics.
But the biggest thing wrong with this statement is the aliens. Why do you assume aliens would be living that close to us? Why assume they could even understand the way we transmit data and what it says? And why assume they may be hostile?

Even though I wish it were all possible, sorry this is all science fiction. And if we ever do see some super lightspeed or beyond communication, you better believe it's going to be Quantum Speed by Comcast and not for free use.


If you don't share information with the colony then why spend $100 trillion or more to send a spacecraft to start the colony? Also the spacecraft would probably take 200 years to travel 20 light years. The robot nannies that raise the frozen embryos will need the latest possible software for schooling them.

Besides as many people have pointed out to me, laser communication with a high data rate is already practical. So that's not science fiction at all.

If we want to explore another solar system, we might as well send frozen embryos and start a colony so the exploration can go on forever. Eventually the colony would be a full-fledged civilization with many good cultural ideas to exchange - not just a scientific outpost.
edit on 6-2-2012 by cloudyday because: (no reason given)



posted on Feb, 6 2012 @ 01:39 PM
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smoke signals



posted on Feb, 6 2012 @ 02:08 PM
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Was thinking smoke signals.


Anyhow, when are we talking about? now? 100 years from now? there is lots of theoretical science out there now that in the future may make our current ideas (frikkin lazer beams) seem like we are suggesting smoke signals.

a taste that may (or may not) pan out to some very interesting realtime chatting and such:
Scientists Teleport Info 10 Miles



posted on Feb, 6 2012 @ 03:26 PM
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Some speculation exists that entanglement could be used as a sort of binary code that could be sent anywhere in the universe instantaneously. The only hurdle would be first transporting of of the bound pairs (or many millions of them required to make messages).

No idea if this will ever come to fruition, but seems like a briliant idea.



posted on Feb, 6 2012 @ 03:31 PM
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telepthy/remote viewing



posted on Feb, 6 2012 @ 04:44 PM
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reply to post by nightbringr
 


binary code is all thats needed. with that, you can have the most advanced communication you care to have (considering it is the basic language a computer speaks...ones and zeros.
Get a processor in it and voila...instant communication in any form you choose...be it morse code, or virtual reality liveview

would make for good entertainment also...pay a few bucks to realtime control a robot on a distant planet wearing vr goggles for a hour or so.

I do envy the (potential) future's entertainment and abilities. if they can do even some of what we dream about...what an amazing world that would be (that they would of course just take for granted and not see the big deal..-shakes fist at them durned youngin's-)

edit on 6-2-2012 by SaturnFX because: (no reason given)



posted on Feb, 6 2012 @ 05:02 PM
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reply to post by SaturnFX
 


Yes, it really is quite fascinating!

Again, the major hurdle here is transporting one of each of the entangled pairs millions of light years away. It might make the potential theory of using entanglement as a binary code impossible if the means to travel such distances are not first tackled. And if they are tackled and fast interstellar travel becomes possible, THAT in turn could make entanglement communication obsolete!

I hope we as people survive, we have such a fascinating future ahead of us if we smarten up.



posted on Feb, 6 2012 @ 05:16 PM
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Since this is speculative;

Perhaps, if we ever get the tech to do so, we could "adjust" one of the mathematical constants of the universe.

Like PI or e, but we'd have to pick one that had minimal effect on physical reality, too (We wouldn't want a stack of Suns to suddenly go nova!). We could also minimize any damage by changing things by a minute amount.

Then a quick calculation anywhere in the universe would be able to "read" the changed constant.

(Shades of Dr Who's, Logopolis, anyone?)



edit on 6/2/2012 by chr0naut because: (no reason given)



posted on Feb, 6 2012 @ 05:34 PM
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Originally posted by Gorman91
reply to post by cloudyday
 


Graviton laser.

Gravity can go almost limitless, and best of all you can track its source.

We invented photon lasers some time ago, and we are on the verge of Electro magnetic ones, "monopoles". Why shouldn't gravity be the same?
edit on 6-2-2012 by Gorman91 because: (no reason given)


I don't understand lasers or gravitons. So what would be the advantage of gravitons over photons for communication?



posted on Feb, 6 2012 @ 05:51 PM
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Originally posted by cloudyday
Imagine some point in the future where Earth (and maybe a terraformed Mars) has as many humans as it can support. We discover an earth-like planet in a nearby star system, so at great expense we send a probe there carrying the minimal kit to create a human colony. I imagine the kit might include frozen embryos and robots.

So now there are two human civilizations. Interstellar travel is still extremely expensive but these two civilizations would like to pool their brain power by sharing information. That information might include scientific papers, poetry, music, etc.

How could these two civilizations communicate with a high enough data rate to share their ideas? Also how could they prevent other potentially hostile alien civilizations from discovering them?
edit on 5-2-2012 by cloudyday because: (no reason given)

Use quantum entangled particle pairs to act as (essentially and exceedingly simplistically) a transmitter-receiver pair. Thus the information can be sent instantly any distance and should anyone intercept the message it can be detected and transmission instantly stopped.

That's the answer according to current physics. However any space faring species MUST travel faster than light (nominally ie point to point). Quite how has not yet been discovered but when it is then the information transfer will utilise the same FLT mechanism.

This is why SETI has not discovered aliens out here yet. It is is still using EM radiation which space faring civilizations do not use.



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