RUSSIA: Attack on Tehran is an Attack on Moscow

Originally posted by victor7

If there is attack then response has to be asymmetric and very successful in certain areas. Russia and China should not sit mute in that event or it will be a catastrophe for them in less than 1000 days down the road.

Neither China or Russia are looking at the bigger picture. They're just doing business as usual, and not striving for world domination. Of course, it's their loss ... on the long run ... but for now, China is content with copying US stuff, and become a "secondary" US.

If Iran would "strike" back, they'd have to do it on their own ... and not expect any help from either Russia or China. And the best way to "strike" back, would be to strike at the western financial system.

Originally posted by victor7

Reverse engineering from Russia and stealing from US are the two sources of ideas to the brilliant minds of the commies.

That is one of the dumbest things I've ever read. Typical US "inflated arrogance".

What "China" can or cannot do, is irrelevant ... because China is not an issue here. And everything the US has, up to date ... is stolen from the Germans, or putting it more accurately "taken from the germans as war goods". And the United States, has been busy feeding the world with everything they have ... they never invented it, but the United States is busy selling this technology to everyone. China didn't "steal" the "Metal Storm", they got it by inoficial channels ... the United States is busy "stealing" from patent offices around the world, and if Germany for instance, creates a new hydrogen engine. The United States buys it, and then hides it away ... but the United States has NEVER been charged for either it's crimes against the human race, or it's enormous theft of patents around the world.

So, belly down your idiocy of China stealing stuff ... there is a reason why the US/UK are using China to build everything ... and it certainly isn't because the US/UK is so advanced.

reply to post by bjarneorn


you still living in the world where US industries are producing goods based on German technology of WWII. China not stealing US technology? Any news inventions or new generation products fielded by China lately? All I see are cheap knock offs and that's all.

You are not only growing old, you are getting senile and losing cognition fast. Alzheimers?

reply to post by Observor


That's true, US can nuke any small country and start a war with nukes and the world will mostly remain mute. However, remaining mute and actionless also WILL have its consequences down the road. That is why SCO based military alliance is very much needed. World only respects the strong and brave.

Unlike the cold war, the economic system or way of life not the issue. Unlike Warsaw Pact, the governments will not be on a mission to make the whole world a godless communist dwelling and curb all sorts of basic freedoms of human beings. The main issue is to put a stop to the aggressive belligerence of the US-NATO over the small countries that they do not like. Unless they see mighty costs involved in their war games over a small country, they will keep on doing it like psychopaths.

Originally posted by victor7
reply to post by bjarneorn

 

you still living in the world where US industries are producing goods based on German technology of WWII. China not stealing US technology? Any news inventions or new generation products fielded by China lately? All I see are cheap knock offs and that's all.

What you are seeing is the production line in China. The United States and Europe in General have China produce all their parts, more or less. Your iPhone is "Made in China", or if it isn't China, it's "Korea" or "Taiwan". But, it deson't matter what you put back there ... it might just as well be "Made in Asia", period.

On every product line, you have what ... 60%, 80% that surpass the "quality" test. What do you think happens to the rest? You should think about your own alzheimers here ... because your not just turning senile, like myself ... your just plain dumb. The Chinese, and others ... use those 20-40% of the products, and make a cheap copy of the original and sell it "internally". It's not meant for exports, and there is severe penalty for selling the "rest" products abroad.

They don't steal "jag shiet" ...

And your so called "new" stuff ... is in reality, "cheap" copies of the "old stuff". Take that computer chip, and turn it upside down ... and you'll see that it got "smaller" on the dye, and you just have more "parallel" stuff on there ... still the same crap. And you take your modern "i2c" bus, and all you'll find is a crappy old serial bus ... with smaller dye, less heat generation, and therefore lesser rise/fall times, and greater speed as a result.

So get off your high horse, you haven't invented a jag "shiet" the past 50 or so years. And without the Chinese (or Asians) helping you with the production, US citizens wouldn't even be able to pee straight.

reply to post by victor7
The whole world is riding and driving and flying on german technology,or technology that they perfected like the diesel and internal combustion engines,jets and rockets,a few of many examples and nazi ss scientists put us on the moon.But at the end of world war-2 it was the russians who aquired 70 to 80% of the german jet and rocket scientists and thats why the russians beat the usa in almost every aspect of the space race...

The germans were then and are still now all about quality,not quantity,thats why they built a couple thousand tiger tanks and the americans and russians built tens of thousands of cheaper tanks and thats why the germans now build tens of thousands of very high quality cars and the japanese and the americans build millions and millions of cheap cars and thats just one of many reasons why germany lost ww-2...

reply to post by blocula


there is no sense debating german and chinese technologies and grand inventions especially by china, good for them.

Originally posted by blocula

... and thats just one of many reasons why germany lost ww-2...

The biggest reason, why Germany lost WW-2 is Hitler. This little personal friend of Prescott Bush, I believe ... he stopped Rommel from winning in the middle east. He stopped the production of Me-262. He grounded the luftwaffe ... he ordered the winter war in russia, despite warnings.

