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Obama Defends Roe v. Wade As Way for ‘Our Daughters’ to Have Same Chance As Sons to ‘Fulfill T

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posted on Jan, 23 2012 @ 09:21 PM
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Originally posted by MissSinFull
i may still be young and i would rather wait till im older before i have kids, but if i were to get pregnant, their is no way i could ever get an abortion, i wouldn't be able to live with myself after. to kill a human just because its "inconvenient" is just murder


And that is your CHOICE




posted on Jan, 23 2012 @ 09:22 PM
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Originally posted by paxnatus
Let me say this is not to start a religious debate but truly define my personal opinion as to why I think it is wrong.


Yes it is. It is about religion.

Don't try to cover it up.



posted on Jan, 23 2012 @ 09:24 PM
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reply to post by Annee
 


God bless you Anee.

It's hypocisy at its finest. The same ones who claim that people should not comment on American soldiers actions unless they've been in the situation are the same ones who somehow don't need empirical experience or they're exempt on this one.

Hippie douche cannot call the soldier a baby killer because he couldn't possibly understand the situation.
The same rule applies for women who consider abortion for whatever reason. It's her situation and no one should tell her anything.



posted on Jan, 23 2012 @ 09:32 PM
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reply to post by Miss Sile
 


Because I like your post.

All my life - - all I wanted to be was a mom. I had this doll which was like a newborn baby. It was years before the anatomically correct dolls - - but (even though it had a cloth body) - - it had a rubber face - arms - legs that looked like a newborn baby.

When other girls were chasing boys - - I was still taking care of this newborn looking doll. His name was Tommy and he was by my side at home at least until I was 14 years of age.

So - how does someone like me have an abortion? Aborting a baby that was actually my husbands - - even though we were going through a divorce.

Having the baby and giving it up to "potluck" adoption - - was not for me. Instead I talked to God and asked God to take it back and give it to a couple that had tried for years to have a baby. (this was prior to me realizing I am Atheist).

I could not have a baby - - then pass it off to some anonymous person. How selfish and self-righteous.

So yeah. Until you are in that position.



posted on Jan, 23 2012 @ 09:42 PM
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reply to post by Annee
 



I just thought it was a good quote that mirrored my thoughts, I have no strong feelings for him either direction. After an experience I had, I have never judged anyone for having an abortion, except one girl I knew who never used protection and basically used it as birth control. I remember when I was mid 20's sitting in the drs office waiting to get pregnancy test results back before they could do an x ray. I was late, but had used 2 forms of birth control. I suddenly, to my complete shock, found myself contemplating the idea of abortion, something I thought I would never consider. I remember thinking how unfair, the rare occasion I have sex, use double protection and I might be pregnant. At that moment I got off my high horse and from then on was understanding of peoples decision on this matter. Now if that were to happen again to me I wouldn't entertain the idea, because of several things I have experienced and believe now. But I have a hard time telling someone to not do something that I was thinking of doing myself.



posted on Jan, 23 2012 @ 09:43 PM
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Originally posted by spinalremain
Hippie douche cannot call the soldier a baby killer because he couldn't possibly understand the situation.
The same rule applies for women who consider abortion for whatever reason. It's her situation and no one should tell her anything.


Oh yeah - - what a bunch of bull-pucky.

ME ME ME - - I carried the baby to term and gave it life - - - aren't I just so wonderful. Then I gave it away - - I did my part.

There is not one unselfish reason for having a baby. There is definitely very good unselfish reasons for not having a baby and/or aborting a fetus.



posted on Jan, 23 2012 @ 09:47 PM
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reply to post by Annee
 


That is an excellent point. Very well put. I have never thought of it that way, nor heard anyone else put it that way. It's also very true. I imagine there are abortions are indeed done so for unselfish reasons. The religious zealot cannot see this.



posted on Jan, 23 2012 @ 09:54 PM
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Originally posted by Miss Sile
I just thought it was a good quote that mirrored my thoughts,


No prob. Reagan was actually the keynote speaker at my high school graduation. We never understood how he became president. Every one I knew considered him a joke. The quote was actually a good quote. Thank you.

There are people who are born without conscience. This is scientifically documented. I know one girl who has had 6 abortions. She is one of those people who literally has no conscience. You simply can not judge people - - because of your own belief.

