American road and car safety.

Reply to post by thisguyrighthere

Here we go: stnw.nhtsa.gov...

What's in euro cars that isn't in there?

Then we'll be better able to compare vehicles feature to feature.


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reply to post by assspeaker


Well, I do rather european cars over americans, if we are not discussing things like this, but it's more to do with style than anything else.

And honestly, the american buddies are giving us that point, since most american super-cars that try to compete in Europe, are more design like european cars than the old american models.

but I'm trying to be fair and realistic. Truth be told, americans don't really need cars that handle like race cars. Most US roads are boring, straight and with very few turns. Even inside cities, they are all leveled out and straight.

In Europe, you have cities that come since the birth of countries, centuries ago when cars weren't even imagined, thus the roads were not built for them.

Here in europe we need cars that can make turns, and climb hills and go "fast" under those types of roads. Americans don't, 90% of the time.

I think you are right though, the standards are not the same, and all the details count in a emergency situation. It almost comes down to how much you value your life. Is it worth it an extra cost in order for you to know "I'll survive most crashes"? I think it does. Especially if you have a family to take care of.

reply to post by Maxatoria


Very good point.

I would like for someone from the US to give some insight on how cars have to be maintained in order to be street-legal (as in terms of condition).

Provably would decrease a lot of fatalities if cars would be held up higher in condition. Sometimes it is a bit shocking to the state of the cars americans drive. But I don't want to sound stereotypical, I'm only talking from what I've seen online/tv.

Reply to post by Tifozi

en.m.wikipedia.org...

Link to vehicle inspection info.


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reply to post by thisguyrighthere

I can't find any differences in your safety regulations compared to ours (on the first look).
How are your standards enforced?
We have the "Technical Inspection Authority" in Germany (TÜV) which performs quality control tests for vehicles. You have to pass their tests every 2 years. Big vehicles like trucks and SUVs need another certification that must be renewed annually.
I think cars older than 10 years must also pass the test annually.

Nevermind you just answered my question.

ETA:
I'm not sure it's the cars. It could well be the roads since our Autobahn is really in pretty good shape... at least that's what most foreigners tell me.

Reply to post by ColCurious

Could be roads. Where I am most are still dirt and in extreme disrepair. But that forces slower and more careful driving.

I still believe the difference is the driver. Most are oblivious.

Are there conditions that would make the typical Euro driver more cautious or alert than the US driver?

I've found around here people tend to drive better when immediate hazards are present such as lack of guardrails, narrow passages, ice or snow, many pedestrians, etc...

Perhaps being too comfortable breeds complacentcy while too much danger is obviously dangerous so a middle ground of difficulty is enough to get the drivers attention while not being so dangerous as to put the driver at undue risk.


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First off, sometimes shht happens and people die. Look at a NASCAR race... sometimes dozens of cars wreck at 140+mph and no one is killed. Then Dale Earnhardt hits the wall in a very minor accident and is killed instantly.

Next look at geography. Most people forget that the US is bigger than Europe. Most states are bigger than many European countries. Most counties in US states are bigger than many European countries. It would take you almost 12 hours to drive from Manteo,NC to Murphy,NC... from the coast to the mountains. Thus we need and demand bigger cars and trucks. Yes, you can drive a BMW that length, but doing it in a big ol' land yacht like a Buick Road Master or a Dodge Quad Cab pick up sure is comfortable. And out in the western US... you can literally drive a couple of hours and not see any thing except power lines and barb wire fences... take on the badlands of Wyoming sometime. While doing so, we came upon a point on the map that looked like a town...turned out to be a cross roads with a long closed service station, a single wide with a car up on blocks, and a horse out front. In Europe, most villages are no more than mere minutes apart.

And then there is culture. In the US, the car is a symbol of independence and a rite of passage. I can't speak for all of my fellow Americans, but most people remember lovingly their first car. Most people have cars as recreational vehicles and collectors items...whole sub cultures, cottage industries are built on the automobile. And because of culture, many Americans steer away from the safety devices of modern cars and trucks.

Just go to a car show. See how many people gather around a 2010 Mustang and how many gather around the real thing... a 1967 Shelby Mustang... or the '69 Comaro... or park a 1957 Chevy Bel Aire...tail fins, chrome rims with white letter racing slicks, two tone turquise blue and white....maybe a '37 Ford coupe...black with flames on the front... maybe it's a macho thing, maybe it's an American thing... but in 1012, those cars still stir the soul. Nobody wants any of those wussy cars they make now. Even the popular Mustangs, Challengers, PT Cruisers are mere shadows of the cars they allude to.

