What Martial Art Is Right For You? Which Ones Are Effective? What Style TO Learn?

About 2.5 years ago are church started offering a program called ABKA (American Bushido KI Karate). I had never studied a martial art, and was skeptical at first. But i wanted something to do with my son, so we started up. At the time 36 and about 35 lbs overweight I was more interested in something to do with my son, and figured this would be easy and fun.

ABKA is run by Sensi Denny Holzbauer a six time world kick boxing champion, and holder various degreed black belts in several martial arts. He developed ABKA to teach a wide range of martial arts skills to novices and experts alike. Also he uses the program as an interesting and unlikely vehical to spread the Gospel. While fun, easy hasn't really entered the equation......

The program is a mix of Karate, (mostly Shotokan and some Koykushin styles), Judo, and Jujitsu. Also some boxing thrown in as well.

The first year and a half I trained directly under Sensi Holzenbaur...quite the experience.

I am currently a blue belt and should be testing for purple soon. If my aging body can hold out ...I hope to make my first black belt shortly after turing 40. Howver; I probably need to focus for 3 to 6 months on a condition program. We are getting into stuff that I can't do effectively until I loose say 20 more pounds.

I have learned quite a bit and done many things I did not think ( at least at my then current age and condition) I could do.

However; I will tell you that while I feel confident that I would do better in a street situation then I would have 3 years ago, I would still do my best to avoid it. Glock Fu is for that......

abkakarate.com...



What is "best" is what you can comfortably learn......

MMA for serious self defense. Although I'd love to learn Tai Chi, and for serious fun I'd love to learn a sword martial art like Iaido.

reply to post by ManBehindTheMask


No need to apologize, I don't have any real/extended formal H2H training. If you read the article you know it was information about fighting directed at (mostly) non-experts and did site multiple reasons/sources/examples for each claim.

I'd be interested in hearing why you believe they're all inaccurate.

I ask a very deliberate question,How often would you statistically find yourself in a life death situation(yeah ok helmand province afghanistan ups the anti im refering to run of the mill western world were i assume vast majority of posters exsist)?Its evident on this particular post that some posters denigrate PURE martial art forms and thier incumbent spiritual basis.Now then how does the question relate to what im driving at?Well ok fair enough if your in life and death then the more violent mma take no #,kill or be killed,'peace or harmony is for a wuss' philosophy .So like middle of baghdad yeah kill or kill but cmon is the doom mongering death cult martial art minus peace and balance philosophy really necessary in the mean streets of suburbia WE ARE NOT LIVING IN CONAN THE BARBARIANS WORLD NOW ARE WE?.So people who hate (not my words("this peace n spirit #")are or possobliy psychopathic or the nuckleheads that i have said on previous posts.Knucklehead being a violent person seeking violence for violence sake.In my book that person has no part of the true spirit of martial arts satans martial arts yeah but as regard contributing to the overall stability of community and positiveness noooooooooooooo .

MMA

I myself have practiced muay thai for 10 years on and off, and I think killer strikes and learning to keep an opponent away from you with a thai long gaurd and good foot movement is paramount and has saved my ass a few times.

One thing I wish I knew more about is floor work and ju jitsu. But if someone gets you in a classic headlock or takes you down just go for the balls and eyes ... this ju jitsu won't teach you

Basically I use a fence type posture when someone is intimidating me aggresively, keep them away with left hand on their chest area, right hand open by the right of my jaw, to catch punch/block head butt and return a fast hard straight right to the chin. So IF they went to attack me I would from that relaxed guarded posture either, left chop to throat, hard right cross or groin kick ... or what ever shot and many follow ups as was needed, thats If they actually went for me.

This has never failed me.

