If God is love then why do animals kill each other?

Originally posted by deepankarm

There are two types of energies--
Material energy and Spiritual energy.
Soul is the source of spiritual energy and it is eternal...
We are unborn and never dying.
Death as we know it is the parting of spiritual energy aka soul from material energy aka body ...
Body never dies as it was never alive.
Soul is always alive and never dies... it just takes another body...
All living beings are real life actors with scripts of their own...

O.k. so if the soul takes another body, how does this model handle the fact that the number of bodies in the universe is not constant? Is there a big waiting room somewhere and the souls all take a number and sit in a chair until there is another body available? And if there aren't enough souls for the bodies does somebody create a brand new soul?

Isn't it more sensible to assume that souls do not exist? Or if souls do exist then there is only one?

Originally posted by arpgme
reply to post by I Want To Believe

 

God set up the system of nature. It's not "can" kill, we MUST. We must kill for food and we kill cells and things in the air. Why would God set up the system in this way?

(GOD = APPRECIATION now0

God made it however he wants and he appreciates it exactly as he made it, and when you appreciate you see through his eye.

That's what I think too. We humans are designed to think we have free will and must make choices between good and evil. In reality past, present, and future are already written and everything is exactly the way God wants it to be. Thinking that way gives some peace of mind.

Jude 1:10 But these speak evil of those things which they know not: but what they know naturally, as brute beasts, in those things they corrupt themselves.

Creating a god to serve us and our imaginations of what and how things ought to be will never be sound in doctrine if in truth God has created us to serve Him. All men build their identity as a human on some foundation but if that foundation is cracked then we can't expect our understanding to stand when faced with the waves of truth (mtthw 7: 24-27 & Luke 6: 47-49.

Trust in the LORD with all thine heart; and lean not unto thine own understanding. In all thy ways acknowledge him, and he shall direct thy paths. Be not wise in thine own eyes: fear the LORD, and depart from evil.

Lying to oneself is the most dangerous thing a man can do, especially when it's about God. When we decide God is who He is because we want Him to be a certain way, we make God a creation of our finite imaginations but He is our Creator, our Father, who has made Himself known through His Word, and through the fleshly embodiment of His Word, Jesus. He is independent of us, not we independent of He: for if it were the case that we were independent of Him then God would not Be and any conceptions about God would be as trivial and flawed as understanding the nature of God based on something other than who He has told and shown us He is.

Truth cannot be relative, point blank, so remove the idea from your mind of leaning on your own understanding. We mustn't build our identity based on our own understanding if we are to be, above all, happy and content with this life and the next. Let us seek God in truth where He has made Himself known to us, through His Word, through Christ Jesus or suffer the consequences of not being able to relay understanding to others because we truly don't understand ourselves.

Originally posted by arpgme
reply to post by I Want To Believe

 

God set up the system of nature. It's not "can" kill, we MUST. We must kill for food and we kill cells and things in the air. Why would God set up the system in this way?

(GOD = APPRECIATION now0

God made it however he wants and he appreciates it exactly as he made it, and when you appreciate you see through his eye.

We MUST kill to survive because that is the only way we can exist in the way that the system was designed. God wanted to create a system that could support life and create new conscious entities like himself.

If God had simply created other conscious entities directly, without a system to support them, he may as well have been playing with finger puppets, it would be like dividing himself into multiple entities so that he could talk to himself. He may have even tried this at some point before creating the universe, and realised that there was no real meaning to be found in talking to himself.

The whole system is founded upon cycles of creation and destruction. With each cycle of creation and destruction, more complexity emerges. It is necessary for the creation of a stable reality.

Survival is a function of creation that allows growth and improvement, death is a function of destruction which helps remove flawed or outdated creations. Eating transfers the matter and energy of the old into the new. Without the struggle to survive, there would be no progress. Without death, there would be no change.

Think about how unreal everything would feel if life was "perfect" and unchanging. I feel that it would be like a dream or a product of imagination. A childrens' cartoon.

