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what would happen if, people were cut off from benefits?

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posted on Jan, 7 2012 @ 12:31 PM
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The sad truth is the American economy would collapse! Today our economy is based on consumerism. What do you think would happen if the government quit subsidizing the poor? They would not have money to spend.

I would hate to calculate the trickle down effects of this... not including the violence but actually from an economic standpoit our country would implode because so much of our economic activity is based on government assistence... this includes businesses.... the largest reciepent of indirect government benefits ....
edit on 7-1-2012 by fnpmitchreturns because: context




posted on Jan, 7 2012 @ 12:32 PM
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Originally posted by AzureSky
I would not see the point in getting a lower paying job if it ends up being less then the benefits you receive, why work to be just as broke when you weren't.

And not all people are lazy, lots of people just cant find work. and need foodstamps because things are always rising in price.


BUT,

What IF the benefits are CUT ?

Riots maybe ?



posted on Jan, 7 2012 @ 12:34 PM
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reply to post by AzureSky
 


Agreed, and I have discussed this with many people.
When I was a teen I knew if I lost my job, I'd have one later that day.
But nowadays the US MANUFACTURES almost nothing.
I will say we do make Bic lighters here!!! woot.
But if we build nothing then that takes a whole workforce off the jobs table.
We need to start manufacturing, not assembling or engineering, but manufacturing.
From raw ore, wood, oil Etc. to a final product.
Then we will see better times and folks working.
It is supply and demand, no job supply so the boss demands we take lower pay, don't like it go on welfare.
Until like many have found, welfare ain't so bad!!
No gas for the car as I don't drive, no daycare as I don't leave the house, less eating out so no huge food bill, plus I get to watch all the tv I want.
Or I could sweat it out at a job for 8-10 hours and put up with the boss Etc.
This is the new mindset, and I can't blame them for it.



posted on Jan, 7 2012 @ 12:34 PM
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Originally posted by v1rtu0s0
It's funny how your put focus on individuals that can't find a job or that are receiving miniscule benefits.

This pales in comparison to some of the corporate welfare that has been handed out, as well as the socialist bailouts walstreet has been given...


edit on 7-1-2012 by v1rtu0s0 because: (no reason given)


good subject, but it's been covered here ad nauseum.



posted on Jan, 7 2012 @ 12:37 PM
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reply to post by Manhater
 


This is the most insulting thing I have read recently. So you have a bad back and work. Bravo, good for you. However you judge everyone by your bad back. There are a lot of other illnesses.

For example: I can work, I can climb a stair case. I can type and I can learn new things. However I am incapable of working. How come? I have CFS/ME. I am battling right now with our benefit office because they believe also that I can work. Even though I am seeing a specialist who diagnosed me and have therapy and my GP also knows I can't possibly work.
Let me explain. If you saw me, you;d think I was healthy. I do not look ill and I don't behave that ill most of the time. Why can't I work?

For starters I'd love to. I used to be a professional, working in labs of very famous pharmaceutical companies as a chemical analyst. However I had to reduce the hours because I was ill with the flu every 3-4 weeks and had a headache every single day. I went to bed at about 19:00 every evening, just to get up the next day.
Then I opted for simpler work and less hours. I ended up working 4 hours two days a week and nearly ended up having an accident because I was too fatigued to even drive home.
CFS/ME explained simply: if I was a car, I would only have 1L of petrol but even getting up or washing my hair, or driving or cooking or even hoovering one room uses up this 1Litre. All normal people have a full tank. Yes even you with your bad back, you have energy, fuel. I don't. Going shopping makes me have to go to bed and I am in as much pain as someone who worked out for 3 hours.

The reason I'm saying this is that the idiotic law in this idiotic country [UK] is such at the moment that even though I have been officially diagnosed AND have won an appeal, nobody is listening and they put me on a work finding program. I can find work, I want to but I CAN'T.

And this is what would happen if all disabled people would lose their benefits. The real sick ones would starve to death and lose their home because of a few a**holes that cheat the system.

I am being treated like a criminal at the moment because the government only tests for physically measurable illnesses such as back pain or arthritis, so they deem people like me fit to work.

