A few questions for those who believe that UFO's are manned by interstellar fairing aliens., page 15

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reply posted on 16-1-2012 @ 07:21 PM by primoaurelius

All of these questions either assume that aliens biology is exactly like ours or assume that our technology is the cream of the crop. Both of these are probably not truths. We hear these stories, or for some of us, we see them, and it seems impossible, but we do not know all the secrets of the universe, and there are many mysteries yet to be solved, indeed there are mysteries to be solved to problems we haven't begun to understand.

reply posted on 16-1-2012 @ 08:36 PM by Outrageo

1. ... current propulsion technology. Your take on this?

"...current propulsion technology"? Current (human) propulsion technology is not utilized (by interstellar travelers), rendering the question irrelevant.

2. ... it is known without a doubt that any engine that is used would need... ...thus requires... Your take on this?

It is NOT known, it is UNknown (by humans), and doubts abound. And humans have yet to fathom what is "required" for interstellar travel.

3 ."Nanospying"?

Silly humans. It is not only feasible, but has been operational for far longer than you can imagine. And much else besides.

.End

edit on 1/16/2012 by Outrageo because: ∞

reply posted on 16-1-2012 @ 08:36 PM by AnthraAndromda

reply to post by wemadetheworld

I guess you didn't read where I said that I wasn't Physicist.

I'm not an ecconomist either, but all of Earth's financial issues can be solved by simply dumping all the petty greed,, and abolishing all forms of currency. This has worked on countless worlds across 7 galaxies.
.

reply posted on 16-1-2012 @ 08:46 PM by AnthraAndromda

Originally posted by SkuzzleButt
the ufos we see could just be little ships that have left the mothership, the mothership could be the size of a city and cloaked

I find it a bit funny how everyone thinks that large ships need to be cloaked. I'm guessing it is lack of experience or something.

Think about this for a moment ...A straship 3km in length X 2.5km wide X700m high. Semi-rough flat black texture on hull exterior, no lights. Do you think you could see that at 100,000km? I bet ya can't. And, frm personal exeience, it is very difficult to see at 100km ... hint, look for the void.

reply posted on 16-1-2012 @ 09:09 PM by refused

1. Many people have claimed that UFO's can accelerate 90 degrees relative to their position. Many scientists have concluded that such aerial maneuvering can create gravitational forces so great it would flatten any living creature like a pancake. Your take on this?

First of all, I don't like how you refer to human scientists as if they're the expert on the universe at large. I think that if another race of intelligent beings were capable of creating such transportation technology, they'd be capable of creating ways to handle such forces. Perhaps the technology and/or SCIENCE (key word) they use is advanced enough that the maneuvers they make create no G-forces on the inhabitants at all? If they have interstellar space ships, is that such a far-fetched theory? (Science is a key word because we ourselves, at this stage in our own "advanced" civilization, are still at a primitive understanding of our own science)

2. To cross the vast distances of the stars, it is known without a doubt that any engine that is used would need to be extremely vast and thus requires a huge star ship. Most UFO reportings are of objects from as small as 3m across to a mile. Such machinery is not capable of achieving the high speeds required to cover the astronomical distances in a feasibly short time, and any advanced civilization capable of travelling to the stars would not waste such high amounts of energy or a long time to just spy on humans. Your take on this?

Without who's doubt? Who says their machinery can't do what? And how the hell do they know this at all?...

What if energy itself was abundant in unlimited supply embedded in the very fabric of reality? I'm talking about Zero Point Energy. What if it literally cost nothing to travel those distances, and the technology they use to harness such energy could be as small as a microchip (or smaller depending on how the zero point field works [I'm no scientist]). Just a theory, I have no proof obviously.

Now I'm going out on a stretch here because the last sentence of this question draws on pure personal speculation about the theory on WHY aliens are coming here at all. Suppose aliens do exist. Suppose their technology is so incredibly sophisticated that if we saw it, we'd likely mistake it for some divine religious or magical event. Why the hell would they come to our crappy side of the galaxy to watch us destroy each other?

