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Kansas slashes food aid for children of illegal immigrants

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posted on Jan, 22 2012 @ 12:04 PM
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www.kansascity.com...

At a time when Gov. Sam Brownback has vowed to reduce child poverty, the Kansas Department of Social and Rehabilitation Services — a state agency the governor controls — made a policy change that eliminated food stamps for hundreds of low-income U.S. children whose parents are illegal immigrants. For more households, benefits were reduced.

“I have to wonder if the governor is really on board with the policy,” said Sister Therese Bangert of the Sisters of Charity of Leavenworth. “I wonder if he understands the ramifications of this policy, if he understands what’s happening to the children.”

The governor’s office did not return several calls and email requests for comment.


Wasn't sure whether to post this is in Social Issues or BAN; but it's disturbing to me on a couple of levels. I used to work with these very families, helping them to fill out the applications for "food stamps" for their citizen children.

I expect this will get me lit on fire pretty quickly, but it is an important point to discuss.

I understand that with smaller government and smaller budgets, cuts must be made. There was a number of years ago a reduction in entitlements, and the government declared that Faith-Based Organizations should bear the brunt of the needs of the hungry and impoverished. This was reasonable, in my mind.

I have also worked with these families as a parent educator; assisting them (because they asked for help) in learning how best to nurture and teach their babies, to help them reach their potential. This was a free-of-charge service funded by a statewide agency through grants, based on the Healthy Families model -- the 0-3 Best Practice theory that Head Start and numerous other Outreach Agencies use. These programs are strictly regulated to what information and updates should be distributed (although there are various "flavors" of it to fit the parents' ability to comprehend and implement the strategies).

This was an absolutely beneficial service offered to ALL first-time parents, regardless of their nationality or status. The children were born here, making them US citizens. These "anchor babies" (as they are sometimes called) are going to grow to majority; after they have done so, they can "sponsor" a relative to become a citizen as well.

Most of the families here having children have come to make their lives better. MOST of them DO pay taxes, and it is cruel and bigoted to portray them as not doing so. They file returns, receive paychecks from which taxed have been withheld, and those tax dollars go into the exact same pot as citizens working "on the radar."

These parents come here to take advantage of the existing laws: that a child born on US soil is a citizen; and that the Health Care system has a deeply entrenched policy of providing care to those in life-threatening emergencies (childbirth is considered one of those), regardless of the patient's ability to pay.

By entering the country to provide citizenship for their about-to-be-born child, they are attempting to give that child a chance that they never had. They are not snickering behind their hands that they are "cheating". They are people who out of desperation have come here via dangerous, very expensive, and often life-threatening circumstances; no one in their right mind would undergo this type of danger unless they were in fear for their lives.

While I understand that they are displacing US citizens in some jobs, generally they are doing very menial labor, even though they may have professional credentials in their home countries. They are not too proud to take positions that many welfare-recipients would refuse out of laziness; they are not reproducing just to receive welfare like many, many impoverished citizens do, purposefully.

It seems to me that the "sins of the fathers" are being visited upon these completely innocent children. Are they deserving of that? Of being starved? Is the intention to get these families to leave? To abandon their children here?

We should, as inhabitants of the same hemisphere, want everyone to have enough to eat, to have gainful occupation and contribute to society. We should encourage compliance with laws, and rewrite those that are harming youngsters that, whether we like it or not, will one day be the leaders and voters.

Sending a family back to their home country may very well put them in grave danger; turning a blind eye on their children with a "not my problem, get lost" attitude is, in my opinion, nothing more than a bandaide on a festering, gangrenous sore. This country's policies toward foreign nationals really makes me sad.

Have at me, ATS; I will never agree that children should be starved, for whatever reason. Who will pull up the slack? Probably the faith-based organizations and the shelters and the soup kitchens. Either way, we will contribute to the survival of these people as members of our community.

We must remember what happened after the institutions for the mentally ill and incompetent were closed and their thousands of residents simple "let go" into the streets; the government expected the communities to take care of them. That's all well and good, IF the communities are PREPARED and ABLE to do so.

If Brownback wants this new policy to have a positive effect on the budget, he had best be prepared to PREPARE the communities by offering them (their leaders) a best practice alternative. It's only fair.



