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A few questions for those who believe that UFO's are manned by interstellar fairing aliens.

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posted on Jan, 14 2012 @ 12:18 PM
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Originally posted by laqueniquesi
reply to post by MathematicalPhysicist
 


1) Learn something man... do u know what is anti-gravity? doesn't look like. With a anti-gravitational field around the "pilot" of the space ship, he feels no acceleration neither g-forces. So they are able to do those turns at any speed.

2) Ok, u little criticizer who doesn't search for info... travelling large distances is by 2 ways mainly: (1) to wrap space, which give to the spaceship extreme speeds (a project NASA is trying) or (2) by controlled wormholes, which is easily seen when "alien" spaceships appear from nowhere. Now, for the size of the ships, did u know that around the sun there are ships huge as some planets? Use some logic, the ones we see on earth are small cause they have a mother-ship "not far away".

3) Well, yes they have cloaking (that's why the mother-ships are mainly seen during solar flares, cause these surround those ships, showing their shape and size), and yes they use small things, the 1 to 3 meter diameter unmanned flying objects. Yes that is yet small for an advanced civilisation cause it has to include in it anti-gravitational systems, electronics, receptors, navigation, "fuel", etc. They use those to spy us, most are cloaked (but still visible in other spectrum) but some few fail to, there is always a possibility on malfunction because of storms or electrostatics on our planet. While the big ones some see are another story, for example: abductions and visitors (they visit us like we visit a zoo...)

... Next Time, before saying something like this, inform yourself


1) Anti-gravity is an idea ! A freakin theory! Do u know what a theory is? Doesn't look like.

How the hell do you know how one feels in a ship with some field around it? Because you read comic books?

2)Warp speed is a theory. Nasa can't figure out anything. You are right about Wormholes ,they do exist;a fact, but it impossible to enlarge and open one, let alone know some aliens have figured it out and are playing mind games with the indigenous population. I suggest you read my previous posts . I guarantee you will learn something.

3) You don't know who is cloaking anything. You are inventing it. All in your mind.

You have no knowledge of anything except stuff on aliens. No evidence and all theories based on faith.

Cheers




posted on Jan, 14 2012 @ 12:18 PM
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Originally posted by kman420
reply to post by MathematicalPhysicist
 


I dont have to read your crap. Aliens exist period. Go preach your preschool level bible thumping illogical "flying spaghetti" man in the clouds BS to someone who still beleives in santa.

Its getting to the point where you not beleiving that aliens exist makes me want to round up all you ignorant douches and get rid of you, your kind of thinking is damaging to the human race and you dont deserve to speak.


No, it's thinking like the quote above, in response to logical arguments from known science which is damaging to the human race.



posted on Jan, 14 2012 @ 12:23 PM
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Originally posted by fg45rr1
Ah just another person claiming the old "to far to travel between stars". You know what? how the heck would our scientests know hmm? we arguably made it to our very own moon even if we did land on the moon a couple times it is to early to call out "to far to travel between stars" You don't know there planet could be much different what if there was a fule that went 50 light years a second possible? yes. unlikley can't say because we don't know anything "supposedly" all those sighting must leade up to something.



"What if"
"We made it to the moon"
"Could be"
"Must lead up to something"

Those were your comments in trying to explain why the OP is incorrect. When actually you basically confirmed to everyone you're delusional.

Try to learn , really try, about "hostile space". And be objective. Meaning use logic.



posted on Jan, 14 2012 @ 12:31 PM
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Originally posted by Darkmask
reply to post by MathematicalPhysicist
 
Man, don't be so smug. We are now doing things that were thought to be impossible 100 years ago. In another 100 years we will be doing things that we now think are impossible. Our knowledge of physics is not complete and we cannot say with certainty that certain things can or cannot be done. A Intelligent species that is hundreds or thousands of years more advanced than us would be able to do things that we think are impossible. That is pure logic you can't argue with, like it or not.



Why do you automatically go a 100 or 1000 years ahead of us? What's with that?

Please try to understand how hard it is to travel in "hostile space". It doesn't matter how different aliens are from us. Everyone(every IT) has to deal and attempt trying to master the same vicious elements from "hostile space". Whomever does it,, is God(s). Trust me you don't want God(s) taxing around earth.

That is pure logic



posted on Jan, 14 2012 @ 12:33 PM
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Originally posted by Diablos

I never alluded that one must be an expert to speak on a topic, no. But, the way some of these posters carry themselves by disregarding accepted scientific fact as if they understand the physics 100% in order to dismiss them is what comes off as both ignorant and arrogant.


