9/11: A Boeing 757 Struck the Pentagon, page 20
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reply posted on 4-10-2004 @ 01:12 AM by SomewhereinBetween
LL.1 You have made statements through the thread that indicates you have already developed an missile-opinion.
Oh? Other than your wayward interpretation, where have I attributed the cause of the impact to anything other than a “craft”?
You aren't seeking the background at all. Each post that you have made, developes you as the person and your thoughts.
Okay, and thank you I suppose for the psychoanalysis. I know however that I am not the one offering a conclusion as to what hit the Pentagon, rather I am one proving with the visuals that we have before us, without enhancements, shows that conclusion to be false. I apologize that I am not seeking the background, I suppose you can say that I started a trend in that you also do not seek “background” at least when it comes to my posts on this thread and of late. The difference between us though is that I use the visual evidence within our grasp to counter the argument, whicle you just pluck some statement from the air.
You stated "why am I not asking a person that has impiled the 757 theory", doesn't this make it cyrstal clear where you are headed
Huh? And no.
If you were seeking, you'd ask, but you continously imply.
I see. What have I sought exactly? Here I was under the impression that all I sought was recognition of undeniable facts in a single clip, as opposed to abstract illusions. I will tell you what I imply though, for clarification in case you missed it ; the photo Catherder used to superimpose an airliner and then claim it as proof that the craft that hit the Pentagon is in fact a 757, has no basis of fact, none. But you feel free to tell me what you think I seek or think or ask, or imply.
Let's say hypothetically, they have distorted the pic for National Security resaons, and none of whatever you are attempting to get at is real.
Sure, let’s say that, why not? Now you want to prove Catherder’s case by claiming he made his case based on assumed National security propaganda and what that propaganda entails? Well, that certainly decimates my argument based on the optical illusions you think I see. I mean, thus far, from the 757 believers, all I have read is conjecture about distances, reflection; distortion and angles in stark opposition to dealing with that which stares them in the face. Why don’t we just say hypothetically that a big bad 757 loaded to the gills with fuel was parked directly in front of the Pentagon and the building slammed into same? National security distortion and all. Trees are behind the plane? Trees with sides and corners? Beige looking trees? Oh my, I learn something new every day. Okay, with that you have managed to make me believe both you and Catherder where a thousand wouldn’t.


reply posted on 4-10-2004 @ 02:23 PM by Shadowflux
I'd like to try and help clarify some misunderstandings. The speed with which the plane was moving, coupled with it's mass and the resistance of the reinforced wall would cause the plane to be virtually shredded making it act in a fluid manner, not turning it into liquid as some seem to think it states. At any given speed every inch of the aircraft is going at the same speed i.e. if the nose is going 100mph the so is the tail and the wings etc. Applying a fundemental knowledge of Newton's laws of physics the force or energy of the nose would be transfered to the brick wall upon impact, granted the force is diminished due to the resistance of the wall but it is not a far stretch of the imagination that a portion of the plane could break through the wall. Upon initial contact with the wall the plane would begin to crumple, causing subsequent poritons of the plane to to meet the newly made shrapnel with the same force, although in a more fluid manner since the structural integrity of the aircraft has been compromised. Since aircraft aluminum is so light wheight the shrapnel would shred through thte metal, this would cause almost cumalitive creation of shrapnel which in turn would almost create a wall of shredded metal for the tail and rear poritons of the plane to impact. As stated before, this is not a cartoon, the plane would not make a 757 shaped hole in the side of the building no matter what angle it struck at. Upon contact with the building the metal would begin to crumple thusly changing the trajectory of the tiny bits of metal. (Remember equal and OPPOSITE reaction) This is evident in the video "evidence" where minor exterior portions of the plane are seen flying away from the building. The force with which the wings hit, coupled with the angle at which the front of the wing tappers from the fuelselage would cause the wings to fold inwards yet still retain their intial foward momentum. In fact, nearly every molecule of the aircraft would retain it's foward momentum until met with enough resistance to stop it. The entire crash happened instantaneously leaving almost no time for the forces of gravity to work thusly creating a maelstorm of brick, steel and aluminum. Nearly every inch of the plane would be destroyed within miliseconds of initial impact yet still retain a deminished force of foward momentum. Actually, if you apply the laws of physics the bricks and other material of the building would increase the wheight of the "cloud" of metal on subsequent walls which in turn would add to the wheight impacting the next wall. Each time this mealstrom hit a wall it's force would be diminished yet the wheight would be increased which might shed some light on why the exit hole was smaller than the entry hole, Now, to understand the physics of the now fluid matter take a look at a river. The greatest speed of the water molecules is always located in the center of the river, with the lowest speed where the molecules contact the river bed. Think of a tidal wive striking a dam, the main compromising of the structure of the damn would be in the center, since the water molecules that did not initially strike the dam are still moving at the same speed and with the same force as it had when unmolested. The bits of the damn now interacting with the force and wheight of the water would now follow the same basic path as the water bursting through it. This is essentially what happened to the Pentagon, the shredded aircraft material would act in a fluid manner SIMILAR to the water where as the Pentagon's wall would act like the dam did. As the matter around the periphery of the mealstrom contacted a still standing wall it's momentum would be redirected in differing angels somewhat opposite to it's original trajectory. However, the force of the initial impact on the wall would be transfered to the bricks causing them to blow out much like an explosion and now follow the original trajectory of the impacting mater if even to a lesser degree. The aircraft matter that did not have it's trajectory changed due to transferance of energy would still be moving at the same force and speed as it had. Eventually the deminishing effect of the walls on the force of the matter would bring the force below the threshold needed to demolish any subsequent walls at which point it would come to rest on the ground. I dont' claim to be a physicist but i believe the equation would be somthing like this : whieght of the plane X velocity of the plane = impact force (kinetic energy) Since the wheight of the mealstrom is virtually the same as the original plane the equation for the kinetic energy on subsequent walls would be somthing like this (wheight of the plane + wheight of demolished bricks) X (velocity - resistance of the wall) = impact on second wall [(wheight of the plane +wheight of demolished bricks) - mass loss due to transferance of energy] X (velocity - resistance of the wall) = impact force on subsequent walls Now we will have Y= the threshhold needed to demolish the wall and Z=impact for or kenetic energy If Z is less than Y then no more demolition takes place, Follow me? Like i said I'm no physicist, these equations don't even factor in the kinteic energy added to the maelstrom by the force of the explosion of the fuel but I do hope it helps clear some things up. It's science, no one ever watched Mr. Wizard? Now, this doesn't rule out the possibility of a conspiracy in regards to 9/11 as a whole, but if we wish to uncover said conspiracy I think we should focus on financial transactions, intel documents, media reports, anything we can have hard evidence of. We should compile, to the best of our knowledge, what led up to, and happened on that fateful day. Then take the comission report and compare and contrast and bring to light any incosistancies, that is how we can prove innocence or guilt. So stop arguing physics and start doing some research!! [edit] I've been informed that it's the square of the velocity ie V^2 which means if you deminish the velocity the impact force is reduced in a converse exponential manner [edit on 4-10-2004 by Shadowflux] [edit on 4-10-2004 by Shadowflux]
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