Australia's Military Alliance With United States Must End.

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posted on Jan, 30 2012 @ 06:30 AM
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Originally posted by theubermensch
I saw our Defence Minister Stephen Smith's press conference on Sky News today. It seemed to be about nothing. He was talking about a review of our Military's ability to "meet emerging strategic challenges". Seems they are getting the taxpayer ready to increase our military budget.

I think this has alot to do with the fact that Obama was here recently telling us how lucky we are that he will be sending US marines to our soil in record numbers and we are strengthening our military ties. So we are obviously defending against the threat of China.

China is the reason we got through the 'global financial crisis' unscathed. China is the reason for our resources boom. China is Australia's future. Why should we risk our prosperity and the lives of our people for a bankrupt and desperate failure of a nation like the United States?

We are only a target because of America. We should be strengthening our military ties with China. It makes sense. We are the two powers in this region. Australia, China beats South Korea and Japan every time. Asia/Austalasia would be sewn up in the event of world war. Australia tips the scale bigtime. So why are we going to waste a massive amount of taxpayer dollars helping the bankrupt United States?? Its insane.

Instead of Marines we should offer China some land in Darwin for a military base and make sure they know that we are their friend and neighbour.Chinese immigrants are a large part of our population,the Chinese use our universities, they support our tourism industry,they invest here, thet create jobs here through mining, drilling, tourism,,,,, What the heck does the United States do for us? They make us a target. Not much else. We have no problem with them but they should keep their marines.


edit on 30-1-2012 by theubermensch because: (no reason given)


First of all, Australia and the U.S. are allies. More than that, strategic defense allies! China is a threat to everyone but China. There is a lot that goes on behind the scenes that most people don't realize. Most cyber attacks originate from China. But that's nothing compared to the fact that their new generation of missiles put U.S. bases in Asia in grave danger. Specifically, the Marine bases in Okinawa.

There is a reason why the U.S. is over in this part of the world, and I have never seen a single person mention it on any of the forums when talking about a military presence. The world's most important trade route is located over here, and ALL of the allies seek to defend it from those who would like to cut it off. If that were to happen, oil would cease, along with everything else. Of course, I don't need to spell out strategic placement to everyone, but as the saying goes...good fences make good neighbors. If this trade route were left unprotected, pirates and God-knows-what would wreak havoc, ultimately affecting the economy of the entire world...not JUST the U.S.!! China wants control of everything. In order to do that, all they have to do is control the money flow. To control the money flow, they control the trade flow...get the picture? Imagine a world owned by China. Is that what you want? Now, they say they're not, however, there is every indication that their buildup of military defenses and naval subs is saying otherwise. All it is, is just a bunch of strategic placements at this point, to send a clear message to China....which they don't like, by the way. If they're intentions were completely innocent, it wouldn't bother them so bad.

The Marines aren't going to cause any harm to Australia by moving there, and in fact, will enhance the local economy a great deal, (as just a fringe benefit). The Australian military and U.S. Military has been training together for years and years, both in AU and in the U.S., so the relationship has already been established.

The only reason for them moving there is to place a security contingency within range of important assets, but OUT of range of Chinese missiles. If Australia did not have the same concerns, they would not be on board with the idea. Of course, here again, there are many more reasons why it would be beneficial for both AU and US to have a small Marine Base located there, but you get the idea.

All I'm saying is, there's no reason to jump onto the U.S. bashing boat. It's not a bad thing. The U.S. and Australia love each other, so I'm not sure why there's animosity here, of all places. Every Aussie I've met has been more than friendly and welcoming of myself and other Americans. I have a great fondness for Australia, and that stems mostly from the people I've met who have represented her....I'm certain the fondness that is mutual has been directly affected by the same things on their end.




posted on Jan, 30 2012 @ 06:31 AM
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reply to post by theubermensch
 


At some point the USA is going to provoke a war with China and it's not a matter of if but when. Fortunately, it will be still some years away and unfortunately the USA is putting this whole country at risk. Ya think the USA cares? They will by the time it's all over because thats when the USA will be completely isolated from the rest of the world and every nation will turn their backs on them.

I can see Australia loosing 3/4 of it's population because of the USA in the future and we'll be taken back to the mid 1800s.