Well, actually the allusion was there. Though the stength may be in the eyes of the reader.



What school did you attend? I'm only a second year student, and we pretty much have an elementary understanding of Maxwell's 8 equations that are taught in our multivariable calculus class. Of course, the total implications of the equations would most likely be emphasized in a physics curriculum rather than an engineering one, and may be much more rigorous in graduate school.


I attended California Polytechnic University, and Stanford University I have Masters degrees in both Electrical Engineering and Coputer Science. Both antiques (1974)
Maxwell had a bit more than was (I can't really speak to today, but see no indication that anything has changed) taught when I was in school. These equations as I found out were considered to complex to be "useful". But that was over 100 years ago, Times have changed, so you tell me. Is there any indication of scalar electromagnetics? Any talk about the properties of a Caduceus antenna? Or how about the temporal effects?



Seriously? SERIOUSLY? Physicists have known much longer before 1930 that there were many phenomena in the natural world that easily exceeded the speed of sound. Also, the speed of sound is dependent upon the properties of the medium it propagates through. For this reason, no serious scientist could have ever come to the conclusion that the sound barrier is a universal speed limit. If you are talking about the neutrino experiment, the uncertainty of that experiment is significant. Many of the physicists who participated in the experiment refuse to believe the results and wanted their names to not be added to the publication. Until other laboratories can confirm by experimentation, light will remain the universal speed limit.


So why was it that nearly everyone in that time was saying that the speed of sound could not be broken? And before that; exceeding 60mph would suck the air out of a person's lungs and kill him.

You look at these sort of things now and laugh a little. You have learned that it simply wasn't true.

Not just the Neutrino experiment, though that was quite interesting. There has been work, and indications for decades that c is not a universal speedlimit. Back in the later 70's (78 or so) I was helping a friend at SLAC (Stanford Linear Accelerator Center), where I was introduced to a few of the Physicists working there. They showed me data that they "insisted" was evidence of Tachyons. I don' t know what the final disposition of their data was, that wasn't y concern. But, the data was unusual, Inlater years it has been shown that the speed of light isn't really constant, but has some dependence of the medium through which the light is propagating, not unlike sound.



You do realize that photons are a property of light?


Oh gee... Do you mean that the photon isn't quanta of electrmagnetic radiation? If my old Proph was still alive, I'd punch him on the nose! The nerve of lieing to us.



Wow, you speak with such authority and have probably not even done a time dilation calculation before.


Time dilation is a nice theory, however if fails to explain several logic issues. Consider the distance vs velocity issues in that. Inertial Frame Dragging; another theory, does a much better job at explaining that class of effect.
Frame dragging also does a much better job at explaining "why" c may be something like a speedlimit.

Oh, if imlementing time dilation equations in C++ qualifies as solving them, then yes, I've done that.



Maybe because micrometeorites are more common in deep space rather than our solar system? Despite that, the ISS's major concerns are micrometeorites as these things are quite a nuisance: www.universetoday.com...


But, you made it sound so ... insurmountable. And, yet, ISS is still in orbit, and manned. So, it would appear that micrometeors, while perhas a serious pain in the ass, are not all that difficult to deal with, even in an unshielded ship.



Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence. Surprising how an engineer as experienced as you could make such outlandish claims without any form of evidence.


So I need to provide you with something you already have before you will beleive?

I made no extraordinary claim in regards of FTL, I only made the observation that yoou have all the component parts to assemble the technology. It should be up to you to take the next step.

Etharzi od Oma



posted on Jan, 14 2012 @ 12:38 PM
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Originally posted by NOTurTypical

Originally posted by MathematicalPhysicist
1. Many people have claimed that UFO's can accelerate 90 degrees relative to their position and other maneuvers that contradict the underlying physical principles of current propulsion technology. What many scientists have concluded is that such aerial maneuvering can create gravitational forces so great (hundreds of times that of Earth) and would flatten any living creature like a pancake. Your take on this?
2. To cross the vast distances of the stars, it is known without a doubt that any engine that is used would need to be extremely vast and thus requires a huge star ship. Most UFO reportings are of objects from as small as 3 m across to a one mile. Such machinery is not capable of achieving the high speeds required to cover the astronomical distances in a feasibly short time, and any advanced civilization capable of travelling to the stars would not waste such high amounts of energy or a long time to just spy on humans. Your take on this?
3. An alien civilization capable of travelling to the stars has most likely mastered the physics of optics, and have cloaking technology at their disposal. Not only that, but they have also most likely mastered nanotechnology and the many other scientific areas that we have yet to even begin to slightly understand. In practice, would it not be feasible to have unmanned, cloaked aircraft that are very small but sufficient enough to serve the purpose of spying on humans?

