Unemployed lady seeks legal advice over human rights issue.

Originally posted by boaby_phet
reply to post by blupblup

 

its not forced though, when people claim JSA they have to sign many forms, including one every 2 weeks to say you still agree! trust me, i have done this many times but thankfully not scince september 2010.

Of course It's FORCED???


Do this or we'll cut your benefits!!!

Sounds forced to me....

reply to post by blupblup


Like somebody said in an early post, this girl is not being dragged by the hair and made to work there, so no, her rights have not been violated, she has the right to get a job, she is not doing this. She is on JSA and one of the terms is that she must be actively seeking work in order to to keep getting paid JSA, if she doesn't like these terms then it is her right to STOP claiming at all.

reply to post by blupblup


im 100% sure a court of law wouldnt agree with your seeing it as forced.

as has been mentioned, she was just as free to get a JOB as she was to sign on to JSA !

she made her decisions and signed of her own free will!!

who do you think held the pen, moved her hand to sign and make the phonecall !

fyi ... i know quite a few people that never signed on, not rich in any way or had money to keep them comfy ... they just got their noses down and got a job so they did not need to sign on!

FORCED

Definition of FORCED
1
: compelled by force or necessity : involuntary < a forced landing >
2
: done or produced with effort, exertion, or pressure < a forced laugh >

www.merriam-webster.com...


And as this case is going to court, we will see what happens.

Forced = INVOLUNTARY.....

So yes, she is being FORCED

In order to obtain Jobseeker's Allowance (JSA) you must enter into a Jobseeker's agreement which is made between you and a DWP employment officer. The agreement contains;
Jobseeker's Allowance Page Index.
Introduction to Jobseeker's Allowance.
Jobseeker's Allowance and being available for work.
Jobseeker's Allowance and actively seeking work.
Jobseeker's Allowance and being capable of work.
Jobseeker's agreement
Jobseeker's Allowance and education.
Jobseeker's Allowance rates of pay.
Residence rules for Jobseeker's Allowance.
Income based Jobseeker's Allowance.
Jobseeker's Allowance and young people.
Jobseeker's Allowance sanctions.
your name; and
the number of hours and agreed pattern of hours that you are available for (this is if you have you restricted your hours); and
any restrictions (if applicable- see below) on your availability; and
a description of the type of work that you are looking for; and
the action that you will take to seek employment and to improve your chances of finding employment; and
the length of any permitted period during which you can specify that you are only available for work in your usual occupation and/or at the level of pay that you are used to receiving; and
a statement of your rights of appeal should you disagree with the contents of the agreement; and
the date of the agreement.
The agreement should be in writing and signed by you and the employment officer. You should be given a copy.
Restrictions
You are able to place restrictions on your availability if any of the following apply:
you cannot be available at once because you have caring responsibilities; or
you cannot be available at once because you do voluntary work; or
you cannot be available at once because you are providing a service; or
you cannot be available at once because you are required to give notice to terminate your employment; or
you are in the first thirteen weeks of a claim and have limited your acailability to your "usual occupation"; or
you are in the first six months of a claim and you have restricted the rate of pay for which you are prepared to work; or
you are on short time or have been laid off, in these circumstances you can restrict your availability to casual employment that is within daily travelling disatance of your home, you must also agree to resume at once the employment that you have been laid off (or put on short time) from; or
you have specified the hours during which you are available for work, the example given is of a claimant who has specified that she is available from Monday to Saturday and from 8am to 5pm; or
you have caring responsibilities and you have restricted your availability to between 16 and 40 hours per week; or
you have a physical or mental disability, in these circumstances you are able to restrict your availability in any way; or
you have sincerely held religious beliefs or a conscientious objection and have restricted your availability to work that does not conflict with those principles.

This is the rules that she signed for......
Sorry, can't give a link using my iPad so put it all here......

Originally posted by xDeadcowx


I just read that article and it made me very sad. On one hand she has a volunteer job working for a museum, where she can use the skills and knowledge she got to go along with her degree. On the other hand she has a minimum wage job at a low end retail store. Since she is on an unemployment type program, she is forced to take the minimum wage job at the retail store. This does nothing to get her in to a position where she can start a career, or utilize her college education.

This shows the mentality of the world right now. If you dont take the job, you are ungrateful, and dont deserve the help. If you do take the job you are stuck going nowhere fast, and throwing away the degree you are now in debt for.

