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Jesus, the members only Club, only members allowed

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posted on Jan, 23 2012 @ 12:21 PM
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Why does everyone seem to want to own Jesus? Isn't it better if we just realize that he owns us? I am getting tired of this member’s only club, full of self righteous members. Jesus only loves and saves those who love him. What is wrong with all of you? When will you start to love your neighbor and your enemies? Jesus isn’t looking for your membership card, what he is looking for is for you to show love to the world so that they might see Jesus working in you.



1 Corinthians 6:19-20 19 Do you not know that your bodies are temples of the Holy Spirit, who is in you, whom you have received from God? You are not your own; 20 you were bought at a price. Therefore honor God with your bodies.


Do you think if you are full of self righteousness and Judgment that Jesus is working in you? Do you really believe that condemning someone to hell proves that Jesus is working in you? Do you think you are self righteous without sin, or that you have done something more deserving of heaven than anyone else?

When will you listen to Jesus so he can work in you?




1 John 4:7-15 7 Dear friends let us love one another, for love comes from God. EVERYONE WHO LOVES has been born of God and knows God. 8 Whoever does not love does not know God, because God is love.


Everyone who loves is born of God. God is love, without God man cannot know love. What does this mean? Many non Christians are loving, how do you explain this verse?



Mathew 7:1-2 1 “Do not judge, or you too will be judged. 2 For in the same way you judge others, you will be judged, and with the measure you use, it will be measured to you.

John 13:34 A new commandment I give to you, that you love one another: just as I have loved you, you also are to love one another.


When are you going to listen, stop judging and start loving. All who love are born of God. EVERYONE WHO LOVES IS BORN OF GOD, Therefore they are all YOUR BROTHER.



Colossians 3:11 Here there is not Greek and Jew, circumcised and uncircumcised, barbarian, Scythian, slave, free; but CHRIST IS ALL, AND IN ALL.




1 John 2:11 But whoever hates his brother is in the darkness and walks in the darkness, and does not know where he is going, because the darkness has blinded his eyes.


Christ is in all. Stop walking around in the darkness, Jesus loves us all. Wake up so you can see and learn to love your brother, ALL OF THEM



Mathew 12:32 Anyone who speaks a word against the Son of Man will be forgiven, but anyone who speaks against the Holy Spirit will not be forgiven, either in this age or in the age to come.

Luke 23:24 Jesus said, "Father, forgive them, for they do not know what they are doing." And they divided up his clothes by casting lots.


Do you see here that Jesus says clearly that you WILL BE FORGIVEN for speaking against the son of man? Then he forgives the ones who not only did not believe him but crucified him.



1 John 4:18 there is no fear in love. But perfect love drives out fear, because fear has to do with punishment. The one who fears is not made perfect in love.


Stop spreading the doctrine of fear, hate and judgment so you can be made perfect in love.



Mark 7:13 Thus you nullify the word of God by your tradition that you have handed down. And you do many things like that.


Start listening to God, pick up the bible and read it for yourself, stop following the traditions that have been handed down to you, from the church that loves your money more than your salvation.



Mathew 7:5 You hypocrite, first take the plank out of your own eye, and then you will see clearly to remove the speck from your brother's eye.

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posted on Jan, 23 2012 @ 12:28 PM
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Originally posted by sacgamer25
Why does everyone seem to want to own Jesus? Isn't it better if we just realize that he owns us? I am getting tired of this member’s only club, full of self righteous members. Jesus only loves and saves those who love him. What is wrong with all of you? When will you start to love your neighbor and your enemies? Jesus isn’t looking for your membership card, what he is looking for is for you to show love to the world so that they might see Jesus working in you.



1 Corinthians 6:19-20 19 Do you not know that your bodies are temples of the Holy Spirit, who is in you, whom you have received from God? You are not your own; 20 you were bought at a price. Therefore honor God with your bodies.


