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The oil-change conspiracy

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posted on Jan, 7 2012 @ 11:19 AM
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I use Mobile-1 in all of my vehicles except my motorcycle which I change more frequently due to the clutch.
I also only ride the motorcycle for 6 months out of the year...

Interesting that you mention Royal Purple because I have actually seen dyno tested cars using that Oil and they actually gained 3+ Horsepower over non synthetics.

There are many aspects to oil degradation.

Oil analysis also provides useful information as to how your engine is wearing.
This is what the Lab were testing for in the Camaro Mobil-1 test....it's a very informative read.




Oil Analysis The oil is analyzed for many different things. The most critical characteristics for the purposes of oil longevity are:

Viscosity: This is the SUS viscosity at 210 degrees. It is the standard SAE viscosity measure; SUS is the unit of viscosity. This value should remain within its grade, or plus or minus 20%, whichever is greater.

TBN: The Total Base Number. This is a measure of acid-combatting additives. Oil is essentially expired once it reaches a TBN around 1.

Insolubles: This is the percentage of the test sample consisting of solids. Solids are always bad; the value should be less than 0.6%.

Wear Metals: The presence of wear metals is a contaminant and the rate of accumulation is an indicator of the oil's protective condition. The exact values representing oil change time is rather subjective; we use Blackstone's conservative guidance in conjunction with other industry experts. Iron, copper, and lead are normally the ones to watch.

Think your corner station mechanic is gonna do this? The oil analysis also checks for fuel, antifreeze, and water in the oil. Of course, ideally all of these values should be zero, but realistically the tolerable limits are: fuel, 2%; antifreeze, 0%; and water, 0.05%. Also, there's the analysis of elements expressed in parts per million.

Some of these elements are indicators of engine wear, while others are additives in the oil. For any of these, the presence or absence of any element is less important than how the values change over time.

Engine Wear: aluminum, chromium, iron, copper, lead, tin, molybdenum, nickel, manganese, silver, titanium, posassium, and silicon. Anti-Wear Additive: molybdenum, phosphorus, and zinc.

Antifreeze Inhibitor: potassium, boron, silicon, and sodium.

Detergent Additive: boron, calcium, magnesium, and barium. Note that molybdenum and silicon can be both an additive and an indicator of engine wear.


Peace

neptune.spacebears.com...
edit on 7-1-2012 by nh_ee because: edits and added links




posted on Jan, 7 2012 @ 12:08 PM
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I found this:

The Slick Truth on Synthetic Oil Made popular by brands like Amsoil and Mobil 1, die-hard gear heads, racers and enthusiasts started using synthetic oil exclusively. Unfortunately, it wasn't until almost two decades later that the major oil companies started offering synthetics to the masses. Despite the number of benefits over mined oil (the stuff they pump out of the ground), Americans still haven't fully embraced this advanced technology. So what's the difference? Synthetic oil is produced in a lab, which means the only stuff in it is what they put in it. Despite the high-tech refining of crude oil, there are still contaminants in the oil that can build up and eventually damage an engine. Changing your oil and filter removes any loose particles that form, but often the build-up occurs in an isolated area of your engine, usually where it gets really, really hot. This build up can clog oil passages and valves, which can eventually lead to reduced engine life. There are also ecological benefits to using synthetic oil. Its viscosity (ability to lubricate) stays higher than mined oil at high temperatures, enough to even affect your gas mileage. Since it breaks down much more slowly than petroleum-based oil, you can greatly extend the time between oil changes. One truck driver drove his semi 409,000 miles on synthetic without changing the oil! Think of how much less oil would have to be collected and recycled if we used half as much every year. The bottom line is synthetic oils are an easy choice. The extra bucks you spend for an oil change will be returned in no time.



So one truck driver drove his semi 409,000 miles on synthetic without changing the oil!
I rest my case.

The source



posted on Jan, 7 2012 @ 12:19 PM
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Here is the Engine Oil Bible!

It covers just about everything you would ever want to know about synthetic and natural oils...including shelf life!

Who even knew engine oil had a shelf life? I didn't!

Just thought I would share it...seems really complete with a ton of data on oils!


edit on 7-1-2012 by jerryznv because: ...



posted on Jan, 7 2012 @ 12:21 PM
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I don't see the point of the 3,000 mile oil change either. It's expensive and I take forever to get around to it. I'm lucky to still have a running car.