DC

edit on 1/12/2012 by xDeadcowx because: (no reason given)

I read the article also, and it seems that most of you just done get it, yes a job is a job, but what is the difference if she works on benefits that would actually BENEFIT her, and ofcourse eventually everyone else. To be good at something, you gotta love it, but instead she has to pick corn fields that dont even feed her? Yeah we pay taxes, does that make us better? A human being i believed has the right to an oppinion about what is best for them.

Why not give her a job she was paying to work at, at least something she would have a future in and benefit people around her in the long run. I get what shes saying to, and being thrown down like that, like a bum, instead of helping for a better future.
We all use our eachothers taxes, you think it belongs to you, then keep it to yourself.

Originally posted by scotsdavy1

You are able to place restrictions on your availability if any of the following apply:

you cannot be available at once because you do voluntary work; or

To coin a phrase from a game I used to play. "BOOM, HEADSHOT"

She did voluntary work in her area of expertise. She was forced out of that position to "work" in an area she had no experience of. In court (where I have experience) we would call this a "WIN WIN."

Originally posted by Traydor
If she is not happy about this situation then maybe she should find a job that actually pays even on a temperory basis until she can find the job she wants.

she is trying to find employment hence her being a job seeker. if she could find a job she wouldn't be unemployed.

.... she should have had unemployment cut a while ago. In my opinion you should have a "right" to a job ... but that Job is a Job regardless of what it is.

.... she should have had unemployment cut a while ago. In my opinion you should have a "right" to a job ... but that Job is a Job regardless of what it is.

reply to post by PW229


Very true, but try telling them that, they are like robots repeating word for word when you see them.
If they think you are smart and have a brain they don't like it one little bit lol

Originally posted by Flavian
reply to post by xDeadcowx

 

What is stopping her from taking the job whilst still looking for the type of work she wants? Geesh, i just don't understand some people.

You don't seem to understand the reason. Once you put the survival job on your resume, you will never be hired for the job you trained for or worked for, they will permanently black list your resume.

And that is really unfair. So, there has to be a better solution than asking people to just through their goals and lives away and yet continue to meet payments for them.

reply to post by just1cornell0


Why should the government be subsidising companies by providing them with free labour for which they pay the worker £53 per week benefits - when the minimum wage for a 30 hour week would be around £150? That means the companies get to profit from free labour with no real 'training' of any value, and that means that people who would be willing to work 30 hours for minimum wage can't get a job because it's being done for free. Government handouts that subsidise company profits are fine apparently - big government for companies and corporations but not when it comes to education, infrastructure, healthcare apparently.

Moral of the story is even with an education many people still work low end jobs . Even if everyone was educated in specific fields of their choice some still have to work at mc donalds , some still has to ring your groceries threw the till. Collage is a scam and prey of naive kids offering them the world. Well not everyone can be the ceo .

It would appear that this lady wants it all her own way - JSA but secured by unpaid employment in a place of her choice.

Frankly, I would be embarassed if this was a friend of mine. She doesnt like the fact that she can't opt for the plush role she wants over the Poundland role she has been told to complete.

If she wants to live in a fantasy world where museum tours add to her employability prosepcts (in geology, yeah right) the let her - just minus the JSA that she no longer becomes eligible for. Poundland might be sneered at, but in the current economic climate that work would in most cases provide far more valuable experience and provide more scope for paid employment (retail jobs tend to be far more forthcoming than Geological ones, or so I'm told).

My brother in law got a degree in Geography - very quickly realised there were no prospects in that field and decided to focus on an equally strong (but less interesting for him) field of experience - computing. He now has a great job, company car, cracking pay - because he read the situation, made a painful decision and bit the bullet.

reply to post by ComeFindMe

Frankly, I would be embarassed if this was a friend of mine. She doesnt like the fact that she can't opt for the plush role she wants over the Poundland role she has been told to complete.

So you think poundland, a company making millions in profits, should be the recipient of a government subsidy on cheap labour?

Originally posted by woodwardjnr


So you think poundland, a company making millions in profits, should be the recipient of a government subsidy on cheap labour?

I think that any company able to deal with the Government and its employment policies on this scale would by definition be a big company and therefore, a company presumably generating (if not profiting by) millions of pounds.

Perhaps you think that the only companies eligible for this scheme should be failing, loss making ones? I suppose the extra hands could help - but would be very awkward if / when the house of cards comes falling down. Government would have egg on its face - how embarassing!

