The Coca Cola Conspiracy: The secret cause for the U.S. obesity epidemic

Originally posted by daskakik
reply to post by fulllotusqigong

 

There's always something. A not-so-convincing case that high fructose corn syrup is worse for you than sugar

After eight weeks, three groups of rats weighed essentially the same – the chow-only rats (462 grams on average), the 24-hour HFCS rats (470 grams) and the sugar-water rats (477 grams). But the rats that were able to drink the HFCS solution for 12 hours each day weighed in at an average of 502 grams, a difference that was deemed statistically significant.

So HFCS available only 12 hours each day is bad but any HFCS at a 24 hour convenience store is OK.

Right there were three factors considered:

Weight gain, Triglycerides and fat mass.

So he's not discussing triglycerides and fat mass.

But the both the male HFCS groups had elevated triglycerides, as did the 24-hour-HFCS females.

The females, although they didn't show nearly as wide a difference in weight gain, had much more significant differences in their fat mass (but only for the 24-hour-a-day HFCS group).

When the study was extended to six months, it turned out that it didn't matter much if the rats had 12-hour or 24-hour access to the high-fructose corn syrup - by week 3, the weights of both groups had diverged from the controls.

The article you quote gives only the first part of the study for eight weeks -- and leaves out the essential part of the study for six months:

reply to post by fulllotusqigong

I already posted the info and the sugar water rats did worse than the 24 hr HFCS rats and the 12 hr HFCS did worse than the sugar water rats. So in a single test they proved that HFCS is both worse and better than sugar. Seems legit.

The ones you linked don't show any numbers just conclusions. I would like to see just how much of a difference it made also why did they leave out the 24 HFCS hr group in following tests?

8 weeks is 2 months if HFCS is the poison that you claim then wouldn't it have shown more even proof of its toxicity even at that inteval?

Whoa! just when I thought I have seen it and heard it all!

Education people is the only way to keep yourselves well-informed.

Some people watch too much television and try to compare fiction with real-world events and that is just not happening. Coca-cola is alright in moderation for as with anything too much can be unhealthy or kill.

Obesity has several factors including heredity at play so fingering Coca-cola to be the culprit is ignorant and unfounded hear-say. I stand at 6' 3" and weight 265lbs of muscles not fat. When I was younger I was one of those buck 'o' five guys but grew up eating very well and exercising. I very rarely drink Coke or eat any of their products and do not crave sugar.

Blame lack of exercise and lifestyle changes if anything. We Americans live fast lifestyles and we are constantly on-the-go with little time to properly eat and exercise.

Next thing you know someone will post up a thread saying that Coca-cola has manipulated the "fat gene" and has turned it on for all Americans who drink or consume Coca-cola products.

How do you think people will feel after drinking the original coca cola formula that includes five ounces of coca leaf per gallon of syrup. Maybe you feel like new after drinking that.

They say that Coca-Cola is coc aine-free, but how do you extract coc aine from a coca leaf?

-------------------
In the United States, the Stepan Company is the only manufacturing plant authorized by the Federal Government to import and process the coca plant,[30] which it obtains mainly from Peru and, to a lesser extent, Bolivia.
--------------------

Originally posted by daskakik

Originally posted by fulllotusqigong
Haha. You said you stopped reading after he compared soda to drinking a pizza. If you read further he compares soda to "sweet and sour" Chinese food. He says the salt hides the sweetness in Chinese food just as it does in soda.

So the sodium is both to make the person thirstier and to hide the sweetness.

I realize you're practicing willful ignorance by not listening to the science lecture -- so I have to repeat it for you. haha.

But the amount is not enough to do either. Do you realize what a small amount of salt is being discussed. If you are repeating what was in the vid then I guessed right it was the same old inaccurate info that pops up over and over.

I already posted info where the Princeton group's results are suspect. I just drank a made up glass of water with 55 mg of salt took a sip and couldn't even taste it. Added a teaspoon of sugar and tasted quite sweet. You keep listening the the experts though.

Here's info on the dish
2 tablespoons of this sauce has 350 mg of sodium and 13 grams of sugar and even that anount of salt doesn't cover the sweetness in the sauce

The figures you give is not for the sauce -- but the dish which includes the meat, etc.

As for what causes the thirst in a can of coke -- what makes you thirstier -- sugar or salt?

The HFCS is actually what makes your thirstier in a coke

It's the salt that hides the HFCS sweetness. Sure it's sweet still -- just as Sweet and Sour is still sweet. haha.