Movies...good ol' American movies. We all have our favorites with cars. I remember White Lightening.. Burt Reynolds running shine in a big ol' 4 barrel Ford LTD... or American Graffiti.... or TV...anybody remember Martin Sheen in a 1970s made for TV movie called The California Kid... how about the ZZ Top video hot rod...even after 30 years, everybody knows The General Lee from the Dukes of Hazard... still one of the best selling replicas on the toy car market.... still draws a crowd at the shows too.

Lastly, Americans are driven and impatient as hell. Out on I-95 or I-85, they are literally driving 75 plus miles an hour...out on the rural stretches of interstates...even a hundred mph is common. Throw in a few semi tractor trailers, a few little gas saver compacts... and BAM... mucho mass casualties.

reply to post by thisguyrighthere


In my opinion, the driver behavior is only important until the moment of the crash.

You can be the best driver and have a huge crash, and you can be a moron and never crash. I think that's not the issue related to deaths. Everyone can have a crash.

It's up to the moment of the crash that the manufacturer comes into play, and the fact that so many american cars go up in flames in a not-so-serious crash (most cars in that example in Florida weren't all that bad, but were burned), that is the real issue.

Most europeans would never put their butt inside a car they think it's possible to get on fire that easily. Why don't americans feel the same?

It's not that hard to accomplish. Harder things have been done.

reply to post by thisguyrighthere


the state where the accident happens has virtually no vehicle inspection rulesby the looks of it so i'd imagine some people will only replace stuff like brakes when they're completely worn out or the car won't start/move etc

reply to post by Maxatoria


Most of the people I know see auto inspections as a nuisance and a way the state makes money... not as a neccessity. Out here in the country, many farmers go without inspections on some vehicles if labled "for farm use only"...most have signs in rear windows or spray paint it on the tail gates.

Frankly, most people would not get their autos checked if no inspection was mandated... I know I wouldn't. I do the usual maintainance anyway... not for safety but to maintain the vehicle.

Since NC did away with having the inspection stickers in the window, there is no way to tell if an auto is properly inspected unless checked. I dare say many car owners nowv have outdated inspections.

reply to post by thisguyrighthere

I guess it's a mixture of all of the named factors. I'd have to drive on US Highways myself to compare...
But I agree, human error already occurred when safety regulations and technology apply.

Originally posted by thisguyrighthere
Are there conditions that would make the typical Euro driver more cautious or alert than the US driver?

I'm not sure... does unlimited speed make you more cautious?

Reply to post by Tifozi

Did you get a chance to go over the US safety standards I linked above?

If so, where is the indication that US cars combust on impact?

The days of the Pinto are long gone.


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Reply to post by ColCurious

It could. Speed limits aren much more than honor system suggestions. Knowing anyone could be out there going any speed could make you more cautious.

Even with posted limits anyone could and will be out there going as fast as they want but a simple mind will place undue authority on those posted limits and not expect or be prepared for the speeding nut flying around at 120.

Realizing that the world is basically anarchy makes us all more cautious people. Putting faith in signage and legislative action put the responsibility of our own welfare onto the shoulders of others and can therefore precipitate reckless or aloof behavior.


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Okay, this is biased as coming from a German driver going 200km/h routinely, but I remember some of those helicopter-videos of carchases with lines like these: "OMG, he's going 140!!!!!! *crash*"

As it was a translation I had to look twice at the video to be sure that the reporter meant kmh, not mph. Yes, it was kmh. And yes, that sounds hilarious to my ears that a driver is unable to hold his steering wheel at 140..


That was until I learned about the much more squashy vulcanised rubber used in us-american wheels than in european tires.

You see, the rubber mixture in tires makes an enormous difference for driving comfort and driving handling - a soft tire has more grip by low speeds combined with a greater abrasion. A hard tire lasts longer and can be driven faster but requires a better suspension system.

A soft rubber running higher speeds WILL go wobbly. It is as if I would have too less pressure on my tires, which would make my driving really much more precarious.

As long as we're allowed to drive ourselves, we will kill ourselves. And so says the law of retardedness.

But do not quiver in fear or jest in misunderstanding. The government knows we are unable to survive on our own, so they continue to construct an ever ending list of laws to prevent us from dieing........................... and then slap us with a fine for not dieing!

reply to post by Tifozi


I also get what you're saying however, this is not unique to cars made in the US. Only last November a similar accident occurred in the South West of England

M5 Pile Up

Again, with this incident, HGVs involved and it was their ruptured fuel tanks that caused the fire as well as them crushing cars which also burst into flames.

Well, I hope the reason for the lack of sleep was worth it.

Oh yeahh