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“Citizens may resist unlawful arrest to the point of taking an arresting officer's life"

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posted on Jan, 14 2012 @ 10:27 PM
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Originally posted by Nite_wing
Be careful here. Don't generlize such a statement. The John Bad Elk (1900) case was the only U.S. Supreme Court case. The other cases were state cases with maybe one or two appellate cases. I no longer have Lexus to Shepardize the cases but in our state, you do not resist for any reason. It is a separate charge from the probable cause for arrest. You will go to jail and you will get prison time if you resist with violence, even if the arrest was unlawful.


While I do agree with you, the statement was taken directly from the source www.constitution.org... so I left it at that.

It is an interesting case and one for discussion. Nothing more.

Peace




posted on Jan, 14 2012 @ 10:30 PM
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Now you would want to be ignorant to this law if something were to happen, and help lead your lawyer to this conclusion, otherwise they could construe it as premeditated

But the Leos need to know the federal law on this subject matter, so they might walk a straighter line



posted on Jan, 14 2012 @ 10:39 PM
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reply to post by sweetnlow
 


Not really. It is merely the law in that jurisdiction. Not the entire U.S.



posted on Jan, 14 2012 @ 10:43 PM
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Maybe I'm being cynical but i feel that resisting arrest in any way would just backfire. I definitely see your point and I think its awesome that we have that right but how many cops do you think are truly aware of this court ruling? And how many do you think would even care?



posted on Jan, 14 2012 @ 10:43 PM
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reply to post by Nite_wing
 


Plummer v. State, 136 Ind. 306. This premise was upheld by the (Supreme Court of the United States) in the case: John Bad Elk v. U.S., 177 U.S. 529.

The Supreme court upheld it, which makes it the law of the land



posted on Jan, 14 2012 @ 10:47 PM
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reply to post by ShadowOblivionX
 


I think they would care if they knew the citizenry could dropem dead in the streets if the law enforcement was jeopardizing citizens lives by their arrogance, which has always been the case, and very tragic ones for the unfortunate citizens



posted on Jan, 14 2012 @ 10:54 PM
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Originally posted by ShadowOblivionX
Maybe I'm being cynical but i feel that resisting arrest in any way would just backfire. I definitely see your point and I think its awesome that we have that right but how many cops do you think are truly aware of this court ruling? And how many do you think would even care?


I would think that this ruling spread through the law enforcement community very quickly. Most likely met with outrage.

Some would understand and agree but many would just not care I believe.



posted on Jan, 14 2012 @ 10:57 PM
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My child hood friend became cop in my home city. We have problems with corruption and vigilante cop justice, like after work hours. He was never involved but told me things done or implied that explain why they are being investigated by the FBI. which they are.

He basically laid it out to me like this. There are criminals that know the law better than they do. The cops started out with noble purposes to eradicate the untouchables, but eventually, after being self justified, they never stopped.

The same would be true if this were to be embraced. We would never stop. It's better to not start. I am not talking about perking up your behind and offering a cigarette after. I am just saying, there are more effective ways of dealing with wrongful detainment.



posted on Jan, 14 2012 @ 11:01 PM
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Originally posted by casenately
My child hood friend became cop in my home city. We have problems with corruption and vigilante cop justice, like after work hours. He was never involved but told me things done or implied that explain why they are being investigated by the FBI. which they are.

He basically laid it out to me like this. There are criminals that know the law better than they do. The cops started out with noble purposes to eradicate the untouchables, but eventually, after being self justified, they never stopped.

The same would be true if this were to be embraced. We would never stop. It's better to not start. I am not talking about perking up your behind and offering a cigarette after. I am just saying, there are more effective ways of dealing with wrongful detainment.


I agree that we should not take this to the streets because interpretation is always personal and many times wrong.

But I also believe that every citizen should be aware of their rights and know this law so as to be able to use it as precedence in a court of law.

Having said that, if the police were to understand this, there would be less chances to test the limits of the ruling as well.

We are almost in agreement with each other...Almost...



