Modern Israel CANNOT be the "land of unwalled villages"

“‘This is what the Sovereign LORD says: On that day thoughts will come into your mind and you will devise an evil scheme. 11 You will say, “I will invade a land of unwalled villages; I will attack a peaceful and unsuspecting people—all of them living without walls and without gates and bars. - Ezekiel 38:10-11

Popular christian opinion interprets Ezekiel 38 to conclude that modern day Israel is this land of unwalled villages, which faces an "invasion" by enemy forces, after which these enemy forces are destroyed by an act of God.
This premise rests on Israel being this land of unwalled villages.

But in reality, Israel is far from being a land of "unwalled villages".
And Israelis cannot be the "peaceful and unsuspecting people" living "without gates", given their own history of conflict and overall preparedness for conflict.

Everyone here who knows about Israel, knows about the existence of the giant walls of Israel.

Map of the size of this "wall"...hundreds of miles long


Pictures of this "wall"...




Pictures of the Israelis and their barricades. Can one honestly call these "a peaceful and unsuspecting people"??






This is NOT a political thread, so even if you think Israel needs these "walls" for security , this is not the place for it. The truth is that modern Israel CANNOT be that land of "unwalled villages", for the reasons stated above.

So, what place do you think qualifies as this "land of unwalled villages"?

If I had to guess, I might say Libya or Gaza, but I'm unaware of the state of their villages and whether or not they have walls.

(edit) After thinking about it a little further, North America would have been a land of unwalled villages before any Europeans arrived.

Here in north america... we 'still' dont have walls... and we arent exactly expecting war...
the people here, can fight, but are unprepared for a real conflict, there ahs never been one on our soil...
I hope i aint right!

I want china to be the land of unwalled villages...

reply to post by AwnAegisean


Doesn't China have an even bigger wall than Israel?

Regardless of our perceptions of what walls exist and what safety exists right now in this moment for the land of Israel, anyone who will read all of Ezekiel's Chapter 38 will know the blatancy of what land is meant when the reiteration of the first thirteen verse begins in verse 14:

14Therefore, son of man, prophesy and say unto Gog, Thus saith the Lord GOD; In that day when my people of Israel dwelleth safely, shalt thou not know it?

15And thou shalt come from thy place out of the north parts, thou, and many people with thee, all of them riding upon horses, a great company, and a mighty army:

16And thou shalt come up against my people of Israel, as a cloud to cover the land; it shall be in the latter days, and I will bring thee against my land, that the heathen may know me, when I shall be sanctified in thee, O Gog, before their eyes.

Apparently the popular secular opinion on this matter is that Christians are expressing their own opinion as opposed to reading the Word of God for what it says.

reply to post by HeFrippedMeOff

Originally posted by HeFrippedMeOff
Regardless of our perceptions of what walls exist and what safety exists right now in this moment for the land of Israel, anyone who will read all of Ezekiel's Chapter 38 will know the blatancy of what land is meant when the reiteration of the first thirteen verse begins in verse 14:

Its not "perceptions" of walls that exist... the verse talks of a literal land of unwalled villages, whos people are "peaceful" and "unsuspecting".
The modern state of Israel with their walls, checkpoints, barricades CANNOT qualify to be this land of unwalled villages , whos people are peaceful and unsuspecting.

Apparently the popular secular opinion on this matter is that Christians are expressing their own opinion as opposed to reading the Word of God for what it says.

The "word of God" describes the place as a land of "unwalled villages", which modern Israel is not for reasons stated above.
So lets stick by what "the word of God" says and NOT the opinion of "popular secularists".

i was also wondering about this recently. maybe this is for the future and "unwalled" could mean like "dewalled"( as in the walls have been taken down) and they are "peacefull and unsuspecting people" because there is peace in the region, although that maybe unlikely

reply to post by toddy3174

i was also wondering about this recently. maybe this is for the future and "unwalled" could mean like "dewalled"( as in the walls have been taken down) and they are "peacefull and unsuspecting people" because there is peace in the region, although that maybe unlikely

If the walls, checkpoints, barricades etc. disappear from Israel, then the idea of Israel being the land of "unwalled villages" might start to make sense. However, the way things are going, I doubt those walls are going to come down any time soon.

Given this scenario, and if the land in question is indeed Israel, then it basically means christians need to wait till Israels walls/barricades are removed, in order for the war of Ez 38 to take place.

I have believed as per the OP for many years. Jewish-occupied Palestine can not be the land of unwalled villages. Further, I am impressed that Ezekiel did not seem to recognize the land/country he was seeing in vision. No familiar landmarks are mentioned. "The mountains of Israel" should refer first to a people, Israel, and remember that Ezekiel was not writing in 1948 or thereafter, so "Israel" had a different meaning to him than it does to most folks today. I have done a lot of research, so I know where the people of Israel (as Ezekiel would have known them) went after they were carried off by the Assyrians, and where they are today. Ezekiel speaks of a nation which was gathered out of other nations, and there are only two candidates that I know of: the USA and JOP. If we eliminate Jewish-occupied Palestine, as the OP has, the remainder is obvious.

reply to post by sk0rpi0n

Matthew 11:13
For all the Prophets and the Law prophesied until John.

Jesus took over where John left off and he became the Apocalypse and the prophet of it, and those things are fulfilled and we are left to deal with the age brought in by the reign of Jesus and to make the world a better place by following his commandments.

Certainly in contemporary times there is no way that ancient walls would protect against a modern invasion. Instead, this is saying that Israel will not have its defenses up and will be surprised by this attack, but it does not rule out the current situation in Israel. Most of the separation wall is being built today is really a fence that is designed to separate the Jews from the Arabs. It could not help against a modern invasion.

www.pre-trib.org...

