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Could ATS Possibly Benefit From A Two Thread Per Forum Rule?

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posted on Jan, 15 2012 @ 04:17 AM
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Just an exploratory thought, and so I am posting for more opinions. To open discussion, not argue or get nasty.

Since I've been here quite a while, and continually run into the problem of posting a thread that has already been posted, it occurred to me that the long standing rule of only one thread on a topic per forum perhaps should be reconsidered, just for moment. And yes, sometimes I forget to use the search engine. But that's not the point. Follow me for just a minute please, k?

Let's suppose, just for fun, that there were TWO threads max on any topic allowed in every forum. What could be the potential pluses and minuses of this? Well when I started to think about it, so many things came up on the plus side, I did a double take. And of course I am aware of the two thread rule for BAN and one other forum. But this is different in that it would allow two threads on the same topic in every forum, no matter what. And also, another integrated idea into this would be that the second thread must at some point list the first thread as a related ATS topic.

Pros
1) The potential for two threads on the same topic to compete, based on quality. Maybe you have a different slant that will attract different comments in your thread? Maybe you have done more research or have more knowledge about a topic? Maybe your post is just better? As it is now, your thread would get locked. Doesn't matter.

2) The potential for increased posts, topics, and thus better ATS standing on website rankings. If there are two threads on some topics, let's face it, they are going to bring in more replies than one. That will help boost the numbers, which will help boost the site. Hoping the admins will see this, cause it never hurts to propose an idea that can possibly help ATS rise further.

3) Increased topic exposure. Let's face it again, two threads on the same topic mean more exposure than one. Double your pleasure with doublethread gum!

4) Less work for mods? Not sure on this one, maybe a mod or two could weigh in?

5) Less work for members? Thread starters don't have to be so conscious about using ATS Search all the time to check for an existing thread. Hey your topic was posted, but it's cool, cause now two are allowed.

Those are the initial pros, but there may be more. Is why I am wondering if anyone might want to comment on the idea?

Cons ? More of a cluttered recent posts list? Is that it? Then are the advantages far outweighing the disadvantages, or am I simply forgetting something so obvious I am a numbskull?




posted on Jan, 15 2012 @ 04:31 AM
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reply to post by TrueAmerican
 


I agree with your ideas.

What gets me is when I see a new thread, I start reading, and someone say's "already posted, heres the link"
so I go to the link and it's a thread four years old.
I wasn't a member four years ago, I want to read about fresh accounts of said story. And im sure there are thousands more members join over those four years that have never even heard of the story/thread.

Hope that makes some sense, been a long day



posted on Jan, 15 2012 @ 04:33 AM
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For breaking news, as it's breaking I agree. For anything with any length, history and content to it I disagree because, firstly for both internal search and search engine results you want keywords associated to take you to the most accurate information, with the least amount of searching.

Where do you draw the line with association to another thread? For example, if I have a thread on the NWO, do you have to post all related Bilderberg and Illuminati and Tri-Lateral Commission news in here? What about each member of these groups? Does their association with these groups mean that news about them will also need to be in the one place? Do you see my point.

But, overall, from a business standpoint, the site would be worse off with less threads. I actually think they're quite mad for the amount of content they delete. If I ran this place I'd see every 'off-topic' post as simply more keywords for google to index!


Just my $.02



posted on Jan, 15 2012 @ 05:15 AM
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Don't consider my response as an official response. Just a different point fo view.


Originally posted by TrueAmerican
1) The potential for two threads on the same topic to compete, based on quality. Maybe you have a different slant that will attract different comments in your thread? Maybe you have done more research or have more knowledge about a topic? Maybe your post is just better? As it is now, your thread would get locked. Doesn't matter.


Even though your thread may have been closed, it doesn't stop you from adding your well researched post or knowledgeable opinion to the existing thread. ATS is not a "competition", i.e. no reason for threads or members to "compete". We're here to share information. Let's say you want to do research on a topic. Let's say "elephants". And you try Wikipedia to broaden your knowledge... Imagine you have to read two different articles on the same topic... Some information contained is accurate and some are only contained in one article, so you HAVE to read both articles to know everything about elephants. Wouldn't it be more convenient if you started off with ONE article containing all the information?

And let's say a certain topic is "debunked" in one thread, but because people are following either one thread or another the one thread may continue without even "knowing" that the topic has been debunked...