Originally posted by maestromason
Whoa! just when I thought I have seen it and heard it all!

Education people is the only way to keep yourselves well-informed.

Some people watch too much television and try to compare fiction with real-world events and that is just not happening. Coca-cola is alright in moderation for as with anything too much can be unhealthy or kill.

Obesity has several factors including heredity at play so fingering Coca-cola to be the culprit is ignorant and unfounded hear-say. I stand at 6' 3" and weight 265lbs of muscles not fat. When I was younger I was one of those buck 'o' five guys but grew up eating very well and exercising. I very rarely drink Coke or eat any of their products and do not crave sugar.

Blame lack of exercise and lifestyle changes if anything. We Americans live fast lifestyles and we are constantly on-the-go with little time to properly east and exercise.

Next thing you know someone will post up a thread saying that Coca-cola has manipulated the "fat gene" and has turned it on for all Americans who drink or consume Coca-cola products.

Coke is just the most blatant form of HFCS in the diet.

So the real issue is High Fructose Corn Syrup.

What you refer to as the "Fat Gene" is actually the hormone leptin that is turned off by HFCS:

Now enter the hormone leptin. Leptin is one of the main hormones regulating appetite. I like to state that leptin lowers your appetite. Several recent studies revealed a diet high in HFCS increased the level of triglycerides, which blocked the brain’s response to leptin. Therefore, if your body becomes insensitive to leptin, and in fact, develops a leptin resistance, the brain will continue to signal your body it needs more food and continue to store fat. Judith Altarejos, Ph.D. a researcher at Scripps states “obesity results when the brain becomes ‘deaf’ to the leptin signals.” If your brain is continuing to tell you to eat, you will have a hard time losing weight.

Originally posted by lke123
How do you think people will feel after drinking the original coca cola formula that includes five ounces of coca leaf per gallon of syrup. Maybe you feel like new after drinking that.

They say that Coca-Cola is coc aine-free, but how do you extract coc aine from a coca leaf?

-------------------
In the United States, the Stepan Company is the only manufacturing plant authorized by the Federal Government to import and process the coca plant,[30] which it obtains mainly from Peru and, to a lesser extent, Bolivia.
--------------------

First off you have many different estruses of Coca depending on climate, altitude, soil conditions, ect so as with any plant species results may vary. The process involves adding several different solvents to extract the active-compound ingredient from the various inactive ingredients but what does that have to do with modern day Coca-Cola?

There is no coc aine in Coca-Cola says the FDA who regulates the food industry as well as several independent labs.

reply to post by fulllotusqigong

The quote was

When was the last time you went to a Chinese restaurant and had sweet and sour pork?

Not just sauce.

Well I tested it and don't see a difference so you keep on believing youtube videos and I will trust my senses. I posted info that shows the other side to the hyperbole that exists in this type of videos for whoever stumbles upon it.

Take care.

daskakik, you would be surprised by how many people believe those youtube vids.

Too many people with vivid imaginations wanting to jedi mind trick and mind-meld the BS to other people.

Originally posted by daskakik
reply to post by fulllotusqigong

 

The quote was

When was the last time you went to a Chinese restaurant and had sweet and sour pork?

Not just sauce.

Well I tested it and don't see a difference so you keep on believing youtube videos and I will trust my senses. I posted info that shows the other side to the hyperbole that exists in this type of videos for whoever stumbles upon it.

Take care.

edit on 28-1-2012 by daskakik because: (no reason given)

Meanwhile the NY Times article considers that Dr. Lustig's science lecture on fructose may even been under-stated -- since cancer was not included.

And if you take that sugar in liquid form — soda or fruit juices — the fructose and glucose will hit the liver more quickly than if you consume them, say, in an apple (or several apples, to get what researchers would call the equivalent dose of sugar). The speed with which the liver has to do its work will also affect how it metabolizes the fructose and glucose. In animals, or at least in laboratory rats and mice, it’s clear that if the fructose hits the liver in sufficient quantity and with sufficient speed, the liver will convert much of it to fat. This apparently induces a condition known as insulin resistance, which is now considered the fundamental problem in obesity, and the underlying defect in heart disease and in the type of diabetes, type 2, that is common to obese and overweight individuals. It might also be the underlying defect in many cancers.

reply to post by fulllotusqigong


This was interesting information and brought out a few interesting comments. Thanks.

Fact: Coke is not good for you.

Fact: Coke makes a lot of money off you.

Fact: Coke has no interest in killing you.

Fact: You are free to abstain from Coke.

