This is why the occupy movement MUST BE STOPPED!!!

A few people doing something disrespectful doesn't represent the whole. Also, those are anarchists, you can pick them out of a crowd by their black clothing.

They will switch allegiances on a dime, and cling to any movement where clashes with police/government are occurring.

reply to post by popsmayhem


I did not serve in Bosnia, Iraq and Afghanistan as a US Marine for these morons. Yes I know illegal wars yadayada, but servicemen like me will be the ones defending your freedoms and rights one day again.

In the instances I just saw I see nothing more than hoolagins akin to European soccer fans out to cause havic for fun and not for any specific cause.

Listen you Occupiers if you had any real balls lets see you fight the police...Afghan children are fighting like men at the young age of 10 against formidable odds.

In this case IF I WERE ordered to defend the OCO'ers I would refuse that order.

Marine Sniper 3rd battalion...8541 (0317)

Originally posted by marinesniper0351
reply to post by popsmayhem

 

I did not serve in Bosnia, Iraq and Afghanistan as a US Marine for these morons. Yes I know illegal wars yadayada, but servicemen like me will be the ones defending your freedoms and rights one day again.

In the instances I just saw I see nothing more than hoolagins akin to European soccer fans out to cause havic for fun and not for any specific cause.

Listen you Occupiers if you had any real balls lets see you fight the police...Afghan children are fighting like men at the young age of 10 against formidable odds.

In this case IF I WERE ordered to defend the OCO'ers I would refuse that order.

Marine Sniper 3rd battalion...8541 (0317)

As everyone knows, fighting police is just plain dumb. Real balls is standing up for what you believe in, while faced with extreme adversity and monumental odds.

Originally posted by popsmayhem

Originally posted by JiggyPotamus
What u did thur is called a "fallacy of composition". It is a logical fallacy that comes about when you try to represent the whole based on only a part of the whole. Understand? My shortest yet most sense-packed post evar!!!

Thousands of occupiers there partaking
in the violence. This is not just 1 or two
people, wooooord? That is why Occupy
will be stopped!

edit on 30-1-2012 by popsmayhem because: (no reason given)

this agenda again? wasn't this tried so many times before the new year?

will be stopped you say? hahah sorry, too many people quit their jobs for this, there is no way back now..

You know what? Who cares about the flag.

Whatever good things it MIGHT have stood for, it doesn't anymore. All it is is a pass to exploit other countries and label it 'freedom' and 'defence'. And then take away the rights of the people who live under it.

reply to post by popsmayhem


THE PICTURE AT THE TOP IS NOT an American flag buddy... You should learn before you post... That is a brittish maritime admiralty flag... NOT an American flag.

Where can you find that flag at? In your local court rooms. Because it is the brittish that write their laws against our constitution. I strongly urge you to do some research before you go spewing BS on this forum.

If I had that flag I too would burn it, and probably use it to wipe my ass first because that flag does not stand for the united states of America.

There is no leadership AT ALL for the movement. As it sits right now, it's just a bunch of hippies in a drum circle wanting world peace and equality without having a single clue how we are to achieve it!!!!

This just goes to show how un-educated some of you people are... Getting all riled up over a flag that doesent even represent the united states. Get a clue people.

***If your righteous anger is burning, please skip this post. Because I'm not angry.***

Back on Page 4 I had an exchange with XPLodER which was all too brief. We talked about "'redress" and what it might mean to OWS.

I was left with the impression, and PLEASE correct me if I'm wrong, that OWS wanted to bring thousands of people to Washington to draw up a petition of grievances, get it approved by those assembled, then present it to Congress. OWS would then stay there, occupying, until bills to address their grievances were passed into law.

Have I got that pretty much right? If so, do you have any really rough ideas of what those laws might look like? i suppose there would be some tax changes, increasing the taxes on the 1%. Eliminate the Fed? balance the budget? Any clues what it might look like?

reply to post by L00kingGlass


Fire on them if ordered = NO (unless they were causing deadly harm to others,
rubber bullets = NO because they could take out an eye,
tear gas = YES
tazers = YES (except the anyone over 50
Cattle prods = Hell yes (j/k)

You somewhat contradict yourself regarding not fighting the police, yet making a solid stand. You cannot (IMHO) without the other WHEN you are being ordered out of LEGAL demonstration areas like parks etc...your only result is to fight back against the police. (this was not meant as an insult or attack BTW)

And I am no more RIGHT or WRONG than any other here, I just list my military experience so you might understand a bit about where my comments come from.

Sniper...

Originally posted by Feltrick
reply to post by PhantomLimb

 

Who represented us during the bailouts? The officials we elected into office! We have elected representation in office. They don't have to ask your or my permission to act on legislation, but must use their best judgement. That's the key when voting, looking for someone we think has our best interests and judgement. If they don't, then we find Someone else, that's our Republic.

This is far from "no taxation without representation." we have elected representation! If you don't like it, find a candidate you do like and work on their campaign, vote for someone new. Destruction of any property just costs the taxpayers and property owners money.

Oh, well, I wasn't aware that we elected anyone to the board of the Fed which has been doling out bailouts like it's candy.

Originally posted by marinesniper0351
reply to post by L00kingGlass

 

Fire on them if ordered = NO (unless they were causing deadly harm to others,
rubber bullets = NO because they could take out an eye,
tear gas = YES
tazers = YES (except the anyone over 50
Cattle prods = Hell yes (j/k)

You somewhat contradict yourself regarding not fighting the police, yet making a solid stand. You cannot (IMHO) without the other WHEN you are being ordered out of LEGAL demonstration areas like parks etc...your only result is to fight back against the police. (this was not meant as an insult or attack BTW)

And I am no more RIGHT or WRONG than any other here, I just list my military experience so you might understand a bit about where my comments come from.