(I only use the fence/thai long gaurd if they are trying to close in on me lol, not all the time, as they could just grab your arm and break it, throw you etc)

6 Painful Things Nobody Tells You About Fighting
#6. Your Fists Are Fragile Flowers #5. Punching a Guy in the Head (or Face) Is a Terrible Idea #4. Kicks Are Useless #3. Your Opponent Knows What's Coming #2. It Takes a Very Specific Type of Person to Win Fights ... #1. ... and You'd Be an Asshole to Want to Be One

1.Your fists arent as fragile as this makes them out to be, especially with training, and most people who train in any type of striking art, have hands and knuckles tougher then people who dont........ex. Ive seen people shatter coconuts and other hard materials with ease and minimal damage to themselves.......

Also proper striking technique keeps you from hurting yourself....

2. Punching someone in the face is not a terrible idea........ending an agressor with a knock out is far better then breaking his limbs......proper striking placement in the jaw, or blinding a person with at well directed strike to the face can stop a fight in its tracks before more damage is done...

3.kicks are useless: Tell that to the 6'4 300 lb man thats rendered helpless by the 5'2 woman who just shattered his knee and his ability to attack her....or that just relocated his testicles from his groin, to his throat...

4.Yes it does take a specific person to win fights........no they arent an a*hole........they want to survive........if surviving makes me an a*hole then i think you can pretty much add 99% of the populace to that..


There I think i did that fairly efficiently

1. The best way to escape from a situation is to run !
2. We are social animals , we don`t know how to fight, and by law it is forbidden !
3. If we have no alternative to get out of the situation we use this rule : a) if the enemy came with fist we came with baseball bat,
b) if the enemy came with baseball bat we came with a pistol..and so one pistol vs machine-gun, machine-gun vs bazooka....and finally the atomic bomb and result will be 00000... this is earth and it is populated with so called humans ...tabulla rasa !!!!!

Originally posted by sabalsis1972
1. The best way to escape from a situation is to run !
2. We are social animals , we don`t know how to fight, and by law it is forbidden !
3. If we have no alternative to get out of the situation we use this rule : a) if the enemy came with fist we came with baseball bat,
b) if the enemy came with baseball bat we came with a pistol..and so one pistol vs machine-gun, machine-gun vs bazooka....and finally the atomic bomb and result will be 00000... this is earth and it is populated with so called humans ...tabulla rasa !!!!!

Except when you are going about your every day life and have NONE of those around to help you...

2. dont you ever watch nature shows? All animals have evolved to fight when needed to for self preservation, hell some even for mating........which i suppose is preservation for species...........even dolphins who are highly social animals, have been shown to be brutal animals when neeeded....

I find youre entire post, though wonderful in a perfect world, entirely false

With the exception to remove yourself from altercations when you can

reply to post by ManBehindTheMask


all the time I remove my body from a future altercation ! I use my space-time bubble to protect myself, I am 40 years old and I have not received a single punch!!

You can theorize all year long about what martial art is best, and which techniques work and which don't. The fact is that without proper physical training all of it is bunk.


Without proper muscle training for speed, endurance and strength you will stand no chance versus someone who has this.

Regarding one of the posts about a woman kicking a large man in the groin: yes that would be very painful, but if this large man moves faster and is stronger, then the woman will not be able to kick him in the groin. And even if she succeeds, it does not mean he will be harmless for more then a few seconds.

The same goes for muay thai, bjj, karate, kung fu or whatever. If you know the technique, but move like a lethargic snail none of it will get you anything.

I see many people training like snails, or not training at all, just interested in technique or say that they will use a baseball bat. In a life threatening situation whatever your reaction will be, if you want to run or fight you have to be better trained or better prepared then the guy who is trying to hurt you.

Even to run away you need to be able to sprint for more then a few minutes (which a lot of people I know are not capable of doing).

If the guy you are running away from is a better runner then you, then all you have succeeded in doing is turning your back to him and making his life easyer.

Besides that, all you can do is use your brain power to stay out of trouble. Sadly, using the brain is even harder then training for most people.

Originally posted by sabalsis1972
reply to post by ManBehindTheMask

 

all the time I remove my body from a future altercation ! I use my space-time bubble to protect myself, I am 40 years old and I have not received a single punch!!