That guy, was working FOR the US ... and his best friend and ally, Prescott Bush.

reply to post by bjarneorn
Germany and russia both invaded poland in september 1939 and they had split poland in half,even though the allies only declared war on germany,not on russia,even though russia did the exact same thing that germany did,invade poland...hmmmm?...I wonder why?

When germany invaded russia on june22 1941,the center thrust first had to fight their way across half of poland before they even entered russia and the germans had already penetrated more than half of the way to moscow by early september and then hitler split the center thrust,after the battle of smolensk, "His Worst Mistake Of The War",when most of his generals wanted to take moscow first and there were only around 100,000 troops guarding moscow at the time...

And by the way,as bizzare as it sounds,whos side was hitler really on?

A 12 year old child would have known to take moscow first before the brutal russian winter set in...

In a conventional world war three,which countries does the united states actually think and believe will send its youth to die with us? What a rude awakening it would be indeed,if our supposed allies all backed out and left us alone in the lurch...

France?...Doubt it

England?...Maybe,but their army is really small...

Israel?...Probably but their army is also small...

Germany...Perhaps,but what would they have to gain?

Canada?...Wouldnt matter if they did because their army is more or less insignificant...

South korea... They would be our only real tangible asset...

So whos left?

reply to post by victor7

That's true, US can nuke any small country and start a war with nukes and the world will mostly remain mute. However, remaining mute and actionless also WILL have its consequences down the road. That is why SCO based military alliance is very much needed. World only respects the strong and brave.

Unlike the cold war, the economic system or way of life not the issue. Unlike Warsaw Pact, the governments will not be on a mission to make the whole world a godless communist dwelling and curb all sorts of basic freedoms of human beings. The main issue is to put a stop to the aggressive belligerence of the US-NATO over the small countries that they do not like. Unless they see mighty costs involved in their war games over a small country, they will keep on doing it like psychopaths.

Alliance against NATO won't work. First off an alliance means promise of mutual protection amongst the members. In order to even think of joining such an alliance, the country concerned must be sure it is reasonably secure for the moment and there is no threat of a NATO attack before its admission into the alliance is finalised. Iran applied for membership, but was not granted citing some "rules". It would have been easy for either Russia or China or both to have rejected the sanctions against Iran and then there would never have been any problem of "rules" for Iran's admission into it. When they won't use their power at the UN to protect potential allies, why would anyone join them? What happens if they go the way of Iran for expressing their intent to join?

Blaming the West is all fine and dandy. But they are psychopaths and that is how psychopaths behave. If those with power to act against the psychopaths don't when they still have an opportunity and are forever inventing excuses not to act, can't even show the courage to verbally denounce the psychopaths, who would want to cast their lot with them and what for? What guarantee is there that these guys will fulfill their obligations when the time comes?

reply to post by Observor


You hit the point quite right regarding UN sanctions. Also during the South Ossetian war, none of the CSTO members would recognize S. Ossetia as a nation even on Russia's urging. So there has to be a mutual confidence in other's actions in any alliance. On the otherhand everyone from Gorbachov to Yeltsin to Putin to Medvedev have been asking that Russia be allowed to join the NATO block. This shows the mindset of the leaders and as to how low they feel about themselves. No matter psychopaths in the west are cashing in on that mentality and pocketing a country after another for their benefits.

Originally posted by victor7
reply to post by SplitInfinity

 

While Russians are behind the west in technological terms, they are not so much behind that they would not know that a super advanced ABM has already been deployed that would cancel out their offensive capability in terms of nuclear missiles. If that was the case, Russians would have gone crazy out of fear and started throwing all sorts of efforts to cancel this system out.

Btw, do not mention the FEL as a sole property of the west. You have been spanked and straightened on it already.

edit on 23-1-2012 by victor7 because: (no reason given)

As far as the ABM system...the U.S. was able to take ordinary Antiaircraft Missle Systems...keep the size of the weapon or missle the same...but change the solid fuel which is now a much denser long time burn to force ratio solid fuel...team it up with Ultra-High Tech. small radar systems rather than the old GIGANTIC over the horizon arrays...and with the help of Highly Advanced computing power of Super Computers that ONLY the U.S. has that are small enough and mobile as well as durable to acccompany these mobile ABMS....to change what was once a buch of regular Antiaircraft Missles into ones that can even bring down Satelittes as was the case a while back when we demonstrated blowing up a falling SAT with a ship born version of one of these.

As far as the Free Electron Laser...you are correct that the Russians have also developed a form of this...but not one that is deployable as they have still not figured out how to regulate the intermix as well as specific energy ratio to light frequency specifics. They are still years if not decades away as they have time and time again demonstrated their inability to even correctly use a current working Particle Beam Weapon that THEY currently have that is not only very powerful but also very dangerous.