The American Govt can NEVER be trusted even as a friend and an allie; they have lied and swindled each and every friend they ever had; they have even stuck their noses in Australian politics at each and every election - and I don't have much faith in the British either.



posted on Jan, 30 2012 @ 06:31 AM
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reply to post by theubermensch
 


There is a reason why China is BUYING stuff from us.

That reason is our alliances with the USA.

Otherwise, who knows what a huge military power might do to secure resources from a smaller country.


Not to mention we have our own interests to safe guard with resources in East Timor and other Asian regions.



posted on Jan, 30 2012 @ 06:32 AM
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reply to post by daaskapital
 


I never said they have no money.

We have $14,660,000,000,000 to spend, what's the point??



posted on Jan, 30 2012 @ 06:34 AM
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reply to post by theubermensch
 


Are you suggesting that we should bend over and take it from our Chinese overlords instead of bending over and taking it from our American counterparts?
Because that's all that i'm hearing.

To be Quite honest I think you're either a Chinese Commy Lover, or a Terrorist who chants "Death to America"... Either way, the manners and decorum section of this website wont allow me to express my opinion of you Sir!
edit on 30-1-2012 by DaRAGE because: (no reason given)
edit on 30-1-2012 by DaRAGE because: (no reason given)



posted on Jan, 30 2012 @ 06:36 AM
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Originally posted by r3axion
reply to post by daaskapital
 


I never said they have no money.

We have $14,660,000,000,000 to spend, what's the point??

"they can not afford to put tons of money into their military."

That is what you said

I replied with "$10,090,000,000,000 "

This means that they do have money when you said they can't afford anything.



posted on Jan, 30 2012 @ 06:37 AM
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Originally posted by r3axion
reply to post by theubermensch
 


You're obviously not very up to date on China's stance.

www.telegraph.co.uk...



Iran is way down on the list. They dont really matter. China and Russia are allies. They could beat you. Right now they are just messing with you and beating you at your own game watching you slowly starve.Becoming more and more desperate and frantic by the day. You have to start a war. Its the only way out for you. You continue to devalue your currency and fail to address the rising national debt. Soon you will have to close your military bases because you cant affoed them. You already are. Its all over,they just havent told you yet. War is the only way out. And like I said,it will come down to who sides with China and Russia. Who will side with the United States and Isreal. I dont think you can win. Thats why I suggest Australia distance itself from you. You have the smell of death.
edit on 30-1-2012 by theubermensch because: (no reason given)



posted on Jan, 30 2012 @ 06:41 AM
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Originally posted by daaskapital

Originally posted by r3axion
reply to post by daaskapital
 


I never said they have no money.

We have $14,660,000,000,000 to spend, what's the point??

"they can not afford to put tons of money into their military."

That is what you said

I replied with "$10,090,000,000,000 "

This means that they do have money when you said they can't afford anything.


It's really not that fantastic of a number when you take into consideration how large their military is and the amount of equipment they are still lacking compared to us. The money would be loosely dispersed.

We have a smaller, but more advanced military, with more money to spend than China.
edit on 30-1-2012 by r3axion because: (no reason given)



posted on Jan, 30 2012 @ 06:42 AM
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you guys are lucky least your countries are bigger then UK it would only take 1 nuke and our economy is gone so is london



posted on Jan, 30 2012 @ 06:46 AM
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Originally posted by DaRAGE
reply to post by theubermensch
 


Are you suggesting that we should bend over and take it from our Chinese overlords instead of bending over and taking it from our American counterparts?
Because that's all that i'm hearing.

To be Quite honest I think you're either a Chinese Commy Lover, or a Muslim... Either way, the manners and decorum section of this website wont allow me to express my opinion of you Sir!
edit on 30-1-2012 by DaRAGE because: (no reason given)


geeze sorry. You hurt my feelings. I guess its not nice to make fun but it is kind of funny because Americans are so America [SNIP] yeah! for the most part and it seems to blow their minds that they are in such a mess. Its like they are all in denial. Its not like Im happy about it. They will bring the rest of us down with them. I just think the rest of us should face facts and jump ship. The reserve currency needs to be handed over. And I dont think anyone should back them because they will lose. In my opinion



posted on Jan, 30 2012 @ 06:47 AM
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Originally posted by r3axion

Originally posted by daaskapital

Originally posted by r3axion
reply to post by daaskapital
 


I never said they have no money.