Yeah, I'll take a job. But don't hold it against me if I have to go home after two hours on the first day. Don't blame me if I'll take 4 days off with flu like symptoms every 2-3 weeks. Don't say I didn't warn you if I can't come in the day after I have worked for two hours because I can't move any limbs because it feels as if I have run a marathon. Hey it must be really good to employ me, because I am so reliable. Apart from that, I would feel so sick most of the time that I couldn't do anything at home as I would have to go to bed immediately.

I am so angry at the moment because this is exactly what I am going through and that is why I am ranting like this.

I want benefit cheats to be caught! I want them hanged and quartered if you ask me. But the fact is that the MAJORITY of people on benefits DO deserve them. I have paid my taxes for over 25 years, I practically paid for myself.

I can't stand people who only look as far as themselves. I would be the first out there to work, longer and more efficient than most. Yet I can't and I have to listen to dribble from the idiotic government AND the people who haven't got a clue.

So yes, the answer is that people like me would have to literally starve, beg or rely on good samaritans.Everything I have worked for [house and other things] would go down the effing drain and I would probably have to kill myself in the end. That is what would happen.



posted on Jan, 7 2012 @ 12:38 PM
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reply to post by rubbertramp
 


Pisses me off too. Right there with you.



posted on Jan, 7 2012 @ 12:39 PM
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Originally posted by Hillarie
I agree with you 100%. But right now I'm on food stamps. Things have been rocky lately. I've been working temp jobs and odd jobs. I got hired for a job and then never heard from them again. This happened twice in the last 2 weeks. I'm doing the best I can. I got a job last week and will start next week. It's a sales job that requires that you produce or they drop you. I'll see if I can do it. I'm not lazy. And ideologically, I'm on track with you. But sometimes reality impedes. As soon as I can I'll get off them.

I'm not living beyond my means. I have a pair of sneakers that are falling apart as I walk. My rent is late. My 12 year old car is holding together by the grace of God. I don't know why I'm saying all this. I don't owe any explanations to anyone.
edit on 7-1-2012 by Hillarie because: I thought of something I wanted to add.


I'll tell you why I think you wrote this Hillarie....Because you have self esteem, and pride. You have good work ethics. You are rightfully using the social resources as they were intended. As a stop-gap, fill-in until your own efforts pull you out of the situation you are in.

I, for one, and damn proud of you. Keep up the good effort, I have faith in you...



posted on Jan, 7 2012 @ 12:42 PM
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reply to post by MeesterB
 


So you think the people who receive benefits make up most of the united states's crime? Haha.. Wow



posted on Jan, 7 2012 @ 12:45 PM
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reply to post by Hecate666
 


Learning new things is work. It's not an easy job. Least you are doing something.

Try living with 2 who do nothing all day...Everyday.....Who don't know, what is even like to get a job or have a job.

You can use your knowledge to work it to your advantage.

And, seeing as you already put 25 years in, you do deserve a break and your benefits.
edit on 7-1-2012 by Manhater because: (no reason given)



posted on Jan, 7 2012 @ 12:46 PM
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reply to post by fnpmitchreturns
 


Close my friend, very close!
The country would not implode, the gumment would implode.
If you have no money, you cannot pay tax collectors, to get the money, then no military, Etc, Etc, Etc,
Then Americans barter and trade, but we do all business tax free.
That is why welfare will not die.



posted on Jan, 7 2012 @ 12:50 PM
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Dir.... Zombie Apocalypse...
...



posted on Jan, 7 2012 @ 01:12 PM
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Originally posted by Wrabbit2000
For some folks, there is a thing we call a Work Ethic and within folks who have such an oddball thing these days.....the amount of money at the end isn't the point. Taking handouts is something to be avoided at all costs..and done only in the most dire of need and ONLY for the minimum time necessary.

Believe it or not..for many people out here, a hard days work produces a feeling of positive accomplishment and well being. It's as important to a balanced approach to life as the paycheck it produces. Just my personal thoughts.

I absolutely agree
and Germany is a prime example for this.
One of the best unemployment assistance systems in the world and still very low unemployment rates.
Most people are striving for fulfilment in their work.
(This requires good wages and working conditions of course.)