Originally posted by AnswerSeeker2012
Animals are creatures of God, but they are not the ones created in the image of God, neither was prehistoric man. God created man in His image for a reason, the man not made in His image...wasn't working out. Without God it is animal vs animal, including pre-historic man. With "man made in the image of God", there is hope to conquer all, physically and spiritually.

I do not conquer. I sometimes change things but the more I understand the more careful I get. I choose to learn about animals and try to understand it's place in the universe. Our image is what I have read in the bible and if you get that soul can be devine then maybe what we call singular should be a plural entity that acts as one. I do not need any push of human ego and beliving I am better than animals is just human ego talking. Do the separation you make from the animal make you harmonious with nature or the oposite?

reply to post by HeFrippedMeOff

. . . if in truth God has created us to serve Him.

This seems like a big IF to me.
Where would you get this idea from that man was made to serve God?
Ministering angels, I think they would serve that function.
I think serving God would be mainly carried out by serving our fellow man where God is holy, as Joshua said and we can not serve Him.
God would be a necessary component of the universe and the universe would not be worthwhile existing if there was no one in it to enjoy it. In my own mind we do not exist to create pleasure for a supreme being but we are the reason for anything to exist in the first place (why else have a physical universe?) and just as we need a physical universe to live in, we also need a spiritual universe equally all-pervasive. That does not make God the servant of man so much as the fulfillment of God in having a universe which is complete.

because they are hungry.

reply to post by jmdewey60

Where would you get this idea from that man was made to serve God?

The idea comes from many sources in scripture, for example, 1 Samuel 15:22: "And Samuel said, Hath the LORD as great delight in burnt offerings and sacrifices, as in obeying the voice of the LORD? Behold, to obey is better than sacrifice, and to hearken than the fat of rams."

Service to God is the equivalent of obeying Him. In John 14:15 Jesus puts it like this: "If you love me, keep my commandments." You are right when you saying serving God is to serve our fellow man. The story of the good Samaritan comes to mind. Also, what comes to mind are the two greatest commandments: Love God, Love your neighbor.

Commandments necessitate service so we do in fact serve a God who has created us.

God would be a necessary component of the universe and the universe would not be worthwhile existing if there was no one in it to enjoy it. In my own mind we do not exist to create pleasure for a supreme being but we are the reason for anything to exist in the first place (why else have a physical universe?) and just as we need a physical universe to live in, we also need a spiritual universe equally all-pervasive. That does not make God the servant of man so much as the fulfillment of God in having a universe which is complete.

What I meant by "creating a God to serve us" is just that, we don't create God. Creating a god so we can feel justified is a hallmark of that relative truth philosophy that remains unfounded in all principality.

Too, to say God is a component of the universe when He holds it in the palm of one hand is odd but I might agree that the heavens and the Earth were made special for us. I would also say that we, like the heavens and Earth, were made special for God's glory too.

reply to post by HeFrippedMeOff

Creating a god so we can feel justified is a hallmark of that relative truth philosophy that remains unfounded in all principality.

I did not create God.
No one creates God.
What did create God no longer exists other that what we see as the physical form of the universe and what we know of the spiritual nature of God.

Originally posted by RevelationGeneration
reply to post by Hydroman

 

When Eve sinned and Adam got the blame they became mortal.

Adam got the blame because he saw what he was eating and knew exactly what it was and instead of flat out refusing and decrying her, he gave heed to her and ate it anyway. Notice woman (she hadn't been named Eve yet) was blessed with her seed being the Messiah who would crush Satan's head (because she had been tricked but Adam knew exactly what he was doing), not Adam's seed and the Messiah was born of Woman Fathered by the Holy Spirit himself and not Adam.

Just before they were exiled from Eden Adam named the woman Eve which means "spring of life" for the savior would come from her.

Originally posted by arpgme
Animals do not have the intelligence of human so they can not fully understand the abstract concept of "God". God is love and there are loving animals but why do the animals have moments of being unloving if they are so connected with God and don't have complex thinking for ego?