But we all know that mechanics gotta eat so that's probably the only reason why it's usually at the 3,000 mark.



posted on Jan, 7 2012 @ 12:33 PM
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Originally posted by jerryznv
Here is the Engine Oil Bible!

It cover just about everything you would ever want to know about synthetic and natural oils...including shelf life!

Who even knew engine oil had a shelf life? I didn't!

Just thought I would share it...seems really complete with a ton of data on oils!



Thanks for the link, that was a lot of informative reading.
I even bookmarked it afterwards.



posted on Jan, 7 2012 @ 12:36 PM
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Originally posted by The Sword
I don't see the point of the 3,000 mile oil change either. It's expensive and I take forever to get around to it. I'm lucky to still have a running car.

But we all know that mechanics gotta eat so that's probably the only reason why it's usually at the 3,000 mark.


Usually fear augments selling of a lot of services and articles.
Probably in this case also.



posted on Jan, 7 2012 @ 12:54 PM
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Originally posted by The Sword
I don't see the point of the 3,000 mile oil change either. It's expensive and I take forever to get around to it. I'm lucky to still have a running car.

But we all know that mechanics gotta eat so that's probably the only reason why it's usually at the 3,000 mark.


I figure it this way...suppose my car runs for 200,000 miles before it dies!

I get the oils changed every 5,000 miles...each oil change costing approximately $30.00.

That equates into 40 oil changes for a total cost of approximately $1,200.00!

That is relatively cheap maintenance in my opinion...over the life of the car...and a far cry cheaper than replacing a motor...so really my question is...why not change it every 5,000 miles?

I agree that changing it every 2,000 - 3,000 miles is a bit much...but every 5,000...sounds okay to me!



posted on Jan, 7 2012 @ 01:01 PM
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Originally posted by jerryznv

Originally posted by The Sword
I don't see the point of the 3,000 mile oil change either. It's expensive and I take forever to get around to it. I'm lucky to still have a running car.

But we all know that mechanics gotta eat so that's probably the only reason why it's usually at the 3,000 mark.


I figure it this way...suppose my car runs for 200,000 miles before it dies!

I get the oils changed every 5,000 miles...each oil change costing approximately $30.00.

That equates into 40 oil changes for a total cost of approximately $1,200.00!

That is relatively cheap maintenance in my opinion...over the life of the car...and a far cry cheaper than replacing a motor...so really my question is...why not change it every 5,000 miles?

I agree that changing it every 2,000 - 3,000 miles is a bit much...but every 5,000...sounds okay to me!



I think you are driven by fear.
I was driven by curiosity.



posted on Jan, 7 2012 @ 01:09 PM
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reply to post by Pokoia
 





I think you are driven by fear.


Your absolutely right...I am driven by fear...fear of my motor blowing up and having to replace it...which I checked out and it is around $3800.00 for a new one!

So I will gladly fork out a bit of money now and then rather than a ton when my motor blows!

That is just me though...and my opinion!



posted on Jan, 7 2012 @ 01:50 PM
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Originally posted by jerryznv
reply to post by Pokoia
 





I think you are driven by fear.


Your absolutely right...I am driven by fear...fear of my motor blowing up and having to replace it...which I checked out and it is around $3800.00 for a new one!

So I will gladly fork out a bit of money now and then rather than a ton when my motor blows!

That is just me though...and my opinion!


I never was fond of cars, for me they are just very old fashioned vehicles.
I always liked mechanics.
My cars are not that expensive.
If really necessary I could use public transportation.
I just had to try it, and it worked.
I understand and fully respect your way of thinking, we just had a different background.



posted on Jan, 7 2012 @ 01:57 PM
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reply to post by Pokoia
 


I fully respect your opinion as well and understand your points in this thread.

You also have to remember that I am American...and we are the oil guzzling nation of the world...waste is part of the American culture...unfortunately!

I would much rather take my motorcycle than my car...my motorcycle gets around 65 mpg and only uses 2 1/2 quarts of oil per change.

In Wyoming though riding season is short and I can only ride about 5 months out of the year!



posted on Jan, 7 2012 @ 02:03 PM
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Originally posted by jerryznv
reply to post by Pokoia
 


I fully respect your opinion as well and understand your points in this thread.

You also have to remember that I am American...and we are the oil guzzling nation of the world...waste is part of the American culture...unfortunately!

I would much rather take my motorcycle than my car...my motorcycle gets around 65 mpg and only uses 2 1/2 quarts of oil per change.

In Wyoming though riding season is short and I can only ride about 5 months out of the year!