The overwhelming majority of individuals claiming JSA are not degree educated - indeed, many do not have any qualifications. Nothing wrong with that - my dad left school at 14 with nothing but a clip round the ear - but a significant part of the rationale behind this students argument falls away when you consider most individuals in this scheme would also not already be completing voluntary work. This is at worst a highlighting of a flaw in the plan for this system.

I am confident that if it was Marks and Spencers involved and not Poundland - this wouldnt have even made the papers.

The lesson here is simply that college is a farce and you shouldn't go unless you've got good connections. You're going to wind up working a McDonald's anyway if you're young, but you can at least do it without the debt.

Originally posted by Domo1
Here's a working link

So this girl has been on unemployment for over a year and the govt. wants her to get a job that she feels is beneath her? So much entitlement over there it makes me cringe. I'm assuming the govt. also footed the bill for her education. In the real world, when you can't find your dream job, you work at a crappy one until you get a break. Volunteering is something she can do after she earns her own money and stops mooching off of actual taxpayers.

Bravo!!

I'm an IT exec in the UK and last year I was out of work for about four months [and not on benefits!]. Each month that I wasn't successful I sent CV's to the next level down in my 'jobs I want list'. Yeah I still applied for the roles that I wanted but by month four I was ready and willing to work at Mcdonalds,,, why,,, because it's work!!

I empathize with the young lady,,, to an extent but hey guess what every single college graduate is gonna have to do some rubbish job before they get a proper job,,, why,, because an education doesn't prove that you can handle a 9 to 5...

I think the biggest problem is calling social welfare BENEFITS. They should call it something that discourages people,,, maybe not something as extreme as Scrounger Support,, but why not something that reflects the fact that it is money for people who aren't contributing to society.

Don't get me wrong. I'm the biggest believer in social welfare and think it's vital that we have some mechanism to support the people who aren't able to work but if your too snobby to work for poundland just because you just got your degree than why should you get my tax money??

maybe if she had considered her career path when choosing what to study she might have made a few plans,,, an internship perhaps??

oh,,, and sorry to throw this in there but a degree means f**k all! I review about twenty or thirty cv's a week and I really don't pay much attention to the education bit. Like I said it means nothing in the working world?? seriously though,, I'm sure that your college professor doesn't hand out assignments that are due in two weeks that would take four people a month to complete! but that's reality in the working world.

Maybe I'm biased because I don't have a college degree but hey I earn twice the national average and personally the idea of going to school for a few hours a week studying something I'm interested in [I like rocks too you know] sounds like such fun!

If she was really interested in working in Geology she should have skipped the school bit and busted her ass to get in on the ground floor with a company in that field. Even if she'd have been the 'tea' girl by know she would know a hell of a lot more about geology in practice and would probably have a pretty good job.....

in my humble opinion of course

oh,,, and how the f**k is this a human rights issue!!! I mean really?!?!

Originally posted by Unity_99

Originally posted by Flavian
reply to post by xDeadcowx

 

What is stopping her from taking the job whilst still looking for the type of work she wants? Geesh, i just don't understand some people.

You don't seem to understand the reason. Once you put the survival job on your resume, you will never be hired for the job you trained for or worked for, they will permanently black list your resume.

And that is really unfair. So, there has to be a better solution than asking people to just through their goals and lives away and yet continue to meet payments for them.

What??!!?

Don't be ridiculous! Just about every hiring manager in the world has had to do some job they didn't want to do at the start of their career,, so we all know the score.

Do you know what her problem is... while she was studying rocks she should have had some part time job so she could prove to future employers that she was capable of handling a working environment [ie answering to a boss, meeting deadlines, working with other staff,, etc etc] but I'm betting she didn't and spent her spare time enjoying the college experience....

This thread is starting to wind me up,,,, so sick of people with entitlement issues?? I wonder how many cv's she sends out a day,, how many geology companies has she been in touch with this week [sorry but I really can't think of any businesses or industries that are after geologists so I'm just going to leave it at 'geology companies']

Personally I think she should stop whinging and if she really wants to be a Geologist then she should treat finding a job like a job. That means up and ready for 9 and then pound the pavement, email and call, send cv etc etc till 5....

Oh and I bet it's not just a job in Geology she want's,,, I bet she also wants a job near where she is because she doesn't want to move away from her friends and family! I know for a fact that she could probably get an internship or entry job with some oil company in scotland or alaska or something.

aaarggg!!!