Do you think if you are full of self righteousness and Judgment that Jesus is working in you? Do you really believe that condemning someone to hell proves that Jesus is working in you? Do you think you are self righteous without sin, or that you have done something more deserving of heaven than anyone else?

When will you listen to Jesus so he can work in you?




1 John 4:7-15 7 Dear friends let us love one another, for love comes from God. EVERYONE WHO LOVES has been born of God and knows God. 8 Whoever does not love does not know God, because God is love.


Everyone who loves is born of God. God is love, without God man cannot know love. What does this mean? Many non Christians are loving, how do you explain this verse?



Mathew 7:1-2 1 “Do not judge, or you too will be judged. 2 For in the same way you judge others, you will be judged, and with the measure you use, it will be measured to you.

John 13:34 A new commandment I give to you, that you love one another: just as I have loved you, you also are to love one another.


When are you going to listen, stop judging and start loving. All who love are born of God. EVERYONE WHO LOVES IS BORN OF GOD, Therefore they are YOUR BROTHER.



1 John 2:11 But whoever hates his brother is in the darkness and walks in the darkness, and does not know where he is going, because the darkness has blinded his eyes.


Stop walking around in the darkness, Jesus loves us all. Wake up so you can see.



Mathew 12:32 Anyone who speaks a word against the Son of Man will be forgiven, but anyone who speaks against the Holy Spirit will not be forgiven, either in this age or in the age to come.

Luke 23:24 Jesus said, "Father, forgive them, for they do not know what they are doing." And they divided up his clothes by casting lots.


Do you see here that Jesus says clearly that you WILL BE FORGIVEN for speaking against the son of man? Then he forgives the ones who not only did not believe him but crucified him.



1 John 4:18 there is no fear in love. But perfect love drives out fear, because fear has to do with punishment. The one who fears is not made perfect in love.


Stop spreading the doctrine of fear, hate and judgment so you can be made perfect in love.



Mark 7:13 Thus you nullify the word of God by your tradition that you have handed down. And you do many things like that.


Start listening to God, pick up the bible and read it for yourself, stop following the traditions that have been handed down to you, from the church that loves your money more than your salvation.



Mathew 7:5 You hypocrite, first take the plank out of your own eye, and then you will see clearly to remove the speck from your brother's eye.

edit on 23-1-2012 by sacgamer25 because: (no reason given)


I see that someone both knows and does not know their Bible...Jesus is not OWNED by people...they simply take the legend of his very personal offer to heart. It is impressed upon us as children that his sacrifice was intended for each and every one of us, as a gift to mankind both as individuals and as a whole, out of pure love. This is a VERY special thing, the likes of which has never been since since then (if we take it to be true), and Christians treat it as such.

You say that non-Christians are loving, and that this defies the notion that God is love. Have you paused to consider that the man-made definition of God, which is used in these days, is materialistic? Allow me to rephrase...we are using human language and human concepts to describe something that transcends, on all levels, human understanding. You are using color to describe sound.

Also, I would not advise telling people that your opinion is more important than the church. That's how the church itself was formed...people believing their version of the Bible was more accurate that anyone else's.

I would say that instead of following a manual on how to live your life, follow these three rules, all of which are stated in the bible, albeit using different phrases:

ENJOY LIFE

LOVE EVERYONE

PURSUE THAT WHICH MAKES YOU HAPPY

We have our own lives to live...why else would we be given free will? Not so that we would be chained to Jesus...we are allowed to make our own mistakes, and learn from them, and discover for ourselves the power of love.

Dastardly deeds lead to dastardly ends, whereas loving deeds lead to loved ends. That is the message of the Bible. It is not judgment; it is fact. It is a logical conclusion...cause and effect.

Namaste.


