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What is the meaning of the Universe if there were no humans/sentient beings?, page 1
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reply posted on 31-1-2012 @ 06:20 PM by Sci-Fi_entist
reply to post by dr treg
I've pretty much decided that "meaning" as a concept is just a human mental construct. I don't think there can be "meaning" in/for anything unless it is created/decided upon by a thinking being.
I've pretty much decided that "meaning" as a concept is just a human mental construct. I don't think there can be "meaning" in/for anything unless it is created/decided upon by a thinking being.
reply posted on 31-1-2012 @ 06:27 PM by Mapkar
reply to post by dr treg
That's such an interesting thought. I haven't got time to watch the video right now but I'm saving it for a later watch.
The questions about what the purpose of everything is has always been interesting to me. I've actually asked myself, what if there is no purpose? What if it's simply here because it is? What if "purpose" is simply a human invention that attempts to give us a sense of meaning to a life that would otherwise be meaningless?
This topic and discussion of it brings some important thoughts to mind. Hypothetically speaking, we're the only living organisms (that we're aware of) that are capable of higher thought and the ability to ponder such things as he purpose to life, the universe, and everything. We question our own existence, we question our purpose, and we question such things as ethics and morals. If we were to get the answer, and it really were as simple as "everything is meaningless" how would we react? Would it change everything if we found that the universe really has no purpose?
I really think the only reason people are around today is because we think we have a purpose. I'm not saying we do, or we don't. I'm simply saying, that without purpose people will loose the will to live because we know our lives will eventually come to an end anyways. Right now we think we have a purpose, so we survive and thrive. People count on us for something, and we feel as though we contribute to the world around us. When people lose sight of these things we see them fall into great depression and even suicide.
So to answer your question, the meaning of the universe does not depend whether or not sentient beings exist because in my opinion "meaning" is merely an invention of sentience for the purpose of fulfilling a need to have a purpose in order to not just survive, but to thrive.
That's such an interesting thought. I haven't got time to watch the video right now but I'm saving it for a later watch.
The questions about what the purpose of everything is has always been interesting to me. I've actually asked myself, what if there is no purpose? What if it's simply here because it is? What if "purpose" is simply a human invention that attempts to give us a sense of meaning to a life that would otherwise be meaningless?
This topic and discussion of it brings some important thoughts to mind. Hypothetically speaking, we're the only living organisms (that we're aware of) that are capable of higher thought and the ability to ponder such things as he purpose to life, the universe, and everything. We question our own existence, we question our purpose, and we question such things as ethics and morals. If we were to get the answer, and it really were as simple as "everything is meaningless" how would we react? Would it change everything if we found that the universe really has no purpose?
I really think the only reason people are around today is because we think we have a purpose. I'm not saying we do, or we don't. I'm simply saying, that without purpose people will loose the will to live because we know our lives will eventually come to an end anyways. Right now we think we have a purpose, so we survive and thrive. People count on us for something, and we feel as though we contribute to the world around us. When people lose sight of these things we see them fall into great depression and even suicide.
So to answer your question, the meaning of the universe does not depend whether or not sentient beings exist because in my opinion "meaning" is merely an invention of sentience for the purpose of fulfilling a need to have a purpose in order to not just survive, but to thrive.
reply posted on 31-1-2012 @ 06:32 PM by Mapkar
reply to post by schuyler
I agree with you, it doesn't need a meaning or a purpose to exist. And I disagree with Berkely, the universe has no reason to depend on an observer to exist. We cannot observe something that does not exist, and we cannot exist if what we are part of the non-existent thing which we are attempting to observe to cause it's existence.
With that logic, there would have to be a sort of seed at some point that would cause the existence of either the observer or the object whose existence is in question. If the object in question is merely existent because of my observation, then I should theoretically be able to observe a new universe on my desk here and therefore cause one to exist.
I agree with you, it doesn't need a meaning or a purpose to exist. And I disagree with Berkely, the universe has no reason to depend on an observer to exist. We cannot observe something that does not exist, and we cannot exist if what we are part of the non-existent thing which we are attempting to observe to cause it's existence.
With that logic, there would have to be a sort of seed at some point that would cause the existence of either the observer or the object whose existence is in question. If the object in question is merely existent because of my observation, then I should theoretically be able to observe a new universe on my desk here and therefore cause one to exist.
edit on 31-1-2012 by Mapkar because: removed a ridiculous grammar error.
reply posted on 31-1-2012 @ 07:46 PM by Osiris1953
Originally posted by Mapkar
reply to post by schuyler
And I disagree with Berkely, the universe has no reason to depend on an observer to exist.
edit on 31-1-2012 by Osiris1953 because: (no reason given)
edit on 31-1-2012 by Osiris1953 because: (no reason given)
reply posted on 31-1-2012 @ 07:49 PM by Osiris1953
reply to post by Mapkar
Quote is up there, rest of post is here.... everything I wrote was minuscule, and partially off the page... don't know what happened.
I disagree.
"A tree falls in the forest and no one is around to hear it fall, does it make a noise?"
We all see reality through our own eyes, giving us each a different perspective; we each have these perspectives because we have the advanced reasoning of a sentient being. Should all who have a perception or an understanding of what a "universe" is cease to exist, the universe would in a philosophical sense, cease to exist itself. Would it still be there, sure, but if nobody existed to experience it, it's existence is meaningless, and in a metaphysical sense, the universe itself cannot exist.
"A universe was created, if no one is around to see it, was it there?"
To answer the OP, sentient beings or none, I can't see a point to all of this anyhow.
Quote is up there, rest of post is here.... everything I wrote was minuscule, and partially off the page... don't know what happened.
I disagree.
"A tree falls in the forest and no one is around to hear it fall, does it make a noise?"
We all see reality through our own eyes, giving us each a different perspective; we each have these perspectives because we have the advanced reasoning of a sentient being. Should all who have a perception or an understanding of what a "universe" is cease to exist, the universe would in a philosophical sense, cease to exist itself. Would it still be there, sure, but if nobody existed to experience it, it's existence is meaningless, and in a metaphysical sense, the universe itself cannot exist.
"A universe was created, if no one is around to see it, was it there?"
To answer the OP, sentient beings or none, I can't see a point to all of this anyhow.
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