Edit to answer:

Alot of purchasing power would vanish and the aggregate demand would plummet.
The economic consequences from this alone means more "money" lost than the unemployment assistance would cost.
edit on 7-1-2012 by ColCurious because: (no reason given)



posted on Jan, 7 2012 @ 01:23 PM
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You do realize that there are people that work and still have to collect benefits to feed their families?

I suppose that the 'working poor' is a myth to you?



posted on Jan, 7 2012 @ 01:28 PM
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reply to post by rubbertramp
 


One misconception the MSM promulgate is that if the Feds stop the human services, they will vanish - but in fact...

If the Feds stop, the states will spend the money directly and will have vastly more to spend because the money is not being collected by the states and sent to the Feds, who pay lots of "administrators" and then sends what's left back into the states.

In many ways, taking the programs out of the bloated federal system would be a great boon.



posted on Jan, 7 2012 @ 01:32 PM
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Originally posted by illuminatislave
You do realize that there are people that work and still have to collect benefits to feed their families?

I suppose that the 'working poor' is a myth to you?


i'll assume this was directed at me.
if you'd read the thread you'll see where i stated that i am not entirely against benifits in all situations.
but, i'd need to know more about the individual, instead of making a blanket statement like you just did.
did the working poor buy their kid a new x-box for christmas?
are they living in a place that costs more than 25% of their income?
are they eating junk food and not budgeting their expenses?
there are many questions i'd need to know the answers too in order to address your comment.
generally speaking, i'd say the working poor are in the position because they spend to much on non-essentials.
instead of benefits, maybe the government should pay for somebody to help people budget their income and live within their means?



posted on Jan, 7 2012 @ 01:35 PM
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Originally posted by Amaterasu
reply to post by rubbertramp
 


One misconception the MSM promulgate is that if the Feds stop the human services, they will vanish - but in fact...

If the Feds stop, the states will spend the money directly and will have vastly more to spend because the money is not being collected by the states and sent to the Feds, who pay lots of "administrators" and then sends what's left back into the states.

In many ways, taking the programs out of the bloated federal system would be a great boon.


that is a reasonable point you made.
never thought about it to be honest.
even with the foodstamp program, i think it's rediculous that there are not more restrictions.
for instance, food stamps can be used to purchase junkfood.
look at the carts next time in line at the store.
piles of potato chips, candy, cookies, ice cream etc......all being paid for with stamps.
pathetic if you ask me.



posted on Jan, 7 2012 @ 01:39 PM
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Originally posted by Wrabbit2000

Originally posted by AzureSky
I would not see the point in getting a lower paying job if it ends up being less then the benefits you receive, why work to be just as broke when you weren't.

And not all people are lazy, lots of people just cant find work. and need foodstamps because things are always rising in price.

Wow... That approach and attitude is precisely why we are falling into the sewer as a nation and really don't have a bottom in sight yet. For some folks, there is a thing we call a Work Ethic and within folks who have such an oddball thing these days.....the amount of money at the end isn't the point. Taking handouts is something to be avoided at all costs..and done only in the most dire of need and ONLY for the minimum time necessary.

Believe it or not..for many people out here, a hard days work produces a feeling of positive accomplishment and well being. It's as important to a balanced approach to life as the paycheck it produces. Just my personal thoughts..

Yikes....


You see, as much as you say this attitude which the poster you quoted is one of the reasons why countries are going into the sewer...i beg to differ.

(England-North west.)
You know how hard it is to live on benefits? It's not an easy task considering that a single male will get £110 a fortnight and £250 pcm towards their house rent. They dont have to pay council tax neither . So that means you have to go buy your food, pay your utility bills as well as paying for the other part of your rent - bare in mind rent prices have gone up because everybody is renting.

But...if two people are partners and have a child, and both people do not work - then thats where the real issue is, and im not onabout the money they get while on benefits. .

2 People with a child who do not work will have an average income of £1000 PCM. This includes Tax credits, Child Benefit, Job seekers, Housing benefit and Child benefits.

