mathematically - why alien technology is so advanced

Originally posted by Vandalour
reply to post by vogon42

 

The time their civilazation learn binary I think the number of fingers dont matter anyway, but if a civilazation would focus more on beneficial research instead of warfare research would make a greater change

I dont know about that myself personally, like Darwin said survival of the fittest. Human beings are a product of their environment, like all animals, living organisms etc. You evolve to fit your surroundings and environment, so if your more warlike with others/rivals the same as you then you would advance technologically faster to keep up with pressures of combat in my opinion, but hey, thats just my opinion...one in 6.5 billion. But being less warlike would probably make technological advancement stagnant methinks...

Originally posted by OmegaOwl

Originally posted by nh_ee


I feel that if we are still unable to even spell Mathematically correctly then that in itself might explain our limitations.

From a mathematical perspective that is....

No , in all seriousness look at our DNA ....it was constructed by vastly intelligent beings that we now proclaim as God.

I will leave it at that.

Peace

I think we give god too much credit, I don't personally believe in him.
But if he did exist I imagine creating life would be like baking a cake.

You throw all the ingredients together(primordial soup) and you throw it in an oven(planet)
The cake will either sink or stay up.

Well I think someone must of forgot to add the self-raising flour as we seem to be sinking and sinking fast at the moment!!

reply to post by vogon42


Maybe having 8 fingers to count would slow their progress, because they would need more digits to represent a big number.

Imagine if aliens evolved on a planet with an atmosphere that obscures the stars... It would be much harder to invent an accurate calendar and fine tune agriculture. There would be no way to learn physics from observing the stars.

Originally posted by Harte
In Sumer, the natives used base six.

There goes your theory.

Harte

I would LOVE to see a reference to this!
I have for many years counted in base six on my fingers.
rather than counting to ten, you can count to a max of 35 (with out the coordination that binary would require).

If you have a good link, ref, what ever......PLEASE send it my way.

Originally posted by cloudyday
reply to post by vogon42

 

Maybe having 8 fingers to count would slow their progress, because they would need more digits to represent a big number.

........

Seriously, look at the differnece in the conversion from
base 10 to base 2
as opposed to how EASY the conversion from
base 8 to base 2 is.

How could that conversion possible be slower progress?

Base 10 to Base 2 requires repeated division and storing of remainders
Base 8 to Base 2 is a very simple (one digit to three digits)...it is that quick.

Are your familar with the (STL) as in Standard Template Library used in C++ programming?

My main use for STL has been a stack used for storing of remainders for base conversion.

HOWEVER, if the base I am working in is a power of two (such as octal or hex).....there is NO need to even load the STL into memory. MUCH more efficient program.

As far as your point of more digits to represent a bigger number. MY same point goes for conversion from binary to hex. At that point a step from hex to base 32 is not a reach.

Can you please explain to me why it is you thing all the calculations involved in a base 10 to base 2 conversion is an advantage over how easy the conversion is from base 8 (or even base 16) to base 2.

Seriously, I am very interested in hearing your view point. I always find new perspectives/algorithms interesting.

reply to post by vogon42


Explanation: S&F!

The answer is they get nowhere technologically as they have NO OPPOSABLE THUMBS!

And we are well equiped for binary as we have 10 binary digits that can be on [extended] or off [retracted] and this allows us to count to 1023!

Having 8 digits would restrict them to counting in binary on their hands to a maximum of 255!



Personal Disclosure: I was taught to count in binary on my hands by my dad! Thanks Dad!

Originally posted by vogon42

Originally posted by cloudyday
reply to post by vogon42

 

Maybe having 8 fingers to count would slow their progress, because they would need more digits to represent a big number.

........

Seriously, look at the differnece in the conversion from
base 10 to base 2
as opposed to how EASY the conversion from
base 8 to base 2 is.

How could that conversion possible be slower progress?

Base 10 to Base 2 requires repeated division and storing of remainders
Base 8 to Base 2 is a very simple (one digit to three digits)...it is that quick.

Are your familar with the (STL) as in Standard Template Library used in C++ programming?

My main use for STL has been a stack used for storing of remainders for base conversion.

HOWEVER, if the base I am working in is a power of two (such as octal or hex).....there is NO need to even load the STL into memory. MUCH more efficient program.

As far as your point of more digits to represent a bigger number. MY same point goes for conversion from binary to hex. At that point a step from hex to base 32 is not a reach.

Can you please explain to me why it is you thing all the calculations involved in a base 10 to base 2 conversion is an advantage over how easy the conversion is from base 8 (or even base 16) to base 2.

Seriously, I am very interested in hearing your view point. I always find new perspectives/algorithms interesting.

Funny you mention STL. I used to be a programmer, so I know ALL about that. The compiler would put out these syntax error messages that were really fun to decipher. Maybe it isn't that awful today. I sympathize with you. You're probably willing to cut off your own fingers so you won't have to use STL anymore.