Peace




edit on 14-1-2012 by jude11 because: (no reason given)



posted on Jan, 14 2012 @ 11:07 PM
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Well something needs to be brought to a . before it gets totally out of hand, the motos on the Police cars used to be SERVE AND PROTECT, then along came the insurance companies telling the cops that its about protecting their assets, then the private investors started telling them its all about the money, So the serve and protect ideology went out the window and abuse came on the menu to serve everyone but the citizens



edit on 14-1-2012 by sweetnlow because: (no reason given)



posted on Jan, 15 2012 @ 02:09 AM
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Suppose you are a witness to an ulaawful arrest....like a rodney king deal.....the victim, Possibly being beaten to death....
Is it leagal then to throw down with your Hbar, and take out the boy/ or boys... in blue from afar?
It would seem so by the example given......



posted on Jan, 15 2012 @ 02:44 AM
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Originally posted by Chadwickus

You then have to run the gauntlet with the courts who will ultimately decide your fate.



Cops will kill you here in the US. They also torture you right out in public with electricity now - whereas the soviets had the decency to take you to a private room for the electro-torture, those classy guys.

Sometimes it is better to be judged by 12 than carried by six.



posted on Jan, 15 2012 @ 03:06 AM
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Does this mean if they go around and start collecting guns you have the right to tell them to go fish and when they try to arrest you you can resist under the castle law if your state has one when they force there way in illegally.



posted on Jan, 15 2012 @ 03:59 AM
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Extreme measures for extreme times.

I don't think I would try this unless SHTF.

In which case, gloves are off.



posted on Jan, 15 2012 @ 07:26 AM
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Some people provide legal precedent, when being falsely arrested

others provide KY jelly.

madness..



posted on Jan, 15 2012 @ 07:45 AM
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To everyone saying that this is not how it was supposed to be understood in the courts...

Well it is. The SCOTUS has upheld justified resistance up to and including taking the life of an officer in many, many cases.

It is federal law, not state law. It is every US citizens right to resist unjust detainment or to resist an unjust law. No matter what state you reside in.

And just for the record, you don't have to deal with "the courts"...

You have to deal with a jury of your peers. Jury nullification. Read it, learn it, teach it.



posted on Jan, 15 2012 @ 07:46 AM
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Great find and thread OP. Since ignorance of the law is not a defence in the USA and new laws are enacted everyday, it may still rest on the individual's determination as to whether the arrest seemed "legal" or not to them, at the time. Law enforcement personel are trained to control a situation and detain anyone involved, then determine the facts. They are often more ignorant of the laws they are enforcing than the average citizen.



posted on Jan, 15 2012 @ 08:35 AM
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reply to post by jude11
 


In regards to your OP, very true but, as former law enforcement myself i can say this. It depends entirely on wether or not the officer believes the amount of force used was necessary. If they "believe" their life was in danger thay have the right to protect it, and theres no way to tell if theyre lying or not when it comes to believing something.

Now in the case of unarmed people like that mentally ill man who was beaten to death in San Francisco by 4 cops, those cops need to be executed.

Cops need to start being held by the same standards other citizens are because they abuse their authority way too much and that badge shields them from things it should not to the point they can literally murder someone in cold blood and get a paid vacation for it. WTF is wrong with this planet? Is everyone losing their moral compass? These are nothing but days of lawlessness when even justice hides under his bed in fear.

This government is corrupt through and through and it's going to collapse in on itself just like ancient Rome did because this is exactly how it started when Rome fell. They had too many wars, overextended their teritory, the people were being abused and mistreated by authority and they got tired of it.

More and more citizens will end up arming themselves and when they see cops coming they will shoot first and ask questions later because you reap what you sow and cops sow nothing but fear and terror and they do not make anyone feel safe. The worst i ever done is get speeding tickets and they don't make me feel safe, in fact i feel threatened in their presence.



posted on Jan, 15 2012 @ 08:38 AM
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Now back to the planet Earth: in a perfect world killing the cop for unlawful arrest would probably work. In a real life you will get sodomized and crucified (not necessarily in that order). Call me a chicken but I would not try this, only as a last resort if you have nothing left to lose.



posted on Jan, 15 2012 @ 08:57 AM
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Originally posted by PURIFIER
Now back to the planet Earth: in a perfect world killing the cop for unlawful arrest would probably work. In a real life you will get sodomized and crucified (not necessarily in that order). Call me a chicken but I would not try this, only as a last resort if you have nothing left to lose.


With the NDAA I don't think we have much left to lose...

Second line.




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