Gloom, Doom and Duty to Others....

This seems the only appropriate place for my thoughts on this, so here goes nothing. (Move if necessary, thnx)

I'd like to start by sharing something and then making an observation. First, I was in a chat with my neighbor recently about general things and the subject got around to 2012 and the prophecies of various kinds. This neighbor has no idea what I do online or the fact I dedicate a great deal more time than watching media to know this topic. However, she doesn't and simply takes information from Discovery or Cable News.

Her observations on 2012 were blunt, succinct and scared me deeply for what it said about average people's perceptions this early on. She confided in me that she was certain the world was going to end sometime this year. She didn't even know enough about the subject matter, as I discovered with more talking, to know December should be the month she fears. She just knew the Mayans predicted Earth ending and many others explained how this was it and we're all doomed. She wasn't joking and she wasn't blowing things out out of proportion. Not from her perspective. It was said as cold hard fact. I did what I could to explain some of this, but fighting certain facts someone believes they know is an exercise in futility at times and this was one of those times.

This scares me....because perceptions and hope are what keep people functioning. It's what gets people out of bed for another day of work or school or whatever it is we all do each day. It's all people without Faith (ANY Faith) have to make sense of the world and know there is reason to keep striving for more.


My observation is fairly simple and here it is:

We, the many at ATS and other places, have a Duty in this coming year. It's not a duty to country, or family or anything so abstract. It's a duty to our fellow human beings and those we share this big rock with. Many of us spend incredible numbers of hours...days, really, researching these topics and learning just about all there is to know of 2012 prophecy and what IS or IS NOT actually predicted. We learn the variations of WHAT may happen in technical detail. Many among us have professional backgrounds which bring valuable insight and knowledge to add and clarify these things.

It's our Duty, if I may, to help our neighbors, friends and family who DO NOT have this kind of time, to understand the facts as they show interest or...more importantly, fear. We really have a choice here. We, the ones who research, can sit by and find amusement in the over-reaction and deep seated fear of people around us...or we can choose to share that knowledge we've each worked very hard to gain by good old fashioned time and research.

If we, as a whole, choose the former....I fear we may see some aspects of the worst come to pass by self fulfilling prophecy. After all, some of the worst predictions are based largely on Human behavior or the lack of control with regard to it. If we choose the latter and help in being a positive influence for peace and calm during the storm to come, it can only be for the good. Panic helps no one and kills many. Fear does NO good...and clouds the thinking of people we may come to rely on if things DO go badly.

Let's strive to take everything we've learned and continue to learn as the year progresses to not only prepare and make safe our own home and family, but to encourage the same thinking in others as the opportunity presents itself. No one wants a preacher, but I have a feeling we won't have to start the conversations before long, just as I discovered with my neighbor.

Peace to All in whatever may come in the next 12 months. May we all be alive, healthy and well this time in 2013 to laugh about all this concern. May we be so fortunate.

I've been doing my part. Most are agreeable but there's a handful who don't want to hear that they have nothing to worry about. No point trying to talk to the latter group about it...I'm convinced they want it to happen more than fear it.
great thread S&F

Great and very insightful post Wrabbit.

I'm finding that some people I know have really bought into the world is going to end this year. I'm quite shocked at what I'm starting to hear from folks I thought were pretty stable. There is even one Lady I know, who plans on marrying a man she said she probably doesn't even love, so she won't be alone when the world ends.

I think you are right about it being our duty to help some people with some clarity. I, like you, don't make it a point of telling folks about my ATS side. I guess I really need to rethink some things.

Hard to even talk to people anymore.

We are perfectly divided at 50% for most issues.

One group thinks the other group are complete idiots for there point of view. And one group is probably right about the other.

But so many people do not have the ability of critical thinking anymore. They make up their mind about it and then ignore any evidence that is in opposition to their opinion. Maybe it is too many video games. Maybe it is the public schools. Maybe it is something in the water.

It is really way to much work to assist others in their thinking and forming of opinions.

So much easier to just nod and smile.

reply to post by Wrabbit2000


Yes well. The enemies of reason can do more damage than people realise. And there are alot of enemies of reason here on ats as well as other places. Every person who has ever written a book on the end or changing of the world predictions in 2012 ia an enemy of reason. Anyone who continues to state that there's anything in it is an enemy of reason. Nowhere at any point does the calender state that anything is going to happen other than the calendar is going to finish.


The preblem is that the REAL experts on the calendar have been drowned out by the new agers and now the BORING truth is burried under a mile of crap. There has been alot of money made with these 2012 predictions and there's not one tiny liitle bit of evidence in anything they say and there is not so much as one single reference in the calender to any global change.

NOTHING IS GOING TO HAPPEN OTHER THAN THE ENDING OF THE CALENDAR. The real experts, the ones who have deciphered it and worked with it have never said that IT says the world will end or anything of the kind.

Anyone who supports and spreads this most unrealistic rubbish is AN ENEMY OF REASON. 2012 is just another year.

reply to post by steveknows

I saw no mention of Mayan calendars in the OP's post but can you not see where it is all headed regardless of Doom Prophecies? Wars, financial meltdown, political instability...?