+36 more 
posted on Jan, 22 2012 @ 12:11 PM
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I agree with your points about how bad a situation it is for these people, and how they are coming to this country out of desperation. However, my question to you is why is it right for them to dump their problems onto U.S. citizens? If they were in such a destitute situation, I would think the only logical thing, if they cared about their family so much, would be to not have children in the first place! What right do they have to come to a foreign country, have a child, and then demand that every citizen of said foreign country takes care of their children? I hope other states follow Kansas' lead on this issue.



posted on Jan, 22 2012 @ 12:13 PM
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There are genuine cases of course where people need these services and should have them. There is aso a lot of fraud going on where women say they are a one income household and yet they are not and the combined income is well over the poverty lines.


+1 more 
posted on Jan, 22 2012 @ 12:17 PM
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reply to post by wildtimes
 


Everyone is so concerned about illegal aliens not getting free hand outs. What is going to happen when all free hand outs stop? In case people don't understand the US is totally bankrupt. The US government is like someone stole a credit card then not only used the balance but overcharged and gave away all the money. The banks want their money with interest and over draft fees and don't care that it wasn't the credit card owner that ran it up.



posted on Jan, 22 2012 @ 12:20 PM
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I don't know, I get a bit "twisted" over this. I agree these children need to be helped, and as a fellow human being I don't mind my taxes going to assist them. While at the same time I think our policies do need changed in regards to how we as a nation handle illegal "aliens". dumb name if you ask me. They are human and not "aliens" lol.

Anyway, I think we need to issue more visa's so that when people from other countries do come here to work they are doing so legally and paying their fare share of taxes. This country has grown on the backs of illegal and legal immigration and I think we ought to respect that and respect that our fellow humans have feelings and emotions just as those of us in this country do..... though sometimes I wonder if we have lost all ability for compassion in this country.

Harm None
Peace


+18 more 
posted on Jan, 22 2012 @ 12:21 PM
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We got to be able to take care of our own before we can think of anyone else.



posted on Jan, 22 2012 @ 12:22 PM
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reply to post by apollo7keep
 


They are not demanding it. MOST of them are working. They are not freeloading. They make an effort to pay their bills. They work two and three jobs at what many citizens would find demeaning and beneath them.

The law of the US provides that a child born on US soil is a citizen. That makes them one of us; who can and will be expected to contribute in kind to the next generation. How can you blame a poverty-stricken, hungry person for wanting a better life for their child?

As for them not having children, well, that's a whole separate issue. Most of the Latin world is heavily Roman Catholic, and they do not believe in birth control.

I am confounded that society does not recognize that we are neighbors to the people living on this continent, or the continent(s) south of us, to which we are attached. Man-made boundaries and hatred and subjugation and corruption are useless. We have to begin to think on a macro-level. These children are CITIZENS; and that it the bottom line. If the people want to stop others from coming here to try to provide a better life for their kids, then remove the enabling factors of life-threatening care being obligatory, and citizenship granted to anyone born here. That might make people from other, less affluent countries less interested in coming here.

But it WON'T make their lives any better where they are! We need for governments -- nations -- to work together to see to the well-being of all of their citizens; and stop the slaughtering and starvation and tug-of-war and wealth-hoarding. It's appalling. Throwing your neighbor out on the street based on their skin color, religion, place of birth, language, income, or education is wrong. We must encourage our leaders to encourage our neighbors' leaders to make staying at home a more safe, healthy, and attractive place to raise their families.



posted on Jan, 22 2012 @ 12:25 PM
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Originally posted by Night Star
There are genuine cases of course where people need these services and should have them. There is aso a lot of fraud going on where women say they are a one income household and yet they are not and the combined income is well over the poverty lines.

Any MANY of these are citizens of the United States. They don't want to work, they want to freeload; they have more babies to get more freeloader funding.

The immigrants with whom I worked were not doing that. They wanted to earn their keep, to provide for their kids honestly, and to pay back the help they were given. They were frightened people willing to do whatever it took to give their kids a better life.


+7 more 
posted on Jan, 22 2012 @ 12:26 PM
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IMO a lot of these illegal immigrants are having children to take advantage of the system because they know that if they are pregnant/have child born here the likelihood of deportation is minimal. SO, they come here already pregnant or get pregnant once here to use the 'system'. Now, They know that there is still a risk of deportation so why take that risk when their is children involved? I'm a father and I don't take risks that would keep me from my children.

Also, a lot of money that goes to cater to individuals that are here against the law could actually be used for poor people that are legal citizens.