They get this as a legal right, luckily. These people who are on benefits dont have spare money, they get to buy the very basic of things, Primark clothing(very cheap) 85% of the time they do not drive due to costs. When they shop they cant buy luxuries just the bare minimum of what they need. Considering a house in my area - 2bedroom is no less than £425, plus duel fuel of £90 a month, plus shopping for you and a baby £360 a month..Thats £900 to just scrape you through surviving the month.

Now i told you these because instead of looking at the person who's not willing to work just to be classed as a good working person in society, instead look at it as why if you do work, are you getting the same as a person on benefits? What is minimum wage? its a wage that scrapes you through your existence just like benefits. You may think that the extra cash you get through a wage would help, but it doesnt because you get taxed through the nose on your wage and you have to pay council tax - when all the taxt has been taken, your working for the same wage and the same type of life a person on benefits would get - but the only difference is, your working for that life and the people on benefits are not.

The real issue is the minimum wage and the amount low income families get taxed. if we eliminated tax for the people receiving under £13,000 annual wage, we would see people wanting to work in low skilled jobs that pay cheap - just to have that extra cash and go buy some luxuries for their selves and families.

Thus generating the buying of products through the spare money people have, stimulating our economy through VAT and much much more. It would also take a large percentage of people out of poverty, enabling them to spend money on other things than just securing their survival of the month.



posted on Jan, 7 2012 @ 01:49 PM
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Originally posted by Destinyone

Originally posted by Hillarie
I agree with you 100%. But right now I'm on food stamps. Things have been rocky lately. I've been working temp jobs and odd jobs. I got hired for a job and then never heard from them again. This happened twice in the last 2 weeks. I'm doing the best I can. I got a job last week and will start next week. It's a sales job that requires that you produce or they drop you. I'll see if I can do it. I'm not lazy. And ideologically, I'm on track with you. But sometimes reality impedes. As soon as I can I'll get off them.

I'm not living beyond my means. I have a pair of sneakers that are falling apart as I walk. My rent is late. My 12 year old car is holding together by the grace of God. I don't know why I'm saying all this. I don't owe any explanations to anyone.
edit on 7-1-2012 by Hillarie because: I thought of something I wanted to add.


I'll tell you why I think you wrote this Hillarie....Because you have self esteem, and pride. You have good work ethics. You are rightfully using the social resources as they were intended. As a stop-gap, fill-in until your own efforts pull you out of the situation you are in.

I, for one, and damn proud of you. Keep up the good effort, I have faith in you...


Thanks Destinyone - that gives me a boost.



posted on Jan, 7 2012 @ 02:20 PM
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Originally posted by rubbertramp

Originally posted by Amaterasu
reply to post by rubbertramp
 


One misconception the MSM promulgate is that if the Feds stop the human services, they will vanish - but in fact...

If the Feds stop, the states will spend the money directly and will have vastly more to spend because the money is not being collected by the states and sent to the Feds, who pay lots of "administrators" and then sends what's left back into the states.

In many ways, taking the programs out of the bloated federal system would be a great boon.


that is a reasonable point you made.
never thought about it to be honest.
even with the foodstamp program, i think it's rediculous that there are not more restrictions.
for instance, food stamps can be used to purchase junkfood.
look at the carts next time in line at the store.
piles of potato chips, candy, cookies, ice cream etc......all being paid for with stamps.
pathetic if you ask me.


Well... I am on food stamps... And I avoid processed foods, will buy NOTHING with high fructose corn syrup (now renamed "corn sugar"), MSG, propylene glycol (why do We eat antifreeze!?!), and so on. I buy only organic food. Yes, I don't get as much food and go hungry sometimes.

But most look at quantity - a lot more can be afforded buying crap.

But yes, I think crap should not be allowed.



posted on Jan, 7 2012 @ 02:28 PM
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reply to post by Amaterasu
 


the other problem i have, even after they bagan issueing the cards instead of stamps is people selling them.
i don't know how many times i've been approached by somebody,
'hey, dude, i'll sell you 100 dollars in stamps for 50 bucks.'
it's almost tempting, but i've never done it.
obviously those trying want alcohol or drugs.



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