Obama Defends Roe v. Wade As Way for ‘Our Daughters’ to Have Same Chance As Sons to ‘Fulfill T

reply to post by Maslo
Bull, again.

Morally, killing is a repugnant act. Abortion is no different. Government has replaced a sense of morality and value of life with the freedom of guilt or responsibility.

Hey. You don't want to take responsibility for your actions?
It's okay.
'Cause the government says so.

reply to post by beezzer

Morally, killing is a repugnant act. Abortion is no different. Government has replaced a sense of morality and value of life with the freedom of guilt or responsibility.

Do you think it is immoral to kill an amoeba? An insect? A plant?

Not all killing is immoral, and not all life is valuable. I just happen to believe human embryos are not valuable.

Originally posted by Maslo
I just happen to believe human embryos are not valuable.

I know.

Good day, sir.

Originally posted by beezzer

Originally posted by Maslo
I just happen to believe human embryos are not valuable.

I know.

Good day, sir.

And no government has forced me to believe it.

Originally posted by timetothink
As far as shoving a belief...it is a matter of right and wrong...

Right and wrong? According to who? YOU?

Our planet and its resources are more valuable then a bunch of cells. That is my Right.

My Wrong is irresponsible reproduction.

. . . and since you have all these freedoms...feel free not to read my posts.....I am on this thread to reply to the op....if you don't like it then find another thread to annoy.

So now you are making rules for an open forum?

reply to post by Annee


I am not making rules...I am telling you to use your freedoms to get the heck out of my face...I have no use for people that have no sense of right and wrong.....the end.

Originally posted by ThirdEyeofHorus

Originally posted by beezzer

Originally posted by ThirdEyeofHorus

Originally posted by windword

And, a mass of cells in a sac is not a baby. It has no right to life. It is unfeeling and unaware and therefore suffers no injustice.

That is the biggest load of bs. And sad coming from someone I almost sympathized with....

Would you care to inform us all exactly when the mass of cells in the sac do become a baby?????

edit on 26-1-2012 by ThirdEyeofHorus because: (no reason given)

edit on 26-1-2012 by ThirdEyeofHorus because: (no reason given)

Funny. Last time I checked, even as adults, we are all just a mass of cells.

Yeh, a mass of cells descended from the ape no less... lol

If you're going to bring evolution into an abortion debate, you can at least be accurate when doing so.
No one has ever stated that humans are descended from apes. Current theory states that modern humans share a common anscestor.

reply to post by timetothink


I have no use for "people" who troll controversial threads with the intent of eliciting either approval or negative emotional responses and are too lazy to engage in thread etiquette. I am bored with useless contributors who care nothing of the cohesiveness of conversation and ignore logic and facts in their arguments.

Originally posted by timetothink
reply to post by Annee

 

I am not making rules...I am telling you to use your freedoms to get the heck out of my face...I have no use for people that have no sense of right and wrong.....the end.

I gave you MY Right and Wrongs.

Oops! They didn't agree with yours.

Originally posted by timetothink
...I have no use for people that have no sense of right and wrong.....the end.

I agree with you, my senses are working.
It is RIGHT for a woman to have choice.

It is WRONG to impose your will on another person.

Good day sir.

Originally posted by beezzer
reply to post by Maslo

 

Bull, again.

Morally, killing is a repugnant act. Abortion is no different.

From this response I can assume that you are against the death penalty and the killing of innocents in the multiple wars the US is engaged in?

Government has replaced a sense of morality and value of life with the freedom of guilt or responsibility.

Would you rather that sense of morality and value be derived from the church? Which church? Does Spirituality count? Is science considered a church or religion? Good parenting? Being a responsible participant of humanity?

Hey. You don't want to take responsibility for your actions?
It's okay.
'Cause the government says so.

What of those who's responsibility has been removed i.e rape and incest or even your/my God, when he decided to create a malformed fetus that will not live on it's own and may kill the mother? Ask our ancestors, who knew and studied husbandry...sometimes it is the wise choice, physically or societally. BTW not everyone who is pro choice is pro government or liberal.

It is against the Constitution, to push your beliefs onto me and vice versa. So doesn't Roe vs Wade protect that Constitutional right, your right, my right? You choose not to believe in abortion, some do.

I'm not being facetious, I'm trying to gauge your beliefs on the multiple aspects this topic touches on.

reply to post by windword


I am not trolling, and it isn't your thread...I agree with the op and have researched and posted usefull information that the op would be interested in...not for your approval. I don't think you have put anything useful forward....just opinion...