Well... what if they created us? Outrageous, I know, but... is it really that outrageous? I mean, we're creating human-rabbit embryos and we're still a "primitive" species by "their" standards. Why would they create us? Who knows. Why do mysterious intergalactic alien civilizations do anything at all?

3. An alien civilization capable of traveling to the stars most likely have cloaking technology at their disposal. They have also most likely mastered nanotechnology and the many other scientific areas that we have yet to even begin to slightly understand. Would it not be feasible to have unmanned, cloaked aircraft that are very small but sufficient enough to serve the purpose of spying on humans?

I assume you're saying that, if the aliens wanted to "spy" on us, they could do it in complete secrecy. That's probably true. But what if they don't want to be a secret? What if their plan involves us being aware of their existence? And what is their plan, if they even have one? They must be so technologically, spiritually and intellectually advanced to be capable of any of these things that, should one come down to earth to explain their actions to us, would we even understand what they said?

This is all bigger than any Earthly concept. You need to think outside the box. Aliens aren't 'spying' on us. They could be observing us, protecting us, preparing us or steering us or any number of inconceivable things.

And besides, in that last question, you answered all of your own:

They have also most likely mastered many other scientific areas that we have yet to even begin to slightly understand.

Therefore, it's logical to assume that it's possible that these aliens are so far beyond us that we could be incapable of even wrapping our heads around WHAT they're doing, let alone WHY they're doing it. I believe in a few things on this subject; I believe that aliens are real and are visiting us. I believe they want to be seen. I believe that they're intelligent enough to know that sudden unexpected mass disclosure would only frighten the crap out of the entire human race who live under a rock in our tiny bubble of space, and I believe that if their plan was to annihilate us we wouldn't be having this conversation.

I believe we have no idea what they're doing and that's exciting at best, horrifying at worst. I guess we'll all just have to wait and find out. But never give up the search for truth!

edit on 16-1-2012 by refused because: (no reason given)

edit on 16-1-2012 by refused because: fixed broken link

reply posted on 16-1-2012 @ 09:32 PM by lamonster99

reply to post by MathematicalPhysicist

1) I have always thought that the propulsion used is based on a gravitic drive type system. If this is the case, you control gravity, you should be able to control inertia. Basically balance the direction of ships inherent inertia to the interior and occupants.
2)gravitic drive. If they are visiting, standard chemical propellants do not apply.
(I duck here). Element 115?
3) maybe a limited exposure is warranted to condition us.

reply posted on 16-1-2012 @ 10:02 PM by avatar01

Not sure if any of these have been answered cause I didn't read the thread. Taking this on as more of a trivia challenge... here goes:

Originally posted by MathematicalPhysicist
1. Many people have claimed that UFO's can accelerate 90 degrees relative to their position and other maneuvers that contradict the underlying physical principles of current propulsion technology. What many scientists have concluded is that such aerial maneuvering can create gravitational forces so great (hundreds of times that of Earth) and would flatten any living creature like a pancake. Your take on this?

I've heard that some craft will create a "gap" in space which surrounds the craft. Laws of physics do not apply within this bubble. Keep in mind our technology and scientific knowledge is only some hundred years old and we are only really beginning learning how to master our physical universe. Imagine the technology we might have in another thousand years. Certainly the ability to create such craft is not outside of reason, although it falls outside of most people's ability to comprehend. The idea of 'television' would have been equally absurd to you a couple hundred years ago.

Originally posted by MathematicalPhysicist
2. To cross the vast distances of the stars, it is known without a doubt that any engine that is used would need to be extremely vast and thus requires a huge star ship. Most UFO reportings are of objects from as small as 3 m across to a one mile. Such machinery is not capable of achieving the high speeds required to cover the astronomical distances in a feasibly short time, and any advanced civilization capable of travelling to the stars would not waste such high amounts of energy or a long time to just spy on humans. Your take on this?