It is never about Right of Abortion - - - it is ALWAYS about Right of Choice. I've been discussing this for 20 years. I've known many who are totally against abortion - - - but understand individual Right of Choice.



posted on Jan, 23 2012 @ 09:58 PM
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Originally posted by Annee

Originally posted by windword
I applaud Obama for coming out, especially during an election cycle, to preserve the "right to choose" of women! OP, I couldn't disagree with you more. No one is trying to take away your right to give birth.

OP, you are looking at the world through rosey colored glasses. Not all women will make good moms, or will become better people for having given birth.


Thank you. I'm gonna ditto you and star you.

Major opposition to abortion is Religion. Same major opposition to Gay marriage.

SURPRISE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! - - I'm sure - not!

But this is not about abortion or gay marriage. It is about Individual Rights.

America is a secular country. Religious belief is an individual right. But it is not a Right to deny others of their individual right.

GO!!!!!!!!!!!! OBAMA!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
True, but the only way religion will ever get out of politics is if the GOP starts losing support, but I digress.

Problem with pro-lifers is that in terms of individual rights, the only the invidual they see is inside of a woman's womb, and not the woman herself. Don't get me wrong, I understand what they're saying (execpt for the ones who claim it's murder or that the women getting abortion are just lazy, they're just idiots), that a fetus should have the right to develop into a human being, but their case is just really weak in comparison to pro-choicers.

As for me, I like to think that the rights of the woman (who is a human being), override the rights of the potential human being living in her body (and off of it I might add).



posted on Jan, 23 2012 @ 09:59 PM
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Originally posted by spinalremain
reply to post by Annee
 


That is an excellent point. Very well put. I have never thought of it that way, nor heard anyone else put it that way. It's also very true. I imagine there are abortions are indeed done so for unselfish reasons. The religious zealot cannot see this.


Yes. I had 2 daughters 9 and 6. Their welfare took priority.

Their father (biological) was jealous of them. He treated me like a queen - - but was jealous of his own daughters and it was beginning to affect them. How could I bring another child into this situation? I couldn't.

Having an abortion was an unselfish decision. It was an extremely difficult decision - - but the only real decision.



posted on Jan, 23 2012 @ 10:01 PM
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Originally posted by Annee

Yes it is. It is about religion.

Don't try to cover it up.


Oh god...you're one of those people. This is NOT a religious thing, although religious people will naturally be inclined to oppose it. Here's a fact: a fetus is a developing & unborn human being. Not a tumor. Not a parasite.

As an agnostic I find some, not all, abortions to be absolutely grotesque & the justifications illogical. Late-term/partial birth abortions should be banned tbh, but I'm sure even if it were women would wait till the 20th week of gestation; then proceed to call it their right to have the babies brains sucked out through a tube until it's skull implodes. Sound very "pro-choice" to me.



posted on Jan, 23 2012 @ 10:05 PM
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Originally posted by Raelsatu

Originally posted by Annee

Yes it is. It is about religion.

Don't try to cover it up.


Oh god...you're one of those people. This is NOT a religious thing, although religious people will naturally be inclined to oppose it. Here's a fact: a fetus is a developing & unborn human being. Not a tumor. Not a parasite.


Oh yes I am - - absolutely.

The majority against abortion are Religious. I've had this same discussion for 20 years - - I am aware there are also some Atheists against abortion - - - but let's not be stupid to who/what the majority of opposition is.

Oh yes - - a fetus is absolutely a parasite - - feeding off its host.



posted on Jan, 23 2012 @ 10:10 PM
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Originally posted by Annee
reply to post by Miss Sile
 


Because I like your post.

All my life - - all I wanted to be was a mom. I had this doll which was like a newborn baby. It was years before the anatomically correct dolls - - but (even though it had a cloth body) - - it had a rubber face - arms - legs that looked like a newborn baby.

When other girls were chasing boys - - I was still taking care of this newborn looking doll. His name was Tommy and he was by my side at home at least until I was 14 years of age.

So - how does someone like me have an abortion? Aborting a baby that was actually my husbands - - even though we were going through a divorce.

Having the baby and giving it up to "potluck" adoption - - was not for me. Instead I talked to God and asked God to take it back and give it to a couple that had tried for years to have a baby. (this was prior to me realizing I am Atheist).

I could not have a baby - - then pass it off to some anonymous person. How selfish and self-righteous.

So yeah. Until you are in that position.





That must have been very hard for you. And I say that with complete sincerity, your post brought tears to my eyes. We might see things differently as to when life begins, but we respect each others opinion and share the desire to not have "grey haired suits", tell us what to do.