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posted on Jan, 23 2012 @ 12:40 PM
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ouch, im not even religious and that burned

i think you broke the bible. lol.



posted on Jan, 23 2012 @ 01:14 PM
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good post, nice to hear about love your neighbor not steal his good and rape his family and murder them all. i have often found it hard to follow any religion the whole concept of ask for forgiveness and you'll be fine has always seemed like a joke to me, and if it were true why would anybody actually go to church or live a moral ethical life? i believe their is a higher power and as long as you live life to the fullest and in your heart do what you feel is right then you should be all set when your time comes. some of the most despicable excuse's for human beings I've encountered have been extremely religious, and tend to judge others more then non churchies. i don't believe god would want us to not enjoy our stay here, what would be the point of creating such a beautiful mystical place as earth and then say ignore it and worship me. if im correct wasn't that satans whole issue with god? that he created us and gave us everything? so as OP stated love each other, help each other. were not here for a long time were here for a good time. no one gets out alive so enjoy why you can. i recently learned to deal with my own anger and hatred in this world, and feel closer to my creator for it.peace



posted on Jan, 23 2012 @ 01:22 PM
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reply to post by DIRTYDONKEY
 


Exactly what I'm saying. All this stuff about "Oh, you have to know Jesus and accept him to go to the pearly gates" is just literalism. I really don't appreciate the literal view of the Bible, because it even says in the Bible that it has "milk for babes, and meat for men".

This means that it is metaphor, and while the literal view will do okay for people, the true messages hidden in the cryptic language will truly benefit man...if only he actually finds it.



posted on Jan, 23 2012 @ 11:38 PM
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reply to post by Starchild23
 


I would say love everyone

Purse that which makes God happy

Then you will be happy
edit on 23-1-2012 by sacgamer25 because: (no reason given)



posted on Jan, 24 2012 @ 01:08 AM
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reply to post by sacgamer25
 

Why do you only quote certain verses but ignore the rest if it bursts your universalist bubble? There are quotes that basically say if you have the Son you are saved but if you don't God will be wrathful.

You even ignore scriptures which states that it is possible to misread scriptures. Who is it addressed to, do you think? If the recipients of that message have the Holy Spirit, and therefore cannot be wrong, why does it state the contrary IN SCRIPTURE ITSELF?



posted on Jan, 24 2012 @ 07:20 PM
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Originally posted by 547000
reply to post by sacgamer25
 

Why do you only quote certain verses but ignore the rest if it bursts your universalist bubble? There are quotes that basically say if you have the Son you are saved but if you don't God will be wrathful.

You even ignore scriptures which states that it is possible to misread scriptures. Who is it addressed to, do you think? If the recipients of that message have the Holy Spirit, and therefore cannot be wrong, why does it state the contrary IN SCRIPTURE ITSELF?

Show me the verses and I will show you how the church has misinterpreted scripture, I will do so by showing you other verses that your interpretation clearly contradicts. There is not one verse in the scripture that my post contradicts. There are far more verses that I could post to prove this but no one on ATS wants to read a 30 min sermon.

I currently have a seven page document that is over 50% scripture that proves what I am saying. I add to it daily verses that support what I am saying. So the challenge to prove me wrong is with you. I do not contradict the bible, and I can prove to you that what you believe clearly contradicts the bible.

You are correct scripture does say that false teachers and false profits will come and teach a message that is contrary to the truth, and that the see the word of God as a means to financial gain.

I am not looking for financial gain but I know those who are. Do you



False Teachers and the Love of Money 1 Timothy 3-10
These are the things you are to teach and insist on. 3 If anyone teaches otherwise and does not agree to the sound instruction of our Lord Jesus Christ and to godly teaching, 4 they are conceited and understand nothing. They have an unhealthy interest in controversies and quarrels about words that result in envy, strife, malicious talk, evil suspicions 5 and constant friction between people of corrupt mind, who have been robbed of the truth and who think that godliness is a means to financial gain.
6 But godliness with contentment is great gain. 7 For we brought nothing into the world, and we can take nothing out of it. 8 But if we have food and clothing, we will be content with that. 9 Those who want to get rich fall into temptation and a trap and into many foolish and harmful desires that plunge people into ruin and destruction. 10 For the love of money is a root of all kinds of evil. Some people, eager for money, have wandered from the faith and pierced themselves with many griefs.