First, you assume they weren't already here...

Second, the laws of science are only applicable to physical reality. Again, if the craft can pop out of physical reality (into some form of hyper dimension) it can likely travel at any rate without using much energy at all.

It is also likely that an advanced civilization would use some form of 'wormhole' technology to connect two distant points in space to form a gateway.

I doubt their main objective is to "spy on humans". They mainly come here for our resources, for example water, DNA, Gold, etc.

Originally posted by MathematicalPhysicist
3. An alien civilization capable of travelling to the stars has most likely mastered the physics of optics, and have cloaking technology at their disposal. Not only that, but they have also most likely mastered nanotechnology and the many other scientific areas that we have yet to even begin to slightly understand. In practice, would it not be feasible to have unmanned, cloaked aircraft that are very small but sufficient enough to serve the purpose of spying on humans?

Yes it would be feasible.

You sound a bit paranoid. Why do you think aliens want to spy on you?

reply posted on 17-1-2012 @ 02:11 PM by Andromerius

1. Yes, gravitational forces will do that, but it is now known that you negate those effects with anti-gravity. For a race millions of years more advanced then ours this should be teached in first grade. Even now, some of our pilots use special suits to negate a bit of the G forces they experience in fighter jets, what would a race millions of years ahead of us do?

2. It might seem that it is a huge waste of energy, because you are thinking about 20th century technology. Even now, a computer cpu wastes 80% less energy then one 20 years ago... Again, a race millions of years ahead of us will probably have better energy conservation then us, no? Besides, we think you need huge amounts of energy to navigate the cosmos, but that might not be so.

3. And who said they do not use it? Have you ever saw a real alien? No! So, for all intents and purposes, they might all be unmanned

Even us humans now use a lot of unmanned space probes and airplanes.

Originally posted by MathematicalPhysicist
1. Many people have claimed that UFO's can accelerate 90 degrees relative to their position and other maneuvers that contradict the underlying physical principles of current propulsion technology. What many scientists have concluded is that such aerial maneuvering can create gravitational forces so great (hundreds of times that of Earth) and would flatten any living creature like a pancake. Your take on this?
2. To cross the vast distances of the stars, it is known without a doubt that any engine that is used would need to be extremely vast and thus requires a huge star ship. Most UFO reportings are of objects from as small as 3 m across to a one mile. Such machinery is not capable of achieving the high speeds required to cover the astronomical distances in a feasibly short time, and any advanced civilization capable of travelling to the stars would not waste such high amounts of energy or a long time to just spy on humans. Your take on this?
3. An alien civilization capable of travelling to the stars has most likely mastered the physics of optics, and have cloaking technology at their disposal. Not only that, but they have also most likely mastered nanotechnology and the many other scientific areas that we have yet to even begin to slightly understand. In practice, would it not be feasible to have unmanned, cloaked aircraft that are very small but sufficient enough to serve the purpose of spying on humans?

I'll come up with more questions as the thread progresses.

reply posted on 17-1-2012 @ 03:18 PM by Gazrok

reply to post by MathematicalPhysicist

Excellent questions....

1. Many people have claimed that UFO's can accelerate 90 degrees relative to their position and other maneuvers that contradict the underlying physical principles of current propulsion technology. What many scientists have concluded is that such aerial maneuvering can create gravitational forces so great (hundreds of times that of Earth) and would flatten any living creature like a pancake. Your take on this?

If we assume the beings are able to manipulate gravity, and traverse space using warping similar to wormhole theory, then this same manipulation can be used to nullify the g-forces inside the craft. If this is so, we'd have more G's making a sharp turn in a car, than these aliens would experience in a 90 degree turn.

2. To cross the vast distances of the stars, it is known without a doubt that any engine that is used would need to be extremely vast and thus requires a huge star ship. Most UFO reportings are of objects from as small as 3 m across to a one mile. Such machinery is not capable of achieving the high speeds required to cover the astronomical distances in a feasibly short time, and any advanced civilization capable of travelling to the stars would not waste such high amounts of energy or a long time to just spy on humans. Your take on this?