2) The potential for increased posts, topics, and thus better ATS standing on website rankings. If there are two threads on some topics, let's face it, they are going to bring in more replies than one. That will help boost the numbers, which will help boost the site. Hoping the admins will see this, cause it never hurts to propose an idea that can possibly help ATS rise further.

Again - as above. Yes, you may get two ATS hits when searching for a topic on Google. But you still have to read both.



3) Increased topic exposure. Let's face it again, two threads on the same topic mean more exposure than one. Double your pleasure with doublethread gum!

Why more exposure? ONE popular thread can mean just as much or even more than two threads with divided popularity...



4) Less work for mods? Not sure on this one, maybe a mod or two could weigh in?

Not sure why it would be less work? Same amount of work as in the past, only now mods have to check if there are already 2 existing threads on the topic or not. And now two threads have to be followed/read to be moderated, instead of one.



5) Less work for members? Thread starters don't have to be so conscious about using ATS Search all the time to check for an existing thread. Hey your topic was posted, but it's cool, cause now two are allowed.

Nope. They will still have to "Search" to make sure their thread isn't thread #3 on the topic.

To be totally honest. I don't think it's a great idea in this case. It would result in some chaos, especially if you're trying to follow events that are currently unfolding, such as "Reports of Osama Bin Laden's capture just in!" for example. It's already hard to stay on top of events as they unfold with just one thread (or two such as with B.A.N. and "other" topics)...

As I explained above, the duplicate thread rule is in place (amongst other reasons) because it simply makes sense to keep all information in one thread.

That said, we give some leniency if there are existing threads - but they're old and "dead" or if people give a good "alternative approach" on an existing topic.

I can see the next person jumping in and say "Why stop at 2 duplciate threads? Why not 3? Or 4? Or why any limit at all?

Didn't want to "shoot down" your idea. Just can't imagine anything practical about it.



posted on Jan, 15 2012 @ 05:19 AM
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Originally posted by Pr0t0
For breaking news, as it's breaking I agree. For anything with any length, history and content to it I disagree because, firstly for both internal search and search engine results you want keywords associated to take you to the most accurate information, with the least amount of searching.


The thing is, ats search would probably list the very same two topics in response to a search query as number 1 and 2. Google lists millions of results for search queries, so I don't really see this as a problem.

I know I like options, as do many of you, and a two thread system gives a person a second option on the same topic. Respond and bump the one you like, that simple.



posted on Jan, 15 2012 @ 05:19 AM
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no, I dont think so. When elections or an impending military action we would be swarmed and essentially out flooded from any real topic we would want to talk about.

I think the influx of "goal oriented" posts is indicative of the effect that would have. The only saving grace is that we can just jump to other threads that we think are more productive.



posted on Jan, 15 2012 @ 07:36 AM
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Sometimes ONE thread per topic is too much.
I don't see any advantage in allowing two threads per topic. In fact, it sounds like a nightmare. There are already too many duplicate threads.



posted on Jan, 15 2012 @ 08:19 AM
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reply to post by TrueAmerican
 


I don't think that the "pros" you listed are real, because, from what I have seen, when we have two or more threads about some topic, there's a "natural selection" of threads, with the ones that appear more at the top of the recent posts/threads list being the one that gets more visits/posts. That doesn't mean that that thread would be the better one, as I have also seen a three posts thread with more information than a 3 page thread on the same topic.

The "competition" between threads would be more a question of which was the most visible, not which was the best.

There wouldn't be any increased posts, as the more visible thread would get them all, and there wouldn't be any increased topic exposure for the same reason.

If we got five threads about some topic (it has happened many times), the mods would have to look for the first two, close the extra threads and point any interested members to both threads, but from what I have seen, most people would follow the first link and ignore the second, so we would be back to a one thread per topic situation.

I don't think it would work as intended.



posted on Jan, 15 2012 @ 11:15 AM
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I have to agree with Gemwolf on this. Changing the thread count rule would for sure inject a chaos factor in to a site where chaos is already on the edge at any given time. And it would also flood the recent topics widgets, as it did when ATS was protesting SOPA (good idea with that protest by the way, lol).

The last thing ATSers need is added chaos.



posted on Jan, 15 2012 @ 11:28 AM
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reply to post by TrueAmerican
 


There already is a two thread rule if you think about it, where a thread can go into a forum such as General Conspiracies or U/A and if it fits criteria for Breaking Alternative News it can go there so technically this is already a rule.