LoL space-time, love it.............congratulations, I wish I could say the same , but it hasnt been that way for me...

Im a very mild mannered person, even more so when I drink, so bar scenarious have only happened with me a few times.......

My self preservation and hand to hand training all those years was tested years ago in a domicile in the big sand box......

Obviously it was effective.......thats the true test , and I hope no one ever has to be put in that situation...


Good on ya bud!

As an instructor in Ninjutsu for 10 years, I can tell you that for the most part the Martial arts don't work on the street. It does help to know anatomy though.

reply to post by Mccw2003


Thats silly.

If it hasn't worked for you, or your students, then that means you are doing something wrong.

There is a good chance you will fall into the category of the people I was talking about in my last post - if you train like a snail, you fight like a snail.

Originally posted by Mccw2003
As an instructor in Ninjutsu for 10 years, I can tell you that for the most part the Martial arts don't work on the street. It does help to know anatomy though.

So my question would be, if most of them dont work on the street.........why teach them?

And if most of them were ineffective , how did they come into being in the first place?

I dont think its so much the martial art as it is the mental state of the practitioner.....

Martial arts are effective, if the practitioner has the mental capacity to apply it in a real world situation........

The issue is training, and the fact that most people never have to face this situation, so when it arises they are at a loss........

If you train hard, and you train with intent and force, its not such a shock to the system to react to it when its presented

reply to post by fedeykin


using this same logic then it would be easy to say to you, (seeing as how you say , ya but if the guy is stronger and faster then the woman cant kick him)

Yes I agree its training and if you have read ANY of my posts on this board then you would know better....

However you are arguing semantics............same works for anyone else......you can have all your muscle speed training you want..........like you said , if someone is faster then it doesnt matter......

You are arguing moot points......

the point is effectiveness of the art and practicioner in general.........

Saying a woman kicking a man in the groin is ineffective "if" is a moot point

I can throw out a thousand situations to nullify any one particular situation........

This exact thought process is what makes me think many people posting on this board have absolutely NO real experience with application in real world scenarious

Being in the law enforcement realm for most of my life, grandpa, dad then me...I would have to say that cross training in everything you can, is the best remedy.

I earned my second dan in taekwondo at 17. Found out how NON effective it was for real combat situations while working security and loss prevention.

Since then, any person I meet that trains a different style, I work out with them. Learn what I can. We used to watch old training footage of the Gracie's Jiu Jitsu, before they entered the UFC's. We practiced on each other, etc. We took boxing, learned some Judo, Aikido, Hapkido and Krav Maga through law enforcement training. Just everything we could. What is the correct combination? I don't know.

I've put my kids in Karate with a friend of mine, as I believe you should start with a structured, traditional style. Build up a respect for martial arts in general. Rather than watching ufc's and trying that $hit out at a bar.

Does this make someone invincible? No,not even close. I've been beat down on some occasions, but never NOT had the ability to protect myself from serious, serious harm against even multiple attackers.

I think cross training, with legitimate instructors and professionals is the best option. I will be 38 this year. My current profession is significantly less physical, in terms of confrontation, but still work out with the different styles 2 - 3 times a week. I don't move as fast, but still can go if needed. I think my body is better off, both physically and psychologically, because of the multiple training philosophies.

.

Brazilian Jiu Jitsu- Hands down the most effective close quarters combat style that gives you the ability to swiftly break a joint or choke unconscious an opponent much larger then oneself. One needs to be mindful of the ground where the fight is taking place to be able to have a safer and more specific strategy

Wrestling- Gives your BJJ skills a strong base of balance and strength. Take downs are all ways a must to know for controlling someone is far more easily done from a dominant ground position rather then dancing around on the feet. A fight can be ended in a second with just one well aimed punch or kick, so even if one is doing well on the feet it might not last for long...better just to get it down to the ground. Overhooks/Underhooks are also a must to know, a clinch game is essential for better control of a dangerous opponent.