This entire conjecture is based on our current understanding of physics, energy sources, and propulsion. Alien beings may utilize forms of these completely incomprehensible to us. Just think of how much we've micronized our own technology, just in a few short decades. I can store more information, for example, in my phone, than I could in 100 computers I used as a kid. Kind of mind-boggling when you consider it really. High speeds? No, that wouldn't work. Without the ability to warp spacetime, even aliens would be stuck exploring their own star system in any kind of realistic time. Even going light speed, it would take us over 4 years to get to the nearest star system, for example.

3. An alien civilization capable of travelling to the stars has most likely mastered the physics of optics, and have cloaking technology at their disposal. Not only that, but they have also most likely mastered nanotechnology and the many other scientific areas that we have yet to even begin to slightly understand. In practice, would it not be feasible to have unmanned, cloaked aircraft that are very small but sufficient enough to serve the purpose of spying on humans?

Maybe, maybe not. All depends on their motivations and technology. For all we know, they may have warp drives, but be baffled by the concept of a microwave oven. We can't make such assumptions. Especially if they haven't had the need for defense style thinking in eons. Also, maybe they do have such drones? After all, occupant sightings have vastly decreased over time (relatively speaking), while UFO sightings are way, way up.

reply posted on 17-1-2012 @ 03:28 PM by cloaked4u

My theory. Manipulation of the mass is why they feel no inertia. STATIC electric mechanism versuse light energy. just a thought.

reply posted on 17-1-2012 @ 04:09 PM by Helmkat

reply to post by MathematicalPhysicist

1: Obviously they have mastered the force of Gravity. In Star Trek they call it an "inetial dampening field" or some such.

2: At our level of tech they would have to be huge. With the tech of a people a millenia or two ahead of us? probably not so huge.

3: If the alien species didn't have eyes why would they cloak? and why would every people even care to hide, some probably just don't care (kind of like why would you hide your safari vehicle from the Chimps.)

reply posted on 17-1-2012 @ 04:51 PM by MADmarine86

Wow, I have been a long time ATS viewer [snipped] I decided to make an account and reply. First of all yes Aliens are real, yes they have vehicles that can travel thru space, eventually this will be physics 101 to the human race. They are real, we have footage of many different types of space craft that are not terresteral. And to answer this dummys question these craft are able to handle these "impossible" manuevers because they are in their own gravatonal bubble so to speak, therefore exempt from the laws of physics that governs your dumbass on this planet. The science is real, its proven by many people, even a regular civillain has built and flown a "ufo". Look up John Searle....

edit on Tue Jan 17 2012 by DontTreadOnMe because: We expect civility and decorum within all topics - Please Review This Link.

reply posted on 4-2-2012 @ 05:05 AM by deckdel

reply to post by MADmarine86

First I have to say, it is total ignorance of scientific thinking, to claim UFOs would defy laws of physics by any means. There is absolutely no such evidence that any of the UFOs would do anything which would not reside within our current frame of understanding.

Standing again on more PHYSICS side of the story, it is good to read the book Unconventional Flying Objects, where a NASA engineer with experiments, data and mathematics clearly explain how UFOs, while performing very impressive technologies, still do not violate our current knowledge (in his case, that of 1970s!!)

I myself enjoyed reading Paul Hill's engineering statements, since these are based on rock solid physics and practical data from tests. And when finished that book, understanding "WHAT" UFOs technically are (the "how" part is a totally other story) - there is absolutely no, not a slightest, problem or controversy relating to UFOs as physical, traveling vehicles. Some of them inter-stellar, some of the for local expeditions.

What comes to claims about distances and light speed - people simply forget that when you reach 95% or above speed of light, the crew will experience travels which for those outside the vehicle would be perceived as years, decades even centuries, while inside that vehicle, they would experience it only as some weeks, or months.

Recommending buying and reading that book, and we can close this sort of questions...

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