After all, Coke is JUNK FOOD. Why is this guy telling everyone what they already know? Coke isn't really food, its a play thing, and it's meant to taste good. If stupid people decide it's a substitute for healthy food, WHO CARES!? It's not as though grocery stores REFUSE to carry healthy items-- it's that stupid people only buy junk food-- and thus become even stupider.

Oh sure... Big Soda is TRYING to kill you...you wouldn't be caught dead drinking the sugary concoction just because it tastes good...

reply to post by fulllotusqigong

I never said fructose was good in large amounts just that HFCS isn't really worse than other sugars with similar fructose contents and that sodium in tens of mgs in a 12 ounce serving doesn't make you thirsty.

Isnt coca cola hq'd in a state with the georgia guidestones!!!!

Its one Of the oldest dow stocks i think

Originally posted by Infrasilent
Oh sure... Big Soda is TRYING to kill you...you wouldn't be caught dead drinking the sugary concoction just because it tastes good...

True. I pointed out some people I know that add sugar to everything. My father in law can make fresh OJ which already has alot of fructose and still add 1.5-2 tablespoons of sugar to the glass before drinking.

Originally posted by k1k1to
reply to post by fulllotusqigong

 

what about all the fat people that arent "genetically" pre disposed to be fat...and they dont drink any sodas and are still fat?

i know a couple of people who are about 50-70 lbs overweight, and theyve never touched a soda in their lives..

i dont thing sugar is the only culprit for obesity

Just start looking a product labels i have found high fructose corn sugar hidden in the contents of many products even hot-dogs and deli turkey
HFCS is not as sweet as cane or beet sugar so they use more of it and the calories from this amount of HFCS is about 15 to 20% higher then cane sugar.

reply to post by ANNED

According to this Relative Sweetness Scale it is sweeter than sucrose.

Originally posted by Infrasilent
Fact: Coke is not good for you.

Fact: Coke makes a lot of money off you.

Fact: Coke has no interest in killing you.

Fact: You are free to abstain from Coke.

After all, Coke is JUNK FOOD. Why is this guy telling everyone what they already know? Coke isn't really food, its a play thing, and it's meant to taste good. If stupid people decide it's a substitute for healthy food, WHO CARES!? It's not as though grocery stores REFUSE to carry healthy items-- it's that stupid people only buy junk food-- and thus become even stupider.

Oh sure... Big Soda is TRYING to kill you...you wouldn't be caught dead drinking the sugary concoction just because it tastes good...

Yeah this thread has a lot of info on it -- HFCS is worse than coc aine in how it causes addiction.

So it's a highly addictive drug that causes diabetes, hypertension, obesity, plaque in the arteries, and cancer.

Since it's in liquid form and cheap HFCS is put in everything.

The sodium taste in the soda hides the sweetness of the high amount of HFCS.

The sugar and salt make your thirstier and worst of all fructose does not activate leptin -- so the body never gets satiated and wants more and more.

So there's the dopamine addiction, the suppression of leptin by the triglycerides, and the rapid fat gain.

reply to post by fulllotusqigong


I am one of the lucky that totally escaped the clutches of coke and all its other coloured brothers and sisters. It was quit funny when my daugher (who also only got to know about coke through friends) was 6 years old, she asked the mother of the birthday girl at a party if she can please have some purple coke (fanta) cause she did not know they all had different names.

We still don't drink any fizzy drinks, and now at 12 my daughter refuses to have them too. I allowed her to look up the truth about coke on the net and she makes great choices!

Anyway, I really wanted to emphasise the disgusting hidden negative effects of coke, but instead, I will post this very short vid which explains it all:

Coke/Pepsi as pesticide

You decide if you gonna help them dumb you down, cause autism, ADHD (and all the lovely new sick varieties of illnesses) in your coming offspring.

We can heal this planet by cleaning up our eating act. Seriously.

Originally posted by daskakik
reply to post by ANNED

 

According to this Relative Sweetness Scale it is sweeter than sucrose.

edit on 28-1-2012 by daskakik because: (no reason given)

On Coke with sugar versus Coke with HFCS

My friends and I did a highly scientific double-blind taste test using HFCS Coke and sugar Coke. The tastes were VERY similar, though all of us could tell a difference in a side-by-side comparison. But we couldn't tell which was which. In the end we determined that the HFCS has a very slight saltiness to it and it very slightly less sweet. To us they basically tasted the same though I enjoyed the HFCS version slightly better. If they weren't side-by-side though, I couldn't have told them apart.