I think two threads in one forum is insane.
There are already toooo many duplicates of threads because people don't look before they post. Why have two threads? It's already a cluttered mess, why add to it?



This will also make it easier for those members who love to steal the spotlight from others to have an excuse to make a duplicate thread and get more recognition. I see it happen often, if this were a rule it would be worse. Many on here just want attention and this would help them. I have no life lol so I'm on here often and see many patterns over time of certain members.

It's really not hard to search the forums before posting. People imo are just lazy or want attention. It takes less than 2mins to check ATS for a previous thread. I know I don't want to spend time making a thread only to have it deleted or closed because there was one already.

Here is how I check: recent posts page, the BAN forum, the forum I'd put the thread in, the search function and then the "New Topic Fire-hose." There are many threads I thought about sharing but after looking on ATS I found they were previously posted already.

I am on ATS all the time and I see so many duplicates it drives me nuts, just check my inbox and you will see my alerts for such threads.
If this were a rule I'd go insane and I'm sure mods would too! They have enough to mod, why add more threads that aren't needed?

I liked the one suggestion Zorgon had about combining duplicate threads when they happen so you can get the information from one to the other because yes sometimes a duplicate thread will have good information in it that should be seen, otherwise it will just get lost in the forum when it's closed.

Here is his thread
Thread Closed vs Merged




posted on Jan, 15 2012 @ 12:07 PM
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Right. Ok.

Bad idea. No problem. Is why I wanted more opinions, and this is exactly as I was expecting.

The end.



posted on Jan, 15 2012 @ 06:24 PM
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reply to post by TrueAmerican
 


no ! once you accept 2 - you open the the floodgate for 3 - 1 is enough ,



posted on Jan, 15 2012 @ 07:19 PM
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reply to post by TrueAmerican
 


No. What we need is some way to 'poll' each thread. A user should be able to see a summary of each thread. That summary would indicate the two main points-of-view of the thread, how many people were on each side, and what the overall conclusion of the thread was.

Follow my train of thought here - almost every thread on ATS is essentially a debate about the topic at hand. Users present what opinions and evidence they have, and at some point each thread reaches some sort of conclusion based on those opinions and evidence. The summary should have a list of links to the most flagged and starred posts in the thread.

ATS threads are a global conversation. Without a way to catalogue, rank and show the outcome of each thread, we risk losing a lot of quality and end up rehashing things over and over. SOME topics should "end" at some point - until further evidence is provided, or an alternative point of view. We should be able to see that at the current time, most of our users think that, for example, 9/11 was an organised false flag, with links to the relevant threads / posts.

Some of you might already realise that I don't really know what I am talking about and have no idea how to design it. I hope that some understand what I am trying to get at and can help to "flesh it out". I see ATS as a wealth of information, poorly organised, with duplicate content and no "outcome" to any topic. It's like the news - so, this and that happened, omg how terrible, what are we going to do, humans are disgusting, end of story, on to the next thread.

I believe there must be a way to turn our conversations and opinions into ACTION. We need to attract more "professional" posts, spread the conversation, have some links to where you can help take action, grow into a more authoritative resource on topics affecting our world. We have a lot of people on ATS who don't know how to argue properly, are close-minded and uneducated - but on the other hand we have a lot of people who are able to take on new ideas, present a good argument, and follow a thread through to it's "temporary conclusion", meaning, that until new ideas or evidence are presented, this particular topic is "solved" - it cannot really be discussed any further.

ATS should be more like an encyclopaedia of knowledge. If we can start to catalogue the threads and information correctly, I think we can get somewhere. Users with sufficient experience on ATS should be given privilege and be able to take certain actions on posts. If someone is simply not making any sense, or there is no value in their post, that post should be able to be voted down to irrelevancy. On the other hand, if a post has a lot of value, information, evidence, it should be promoted, it should be set as the current "agreed conclusion" of the thread, or as one of the more important posts in the thread, until someone can prove otherwise.

Unfortunately, I feel that I have not expressed myself properly and I seriously hope someone can understand what I am driving at better than I can explain it. Too much information and "decisions" are lost here in ATS, only to be rehashed again and again without taking into account important data from other threads.



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