Who is it that is charging people to hear what they call the word of God each week? I know that I do not, nor would I ever even think to do this. Food, clothing, and maybe a place to lay their head were the only things the Apostles accepted on their own behalf. They received only what they needed to survive.
Anyone who has been given interpretation from the Holy Spirit will understand this verse.

Mathew 10:8 Freely you have received, freely give.



posted on Jan, 24 2012 @ 07:35 PM
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reply to post by sacgamer25
 


Lol. Members only club?
.

Take a look around, do you see anyone that doesn't already belong to Christ that wants anything to do with him? We couldn't give them Christ no matter how hard we try because they do not want him and they do not want him because they haven't been chosen to love him and be one of his. He is not their King so why should they want him?



posted on Jan, 24 2012 @ 09:56 PM
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Originally posted by lonewolf19792000
reply to post by sacgamer25
 


Lol. Members only club?
.

Take a look around, do you see anyone that doesn't already belong to Christ that wants anything to do with him? We couldn't give them Christ no matter how hard we try because they do not want him and they do not want him because they haven't been chosen to love him and be one of his. He is not their King so why should they want him?


They don't want the Jesus that the church and most of those who call themselves Christians teach. Frankly I don’t want the false Jesus either. I prefer the real Jesus who says things like this.




A Warning Against Hypocrisy
1 Then Jesus said to the crowds and to his disciples: 2 “The teachers of the law and the Pharisees sit in Moses’ seat. 3 So you must be careful to do everything they tell you. But do not do what they do, for they do not practice what they preach. 4 They tie up heavy, cumbersome loads and put them on other people’s shoulders, but they themselves are not willing to lift a finger to move them.
5 “Everything they do is done for people to see: They make their phylacteries[a] wide and the tassels on their garments long; 6 they love the place of honor at banquets and the most important seats in the synagogues; 7 they love to be greeted with respect in the marketplaces and to be called ‘Rabbi’ by others.
8 “But you are not to be called ‘Rabbi,’ for you have one Teacher, and YOU ARE ALL BROTHERS. 9 And do not call anyone on earth ‘father,’ for you have one Father, and he is in heaven. 10 Nor are you to be called instructors, for you have one Instructor, the Messiah. 11 The greatest among you will be your servant. 12 For those who exalt themselves will be humbled, and those who humble themselves will be exalted.


YOU ARE ALL BROTHERS. What is so complicated for everyone to understand? When you reject what I say you are rejecting the one who you say you love.

Stop accepting a twisted version of scripture where every verse needs some sort of mystical interpretation. Just accept what it actually says. The truth is love, and what you believe is judgment and hate, that leads to separation and war.

You are so happy with your high place, step down from there, humble yourself and find Jesus in you. You say you have Jesus in you but you fail to prove it every time you speak. I know you love Christians but they are not your only brothers. And even if you believe non Christians are your enemies love them also, Just like Jesus said.

No one is to be called Rabbi, do you know why? I do. Does the one who allows himself to be called Pastor know why? Do you understand the gifts of the Holy Spirit? I do. We are not to be called teachers because we are not teachers.

I am not teaching you the Holy Spirit is simply using me to teach you. Everyone wants to claim they have this gift or that, as if somehow they are more important than some one else. The charismatic’s have created what they called tongues. They are so far from the truth it saddens me. They want the spirit so bad they have convinced themselves by this false sign that they indeed have the Holy Spirit.

The gifts of the Holy Spirit are not something that you can grasp. If you think you understand them you do not. I have the gift of teaching but it is not me teaching. It is not me understanding. It is the Holy Spirit teaching me and teaching you through me. It is the gift given to you by the Holy Spirit through me. I am not special, we are all special, and the same Holy Spirit that is teaching through me has a gift for you.

As long as you continue to accept this false doctrine, that contradicts the basic commands of Christ Jesus, how do expect the Holy Spirit to work through you. You must first learn to love, which you are close to but still so far away.