We have $14,660,000,000,000 to spend, what's the point??

"they can not afford to put tons of money into their military."

That is what you said

I replied with "$10,090,000,000,000 "

This means that they do have money when you said they can't afford anything.


It's really not that fantastic of a number when you take into consideration how large their military is and the amount of equipment they are still lacking compared to us. The money would be loosely dispersed.

We have a smaller, but more advanced military, with more money to spend than China.
edit on 30-1-2012 by r3axion because: (no reason given)

How do you know what they would spend their money on? For all you know, they could have some kick arse weapons, because no one outside really knows what's going on behind the scenes over there. Look, i'm not anti-America, in fact they aren't such a bad ally, but i am saying that Australia should also pursue a relationship with China.



posted on Jan, 30 2012 @ 06:53 AM
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Originally posted by atlasastro
reply to post by theubermensch
 


There is a reason why China is BUYING stuff from us.

That reason is our alliances with the USA.

Otherwise, who knows what a huge military power might do to secure resources from a smaller country.


Not to mention we have our own interests to safe guard with resources in East Timor and other Asian regions.



The US is the only country I see running around the globe,exercising their huge military power. I see Russia and China veto on military action when the bankrupt Imperial powers want to go rape another country. I see China and Russia as having more sane sensible society. Im with them. And the Russians have more hot chicks per capita.



posted on Jan, 30 2012 @ 06:54 AM
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We don't do too badly for a small country with defense budget lol #3 on list



posted on Jan, 30 2012 @ 06:57 AM
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Originally posted by Sk8ergrl
We don't do too badly for a small country with defense budget lol #3 on list

That's true, but we get all of your service men and women who have been cut



posted on Jan, 30 2012 @ 06:59 AM
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reply to post by daaskapital
 
Yes but you have our flag on your flag lol so we share



posted on Jan, 30 2012 @ 07:00 AM
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reply to post by daaskapital
 

Well I just mean they would have to put a huge chunk of that money towards logistics. Supplying troops is the main part. They need to eat, they need ammo, they need reliable weapons, and other various supplies. Not to mention the supply of ground vehicles, fuel, air vehicle maintenance, ship maintenance and supply, etc. That's not even including the ships and such that they would still need to build and the cost of mobilization. They would have less to spend on a lot more.

I respect your opinion though. But you have to remember it's our governments who make these decisions. A lot of people on ATS have a very warped anti American view. They think we're all fat stupid war mongering hicks. That's not the truth, though. Some of us are, yeah, but you can't base the country off of some dumb people's comments you read on ATS. I'll be honest, I'm a little ignorant of your political situation over there, but I'm assuming your government isn't much greater than ours, correct?

I don't want to go to war with China, even though in my opinion, bias set aside, I believe we would have a chance if it ever happened. But honestly, I don't see a war with China happening. I don't think China at least, would be so quick to jump on the war wagon. They like to chill for the most part
edit on 30-1-2012 by r3axion because: (no reason given)



posted on Jan, 30 2012 @ 07:02 AM
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Originally posted by Sk8ergrl
reply to post by daaskapital
 
Yes but you have our flag on your flag lol so we share


That's true, although England didn't feel like that in WW1 and WW2

At least in today's world, we are all equal



posted on Jan, 30 2012 @ 07:03 AM
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reply to post by daaskapital
 





posted on Jan, 30 2012 @ 07:05 AM
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reply to post by Sk8ergrl
 
I have no problems with our friends USA cos my parents use to live there and my sister was born there



posted on Jan, 30 2012 @ 07:06 AM
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reply to post by r3axion
 


Our government is just a puppy dog for your government
So no it isn't much better. As i stated i respect America, and am not anti-American, in fact you came to our aid in WW2 when Britain would not, so i respect your country for that, even though it feels as if Australia had to sell it's soul to America in WW2. China doesn't seem to want any war, they are playing it smart, but Israel is the one who wants it, and the USA is their follower. So it becomes a very crowded situation.





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