How about this, and not worrying about # of digits and not meaning to hijack this thread...

Length of time in their "computer" age.

For arguement's sake we'll say that our computer age started in 1960, so we have 50 years of computers.

Their computer age started and advanced at the same rate as ours 750 "years" ago.

How much more advanced are they?

The time for the civilization to evolve is the key. If the christians wouldn't have suppressed scientific endeavors and destroy so much great research @ Alexandria, we'd be living among the stars now.

Derek

Originally posted by Viesczy
The time for the civilization to evolve is the key. If the christians wouldn't have suppressed scientific endeavors and destroy so much great research @ Alexandria, we'd be living among the stars now.

Derek

I concur...
2nd...

It really doesn't make a difference what base system any race uses...we us 10 because of our 10 digited fingers and thumbs...but as far as an Alien race using a base 12 or base 6 or whatever...it has no real advantages or disadvantages over any other.

The only truly important math understanding is knowing and understanding as well as using it to engineer craft that can Fold Space....is the Unified Field Theory which in all likelyhood is interconnective to a Multiversal system.

We have not come close to figuring this out because we are thinking too small and must realize that more than one Universal Constant must be used to connect the Macro to the Quantum. Split Infinity

Forgive me for being flippant, but to get back to the original post, Caveman Billy-Bob or whatever his name was, would come out of his slimy cave, into the sunlight and, like me with no clothes on, would be able to count to 21 (23 on a warm day).
So, what concept is that in Mathematics?
Sorry, but it seems pretty puerile to me.

Originally posted by vogon42

Originally posted by Harte
In Sumer, the natives used base six.

There goes your theory.

Harte

I would LOVE to see a reference to this!
I have for many years counted in base six on my fingers.
rather than counting to ten, you can count to a max of 35 (with out the coordination that binary would require).

If you have a good link, ref, what ever......PLEASE send it my way.

Sorry, it was base 60, not base 6.

LINK

Harte

Originally posted by DARREN1976

Originally posted by Viesczy
The time for the civilization to evolve is the key. If the christians wouldn't have suppressed scientific endeavors and destroy so much great research @ Alexandria, we'd be living among the stars now.

Derek

I concur...
2nd...

I don't.

You can blame religion for some things, but the Library isn't one of them.

There almost certainly was nothing in the Library at Alexandria that would have advanced our culture technologically that wasn't widely known at the time.

Most of the Library was created by confiscating books and returning copies of those books to the original owners.

There are other, intact, libraries as old (or older) that the one at Alexandria.

Harte

reply to post by Harte


I like the base 60 stuff. Carbon 60. Buckminster Fuller. Soccer balls. Honeycombs.

Originally posted by Harte
...

There almost certainly was nothing in the Library at Alexandria that would have advanced our culture technologically that wasn't widely known at the time.

Most of the Library was created by confiscating books and returning copies of those books to the original owners.

There are other, intact, libraries as old (or older) that the one at Alexandria.

Harte

What are the older libraries? The only thing I found on the internet is this started in 6th century AD which is younger than the library in Alexandria. (Or maybe you mean libraries like the clay tablets from Persepolis?)

Therefore the oldest continually running library in the world is at the St. Catherine’s Monastery in the Sinai, Egypt. It was built in the middle of the 6th century and houses the second largest collection of religious material in the world (after the Vatican)

Oldest Library

reply to post by OmegaLogos


I had thought about bringing up the binary on you fingers, but I am not dexterous enough to reliably represent many specific values.

Are you? Perhaps its just my lack of coordination.

Base 6 I can fly through on my fingers, but binary......try holding a pattern of alternating 1's and 0's, then add 1, then add one again.

Are you able to do that.......I end up loosing a digit or two.

reply to post by vogon42


Haha.
I see what you did there...

Has anyone mentioned the theory that if they lack thumbs not only would they be better at PC's but way more productive as they cannot masturbate? did you put that factor in the equation? #Justsaying hehe

Originally posted by JayDub113
reply to post by vogon42

 

Haha.
I see what you did there...

Not sure I understand what you are referring to?
Yes, I understand things like, what the number 4 would be in binary on our fingers....but all in all its just another digit.

Just like if you work in base 36 (zero to z) you are going to end up with some rather "rude" numbers. I just find base 36 to be an easy way to compress numbers in a program, just do NOT display the base 36 result to the end user.

Originally posted by Xality
Has anyone mentioned the theory that if they lack thumbs not only would they be better at PC's but way more productive as they cannot masturbate? did you put that factor in the equation? #Justsaying

hehe

I thought if they didn't have thumbs they would be forced to find girlfriends.
This in itself would impede the advancement of technology.

Speaking of nerds.....perhaps I should ask this question on slashdot.org ?