Lonewolf, you love those who you acknowledge as your brothers but you have so many more brothers you refuse to love. Did Jesus teach judgment and hate? Then why do you?

To be perfectly honest with you Lonewolf, you have probably lived a far better life than me. I found God because I only had two choices, accept I was going to hell or to let God prove to me I was forgiven. He has proven to me I was forgiven. He who has been forgiven much loves much. I don’t know why a sinner like me has been chosen to bring the truth but what I bring is not from me. Listen to the Holy Spirit at work in me. Instead of trying to prove me wrong by the logic you have been taught by the church, try to find where my logic contradicts the bible.

If the Holy Spirit is not at work in me than surely I must be contradicting scripture. But I am not this is how you can know the spirit that is a work in me. The only thing I contradict is what you believe, the traditions of men.
edit on 24-1-2012 by sacgamer25 because: (no reason given)



posted on Jan, 24 2012 @ 09:58 PM
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double post
edit on 24-1-2012 by sacgamer25 because: (no reason given)



posted on Jan, 25 2012 @ 01:36 AM
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Originally posted by sacgamer25

Originally posted by 547000
reply to post by sacgamer25
 

Why do you only quote certain verses but ignore the rest if it bursts your universalist bubble? There are quotes that basically say if you have the Son you are saved but if you don't God will be wrathful.

You even ignore scriptures which states that it is possible to misread scriptures. Who is it addressed to, do you think? If the recipients of that message have the Holy Spirit, and therefore cannot be wrong, why does it state the contrary IN SCRIPTURE ITSELF?

Show me the verses and I will show you how the church has misinterpreted scripture, I will do so by showing you other verses that your interpretation clearly contradicts. There is not one verse in the scripture that my post contradicts. There are far more verses that I could post to prove this but no one on ATS wants to read a 30 min sermon.

I currently have a seven page document that is over 50% scripture that proves what I am saying. I add to it daily verses that support what I am saying. So the challenge to prove me wrong is with you. I do not contradict the bible, and I can prove to you that what you believe clearly contradicts the bible.

You are correct scripture does say that false teachers and false profits will come and teach a message that is contrary to the truth, and that the see the word of God as a means to financial gain.

I am not looking for financial gain but I know those who are. Do you



False Teachers and the Love of Money 1 Timothy 3-10
These are the things you are to teach and insist on. 3 If anyone teaches otherwise and does not agree to the sound instruction of our Lord Jesus Christ and to godly teaching, 4 they are conceited and understand nothing. They have an unhealthy interest in controversies and quarrels about words that result in envy, strife, malicious talk, evil suspicions 5 and constant friction between people of corrupt mind, who have been robbed of the truth and who think that godliness is a means to financial gain.
6 But godliness with contentment is great gain. 7 For we brought nothing into the world, and we can take nothing out of it. 8 But if we have food and clothing, we will be content with that. 9 Those who want to get rich fall into temptation and a trap and into many foolish and harmful desires that plunge people into ruin and destruction. 10 For the love of money is a root of all kinds of evil. Some people, eager for money, have wandered from the faith and pierced themselves with many griefs.


Who is it that is charging people to hear what they call the word of God each week? I know that I do not, nor would I ever even think to do this. Food, clothing, and maybe a place to lay their head were the only things the Apostles accepted on their own behalf. They received only what they needed to survive.
Anyone who has been given interpretation from the Holy Spirit will understand this verse.

Mathew 10:8 Freely you have received, freely give.


I can guarantee you are twisting scriptures if you claim that believing in Jesus is not the only way to heaven. People cannot claim ignorance anymore: they hear the truth and reject it.
edit on 25-1-2012 by 547000 because: (no reason given)



posted on Jan, 25 2012 @ 01:48 PM
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reply to post by 547000
 





I can guarantee you are twisting scriptures if you claim that believing in Jesus is not the only way to heaven. People cannot claim ignorance anymore: they hear the truth and reject it.