Guess not. Have fun!

ETA I stand corrected. Mayans were mentioned but this is but a part of the "thing" and probably quite insignificant. In any case, bad # seems to be speeding up like never before.

Originally posted by LightSpeedDriver
reply to post by steveknows

 

I saw no mention of Mayan calendars in the OP's post but can you not see where it is all headed regardless of Doom Prophecies? Wars, financial meltdown, political instability...?

Guess not. Have fun!

ETA I stand corrected. Mayans were mentioned but this is but a part of the "thing" and probably quite insignificant. In any case, bad # seems to be speeding up like never before.

edit on 5/1/12 by LightSpeedDriver because: ETA

Which particular part of the truth I posted upset you enough to cause you to rush in and respond to my post without you first reading the OP correctly?

It's kind of like turning off the TV while the kids are watching Alice in wonderland. Isn't it? Guess so. Have fun!

Yep. Enemies of reason.

Just to clarify before things get totally out of hand...

I mentioned the Mayan Predictions and it is seen as 'The Big One' with relation to the media and the focus the public will likely be seeing on their televisions for at least the last half of this year..in a nonstop flood. That isn't the only one though and I don't think it'll be the only thing people come to learn -just- enough about to deeply fear.

Frankly, it's the combination of factors I'm thinking about as much as any one thing for fear being generated at high levels among those around us this year.

Some of the highlights of doom we are already being told is quite possible or can be expected:


- Mayan Prediction - Dec, 21 2012
- Solar Cycle 24 - All year with latest reports indicating a peak in Jan-March of 2013. Reports vary on dates.
- Financial Collapse - All Year or until it happens whichever comes first.
- Societal Collapse - (Occupy style) - All year or until it happens, whichever comes first
- Super-Flu / Various Bio Threats - All Year or until it happens
- War with Iran - Sooner than later by news headlines
- War with Syria - Probably later than Iran but sooner in the scope of things
- World War III - The Big Thermo-Nuclear Kahuna to end them all - All year or until it happens
- Galactic Gravitational Plane Alignment - Maybe Maya, maybe not - Starting sometime in late 2012


That's only the highlights and headliners. As I've said in side posts and replies, this is the big one. Y2k was a warm up and Elenin was nothing but a side show. This is what people have talked about and heard they should fear for many years...some, for decades. There is something in there for every flavor of worry and anxiety. By the time 2013 opens to a new year, I believe we'll have seen all of the above played to maximum effect by Media, if not some actually play out to happen.

reply to post by Wrabbit2000


Nice summary. Now I am scared.

reply to post by steveknows

Let us indeed speak truth. The point is, the OP was focusing also on "human issues" more than just a Mayan calendar (which few people really "know" about apart from what they read in the papers, Apocalypto)), unlike the neighbour. She lives nextdoor to a conspiracy theorist, I'm sure it's invisibly catching and possibly telepathic.

Viva 2012! It will surely be a most excellent vintage. The end of the world is nigh so let's help one another a little. Just for a change...

reply to post by LightSpeedDriver


Could not be as bad as 2009.

That was a tough year. Deployed, deployment canceled, layed off.

2011 was a great year. Give me another like that.

Many people are so absorbed in survival there is no time for reflection, or news, or debate, or research.

Just go to work, kids to soccer. Go to bed. Do it again the next day.

reply to post by Wrabbit2000


Unfortunately those that spread this fear feel that they have no responsibilities towards others. If someone takes their own life as a result of the lies spread about 2012 the fearmongers have come out and said that they will not feel the least bit guilty. As a result how can you expect them to come out and help assuage fears when they see no repercussions to their actions? The way I see it most are almost disconnected from reality. They don't see this as a literal end of the world. They see it as a game. They don't care about what the end of the world would actually entail. They just care about being right. Unfortunately this happens to be the most vocal contingent. One need only look at the 2012 forum on here to see this. I have tried to dispel the fears surrounding 2012 through extensive research, but anyone on here can see that my attempts have been buried by those who would rather spread lies then look for the truth.

reply to post by Xcalibur254


Beautifully put.

Due to personal proximity to what can happen to the susceptible at the hands of fear-mongering, I have no problem admitting that I've developed an intense desire to shame the living # out of certain doom merchants who spread baseless endtimes musings.

Call it an agenda, I don't give a toss.

reply to post by Xcalibur254

I think your entirely correct about some people really enjoying the fear and, in some cases, terror they can generate in others. I saw it in the Elenin thread and in a few cases..I admit I was among the crowd that war gamed some awfully terrifying scenarios without any qualifications or notes about how unlikely it might actually be...yet possible. I suppose that is about the time I began to realize that some folks reading those threads...and now 2012...ARE taking this very seriously and feeling deep anxiety.

