What is the best form of interstellar communication?

reply to post by remembering

Originally posted by remembering
In one of the books by Stephen Hawkings he states that gravity is the one force that is felt everywhere in the universe instantaneously. This would mean that the delay problem would not be an issue.

Not sure if it's true(according to known sceince) that gravity is experience instantaneously throughout the Universe.

The speed of gravitational waves in the general theory of relativity is equal to the speed of light in vacuum, c.[1] Within the theory of special relativity, the constant c is not exclusively about light; instead it is the highest possible speed for any physical interaction in nature.

Einstein is proving to be real pain in a$$. This speed limit thing really puts the breaks on so many cool ideas.

Haven't scientists detected neutrinos that break the light speed barrier?
Just put a postage stamp on one of them and there you go
Sorta like cosmic pidgeon carriers

reply to post by artistpoet


I have read that this has been reported, however (according to those that reported it ), there are too many factors involved to rule out errors in the experiment and/or measuring technique, to disregard Einstein's work at this point.

however, I really hope they do find a loophole, to this 'killjoy' limit

Originally posted by rom12345
reply to post by artistpoet

 

I have read that this has been reported, however (according to those that reported it ), there are too many factors involved to rule out errors in the experiment and/or measuring technique, to disregard Einstein's work at this point.

however, I really hope they do find a loophole, to this 'killjoy' limit

Yes I hope so too - I am sure there is more than Einstien (though a genius) ever imagined.

Tachyons present another hypothetical means of superluminal communications.

One curious effect is that, unlike ordinary particles, the speed of a tachyon increases as its energy decreases. In particular, E approaches zero when v approaches infinity. (For ordinary bradyonic matter, E increases with increasing speed, becoming arbitrarily large as v approaches c, the speed of light). Therefore, just as bradyons are forbidden to break the light-speed barrier, so too are tachyons forbidden from slowing down to below c, because infinite energy is required to reach the barrier from either above or below.

Originally posted by hisshadow
and it has begun !

www.newscientist.com...


a diamond in every cellphone, car, plane, space ship... the begining of a quantum network is here

Thank you,
this could be the major leap needed for the next step of humanity, FTL communications.

If this can be made to entangle long enough to be practical, we got it.

and the data rate, don't even ask, if the pulses are 100 femtoseconds long, 1 X10 ^13 pulses can be sent every second, assuming one pulse carries one byte of data, that comes to just over 9 terabytes/ second. I don't know what the hell I would do with a 9TB/s link?

The means of communication are secondary to the information they/it transmits.
Technological advancement is not the measure of what a Human being is - The intention for it's use is a more fundamental question.

Originally posted by rom12345
Of course there is always the spice

I guess knowing information before it happens is the ultimate communication.

Currently the fastest form of interstellar communication that we human use is Laser induction.

For Example lets take the Rovers on Mars.

When Both the Earth and Mars are on the same side of the lag is about four minutes each way when the planets are on the same side of the sun, but can lag as much as 20 minutes each way when the sun moves between Mars and Earth as they orbit. The distance between the Earth and Mars can vary from approximately 36 million to 250 million miles, depending on their locations as they orbit around the sun.

"So if you try to drive it like a radio-controlled car or a slot car ... nothing would happen on the rover for at least four minutes" until the commands reached Mars, he said. "Because of that delay, by the time you see a cliff coming, you've already driven over it because what you see already happened in the past. As a result, we don't drive them that way."

But since we have no discovered that it is now possible to exceed the speed of light, this could change how we communicate over long distance.

Originally posted by artistpoet
The means of communication are secondary to the information they/it transmits.
Technological advancement is not the measure of what a Human being is - The intention for it's use is a more fundamental question.

The technology of communication would affect the nature of communication. Are we talking about telegrams that cost a billion dollars per character and take 10 years to arrive? Or are we talking about free FTL internet links for everybody?

Worm Hole Internet Protocol - WHIP. Whip it good.

Yeah, I'm still in a silly mood.

Communication would really depend on distances.
I'm not going to call your cell phone if you're standing right in front of me.

Same would go for interplanetary versus interstellar versus intergalactic communication.
For interplanetary talk, standard radio might be boss enough. It's cheap. It gets the job done.

From our sun to another one, well then we're looking at all sorts of crazy lag times in years, decades, centuries, or more.

Depending on what you want to communicate, there are obviously different mediums.

If you are communicating at light speed with a colony at a nearby star, obviously you set up laser transmission networks to ensure that not only will the signal be sent and received, any gravitational anomalies that might pass in the large space can be accounted for and the real message let through. If the Star was 22 light years away and Colonization a large task then the Laser Signal Networks come pre-built with certain commands and subroutines based on what could go wrong with the plan.

The 22 Light Year space could only be a 44 year ping between our Earth saying 'shipment ready' and the colony saying 'acknowledged and ready to recieve", they do not need to send what the shipment contains, that could have been sent ahead of time with the Laser Network to be in place at the destination.

The 44 Year Ping can be diminished with the pre-placed ready-to-send stream of goods, an 88 year long agreement to ship materials and personnel ahead of time would be utilizing the proper way to send, track and receive these signals as well as the shipments. However most planners would tack on an extra 12 years to make it a steady 100 year plan, some leeway with interpreting any incidents to repair any major flaws in the plan.

If every hundred years we need to make a new plan for shipping, both sides can have 44 years to talk about it and 12 years to Ratify the agreement and ready the materials or personnel to be sent. It would be a long time to a human, however on a galactic scale this is but a blink of an eye!