Youre right. Universalism the doctrine of "all roads lead to heaven" is already decieving billions. The great deception has already begun. These people are going to believe their delusions that there are other paths to heaven than Christ no matter what we say. The wheat and the tares are being separated as we speak.



posted on Jan, 25 2012 @ 07:21 PM
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reply to post by 547000
 


I have not twisted anything, and you and your church have no answer for these verses.



Mathew 12:32 Anyone who speaks a word against the Son of Man will be forgiven, but anyone who speaks against the Holy Spirit will not be forgiven, either in this age or in the age to come.

Luke 12:10 And everyone who speaks a word against the Son of Man will be forgiven, but anyone who blasphemes against the Holy Spirit will not be forgiven.


Would a believer speak a word against the son of man? At least not intentionally, although every time a Christians judges someone they are speaking against Jesus.

I have provided you with verse upon verse that shows you that your brother is everyone but you refuse to believe it. What I say aligns perfectly with this verse from Mathew. What you believe directly contradicts the very words spoken by Jesus.

But you still want to tell me I am wrong and thus continue to condemn your brothers, simply because you refuse to love anyone who is not Christian.



posted on Jan, 26 2012 @ 01:56 AM
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Read the whole bible and stop picking interpretations of verses that contradict other ones. Maybe if you did not have the delusion that you have the gift of interpretation you would be able to admit you are wrong. It doesn't matter what verse I throw at you, you will twist it and claim you have the Holy Spirit and that is why you are right. The hell with what the bible and tradition says, we have to make it say what we want to fit our modern philosophies, right? If you want to truly learn google as to why universalism is false.

I can love non-Christians, but I will not lie to them or give them false hope.
edit on 26-1-2012 by 547000 because: (no reason given)



posted on Jan, 27 2012 @ 12:53 AM
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Originally posted by 547000
Read the whole bible and stop picking interpretations of verses that contradict other ones. Maybe if you did not have the delusion that you have the gift of interpretation you would be able to admit you are wrong. It doesn't matter what verse I throw at you, you will twist it and claim you have the Holy Spirit and that is why you are right. The hell with what the bible and tradition says, we have to make it say what we want to fit our modern philosophies, right? If you want to truly learn google as to why universalism is false.

I can love non-Christians, but I will not lie to them or give them false hope.
edit on 26-1-2012 by 547000 because: (no reason given)


I have posted so many quotes that contradict what you believe but you have not provided even one verse that proves what I am saying is wrong. I never said I believe in Universalism nor do I consider Google an expert on the bible. Why don’t you use Google to prove me wrong? I will win any debate on this subject, because the truth will not contradict scripture. Because the truth was not found by me but shown to me I know that it is the truth.

Let me ask you one question. Let’s just say I agreed that the Jesus was building his church with Peter as the head. What makes you believe the Catholics doctrine that they are that church? Because they said so?
I say that I am the Church that Christ built. What makes that true? Actually the bible but you don’t seem to understand that part of scripture. The verses that say Christ in you, you are the temple; the Holy Spirit will teach you all things.

Again I do not contradict scripture, only the traditions of men. It is the traditions of men that contradict scripture which I repeatedly prove with scripture. You can continue to follow the path of many or you can look for the path that only a few will find.



posted on Jan, 27 2012 @ 01:23 AM
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reply to post by sacgamer25
 


At least pay attention to the miracles of the saints. God says his disciples would be able to do wonders. Only Catholic Church has such first-class miracles. I had the experience of a Catholic miracle myself. Jesus Himself said if you can't follow Him for His teachings, at least believe Him because of His miracles. You can either say "they are liars" or "the Devil is doing it". I implore you to study these miracles and try to UNDERSTAND what Catholics say. Protestants are indoctrinated to hate the Church without even understanding its positions.