Originally posted by windword
reply to post by timetothink

 

I have no use for "people" who troll controversial threads with the intent of eliciting either approval or negative emotional responses and are too lazy to engage in thread etiquette. I am bored with useless contributors who care nothing of the cohesiveness of conversation and ignore logic and facts in their arguments.

reply to post by windword


Facts and logic, I agree. Personal opinions of right and wrong only cloud the issue. It is not disputed that murder is illegal. It is logical to hold that at the moment of conception a human life begins and from that moment forward we have various stages of development. Any line drawn in an attempt to dehumanize that life is completely arbitrary. Any deliberate act to end that life is wholly consistent with the legal definition of murder. I await your logical response.

reply to post by DenyObfuscation


Perhaps you missed my post in this thread www.abovetopsecret.com...

An embryo, zygote and a fetus do not qualify as life, by definition. On the other hand, a single cell does. However, a group of cells is not a biological organism in itself. A fetus is unable to perform homeostasis, required for the definition of life.

The law determines protection of the fetus at 20 weeks, but, in my opinion, it shouldn't until that child takes it first breath.

That's my opinion. My post, linked above, is my logic based answer.

reply to post by windword


I'm replying to this post instead due to my lack of "skills".

The cell is the basic structural and functional unit of all known living organisms. It is the smallest unit of life that is classified as a living thing,

According to your definition here a zygote is a living thing. The DNA contained in it define it as human. It never can be anything else. As I said, any line drawn in an attempt to dehumanize that life after conception is arbitrary.

Originally posted by DenyObfuscation
reply to post by windword

 

I'm replying to this post instead due to my lack of "skills".

LOL, I see you're new here. It takes a while to learn to navigate this site, but its got some good little tricks.

The cell is the basic structural and functional unit of all known living organisms. It is the smallest unit of life that is classified as a living thing,

According to your definition here a zygote is a living thing. The DNA contained in it define it as human. It never can be anything else. As I said, any line drawn in an attempt to dehumanize that life after conception is arbitrary.

You're right, Although my daughter has a PHD in Biology, Micro Biology, Bio Chemistry and Molecular Genetics, and I listen to her talks and read her papers, I have to remember how little "I" actually know.

So, Here's my rebuttal....

Human sperm cell, Life. Not a human being
Human Ovum, Life. Not a human being
Fertilized Human Ovum, one cell organism, Life, Not a human being.

It's not the beginning of life, because both the egg and sperm were already alive. The human sperm changes the chemistry of the original, live human egg, creating a human zygote, carrying the blueprint for a potential human being.

It is at this stage that many birth control methods cause the zygote to abort. Is this the stage which you would declare personhood?

Originally posted by marg6043
reply to post by windword

 

A star for you, I am pro abortion and to keep our rights as women to rule over our reproductives rights, no government, no religious freak or zealous anti abortion believers should make laws or dictate what women out to do with their wombs.

What is this "reproductive rights" twaddle? If you're murdering your offspring it's filicide, not reproducing. Or in the case of abortion, infanticide.

/TOA

All these damn anti-abortion, save the kids people piss me off, you all have no idea...

I have a friend who was raped and fell pregnant, so its wrong if she has the right to abort that baby? the whole "save the kids" thing really gets to me, and you will probably see its those without kids and nothing better to do with their lives who care so much about it, if you want to abort because your life is in a # state, and you KNOW you CANNOT take care of a child, then I believe you shouldn't have to be forced to take care of one, making the child's life worse off in the long run...

What is this "reproductive rights" twaddle? If you're murdering your offspring it's filicide, not reproducing. Or in the case of abortion, infanticide.

Really?....Infanticide?....so say my friend was raped right, she is a baby killer eh?, gimme a f%$#ing break, if someone is pregnant, they MUST have the baby, MUST go through the pain of labor and just deal with it because "abortions are murder"?, if us as human beings in our lives, believe we are unable to bring up a child at a specific time in life, right down from the cost of living to actually raising the baby, then they shouldn't be forced to do so.

reply to post by windword


We agree neither reproductive cell could ever be considered human life. This is a case where 1+1=1 as the two cells fuse to form the single cell we call the zygote. We agree that this is life but you say not a "human being". I must ask if not "human" then what is this life? At this point it has all the information it will ever need to grow and live until death. If female she already has all the information to make all the ova she'll ever produce as well. Also keep in mind that this cell is so much more than the sum of it's parts. Not a skin, blood or brain cell but a single celled human being.