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Ron Paul's "Austrian" Jewish Economics

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posted on Jan, 4 2012 @ 07:47 PM
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In an article by Anthony Migchels (on henrymakow.com), there is an examination of Ron Paul's past statements and his views on the Gold standard as opposed to fiat currency. A quote from the article;


RON PAUL

All this has become relevant because of Ron Paul, of course. But Paul is not the man patriots think he is. In 2001, he said, There's nothing to fear from globalism, free trade and a single worldwide currency.... The effort in recent decades to unify government surveillance over all world trade and international financial transactions through the UN, IMF, World Bank, WTO, ICC, the OECD, and the Bank of International Settlements can never substitute for a peaceful world based on true free trade, freedom of movement, a single but sound market currency, and voluntary contracts with private property rights.... The ultimate solution will only come with the rejection of fiat money worldwide, and a restoration of commodity money. Commodity money if voluntarily and universally accepted could give us a single world currency requiring no money managers, no manipulators orchestrating a man-made business cycle with rampant price inflation." -- Ron Paul, Congressional Record, March 13, 2001

Liberty Review Article

Paul says Gold will keep Government spending in check. He wants to cut Government spending, but is unable to explain how this would lead to different results than what we have seen in Greece: an imploding economy with a withering tax base and even higher deficits as the predictable result.

In the debate you see the Keynes-Austrian Dialectic: Spending versus Austerity. Both ignore interest, which is the hidden common ground.


Now, personally I like Ron Paul as he appears to be a bit of fresh air when it comes to politicians, however, he does seem to support standards that do not move toward a social credit system, but rather a gold standard system that would have the same effects as fiat currency, they both share interest.

I am not for a gold standard apart from a national currency valuation standpoint. I would like to see a social credit platform in use, one where money is produced by government treasuries directly at zero interest so that money can circulate unencumbered. It really is the only way we are going to dig ourselves out of the "Rothschild black hole."

So, this is just a bit of a heads-up that may or may not have been seen before.

Cheers - Dave
edit on 1/4.2012 by bobs_uruncle because: (no reason given)




posted on Jan, 4 2012 @ 08:23 PM
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reply to post by bobs_uruncle
 


"Jewish Economics" .... What? It's called Classical Economics. Ron Paul leans towards something called "Mercantilism".. sometimes called "Protectionism".

A key aspect of this combination of Mercantilism and Classical Economics is a strong emphasis on production and balanced trade.

Gold as a physical form cannot be created from nothing, cannot be inflated into existence, cannot easily be borrowed from other countries etc. It IS a limited form of currency in that the extensions of credit cannot create huge capital inflation in equities which results in much slower economic advancement .. it's a horrible currency for a Technology based economy like ours, it would cripple us. You also cannot have a huge trade imbalance .. it will collapse the economy. And you cannot have massive debts at interest based on Gold .. you will quickly go bankrupt. As many nations in the past have. The "Fiat" (horrible name but it's the only thing ATS understands) currency is perfect for an economy that doesn't really produce anything tangible but has the economic power to influence it's value.

The REAL problem, imo, with our current currency is Fractional Reserve Banking. This isn't tied to Capitalism in any way, or any variation of it.. but it allows private corporations to essentially "print" money as a fraction of their holdings.. no company should ever be able to loan more than they actually have in physical holdings. Get rid of Fractional Reserve Banking and you eliminate a massive portion of the "victimization" that occurs in our economy.



posted on Jan, 4 2012 @ 08:32 PM
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reply to post by bobs_uruncle
 


He's completely against the UN, IMF, New World Order, Trilateral Commission, North American Union, and all of those kinds of organizations...