Considering universalism: "Whoever believes in the Son has eternal life, but whoever rejects the Son will not see life, for God's wrath remains on him." and "If any one remaineth not in me, he shall be cast forth as a branch, and shall wither and they shall gather him up, and cast him into the fire, and he burneth."



posted on Jan, 27 2012 @ 05:43 AM
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reply to post by lonewolf19792000
 



Youre right. Universalism the doctrine of "all roads lead to heaven" is already decieving billions. The great deception has already begun. These people are going to believe their delusions that there are other paths to heaven than Christ no matter what we say. The wheat and the tares are being separated as we speak.


That line of rhetoric is one of the main things that turned me against Christianity. Our Way or the highway mentality. Has it occurred to you that not all wish to go to the Christian Version of the Afterlife? There are other, and better places, you know. Belief in a God that will strike ye down into the eternal flames of Hell if you happen to disagree with him, or his son, but he loves you anyway, and he needs your money....... and my Wiccan, Buddhist, Islamic, Indian and Jewish friends aren't welcome in the "Christian version" of the afterlife anyway? I simply do not understand why a Deity would go about creating humanity just to damn them to Hellfire in the fist place.



posted on Jan, 27 2012 @ 04:28 PM
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Originally posted by 547000
reply to post by sacgamer25
 


At least pay attention to the miracles of the saints. God says his disciples would be able to do wonders. Only Catholic Church has such first-class miracles. I had the experience of a Catholic miracle myself. Jesus Himself said if you can't follow Him for His teachings, at least believe Him because of His miracles. You can either say "they are liars" or "the Devil is doing it". I implore you to study these miracles and try to UNDERSTAND what Catholics say. Protestants are indoctrinated to hate the Church without even understanding its positions.




Matthew 24:24 For false Christ’s and false prophets will arise and perform great signs and wonders, so as to lead astray, if possible, even the elect.

2 Thessalonians 2:9 The coming of the lawless one is by the activity of Satan with all power and false signs and wonders,

Matthew 7:15 “Beware of false prophets, who come to you in sheep's clothing but inwardly are ravenous wolves.

Revelation 19:20 And the beast was captured, and with it the false prophet who in its presence had done the signs by which he deceived those who had received the mark of the beast and those who worshiped its image. These two were thrown alive into the lake of fire that burns with sulfur.


You do realize that the Pope is called the Vicar of Christ, So essentially the equal to Christ or possibly false Christ. The bible makes it abundantly clear that no man has been or ever will be equal to Christ. It is enough for us to be like Christ.




Galatians 1:8 But even if we or an angel from heaven should preach to you a gospel contrary to the one we preached to you, let him be accursed.



I have listened to the bible and prayed for the Holy Spirit to do what God promised. You have accepted the traditions handed down by men. I continue to show you that the church is teaching a message that contradicts the bible.




Considering universalism: "Whoever believes in the Son has eternal life, but whoever rejects the Son will not see life, for God's wrath remains on him." and "If any one remaineth not in me, he shall be cast forth as a branch, and shall wither and they shall gather him up, and cast him into the fire, and he burneth."



Here is the closest that you will get to proving me wrong. But I will show you how you are not understanding what you are reading, by simply choosing the only answer that does not contradict scripture.



James 2:19 You believe that God is one; you do well. Even the demons believe—and shudder!

Matthew 8:29 And behold, they cried out, “What have you to do with us, O Son of God? Have you come here to torment us before the time?”

Mark 3:11 And whenever the unclean spirits saw him, they fell down before him and cried out, “You are the Son of God.”

Mark 5:7 And crying out with a loud voice, he said, “What have you to do with me, Jesus, Son of the Most High God? I adjure you by God, do not torment me.”


You see believing that Jesus is the son of God only makes you as good as the demon, so this does not appear to be the correct way to interpret the scripture, and if you don’t believe yet read this.



Matthew 7:22-23 22 Many will say to me on that day, ‘Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in your name and in your name drive out demons and in your name perform many miracles?’ 23 Then I will tell them plainly, ‘I never knew you. Away from me, you evildoers!’