I live in Europe and things are far from perfect here.
Europe did however do some good about gas- guzzling, especially in cars.
Most new cars now have a great mileage.
Although I still consider hem primitive.
So much better engines have been invented than the "otto" motor.
edit on 7/1/12 by Pokoia because: (no reason given)



posted on Jan, 7 2012 @ 04:19 PM
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Originally posted by Chadwickus
reply to post by Pokoia
 


My experience with a particular model of car, one many a taxi driver uses here in Australia will do over a million km with a regular service schedule, this is more than an oil change of course but the same model without a service will be lucky to run at full capacity/efficiency at a quarter of the mileage.





falcon?



posted on Jan, 7 2012 @ 05:13 PM
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The only thing I disagree with is the MAYBE part. It most DEFINETLY IS a conspiracy.
Oil is a limited resource and because of that fact they are able to charge us accordingly. People around the globe have already came up with several solutions, but since they are the ones with all the money to get things done they can afford to choose not to..........and there is the rub.



posted on Jan, 7 2012 @ 06:35 PM
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Originally posted by Pokoia
reply to post by traditionaldrummer
 


Thanks for your post.

So you are totally against my "method".
I am doing this now for years, without any adverse effects.
How can this be ?


No, I am certainly not against your method. In fact, I'd be very interested in testing samples of your oil to see exactly how your method is working for you. Contact me through PM and I can tell you how to contact my lab.



posted on Jan, 7 2012 @ 07:01 PM
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Originally posted by traditionaldrummer

Originally posted by Pokoia
reply to post by traditionaldrummer
 


Thanks for your post.

So you are totally against my "method".
I am doing this now for years, without any adverse effects.
How can this be ?


No, I am certainly not against your method. In fact, I'd be very interested in testing samples of your oil to see exactly how your method is working for you. Contact me through PM and I can tell you how to contact my lab.


If your able to obtain a sample of this oil...it would be great if you could share it (in laymen terms) with us...I for sure am curious about oil that has ran over 62,000 miles...whether it be semi-synthetic, synthetic, or natural!

You might have the key to whether this is a conspiracy or not!

By the way...have you ever sampled something like this?

If so...what have you found in samples with this high of mileage?

Would you share your expertise on synthetics, semi-synthetics, and natural oils at this level if you have any?

I am truly curious about how an expert in sampling these oils feels about 60,000+ mileage oil!



posted on Jan, 7 2012 @ 07:21 PM
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I have never heard of placing a magnet there. What does this do? Interesting post BTW. Since I moved to NYC I haven't had a car for a few years, but when I did...I changed the oil/filter twice per year. Thicker oil in the summer and thinner oil in winter.



posted on Jan, 7 2012 @ 08:33 PM
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reply to post by Pokoia
 


I feel bad for anyone who bought your car after you.

I am a long time mechanic and work at a used car lot, and I get at least 5 cars a year, that the owners did not do the normal maintenance (oil change) and has a bad rod bearing, or bad oil pump. And I have to put a used engine in it.

IT IS VERY IMPORTANT to change your engine oil. The oil its self could last in longer intervals. But the additives do not. Many car manufacturers have 12,000 mile oil changes. But they do not hold 4 - 6 qts. They hold much more and have a much better filtering system.

Do not do this unless you want to spend well over $1000 to replace your engine.

Many engines such as the chrysler 2.7l v6, have sludge problems and if overlooked for a short amount of time the engine will fail.

Again, I can not stress this enough, if you do this your engine WILL fail prematurely.



posted on Jan, 10 2012 @ 09:30 AM
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Originally posted by jerryznv
By the way...have you ever sampled something like this?

If so...what have you found in samples with this high of mileage?

Would you share your expertise on synthetics, semi-synthetics, and natural oils at this level if you have any?

I am truly curious about how an expert in sampling these oils feels about 60,000+ mileage oil!


Gas engine oils with 15-20k miles or more usually look like acidic sludge. Oil is designed to do certain tasks for a certain length of time. Once the oil can no longer do those jobs (deplete alkaline reserves & oxidation inhibitors, keep particulate in suspension, etc.) things go south very quickly.

Lots of people try things such as the OP reported. For some, it seems to work out, others not so much, but the best way to really know how it's working is through oil and/or filter analysis. I'm starting to sound like a salesman so I'll leave it at that. I would be interested in obtaining a sample of the OP's used oil to see the effects of his techniques.



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