Based on what I picked up from that quote of his, he's not calling for a one world currency or anything like that, but instead universally sound money that doesn't screw over the majority.
edit on 4-1-2012 by TupacShakur because: (no reason given)



posted on Jan, 4 2012 @ 08:39 PM
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reply to post by TupacShakur
 


Although the best thing about the Gold Standard.. it IS an International Currency. Assuming of course it's physically formed, and not "Gold Backed" or, in other words, paper that can be valued in any way but exchangeable in Gold. Nothing wrong with an International Currency .. so long as it's not a banker controlling it. Let Mother Nature dictate the supply of money.



posted on Jan, 4 2012 @ 08:41 PM
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Ron Paul seems like a great guy but there is no saving this system.

Sometimes the forest needs to burn down so that something new can grow in its place.



posted on Jan, 4 2012 @ 08:56 PM
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reply to post by Rockpuck
 



"Jewish Economics" .... What? It's called Classical Economics. Ron Paul leans towards something called "Mercantilism".. sometimes called "Protectionism".

What are you talking about?

That statement is a total lie, Ron Paul in no way leans towards Mercantilism or any kind of protectionism!



posted on Jan, 4 2012 @ 09:04 PM
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Many people say the gold standard would be bad because our over-inflated way of life would come to an end.

DUH.


Who wants to live a lie???


But Ron doesn't want a purely gold backed economy, he is openly for competing currencies and commodities.

Nothing wrong with that.


Let's reverse the damage done by the federal reserve and the filthy rich mega elites that fund the world's central banks. It is time for us to take this country back.

Vote Ron Paul! Be a delegate! do SOMETHING!



posted on Jan, 4 2012 @ 09:04 PM
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U.S. Constitution, Article 1, Section 10 might be worth a read there, bob, to see where Paul is coming from.



posted on Jan, 4 2012 @ 09:33 PM
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reply to post by Rockpuck
 


Well measured words of yours there Rockpuck. I enjoyed reading your post.
In the beginning, there was a 3:1 ratio of lending:holdings. That seemed to be a solid
practice. Or a least more solid than today's practices.
The danger of currency wholly based on commodities is often overlooked.
This danger is the utmost depletion of natural resources.

Think Haite for a moment. What happens when all the forests and resources are depleted
and yet you have a growing population. I think you know.

Maybe Easter Island would be a better example.

In either case, the point of balance is forever imbalanced.

Thus was born " Intellectual Currency".

But Alas, someone forgot to spank that child. So, good luck with "The Brat."


I might add that "Speculation" is the bastard child of "Intellectual Currency".

This may be the symbolic child ripe for the sacrifice upon The Alter of The God of Abraham.

"Where do you want that killing done?" Down on Highway 61.

edit on 4-1-2012 by Wildmanimal because: Add Content



posted on Jan, 4 2012 @ 09:40 PM
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reply to post by Rockdisjoint
 


Ron Paul is against Free Trade, the WTO, NAU, believes in strict Tariffs and using the Government to reduce foreign competition be deregulation and lower taxation (on all levels) to entice corporations back to the United States.

Mercantilism:

"an economic system developing during the decay of feudalism to unify and increase the power and especially the monetary wealth of a nation by a strict governmental regulation of the entire national economy usually through policies designed to secure an accumulation of bullion, a favorable balance of trade, the development of agriculture and manufactures, and the establishment of foreign trading monopolies "

www.merriam-webster.com...

Note I said a variation of Mercantilism, which is a variation of Capitalism in general. ANY economic policy that favors a Gold Standard is a variation of Mercantilism, because the Government will be required to do all that is necessary to ensure an industry does not run amok in the system and exhaust the supplies of precious metals. Such was the case many times in Europe, and even the United States prior to WWI. The key component to Mercantilism is manufacturing, having a Gold Standard, using Trade Controls/Tariffs and regulation of finite resources.

You cannot for instance have a "Free Market" economy with the Gold Standard, because the direction of equity investment dictates the movement of precious metals from region to region, consequently, outside of the Nation. Once this occurs the willing movement of capital from one nation to another becomes a migratory pattern of wealth movement that will sink entire empires (Think naked short-selling).. hence why under the Gold Standard the Mercantilism philosophy of controlling the exports of precious metals meant that capital investments outside of the Nation was strictly regulated if not banned all together. This leaves manufacturing as the key source of wealth generation for capital purposes to expand the economy as a whole.