Muay Thai- If complemented with a strong clinch game from wrestling one could be a very scary person to get close to. Nothing gets your point across more then getting a deep underhook with the left hand until one can grasp the opponents clavicle, then grabbing on to the head with the right hand while driving knees into his face and sternum. Knees to the sternum are a great way to end something quickly, as well as knees and short hard punches to the liver...get a square punch on the liver, punch in, then push up towards the rib cage for a great liver shot.

Thats the stuff I've trained for years and I feel VERY comfortable in a hand to hand situation with nearly anyone...if SHTF this is the stuff that IMO would be the best for everyone (BJJ and wrestling making your body and hands like a constrictor snake while the Muay Thai gives one a deadly and precise attack like a King Cobra to inflict the bloodiest wounds and to allow one to get close to their opponent, which kicks right back to the BJJ and Wrestling)

Note: I've trained BJJ, Wrestling, Muay Thai, and Western Boxing for 5 years and competed in MMA and had to defend myself on the street. This is where I draw my experience from.

reply to post by PaxVeritas


I would say learn some kickboxing, that will teach you how to strike...then you need to learn some wrestling because alot of fights end up on the ground

reply to post by PaxVeritas


lol yeah I've been challenged a few times, luckily I never had to do anything, because they're buddies would step in and stop things.

I think I'm gonna look into Krav Maga, seems like a good one to learn to disable and then get out of there.

Originally posted by ManBehindTheMask

6 Painful Things Nobody Tells You About Fighting
#6. Your Fists Are Fragile Flowers #5. Punching a Guy in the Head (or Face) Is a Terrible Idea #4. Kicks Are Useless #3. Your Opponent Knows What's Coming #2. It Takes a Very Specific Type of Person to Win Fights ... #1. ... and You'd Be an Asshole to Want to Be One

1.Your fists arent as fragile as this makes them out to be, especially with training, and most people who train in any type of striking art, have hands and knuckles tougher then people who dont........ex. Ive seen people shatter coconuts and other hard materials with ease and minimal damage to themselves.......

Also proper striking technique keeps you from hurting yourself....

You nailed it. The constant use of your hands, shins, forearms, and feet to strike creates calcium build up, which both strengthens the bone, as well as making your strikes firmer (which means your opponent is feeling a hammer hit them and not a slab of hamburger).

2. Punching someone in the face is not a terrible idea........ending an agressor with a knock out is far better then breaking his limbs......proper striking placement in the jaw, or blinding a person with at well directed strike to the face can stop a fight in its tracks before more damage is done...

Also correct. The eye socket, nose, and jaw joint are extremely easy to break, and doing so will generally stop most aggressors in their tracks.

3.kicks are useless: Tell that to the 6'4 300 lb man thats rendered helpless by the 5'2 woman who just shattered his knee and his ability to attack her....or that just relocated his testicles from his groin, to his throat...

A kick can be a game ender is if you know what you're doing. I was banned from the bags when I used to train at our local dojo because I was constantly busting them. They had lifetime warranties on the damn things, but the act of returning them every couple weeks was getting under the owner's skin. Kicks can be legal if you know where and when to strike.

4.Yes it does take a specific person to win fights........no they arent an a*hole........they want to survive........if surviving makes me an a*hole then i think you can pretty much add 99% of the populace to that..

There I think i did that fairly efficiently

Again, you nailed it. @$$holes don't win fights. The person that wants that win more does. In a "real" fight, there's the threat of being killed or at the very least, beaten to within an inch of your life to where you're physically never the same. Unless you want that to happen, you're going to have to bury that fear, that reserved quiet, that moral code, and reach for the one objective someone has when they're in a fight or die situation: a quick victory. Don't think "I'm not gonna kick this guy in the balls, cause that's a punk move." Think "I'm gonna kick this guy in the balls, because when I do he's going to hunch over, and when that happens, I'm going to hammer fist the back of his head, where the skull connects to the neck, and end this fight in 2 moves.

I have the feeling that the rules this guy was posting, were from one of those people you were talking about in earlier posts.