Maybe God is Joy since all beings are seeking that...

What do you think about all of this?

God is life my friend.

Life will do what it needs to do to survive.

Love is the law of God for Man.

We are the only ones who can reason why.

Eventually.

With Love,

Your Brother

reply to post by arpgme


I have a very loving dog, but when she is hurting I've seen her nip at her buddy, the cat.

You know, this whole food chain business is gruesome isn't it? In this world killing is necessary for the survival of so many species. I believe it will be different in Heaven, don't you?

Originally posted by RevelationGeneration
reply to post by Hydroman

 

When Eve sinned and Adam got the blame they became mortal.

Right, but why was the Tree of Life in the garden if they were immortal to begin with? Did god plant it after they sinned? Nope.

There has to be balance. Theres also the idea that there is only one life and that nothing really dies.

reply to post by MoeSantana


That's the physical world where "life" is nutrients which go into the body of another.
Or is energy from those nutrients going into producing seed for a new living entity.
The thing that makes a person who they are is of a spiritual nature and though it does rely on a higher order spirit, God, to maintain this individuality, it is not that god, but is itself.

Animals are driven by instinct, and their instinct to survive drives them to kill other animals for food and to reproduce. They fight over territory in order to secure good hunting grounds for food and to mate.

This is called survival. Humans, who are highly more intelligent than animals have the same instincts to survive. They fight over territory. Securing the best territories ensures the best resources needed to survive. Furtile lands equals food. Humans harvest not only grains and fruits, but also animals for meat. Our intelligence allows us to be less barbaric than wild animals and insects when it comes to hunting for food.

That's the way we were created. Humans, animals and insects follow the same cycle of life. They need to eat to survive. They are driven to procreate and thus have the desire to mate. This is the blue print in every living creature's DNA. Whether this is the result of nature and evolution or GOD is another debate.

Not everyone believes is GOD, at least not the omnipresent, perfect being described in the bible. If you believe in GOD and the fact that he created the heavens and the earth and everthing near and far, you then have to believe that the state of life as we know it was by design....his design. An all knowing all seeing being that is perfect in everyway does not make mistakes. When things can't be explained which contradicts the teachings of the bible and go beyond good old common sense, its usually said or explained away by saying "you can't understand or make sense of what is divine."

To that I say, a divine, omnipresent, loving and perfect being that wants you to follow and heed his word will not make it difficult to understand his way.

If GOD created this system where animals eat each other for food and in this process there is pain and suffering, then GOD is not a loving and merciful GOD as the bible says. GOD cares about you as much as a scientist cares about a lab rat.

Originally posted by sad_eyed_lady
reply to post by arpgme

 

You know, this whole food chain business is gruesome isn't it? In this world killing is necessary for the survival of so many species. I believe it will be different in Heaven, don't you?

Suppose people were extremely compassionate and chose not to eat animals - and this awareness went to other animals and they stopped eating each other too.

Wouldn't they still have to eat something to survive? Plants will still die and just by breathing air microscopic life will die.

It just doesn't make sense to me that this place is "bad" and heaven is "perfect" - what would be the point?

To learn? Well, can't we connect with God in heaven - infinite intelligence?

To be tested? Well, isn't everything in heaven purified to be good anyway?

Something is not making sense here...

I can say that this is a mystery of life. We only know portions of it, that is "animals kill each other in order to survive" and through this, balance is attained in the ecosystem. Our perception of unloving God based from the matter is flawed because of our limited knowledge.

For reference, please google this article "Heaven is real, says neurosurgeon who claims to have visited the afterlife". This man experienced a life of a worm and then a butterfly during the state of coma and then left earth and went to a place like heaven.

Deuteronomy 29:29 "The secret things belong to the LORD our God, but the things that are revealed belong to us and to our children forever, that we may do all the words of this law.

Reincarnation... transgression of soul... these are mysteries.

We must follow the example from the life of Job. Despite of his terrible trials, he did not blame God. He trusted God till the end.