9/11: A Boeing 757 Struck the Pentagon, page 79

Good questions, but easy answers though.

Originally posted by Hunting Veritas Yes, how true. But please do show me a picture of the wall with 2, 9ft in diameter holes left by engines that weigh nearly 6 tonnes each. Wouldn't 12 tonnes of steel and titanium alloy going 500mph leave some sort of impression on the pentagon wall yet I have to find a picture that shows 2 engines that went into the wall. All what was seen right after the crash is a 16ft hole that goes, wasn't it like 3 of the outer rings. No other holes. The engines, wings, fusalage, tail, all just magically fitted into 1 hole roughly 16ft in diameter.

That's fairly easy. Not only can I show you the pictures where the engines went in, I can show you the pillars they hit as they penetrated the office space and the most likely spot where they ended up within the Pentagon. (I just happened to have been working on this information as a response to a different post but it'll respond to both posts just fine here.) It didn't all just fit into a single 16-foot hole, and the photographs support this, as does the damage to the building. Here is a photo of the front of the Pentagon before it collapsed and immediately after the first firefighters arrived and started extinguishing fires on the Pentagon facade. You can see at pillar 17 that it is smashed (all concrete is gone) and only the metal rebar spiral remains (bent to the left and inwards significantly). This was taken within 5 minutes if the plane hitting the Pentagon.

[click photo for larger image] Here is another photo of the front of the Pentagon before it collapsed. This one taken from the left of the damage zone, and before firefighters extinguished external fires. This was taken within 3 minutes of the plane hitting the Pentagon.

[click photo for larger image] You can see pillars 9, 10 and 11 are all but gone (they're completely obliterated with only partial spiral rebar remaining). You can also see that both pillars 9 and 10 are forced inwards and to the extreme left of their original position. The following graphic shows each column in relation to its position on floor 1 of the Pentagon, and the level of damage each pillar sustained. I have added what I feel is the best actual engine path after impact (the port engine hit the both columns 9 and 10, the starboard engine impacted column 17). You can see the path the engines took based on the damage to columns in their path. There are indeed minor changes to direction of each engine (they slammed into and off of large concrete pillars with internal spiral rebar). What makes total sense though is, when you check which columns along the engine impact path took what level of damage, everything fits perfectly.

[click graphic for larger version]

The above two photos (both clickable for larger versions) show the following: The graphic on the left shows column damage (direction, shape, and type of damage), the graphic on the right shows the damage zones within floor 1 of the Pentagon. After the starboard engine impacted the generator, part of it probably deflected upwards and left this imprint in the rock fact at the 5th floor (you can also see a fair number of other "scars" on the Pentagon from the impact of various parts -- a lot of people just fail to notice how much rock is missing from the facade of the Pentagon on the lower 2 floors in all the photos of the attack scene as well).

The starboard wing also sustained damage from the impact with the generator and most likely partially detached from the main body. This would further account for the upward angle and the wing imprint on the right side of the impact hole on the Pentagon. It also makes total sense that the engine would lose some of it's energy (momentum) from this first impact with the generator and it would be expected that the starboard engine would not penetrate the Pentagon as deeply as the port engine. The column damage within the Pentagon supports this premise. -- The information I've based the above on is all available online already in an independant non-government study called The Pentagon Performace Report done by the American Society of Civil Engineers and the Structural Engineering Institute. The link to this online PDF is available from a government site, or from the ASCE themselves if you'd prefer to pay $39.00 for it ($29 if you're a member). I just thought I'd mention this so everyone is aware that this is not a government publication but a publication by the ASCE. This is a publication done by civilians in the days following the attack on the Pentagon (within days). These are people who were granted access to the building to perform an inspection and assessment of the area impacted to see what was useable and what had to be replaced/upgraded/demolished. They also took the time to do core samples of pillars and test concrete and steel in many locations in the Pentagon to see just how strong the building was and how much of the concrete damage was from fire compared to impact. Read the document, it's superb material and it's extremely informative. What I have done with the above photos, and the information contained in the report is extrapolate based on pillar damage and impact evidence in photos what path(s) the engines took. Everyone is, of course, welcome to point out any mistakes or comments regarding this edivence and the conclusion I arrived at.

And why would a C-130 be flying over head?? Making sharp turns at low altitude?

That's also easy, and it's been responded to by numerous sources, including the pilot himself (and another member of that flight crew, but I would have to look back to find their names for you). That was one of the aircraft in the area that was asked by air traffic controllers to see if they could get a visual on a non-responsive AA flight 77 which was entering their airspace. The C130 tried to catch up to the 757 (which it had visual on for quite a while) but simply could not outpace it's 490-510mph speed. If you really want, I could go look up the information for you and quote sources. (spent about 3 hours doing yardwork in 90 degree weather just now so I'm not very motivated at the moment lol)

And could you please explain why the people below are getting off this bus and walking toward the pentagon? (Later shown to be picking up the debris of this 757). I am especially intrigued by the guys in plain black and white suites.
Who are these people?

I'm pretty sure that they're Pentagon security. The white shirt, black pants and tie, people on the Pentagon grounds are all civilian employees with low level security clearance (so they can move around most low security parts of the Pentagon - i.e. the access points). These are the same people who guard the entrances (parkades, doors, etc) and patrol the grounds. I'd really like to find more of this particular video as it is one of the videos (I think) that shows them picking up various pieces of the fuselage incuding one substantial sized one (half as high as the man who is picking it up) and it has an "e" or a "c" on it in red paint outline with white. It's one of those images that I've seen low res crappy stills of and don't place any value to without seeing the original source. Although I may be mistaken and it might be from a different press recording. (really don't know) [edit on 6-7-2005 by CatHerder]