In the last 11 attemps over 27 people...Russians...have died by accidental irradiation. Some of these people were irradiated even after the weapon was off line. They also have a problem with tracking and Targeting as unlike the FEL a Particle Beam will destroy a mirrored SAT and must be line of sight when firing. I in no way am saying the Russians are not bright and ingenious people...they are....they just are no where NEAR our level of Technical Ability....no one is. We fought the Iraq war with weapons designed in the 70's....I do not know everything nor can I say everything I know...but as far as worrying about Russia or China....Forget about it!
And there is no way in HELL Russia will defend IRAN nor will China if we have to go in...and I find a U.S./Iran war unlikely as Russia, China and even Iran knows that the only thing preventing the Israelis from bombing Irans Nuclear sites...is the U.S. saying...NO! The U.S. knows Iran is on the verge of regime change within 12 to 18 months and 90% of the Iranian population is pro west. Split Infinity

reply to post by SplitInfinity

The U.S. knows Iran is on the verge of regime change within 12 to 18 months and 90% of the Iranian population is pro west.

And Iraqis were going to welcome the US military as liberators and with flowers.

Do you seriously believe stuff like that or do you take the listeners to be idiots incapable of seeing through it?

Originally posted by Observor
And Iraqis were going to welcome the US military as liberators and with flowers.

In all fairness.

Did you miss all the initial celebrations before the sectarian violence broke out [Supported by Iran] which needlessly extended the war for 4 or more years and which cost the lives of untold tens of thousands of Iraqis?

Do you seriously believe stuff like that or do you take the listeners to be idiots incapable of seeing through it?

Do you only see what you want to see and disregard the rest?

reply to post by SLAYER69

Thanks! I got my answer

Originally posted by snowspirit

Originally posted by blackmirage0311
Russia and China are both goals for the US in a strategic standpoint.

Russia's threats are just what was being looked for. Iran can be crushed immediately, that's not a problem unfortunately. A war with Russia is ultimately what is being looked for. We have the resources, funding, training, and experience to take them out. Russia needs to be careful what it does because it's falling into the trap.

Control freaks :shk:

How can Iran be crushed "immediately"? If they're so easy, why did Iraq, Afghanistan, Libya, etc. last so long?

MADness.

Because we were after selective targets during those wars. In Iran we would be much less.... discriminate about who was killed.

reply to post by SLAYER69


Blaming resulting violence on Iran is not right and whatever violence Iran purported it was to hedge its bet because they knew soon attack will be focused on them. Lot of violence was a result of insurgency which took like 6 years to win over. US attack on Iraq was illegal, unethical and destroyed the whole country.

US is not going to achieve anything long term in Afganistan also. The moment they leave Pakistan supported Talibian will be back and rest will be as it always was. US had to attack Afganishtan because of Al Queda and 911, however why cook the meal only half. US should have gone into Pakistan and smashed the sanctuaries of AQ leaving them with no place to run neither hide.

reply to post by SplitInfinity


US knows the costs involved in attacking Iran. Also Russia is not being vocal because they want oil prices shoot from $110/brl to $210/brl and stay there even a month. In this scenario, Russia will earn additional $1B a day in profits. $30B in profits if given to build the disarrayed state of Russian Army would mean what? Example: $2M a piece upto 50 Yakhonts can be bought for $100M. At $3M a piece, 333 T-90 tanks can be added for $1B and these figures are retail costs, do not know how much does it cost Russia to produce them. So Russia is walking a tight rope here. On one side they want Iran attacked and its nuke capability destroyed and ofcourse oil shooting to $250/brl. On the other side, Russia wants a friendly regime maintained in Tehran. Clever bastards!

Regarding the ABM and FEL and rest, you are better off discussing with Ludwig who has given you good spanking already once. If you say that current US ABM is lock tight then good for you. If Russians are not worried then that speaks volumes in itself.

Originally posted by Observor
reply to post by SplitInfinity

 

The U.S. knows Iran is on the verge of regime change within 12 to 18 months and 90% of the Iranian population is pro west.

And Iraqis were going to welcome the US military as liberators and with flowers.

Do you seriously believe stuff like that or do you take the listeners to be idiots incapable of seeing through it?

Do yourself a favor. Go on a social web site and talk to a few Iranian Pro-Democracy Students. They will tell you what is REALLY going on on the ground.

The U.S. does not want to go into Iran and is holding Israel Back from bombing their Nuke sites because we don't want to piss off MILLIONS of very soon to be new friends in the form of the Iranian Youth. Iran will implode 12 to 18 months from now.

I was asked but did not go but many of my associates were asked and they are taking the pay to be CONSULTANTS for the IDF. A childhood friend of mine who is a LT. Colonel is there now...he wanted me to go with him. I declined.

Israel is just itching to launch an attack and the ONLY THING STOPPING THEM IS THE UNITED STATES....or else they would have done it months ago. This would cause too many problems and throw Radioactive debris in the air all over the Middle East.

The U.S. KNOWS where each and every secret Nuclear site the Iranians have built and the only way to resolve this issue is in two ways...1. The Iranians come to their senses and allow inspectors back in and eventually become a democracy....or....2. Iran either tries to use their navy to block the Strait or even worse...Declares to the World they have developed a Nuclear Weapon. In this case...the U.S. would go in with thousands of Special Forces and Rangers airborne...secure these Nuclear Sites...and use new small but powerful EMP devices to imobilize any Iranian counter attack. The Iranian Airforce as well as Navy would be destroyed.

Anyway...war in unlikely. I am sure both Russia and China have read the RIOT ACT to Iran. Split Infinity