I don't mind the immigration, they just need to come here legally.



posted on Jan, 22 2012 @ 12:28 PM
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If you want illegal mexican immigrants to stop jumping borders to the U.S., you make mexico safe for their people and help them build their economy to maximize their potential. The root of their problems are the massive amounts of drug cartels that terrorize the people for power and wealth. After you take down the drug cartels you stabilize their government and help establish industries that help economies grow including food production industries. Mexico has every bit of the potential to be what the U.S. is once you weed out the corruption in government, law enforcement and the military and make the nation safe for their people and a place where they can have better lives. People will not stay in a place they do not feel safe in and do not prosper.

As is President Morales is so scared he won't even leave his heavily gaurded mansion most of the time. The fact that the Zetas cut peoples heads off or disembowel and hang people from bridges who speak out against them only compounds the matter and makes it worse. While i feel we in the U.S. should help those in need, the best we can hope to do as we are is treat a shotgun wound with a bandaid. We need to stop these wars in the middle east and bring the army to bear on the mexican drug cartels. There is no reason Mexico should have to suffer for what those evil men do. Then ofcourse there's the corruption in the U.S. we have to fight on our own as we have people in government who broker arms deals with the mexican drug cartels and U.S. government officials who are on these cartels and the Zetas' payrolls.

Make their lands a safe place to live where they can thrive and be happy and instead of them coming over to the U.S. to live, you might actually see americans hopping borders to go live there instead.



posted on Jan, 22 2012 @ 12:29 PM
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Originally posted by satron
We got to be able to take care of our own before we can think of anyone else.


I totally agree with you 100%. Nevertheless, these children ARE "our own". They were born here; that make them citizens. Their parents knew that if they got here in time to have their child, the child would be a citizen. I agree we MUST get our own house in order.

But there is a huge difference between "butting out" of other nations' affairs, and "looking after" the poor, tired, starving and helpless right here at home.

THEY ARE CITIZENS. If we don't want the babies of foreign nationals to have citizenship, then change the law for citizenship, don't starve the children of the people who wanted it for their kids and have made enormous sacrifices and left behind their friends and families and homes, possibly forever, and often made the journey in ways that are as likely to end up in death as in success...so that their children will survive and have a chance.



posted on Jan, 22 2012 @ 12:29 PM
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This illustrates one problem with the "leave everything to the states" approach. As miserable as life is made for illegal immigrants here, it will still be better than their life at home. At least, that's the assumption.

What needs to happen is for the Federal government to start leaning on the leadership of other countries, and use US trade power - what's left of it - to demand that trading partners start creating livable conditions in their countries.

That will decrease the incentive to come here illegally. Which is the ONLY way this is ever going to get under control.

And states do not have the power to make or enforce international treaties.



posted on Jan, 22 2012 @ 12:31 PM
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reply to post by lonewolf19792000
 

The only way to stop the drug cartels is to end the preposterous war on drugs, and legalize all drugs. Legalize, produce, regulate, sell and tax all drugs. Problem solved.



posted on Jan, 22 2012 @ 12:33 PM
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Originally posted by wildtimes

Originally posted by satron
We got to be able to take care of our own before we can think of anyone else.


I totally agree with you 100%. Nevertheless, these children ARE "our own". They were born here; that make them citizens. Their parents knew that if they got here in time to have their child, the child would be a citizen. I agree we MUST get our own house in order.

But there is a huge difference between "butting out" of other nations' affairs, and "looking after" the poor, tired, starving and helpless right here at home.

THEY ARE CITIZENS. If we don't want the babies of foreign nationals to have citizenship, then change the law for citizenship, don't starve the children of the people who wanted it for their kids and have made enormous sacrifices and left behind their friends and families and homes, possibly forever, and often made the journey in ways that are as likely to end up in death as in success...so that their children will survive and have a chance.


You make Mexico sound like it's Ethiopia.

When we run out of money, there will be no money to feed yourself.



posted on Jan, 22 2012 @ 12:35 PM
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Originally posted by lonewolf19792000
If you want illegal mexican immigrants to stop jumping borders to the U.S., you make mexico safe for their people and help them build their economy to maximize their potential.


Why do 'we', the U.S. have to make them safe? they are their own Country with a government, military, education system, etc. They have the means to do what needs to be done, it's only a matter of acting out and actually getting it done. They could work with our government to quell things on immigration but they don't, but yet the U.S. helps them with their drug war, even though we are involved, we still give them more help than we receive.