I agree with this, besides it has been shown throughout history that a determined force is not deterred by walls. Rockets beat walls.

reply to post by Iamschist

Originally posted by Iamschist
besides it has been shown throughout history that a determined force is not deterred by walls. Rockets beat walls.

No doubt about it.
The point is Ezekiel 38 refers to a land of "unwalled villages".
Do you take this literally or figuratively?

Originally posted by jmdewey60
reply to post by sk0rpi0n

 

Matthew 11:13
For all the Prophets and the Law prophesied until John.

Jesus took over where John left off and he became the Apocalypse and the prophet of it, and those things are fulfilled and we are left to deal with the age brought in by the reign of Jesus and to make the world a better place by following his commandments.

Are you spouting these lies again? Look around you. There's still war, death, famine, murder, greed, avarice, sexual immorality, babies being still born or only living a few days, babies being murdered in the womb. Where is New Jerusalem? Do you see a giant cube thats 1500 miles broad and 1500 miles high anywhere on this planet? no? Then Jesus hasn't returned. We have the restrainer, his Holy Spirit. "We" can try all we want without the King of kings here to rule with an iron hand it is for nothing. You should repent your wicked ways and turn back to Christ because those demons youre listening to are lying to you big time.

Come now, let us deny ignorance.

Ezekiel 38: 14-18 Therefore, son of man, prophesy and say unto Gog, Thus saith the Lord GOD; In that day when my people of Israel dwelleth safely, shalt thou not know it? And thou shalt come from thy place out of the north parts, thou, and many people with thee, all of them riding upon horses, a great company, and a mighty army: And thou shalt come up against my people of Israel, as a cloud to cover the land; it shall be in the latter days, and I will bring thee against my land, that the heathen may know me, when I shall be sanctified in thee, O Gog, before their eyes. Thus saith the Lord GOD; Art thou he of whom I have spoken in old time by my servants the prophets of Israel, which prophesied in those days many years that I would bring thee against them? And it shall come to pass at the same time when Gog shall come against the land of Israel, saith the Lord GOD, that my fury shall come up in my face.

We can all see "modern" Israel has walls and is at unrest but as any reader of the Word knows, in the future there is coming a day when we will hear it said, Peace and safety; then sudden destruction comes upon them, as travail upon a woman with child; and they shall not escape (1 Timothy 5).

Sk0rpi0n,

Study to shew thyself approved unto God, a workman that needeth not to be ashamed, rightly dividing the word of truth. (2 Timothy 2:15)

Knowing this first, that no prophecy of the scripture is of any private interpretation. (2 Peter 1:20)

Trust in the LORD with all thine heart; and lean not unto thine own understanding (Proverbs 3:5).

reply to post by lonewolf19792000

Do you see a giant cube thats 1500 miles broad and 1500 miles high anywhere on this planet?

You need to get in touch with the concept of figurative speaking.
This is the style in which the Book of Revelation was written in.
It could mean the figurative City of God come to Earth.
These are spiritual concepts put into physical terms and not any of it is meant to be taken literally.

You should repent your wicked ways and turn back to Christ because those demons youre listening to are lying to you big time.

This is a well known concept and has been accepted by the overwhelming majority of Christian interpreters of Revelation.

reply to post by sk0rpi0n

The point is Ezekiel 38 refers to a land of "unwalled villages".

I believe it is figurative. I agree with the Rabi I quoted, it means Israel is surprised, unprepared.

You make the argument in an earlier post that America is the unwalled country that Ezekiel means. Why not Canada, South America, Africa, none of those countries have walls?

It is an interesting question you have posed.

reply to post by Iamschist

I believe it is figurative. I agree with the Rabi I quoted, it means Israel is surprised, unprepared.

If the walls are "figurative", what about the disaster that ensues after the invasion?
That needs to be suddenly interpreted "literally"? Yeah, right.

...a peaceful and unsuspecting people—all of them living without walls and without gates and bars.

Thats a pretty explicit description. So its quite a stretch to read it as only meaning "surprised" and "unprepared".
Im sure the hebrew language had words for "surprised" and "unprepared", so if thats what the writer intended to mean, the verse would have read so.

You make the argument in an earlier post that America is the unwalled country that Ezekiel means. Why not Canada, South America, Africa, none of those countries have walls?

I think you're confusing me with someone else. I never suggested America being the "unwalled country".

Revelation exists in order to spiritualize what had been earlier interpreted from the spiritual and into the physical, and John reverses it and puts it back into its original way of understanding.
John takes that motif from Ezekiel, which is a reference back to the time of the Exodus, when the Israelites dwelt in safety when all they had was tents.
The spiritual understanding is that God will be dwelling among the believers in the form of Jesus, but with us in a spiritual sense, and all the nations arrayed against them, as in the situation where the Israelites were in the wilderness and the nations conspired to attack them before they could cross their borders into their own countries.
So it is with Christianity, that the false religions will attempt to undermine it before it can transform the world. There is a divine judge on a great white throne who will intervene and prevent the faith of Jesus to be eliminated. The divine spiritual presence of Jesus is with us in the camp and prevents its destruction.

Anyone wanting to follow this line of thinking, read "Isaiah's New Exodus in Mark (Biblical Studies Library)" by Rikki E. Watts, and Commentary on the New Testament Use of the Old Testament, by G. Beale.

reply to post by sk0rpi0n

I think you're confusing me with someone else. I never suggested America being the "unwalled country".

You are correct, my bad,

Fact of the matter is none of these replies are correct. Ezekiel chapters 38 and 39 describe events that took place in the 2nd century B.C. corresponding to the Maccabean revolt.