I'll come up with more questions as the thread progresses.


I'm in the camp with Drs. J Allen Hynak, and Jacques Valle who think these "aliens" are not extraterrestrial, physical creatures, but are in fact inter-dimensional entities who can materialize and de-materialize at will in our 4 dimensions.



And you think jesus is god and the holy ghost. ,,,, Your point?

All you're doing is merging your faith into science. You do know , your awareness of "dimensions" comes from the Scientific community. You're just as delusional as the UFOers.



posted on Jan, 14 2012 @ 12:38 PM
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Originally posted by Cosmic911

Lots of theories...but we just don't know...

You all could just stop listening to theories and remember it yourself.



posted on Jan, 14 2012 @ 12:42 PM
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Dropping the G word into it all the time
face palm time again .

2nd line

G word , as in the religious term .
edit on 14-1-2012 by watchdog8110 because: (no reason given)



posted on Jan, 14 2012 @ 12:49 PM
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You are assuming advanced alien species, who may well have millions and millions of years on us evolution wise, have a human level understanding of physics.

Some sort of anti-gravity drive (which may be possible for an advanced species with a complete understanding of the workings of the universe) would in theory render the ship's occupants immune to inertia and gravitational "G's" if you will.



posted on Jan, 14 2012 @ 12:51 PM
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Originally posted by kman420
reply to post by MathematicalPhysicist
 


I dont have to read your crap. Aliens exist period. Go preach your preschool level bible thumping illogical "flying spaghetti" man in the clouds BS to someone who still beleives in santa.

Its getting to the point where you not beleiving that aliens exist makes me want to round up all you ignorant douches and get rid of you, your kind of thinking is damaging to the human race and you dont deserve to speak.

So next time you think of writing some bs you made up trying to cope with the fact god dosnt exist, Think twice, then a third time, Because nothing you say will change our minds. EVER. PERIOD> GET OVER IT.

We cant unsee the Ufo's weve seen, and beleive it or not, with a little faith you'd see one too. Which is far more than faith in god will ever get you.

You still really think your post would actually change any of our minds LMAO.
edit on 14-1-2012 by kman420 because: ignorance is bliss.


Then Don't read his crap!. Continue reading your own crap. Anyone who chooses to fill-in one's unsolved daunting universal question-gaps with "God" or "ET" is a delusional fool. A fool who choose to have "imagination" and "faith" trumping logic.

Just because of mathematics the amount of possible blue planets do to the sheer size of the cosmos; doesn't mean aliens existing is a fact. Especially aliens visiting us,,,,C'mon!

Its your strong faith that makes you think you are using logic.

Your stubborn ignorance is rooted deep with blind faith. Try learning about "hostile space".. Try


I bet you ,,I am changing your mind,,bit by bit. With time you will see you've been played by hollywood.



posted on Jan, 14 2012 @ 12:55 PM
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Originally posted by thoiter

Originally posted by dilly1

Originally posted by WeAreAWAKE
Personally, I believe that if there are "aliens" and "UFOs" that they are dimensional and not simply from another galaxy. I try to take the position of...what single answer explains "everything". "Everything" being aliens, ancient civilizations, 2012, the Bible, GOD, etc., etc. Again...not that I believe it...but the only thing that seems to answer "everything" is that these things would have to co-exist with us (or close to us or occasionally close to us) and appear "out of the blue". Therefore...dimensional. IMHO.


Personal belief is based on ?? Nothing really

You are totally brainwashed with all the crap society has been feeding you.

Dimensional is theoretical. Not a shred of evidence.



All science is theoretical at some stage. And to say there is no evidence of other dimensions is not correct.


Wow,,, you have the cojone's to tell me I am incorrect with not a lick of backing.

I'm waiting



posted on Jan, 14 2012 @ 01:16 PM
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Originally posted by MathematicalPhysicist
1. Many people have claimed that UFO's can accelerate 90 degrees relative to their position and other maneuvers that contradict the underlying physical principles of current propulsion technology. What many scientists have concluded is that such aerial maneuvering can create gravitational forces so great (hundreds of times that of Earth) and would flatten any living creature like a pancake. Your take on this?
2. To cross the vast distances of the stars, it is known without a doubt that any engine that is used would need to be extremely vast and thus requires a huge star ship. Most UFO reportings are of objects from as small as 3 m across to a one mile. Such machinery is not capable of achieving the high speeds required to cover the astronomical distances in a feasibly short time, and any advanced civilization capable of travelling to the stars would not waste such high amounts of energy or a long time to just spy on humans. Your take on this?
3. An alien civilization capable of travelling to the stars has most likely mastered the physics of optics, and have cloaking technology at their disposal. Not only that, but they have also most likely mastered nanotechnology and the many other scientific areas that we have yet to even begin to slightly understand. In practice, would it not be feasible to have unmanned, cloaked aircraft that are very small but sufficient enough to serve the purpose of spying on humans?