Hopefully in this, a much larger issue, others can realize the same thing you're talking about and which led me to write this thread. I imagine it's something like the crowd yelling for someone to jump off the ledge or bridge. It's all great fun until the guy actually does it...only then does it dawn on a % of the crowd that they HELPED cause the death. Perhaps...just maybe....voices like yours and mine, along with others here can help avoid the worst of the doom porn and scare tactics being run this year purely for the amusement of those posting it.

reply to post by Wrabbit2000


That's correct. It's more than just the 2012 predictions crap that the enemies of reason like to spread. They exaggerate the potential negative effects of immunisation and this once actually caused a rise in child deaths in the UK who would otherwise have been protected.

They convince people to go to witch doctors and new age quacks when the've got an unexplained illness because they spread rumours that modern medicines is trying to change our genes or get us hooked or sum such crap and then by the time the sick person gets to a real doctor there's nothing that can be done and they die. Yes it is more than the unrealistic panic of the Mayan thing that is a danger thanks to the enemies of reason.

The enemies of reason have a lot to answer for and that includes every single one of them here on ats.

So 2000 came and went and so will 2012. Yes, many will spend a lot of money on things to "survive" and yes, in 2013 there will be a fire sale of the same stuff. We saw this in 2000, and my mother was right there with everyone else. The bottom line is some will make a lot of money selling the hype and some will lose money in their bet that the world will end in some way, but over all we will call carry on, and that corner where we have the "if the # hits the fan" stuff we will look at it like we did for 2000... in other words not a big deal in the end...

Originally posted by steveknows
reply to post by Wrabbit2000

 

That's correct. It's more than just the 2012 predictions crap that the enemies of reason like to spread. They exaggerate the potential negative effects of immunisation and this once actually caused a rise in child deaths in the UK who would otherwise have been protected.

They convince people to go to witch doctors and new age quacks when the've got an unexplained illness because they spread rumours that modern medicines is trying to change our genes or get us hooked or sum such crap and then by the time the sick person gets to a real doctor there's nothing that can be done and they die. Yes it is more than the unrealistic panic of the Mayan thing that is a danger thanks to the enemies of reason.

The enemies of reason have a lot to answer for and that includes every single one of them here on ats.

edit on 6-1-2012 by steveknows because: (no reason given)

Somewhere in all this Darwin Theory kicks in....

Originally posted by Xtrozero

Originally posted by steveknows
reply to post by Wrabbit2000

 

That's correct. It's more than just the 2012 predictions crap that the enemies of reason like to spread. They exaggerate the potential negative effects of immunisation and this once actually caused a rise in child deaths in the UK who would otherwise have been protected.

They convince people to go to witch doctors and new age quacks when the've got an unexplained illness because they spread rumours that modern medicines is trying to change our genes or get us hooked or sum such crap and then by the time the sick person gets to a real doctor there's nothing that can be done and they die. Yes it is more than the unrealistic panic of the Mayan thing that is a danger thanks to the enemies of reason.

The enemies of reason have a lot to answer for and that includes every single one of them here on ats.

edit on 6-1-2012 by steveknows because: (no reason given)

Somewhere in all this Darwin Theory kicks in....

I hope so. I really do.

reply to post by Wrabbit2000





I like your idea about helping others it is very nice and the right thing to do. I am not sure the world is coming to a end but I do believe the more people buy into it the better the chance for a self fulfilling proficy to happen.



Just one think to add about helping other you don't need to run faster then the bear. It is harsh but true.

I see where you are coming from and see the logic. Though personally, I don’t think it can change much.
For one thing, prophecies are largely subject to interpretation and have nothing to do with facts....but okay, it could be said, if they are going to base their perceptions of reality on prophecies, you could use that as a way of influencing their perceptions by adjusting their interpretations.

The thing I observe is that, like you pointed out in this woman, fear is not a big factor in those that have accepted this view of the world ending ! I’ve watched the same thing around me too. There may be moments where a bit of fear creeps in, but it seems to be outweighed by an opposing feeling of willing such a thing to happen. There’s an ambivalence going on.

There’s a discontent with the current state of things, of our society at this time, which has reached huge proportions in the collective consciousness. I started picking up on it years ago, and feeling it grow like a tsunami does- long time, under the surface, building force as it travels. (that’s when I started preparing myself). So many just feeling like we’ve come to a phase of our technology and culture in which the separation is too wide- self and other, individual conscience and collective conscience, rich and poor, strong and weak, subjective and objective, mental and physical realities.....at a point where re-integration becomes the strongest drive. Yang to Yin.

It may cause an inner conflict between that larger view of a need to « end game » and start again with a blank slate, and our own physical instincts of self preservation : concern for self and concern for the whole.
But there seems to be a point in the collective consciousness where the scales have tipped, the events have been decided by a majority and there’s not much else that can be done to change it. The mechanisms are put into action. I think we are at that point.

So each of us can deal with that as it is arriving- some turn to faith that they’ll survive, some turn to faith that they won’t and another reality awaits them, in order to calm the anxiety of self preservation instincts. And honestly- think about it- if we just have a period of transition (say, another world war) in which there are many deaths, but the world does continue to exist.....how can you be sure that those foreseeing an end to this world aren’t correct in subjective terms ?? Like maybe they are sensing what will happen to them ! Perhaps, for them, this world will no longer exist. They may be one of those that will pass on.

I don’t think we are in any position to judge whether they are right or wrong about that.