Sniper...

I don't think it's a contradiction, I think passive resistance is perfectly acceptable when anarchists aren't there causing chaos.

Also, I really admired them for standing up to the police here:



Those peace shields were great!

Disinfo?

Lets keep in mind, the US Government are the same one's who brought you J. Edgar Hoover and his COINTELPRO. Planting people on the payroll who worked their way into the Black Panther Party, the KKK, Communist groups, recently even notorious gangs like the Mongols and Hells Angels.

Once a group is gaining steam, more and more sympathizers, and more media attention, simply initiate the government agents within to discredit them.

Brilliant really.

reply to post by theubermensch


Just to share with others. The Iron Heel by Jack London (in the Public Domain).

The novel is based on the (fictional) "Everhard Manuscript" written by Avis Everhard which she hid and which was subsequently found centuries later. In addition, this novel has an introduction and series of (often lengthy) footnotes written from the perspective of scholar Anthony Meredith. Meredith writes from around 2600 AD or 419 B.O.M. (the Brotherhood of Man).

Jack London thus writes at two levels, often having Meredith condescendingly correcting the errors of Everhard yet, at the same time, exposing the often incomplete understanding of this distant future perspective.

Meredith's introduction also acts as a huge and deliberate "spoiler" (the term did not yet exist at the time of writing). Before ever getting a chance to get to know Avis and Ernest, how they fell in love or how Avis became politically involved, the reader is already told that all their struggles and hopes would end in total failure and repression, and that both of them would be summarily executed. This gives all that follows the air of a foreordained tragedy. There is still left the consolation that a happy end would come for humanity as a whole – though hundreds of years too late for Avis and Ernest as individuals; the cruel oligarchy would fall, and the two will be vindicated and respected by posterity as pioneers and martyrs. (George Orwell would forty years later specifically and explicitly deny that consolation to his Winston Smith though he confirms it in appendix, and so would other later dystopian writers.)

The Manuscript itself covers the years 1912 through 1932 in which the Oligarchy (or "Iron Heel") arose in the United States. In Asia, Japan conquered East Asia and created its own empire, India gained independence, and Europe became socialist. Canada, Mexico, and Cuba formed their own Oligarchies and were aligned with the U.S. (London remains silent as to the fates of South America, Africa, and the Middle East.) In North America, the Oligarchy maintains power for three centuries until the Revolution succeeds and ushers in the Brotherhood of Man.

During the years of the novel, the First Revolt is described and preparations for the Second Revolt are discussed. From the perspective of Everhard, the imminent Second Revolt is sure to succeed but, from the distant future perspective of Meredith, we readers realize that Everhard's hopes were to be crushed for centuries to come.

The Oligarchy are the largest monopoly trusts (or robber barons) who manage to squeeze out the middle class by bankrupting most small to mid-sized business as well as reducing all farmers to effective serfdom. This Oligarchy maintains power through a "labor caste" and the Mercenaries. Labor in essential industries like steel and rail are elevated and given decent wages, housing, and education. Indeed, the tragic turn in the novel (and Jack London's core warning to his contemporaries) is the treachery of these favored unions which break with the other unions and side with the Oligarchy. Further, a second, military caste is formed: the Mercenaries.The Mercenaries are officially the army of the US but are in fact in the employ of the Oligarchs.

Asgard is the name of a fictional wonder-city, a city constructed by the Oligarchy to be admired and appreciated as well as lived in. Thousands of Proletariat live in poverty there, and are used whenever a public work needs to be completed, such as the building of levee or a canal. The Manuscript is, really, Everhard's autobiography as she tells of: her privileged childhood as the daughter of an accomplished scientist; her marriage to the socialist revolutionary Ernest Everhard; the fall of the US republic; and her years in the underground resistance from the First Revolt through the years leading to the Second Revolt. By telling the story of Avis Everhard, the novel is essentially an adventurous tale heavily strewn with social commentary of an alternate future (from a 1907 perspective). However, the future perspective of the scholar Meredith deepens the tragic plight of Everhard and her revolutionary comrades.

From Wikipedia's, The Iron Heel

reply to post by popsmayhem


The trouble with youth is too often it is wasted on the young.

reply to post by XPLodER


You are right, Xploder....no redress was provided...or even addressed...I see the spring as the time for blooming OWS movements sprouting up all over the country.....and, if the government thinks they can use their newfound NDAA law to strip the protestors of their rights, it will be like pouring gasoline on a spark.....I am 61 years young...and I will be out with them, too....and, we are LEGION.....

Let me see, dysfunctional government that is bribed and in bed with special interests at the expense of the greater general public. That's ok. Almost a score trillion dollars given to banks largely faulted with housing bubble collapse and shady wall street practices. That's ok.

A couple of angst kids burning the American flag after it's representation (constitution) is rendered a joke.....THE MONSTERS!!!!

reply to post by L00kingGlass


As do I, I by my personality and training tend to be less passive (for good or bad) when I am under attack or my freedom's being stepped on.

Take a look at what the last 6 months of peaceful protests accomplished... = NOTHING, no new legislation, no change in law enforcement tactics, again did I say no movement from Congress or the White House on anything...: )

I believe "LookingGlass" you and I have more in common than not, we just have differing opinions on how to go about it.

Sniper

reply to post by popsmayhem


I agree they are pansies, that run rather than face the police and show their full commitment to the cause...anyway what kind of weak-arse movement breaks into a YMCA...?

Sniper