I'll come up with more questions as the thread progresses.


1. We donteven have a basic understanding of physics, as evidenced by the mistaken and long held belief that nothing can travel faster than light. We just recently discovered that neutrinos travel at 20 parts per million faster than light. Standard model does not work at all when you add the 4 constituent feld theories together. We have yet to have even a basic understanding of the nature or the cause of grvitation( higgs boson, still no where to be seen if it exists at all) string theory is a joke, the whole universe is just vibrating infinitly long and infinitly thin strings that when "plucked" their different " tones" cause all the particles an forces to exist like a guitar string makes music by vibrating the air around them, and it works great as long as you use N theory and keep adding another unporvable dimension every time you run into a problem. In short we know #.

2. To say that we know for a fact that we would need an engine of any perticular size to do anything if just ( I hate to use this word but) dumb. That is like saying in the 1800's we know that you can not fly ever, or break the sound barrier because the steam engine for that power would have to be to big to get off the ground. We know next to nothing about the universe or what is possible. If man would stop acting like we know everything and approach sciene from a we are still trying to learn because we are quite new to this philosophy we would be a lot farther then we are now.

3. I find most of these statments to be without fault or assumption, we know adaptive optics is real, we know cloaking is real, we know nanotech is not only real but potetially one of the most powerful discoveries of man. I agree that any species capable of traversing THE VOID between the stars would probably not send biologicals, however for all we know they discovered immortality 1,000,000 years ago thus making time irrelevant for them so it is still possible, unlikely but stll possible. Small " unmanned" drones are way more likely. You could just
produce them with nanotech send them out in all directions, have those produce more with nanotech in a star system to send out more.......... and explore a large swath of the universe while sitting on the "home "system.

BTW, very well phrased thought experiment across the board, these are the real questions we are running into when it comes to main stream science, as it applies to the UFO phenom!
edit on 14-1-2012 by reddwhite because: damned droid



posted on Jan, 14 2012 @ 01:21 PM
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Hmmm , pure energy , encapsulated in a nano tech structure . Making head way are we ?



posted on Jan, 14 2012 @ 01:25 PM
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reply to post by MathematicalPhysicist
 


1. Many reports have described gyroscopic enclosures that simulate gravity and inertia so that the space within the craft is essentially customized to the liking of the passengers... And unaffected by redirection or acceleration.

2. Known without a doubt that they,d be "huge"? Ever hear or Moore's law? ...technology naturally becomes smaller and more efficient as it progresses.

3. I think you're assuming things when you say they 'don't like huma nattention' just because people film them moving to another location... Who's to say there isn't another human somewhere else viewing their arrival when after they leave the first humans sight...and I would think it would be ignorant to assume these crafts inhabitants are all non human aliens.... Nazis were delivered tesla technology and developed anti raft bell craft back in the 40s. You can only imagine what the remnants of the nazi party have developed now.

It's not very mathematically theoretic to assume so much. It's unscientific



posted on Jan, 14 2012 @ 01:46 PM
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reply to post by dilly1
 


Dilly1 ---- Anti-gravity is not just an "idea." It is a reality based on fact. Have you ever played with magnet's --- my friend?

So as the old saying goes ---- "Like poles repel.... unlike poles attract."




Foofighter's


Erno86



posted on Jan, 14 2012 @ 01:51 PM
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1) Everything you have mentioned is either a theory or particles in the QUANTUM WORLD!! Wormholes exist ,,but in the quantum level. The micro world is whole different ball game when comparing it to the macro world. We would need new physics to con-join them.

2)We wouldn't need a certain sized engine. We would need new physics to travel in "hostile space". Flying in earth is a joke compared to traveling, not orbiting, infinite space.

3)Adaptive Optics doesn't help any being to accomplish traveling thru "hostile space".
Cloaking is not a fact,its a theory. Look it up. Nanotech is still in its infancy. Could it be a player in the very far future? Sure,,,and,, so what? Doesn't solve anything or give us a hopeful picture to explore space. Your immortality part is correct. But again your "Nano" ambitions is way too ambitious.



posted on Jan, 14 2012 @ 02:00 PM
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Originally posted by Erno86
reply to post by dilly1
 


Dilly1 ---- Anti-gravity is not just an "idea." It is a reality based on fact. Have you ever played with magnet's --- my friend?