And wasn't their an article the other Day about Mexico deporting thousands of Central Americans to their home countries? It's o.k. for them to deport illegals that moved into their country but when citizens from their country are under scrutiny for going somewhere illegally all hell breaks loose.
edit on 22-1-2012 by kimish because: (no reason given)

edit on 22-1-2012 by kimish because: (no reason given)



posted on Jan, 22 2012 @ 12:35 PM
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Originally posted by wildtimes

I will never agree that children should be starved, for whatever reason.


The children are NOT "being starved". They are starvING (supposedly). Big difference.

The first one insinuates forcible emaciation; like they are locked in a stone dungeon underground and not given food. Absolutely false.

The second is more accurate; they lack food because they cant find any themselves; they are not being held prisoner and "being starved".

They knew it was dangerous as you said. They accepted the risks, and must accept the consequences of a backfired gambit if it comes to that.


Originally posted by wildtimes

I totally agree with you 100%. Nevertheless, these children ARE "our own". They were born here; that make them citizens. Their parents knew that if they got here in time to have their child, the child would be a citizen. I agree we MUST get our own house in order.


And the babies born on US soil are citizens law is horribly exploitative as we can all see. It should really be repealed and replaced with if both your parents are citizens, then the baby is as well.

Hell it should be retroactively repealed, and citizenship stripped from those whose parents exploited basically a loophole, and then deported, with their parents, back to the boarder of their actual country.

The US has NO obligation to support poor foreigners/illegals who use loopholes in the law to get a foothold into the country, diluting resources away from legal citizens.
edit on 1/22/2012 by CaticusMaximus because: (no reason given)



posted on Jan, 22 2012 @ 12:37 PM
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Originally posted by redrose123
reply to post by wildtimes
 


Everyone is so concerned about illegal aliens not getting free hand outs. What is going to happen when all free hand outs stop? In case people don't understand the US is totally bankrupt. The US government is like someone stole a credit card then not only used the balance but overcharged and gave away all the money. The banks want their money with interest and over draft fees and don't care that it wasn't the credit card owner that ran it up.


Maybe everyone is concerned about everyone not getting help. In my opinion, it is up to a community to look after its own, on a community-wide level. Share if you have excess, help educate those who need it, teach skills that provide the needy with means and knowledge to achieve independence.

Yes, the government is broke. Never argued that. I have never in my life taken "hand-outs", but I did have to use the public health system when my youngest was born as we had no insurance at the time. The difference in the quality of care and continuity of service was remarkable from when I had my eldest in a nice, private hospital birthing suite.

If we take it upon ourselves to help our neighbors, to educate their children and nourish them so that they can be healthier adults in better circumstances, we contribute directly to the betterment of future generations.

We cut them off, send them packing, and back to their desperate lives...guess what; you are creating a future mindset of anger, intolerance, and retaliatory hatred...
just think about it.



posted on Jan, 22 2012 @ 12:41 PM
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Originally posted by kimish

Originally posted by lonewolf19792000
If you want illegal mexican immigrants to stop jumping borders to the U.S., you make mexico safe for their people and help them build their economy to maximize their potential.


Why do 'we', the U.S. have to help them? they are their own Country with a government, military, education system, etc.


Would you leave them in their misery? I could not and would not. The drug cartels are terrorists no different than any other terrorist organization. They shouldn't have to ask our help we should be volunteering it.



posted on Jan, 22 2012 @ 12:42 PM
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reply to post by kimish
 



IMO a lot of these illegal immigrants are having children to take advantage of the system because they know that if they are pregnant/have child born here the likelihood of deportation is minimal.

This is incorrect. Please read the above threads to get a more clear picture of the reasons they come here. They come here to escape extreme poverty, poor education, poor health care, and hopelessness. They come here for the sake of their children, and their desperate extended families (or immediate families) at home who remain in war-torn, dire straits.

They hope that one day their citizen-born children will be able to "sponsor" them coming here legally.



posted on Jan, 22 2012 @ 12:46 PM
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reply to post by satron
 



You make Mexico sound like it's Ethiopia.

When we run out of money, there will be no money to feed yourself.

Have you ever been to Mexico? Not to the tourist destinations, but to the tiny ranchitos where families live in primitive conditions, isolated from everything modern?

It is like Ethiopia; and we don't have to go near that far. Look at the shanty towns on the border at corpus christi, and tell me those people have it good.

When we run out of money, as you say, we'd best be able to grow our own food, hmmmm? The world need not depend on money to revolve. It depends on education, skill-building, and self-sufficiency.



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