Originally posted by Sachyriel
Depending on what you want to communicate, there are obviously different mediums.

If you are communicating at light speed with a colony at a nearby star, obviously you set up laser transmission networks to ensure that not only will the signal be sent and received, any gravitational anomalies that might pass in the large space can be accounted for and the real message let through. If the Star was 22 light years away and Colonization a large task then the Laser Signal Networks come pre-built with certain commands and subroutines based on what could go wrong with the plan.

The 22 Light Year space could only be a 44 year ping between our Earth saying 'shipment ready' and the colony saying 'acknowledged and ready to recieve", they do not need to send what the shipment contains, that could have been sent ahead of time with the Laser Network to be in place at the destination.

The 44 Year Ping can be diminished with the pre-placed ready-to-send stream of goods, an 88 year long agreement to ship materials and personnel ahead of time would be utilizing the proper way to send, track and receive these signals as well as the shipments. However most planners would tack on an extra 12 years to make it a steady 100 year plan, some leeway with interpreting any incidents to repair any major flaws in the plan.

If every hundred years we need to make a new plan for shipping, both sides can have 44 years to talk about it and 12 years to Ratify the agreement and ready the materials or personnel to be sent. It would be a long time to a human, however on a galactic scale this is but a blink of an eye!

In my opinion there is nothing physical that is valuable enough to justify sending it between stars except for the initial colony start-up kit. After that, the only trade will be in ideas like new scientific discoveries, poems, music, etc. Colonization will be a way to increase human population beyond the limits of Earth. A larger population will accelerate innovation as long as there is adequate communication.

It's hard for me to imagine physical freight shipments between stars unless we discover the planet Dune and everyone want some of that spice.

Originally posted by cloudyday

Originally posted by artistpoet
The means of communication are secondary to the information they/it transmits.
Technological advancement is not the measure of what a Human being is - The intention for it's use is a more fundamental question.

The technology of communication would affect the nature of communication. Are we talking about telegrams that cost a billion dollars per character and take 10 years to arrive? Or are we talking about free FTL internet links for everybody?

edit on 5-2-2012 by cloudyday because: (no reason given)

What does FTL mean please?

I would suggest if you can interstellar travel, that you have found a way to go beyond c, so why not a carrier pigeon on one of you faster than light spacecraft?

Faster than light.

I always wondered how Star Trek communicated when they were in warp drive.

The whole thing doesn't make sense.

Originally posted by artistpoet

Originally posted by cloudyday

Originally posted by artistpoet
The means of communication are secondary to the information they/it transmits.
Technological advancement is not the measure of what a Human being is - The intention for it's use is a more fundamental question.

The technology of communication would affect the nature of communication. Are we talking about telegrams that cost a billion dollars per character and take 10 years to arrive? Or are we talking about free FTL internet links for everybody?

edit on 5-2-2012 by cloudyday because: (no reason given)

What does FTL mean please?

Faster Than Laughter?

Originally posted by nineix

Worm Hole Internet Protocol - WHIP. Whip it good.

Yeah, I'm still in a silly mood.

Communication would really depend on distances.
I'm not going to call your cell phone if you're standing right in front of me.

Same would go for interplanetary versus interstellar versus intergalactic communication.
For interplanetary talk, standard radio might be boss enough. It's cheap. It gets the job done.

From our sun to another one, well then we're looking at all sorts of crazy lag times in years, decades, centuries, or more.

Hopefully we will discover an earth-like planet suitable for colonization within 20 light years, because there are 136 stars. There must be 1000 planets and one of them should be suitable. So the maximum lag time would be 20 years. But if you want to ask a question you would need to wait 40 years for the answer.

It's hard for me to imagine a signal traveling that far and carrying a useful rate of data. But we are able to communicate with Voyager using that tiny antenna it carries - that's amazing. I wonder what it would take to send a similar data rate 20 light years? That might be enough to send important news and scientific discoveries back and forth.

reply to post by nineix


Thanks for that - Faster Than Light - I see - perhaps thought itself is faster than light - We perceive all through thought - all we perceive is thought perhaps

Originally posted by cloudyday

Originally posted by artistpoet
The means of communication are secondary to the information they/it transmits.
Technological advancement is not the measure of what a Human being is - The intention for it's use is a more fundamental question.

The technology of communication would affect the nature of communication. Are we talking about telegrams that cost a billion dollars per character and take 10 years to arrive? Or are we talking about free FTL internet links for everybody?

edit on 5-2-2012 by cloudyday because: (no reason given)

Yes for sure the technology of communication affects the nature of communication on a superficial level.
For example if we could communicate with other star systems what would be our reasons for doing so.
What is it we we would wish to comminicate - and why? sorta off at a tangent I know.

Naturally, i am strong believer in laws of nature and physics (whether i like it or not)..so at this point there is no way around the barrier of light speed.

BUT...i am seriously speculating and hoping that we will discover ways to transfer information FTL..and some of those speculations and ideas are actually borderline "spiritual", if you will.

One speculation would be that in MANY, MANY years...we actually "grow" out of our physical bodies and would be able to act and "live" on whatever people now call "other dimension", "other plane etc"....the result is we might discover ourselves as not really depend on our physical bodies and thus will find ourselves also free from physical laws.

This WOULD allow us to travel, communicate and exist in very "esoteric" ways, for a lack of better words. I also believe that, IF other beings/aliens etc. exist...they might actually be so advanced that they already do this. But it is so advanced and far out from our current understanding and technology that we wouldn't understand a lot of it right now.