So as the old saying goes ---- "Like poles repel.... unlike poles attract."




Foofighter's


Erno86


Thick skin remember?

Magnets can only perform "anti gravity on earth or anywhere with a strong gravitational pull. An Anti-gravity field-sphere(which is what we are talking about) for a craft in space is freakin star wars talk.

When someone has blind faith in alien-ufo jargon they will do anything to make there claim factual.


Welcome back Erno!



posted on Jan, 14 2012 @ 02:00 PM
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Originally posted by dilly1

I say achieving light speed for short travels. Yes light speed is impossible to achieve. Which is my point. Your not understanding my under-lining point.


Oh, I understand your point quite well. However, it seems that you are "stuck" on the theoretical. I've already stated that time dilation is a myth, and that the effects observed are better explained by frame dragging; another theory...for you anyway. Frame dragging effects have been observed by T. Humans, but, are still not well understood. But, this is not true for any species even 50 years ahead of you. For some these effects are employed to significant advantage in space travel.



Warp speed cannot be done easily and its not primitive. Its a theory , ,, just like "frame draggers"... You should look it up read about it slowly. So it sinks in.

Again!!!! Wormholes is impossible to control and open. Back to my under-lining point. Wow


whether One considers war drives primative or not is a matter of perspective. For you it is only a couple of theories, for the Zetas it is face, and they have coposed "laws" governing and describing the physical properrties. It has been reduced to a technology, one that provides great benefit to their species and culture. Without outside help, it will be the same for you.

Wormholes are not ipossible, very difficult perhaps. None of your local ETs have that technology yet. I'm not well versed in wormhole mechanics, but, I have seen ad touched devices that can generate and control them. These devices require vast amounts of power, and they seem to build very limited conduits.



Immortality is not some fantasy ploy. It is a requirement to be able to explore infinite space. Which is impossible to achieve!!!!! Again my under-lining point.

How the hell does some being that achieves immortality will get bored after 1000years.??? Your just inventing stuff. Its not some worry of not being entertained. It about needing to stop(or almost stop completely) aging so you can be successful traveling in an infinite space.

You(we, beings) can't do everything!!! Space is infinite. Are you serious. Please learn about "hostile space" ... Its clearly you know very little,just theories, about space.


Again, immortality is undesirable. It oesn't matter what the time period is; 10 yesrs, 10 billion years, With all of eternity available, One neccessarily must see and do everything, leaving nothing new to experience. This would make Ones life pointless

Yes space is infinite, the universe is finite, and thus the oportunity to experience is also finite.



My three points are to show everyone that believing aliens visiting earth constantly is a joke. Getting here is too hard. And if achieved we are all screwed. You do not want some being achieving the 3 points ,to suddenly land on mother earth. Trust me you don't.


Your three points are moot. They are simply technical issues to be solved.

While your three issues may not have been resolved, there are at present at least 8 different species near or on Earth. And, while space travel isn't easy, it is not impossible. Whether you want to admit it or not your species has solved most of the issues around deep space travel.

And, just why would you not want us to visit? You could derive great benefit from the right species.

Etharzi od Oma



posted on Jan, 14 2012 @ 02:03 PM
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reply to post by dilly1
 


Still believe??? Oh,,,, yes,, just like how christians and muslims believe. Enjoy your alien dogma.

Of course you believe in something too, right? Which you have no proof for either? Try adding something to the conversation instead of just tearing others down. Remember these are obviously only theories on a conspiracy theory forum. But you already know that judging by your Avatar. BTW, using Jesus name in vain on the boards might rub the T&C's the wrong way as well. Mods will let you know.

Edit: post by dilly1




edit on 14-1-2012 by intrptr because: added link



posted on Jan, 14 2012 @ 02:07 PM
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reply to post by dilly1
 


It has nothin to do with nano vs macro scale, they do in fact work together in the physical world, the fact we can't
make them play nice together on paper is proof positive we have it wrong.

Cloaking is real darpa just hid an event from time, mking it not only impossible to see it with the eye, but impossible to detect it at all. It never even happened. Not to mention the actual cloaking techniques we have created in our very early attempts. We are not talking here now human tech, this thread is about " alien civilizations" that we have no idea about.

I think my nanotech statement was cnservative if anything, we are not talking about us, we are talking a civilisation that might potetially be billions of years more advanced than us.



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