So Again it appears that “BELIVING IN” is a little different than “BELIVING THAT” he is the son of God.
For you to understand what this means you must first understand the basic teaching. I have posted it many times, but the basic teaching is that all who know love are born with the spirit of Christ. You must accept this as the truth, which it is, and I have shown you and lonewolf many times that it is indeed the truth, with plain easy to understand scripture that needs no special interpretation.

Now once you accept this you understand that each of us are born with Christ in us. Now you can understand that we all must believe in the word written on our heart, which is Christ Jesus.

What does “BELIVE IN” Jesus look like?
Love your neighbor as yourself.
Turn the other cheek and love your enemy.
Don’t judge because all have fallen short.
God loves us all.

You realize that almost every religious person from any religion will read the bible and agree with the message that Christ teaches on love? Everyone believes in something. Atheists believe in a moral code, and consciousness that guides them to do what is right. Buddhist, Muslim, Hindu all believe in some sort of God force that is guiding them to do what is right. Every one of these groups believes that they were born with this understanding. And this aligns perfectly with what the bible says.

Christ is in all, so everyone believes in the word written on their heart. If you can accept what I am saying then these verses no longer contradict each other but instead they agree perfectly.



Matthew 7:22-23 22 Many will say to me on that day, ‘Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in your name and in your name drive out demons and in your name perform many miracles?’ 23 Then I will tell them plainly, ‘I never knew you. Away from me, you evildoers!’

Luke 12:10 And everyone who speaks a word against the Son of Man will be forgiven, but anyone who blasphemes against the Holy Spirit will not be forgiven.

John 3:16-21 16 For God so loved the world that he gave his one and only Son, that whoever believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life. 17 For God did not send his Son into the world to condemn the world, but to save the world through him. 18 Whoever believes in him is not condemned, but whoever does not believe stands condemned already because they have not believed in the name of God’s one and only Son. 19 This is the verdict: Light has come into the world, but people loved darkness instead of light because their deeds were evil. 20 Everyone who does evil hates the light, and will not come into the light for fear that their deeds will be exposed. 21 But whoever lives by the truth comes into the light, so that it may be seen plainly that what they have done has been done in the sight of God.


If someone does not believe that there is a force, a spirit, the son that is guiding them to follow “Immanuel” God with us, then they are condemned already. He did not just send Jesus in the flesh but the spirit which he gave to all who know love. In this way one could both speak against Jesus but follow the law on their heart. The interpretation that I provide you is the only way to reconcile these three verses. Jesus has many names; the important thing is that everyone follow what they know to be true.

Personally without the bible I don’t know how this is possible but with God all things are possible. Read about Gandhi and tell me that you honestly believe you deserve heaven over him. Read about Gandhi and tell me if he did not follow the spirit inside him guiding him to love. The spirit in him was Christ Jesus, and he believed in the spirit as perfectly as any man I have had the pleasure to read about. If you can accept what I say is true, and it is, than you can stop condemning your brother Gandhi to hell and start be amazed by the power of God.

Jesus is the way, the light, and the truth. For he is the word on our hearts and the spirit that lives in us all, not just Christians. This is how we know that all will be judged fairly because the truth was made known to all. If anyone does not follow the spirit that lives in them they are condemned. As Christians we are supposed to be living examples of Christ, so that all may come to the truth that is Christ in them.

Stop teaching Jesus or Hell.


1 John 4:18 There is no fear in love. But perfect love drives out fear, because fear has to do with punishment. The one who fears is not made perfect in love.




edit on 27-1-2012 by sacgamer25 because: (no reason given)

edit on 27-1-2012 by sacgamer25 because: (no reason given)

edit on 27-1-2012 by sacgamer25 because: (no reason given)



posted on Jan, 27 2012 @ 05:23 PM
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Originally posted by lonewolf19792000
reply to post by sacgamer25
 


Lol. Members only club?
.

Take a look around, do you see anyone that doesn't already belong to Christ that wants anything to do with him? We couldn't give them Christ no matter how hard we try because they do not want him and they do not want him because they haven't been chosen to love him and be one of his. He is not their King so why should they want him?


I thought you were a free-will guy?



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