One thing I want to mention about a reply you gave to the OP a few posts ago when she said she didn't want to get into a religious debate and you said it was about religion - I'm christian now, but before I was, I was against abortion. I have met a few people in my life also who are not christian and are against abortion. My reasons deepened when I became christian, but for the most part are the same.



posted on Jan, 23 2012 @ 10:17 PM
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Originally posted by Annee

The majority against abortion are Religious. I've had this same discussion for 20 years - - I am aware there are also some Atheists against abortion - - - but let's not be stupid to who/what the majority of opposition is.

Oh yes - - a fetus is absolutely a parasite - - feeding off its host.



While that may be true, the majority of the worlds population is religious; I would expect most pro-life people to be religious considering that. Yet the issue itself is not a religious one. Just as we don't need a religion to tell us that murder or rape are wrong; they're both acts of violence. Abortion is also an act of violence but it's sanctioned by many because they don't consider a fetus a human. Which is completely & factually untrue.

As for it being a parasite, since you haven't taken the moment to at-least search for the definition of one , here it is.

par·a·site
   [par-uh-sahyt] Show IPA
noun
1.
an organism that lives on or in an organism of another species, known as the host, from the body of which it obtains nutriment.
2.
a person who receives support, advantage, or the like, from another or others without giving any useful or proper return, as one who lives on the hospitality of others.

Take a look at the bold letters. But suppose it is a parasite in some sense. So is anyone who receives support or advantage, financially or otherwise. I suppose then we can execute 90 percent of the worlds population with a clear conscience?



posted on Jan, 23 2012 @ 10:19 PM
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reply to post by Annee
 


You need to look up the definition of parasite. A flea is a parasite to a dog. A mosquito is a parasite to a human. A heart worm is a parasite to a cat. Your own flesh and blood growing in your body is not a parasite. It is a part of YOU!! Are you a parasite?

You keep saying that all of this is about religion. I beg to differ. I think it is about morals. Do you have any? What was considered wrong a hundred years ago is a smashing good time now. In a couple years we will be reading about how pedophelia is an individuals right. I mean they do make the CHOICE, am I wrong? A women makes the choice to kill her unborn child. The child has no say so in this decision. A man makes a choice to molest an infant. It's his choice, the child has no say say in this decision. Some CHOICES are wrong!!! I don't care who you pray too. I don't care if you pray at all actually. Some things are right and some are wrong.



posted on Jan, 23 2012 @ 10:20 PM
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reply to post by Miss Sile
 


If you read other posts of mine - - you'd know I was raised Christian. In my quest for truth (60 years) - I am now Atheist - - because of factual information.

Anyway - - religion is the primary reason against abortion. However - - in my 20 year debate on this - - I have encountered many Christians who support Right of Choice - - - although they themselves are anti-abortion. And a few Atheists who are anti-abortion.

The importance is to understand Individual Right of Choice. No matter what you personally believe - - - you can not force it on those who do not share your belief.

The American government is secular and must not legislate by religious belief. It must support Equal Rights - - and Individual Right of Choice.



posted on Jan, 23 2012 @ 10:21 PM
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Originally posted by newsoul
reply to post by Annee
 


You need to look up the definition of parasite.


No I don't.

A fetus is a parasite living off the host body.



posted on Jan, 23 2012 @ 10:24 PM
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reply to post by Annee
 


Did you even read the rest of my post? Is a baby a different species from it's mother?



posted on Jan, 23 2012 @ 10:24 PM
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I'll be point blank about abortion: I would rather these kids be aborted while they have no memories, no nerves, no real consciousness.

If these women cannot take care of their child or don't want that child, then death is a better option. Better give them that mercy than have them grow up abused and neglected. Better for them and for society because the reality is that most of these kids are going to grow up to be criminals and broken creatures that, like their mothers before them, will only tax our system and be trapped in that life.

I vehemently disagree with the concept that a chance at life is always the better option. Life is hard enough, and these kids are going to start with two strikes already against them.



posted on Jan, 23 2012 @ 10:33 PM
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Originally posted by Annee

No I don't.

A fetus is a parasite living off the host body.


Quite dense aren't you... ok let's just say by your standards a fetus is a parasite. Now what? Does using that word clear your conscious when you take the life of an unborn human being? One of the precursors to genocide, in this case fetacide, is dehumanization. You dehumanize the fetus, you have no problem sucking its brains out through a tube a few days before birth.

Your justifications are shallow, irrational, and like most pro-choicers, beyond dissonance.

That's not to say I think abortion should be completely outlawed, but we need to have a serious debate on the morality of it. None of this cutting corners nonsense like you're doing.



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