Paul may not be an outright supporter of Mercantilism or any variation thereof, however his core economic ideologies strongly support Mercantilism's core tenants. It all revolves around GOLD. You cannot have a Gold standard and an open free and global economy.. the United States would be bankrupt within hours.


edit on 1/4/2012 by Rockpuck because: (no reason given)



posted on Jan, 4 2012 @ 09:48 PM
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Originally posted by Rockpuck
"Jewish Economics" .... What? It's called Classical Economics. Ron Paul leans towards something called "Mercantilism".. sometimes called "Protectionism".

Protectionism?
He wants more trading even with Cuba and maybe Iran and North Korea
Come on man

Originally posted by Rockpuck
Gold as a physical form cannot be created from nothing, cannot be inflated into existence, cannot easily be borrowed from other countries etc.

Gold CAN be borrowed to other countries
When the U.S. had the gold standard it was a creditor nation, now that there's no gold standard the U.S. is a debtor nation


Originally posted by Rockpuck
It IS a limited form of currency in that the extensions of credit cannot create huge capital inflation in equities which results in much slower economic advancement

It is NOT a limited form of currency
it's not about limiting currency but limited delfation and/or inflation
Basically if you put $30 under your bed for 40 years it should still be worth $30 in 40yrs
That has nothing to do with limiting currency


Originally posted by Rockpuck
it's a horrible currency for a Technology based economy like ours, it would cripple us.

Quite the opposite, as we move more and more towards technology under a FIAT currency governed by the FED money is dust to elected officials.
The amount of laptops, iPads and whatever that they buy you have no idea
Sometimes loads of laptops are just left at the doorstep of elected officals
Now politicians want something called Telepresence, bought by Cisco from Tandberg, check how much $$$
Flights, executive suites in 5 star hotels, private jets..... the works

A gold standard keeps the govt. in check
Keeping the govt. in check means less taxes and more reserve
More reserves and less taxes means more buying power
Less regulations, less taxes, more buying power means a healthy economy
Gold Standard means a non-fluctuating currency value combined with healthy buying power in the market means confidence in the market

These are all good things
A gold standard keeps govt. in check


Originally posted by Rockpuck
You also cannot have a huge trade imbalance .. it will collapse the economy.

Then you are for a one-world currency



Originally posted by Rockpuck
And you cannot have massive debts at interest based on Gold

True, very true
Going back to the keep govt. in check
since you cannot have massive debts based on Gold HelloOOooo, you won't HAVE so much debt


Originally posted by Rockpuckyou will quickly go bankrupt. As many nations in the past have.

Ummm...
Going bankrupt now
Hello?


Originally posted by RockpuckThe "Fiat" (horrible name but it's the only thing ATS understands) currency is perfect for an economy that doesn't really produce anything tangible but has the economic power to influence it's value.

That makes absolutely no sense



posted on Jan, 4 2012 @ 10:07 PM
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reply to post by ModernAcademia
 




Protectionism? He wants more trading even with Cuba and maybe Iran and North Korea Come on man


Trading has nothing to do with Protectionism. Free trade. Being against any form of "Free Trade" is considered "protectionist" Nothing wrong with that.. I'm a Protectionist.. bring the troops home, close our bases, raise a Tariff and tell the World to screw off.



Gold CAN be borrowed to other countries When the U.S. had the gold standard it was a creditor nation, now that there's no gold standard the U.S. is a debtor nation


Key word: "Easily" .. if you do not produce Gold or else aquire it by a trade surplus, outstanding debt in Gold will quickly bankrupt the country. When America was a creditor (via Gold) they had a massive trade surplus.



It is NOT a limited form of currency it's not about limiting currency but limited delfation and/or inflation


Two types of Gold Standards:

Physical. Inflation is determined by the total accumulated wealth within an economy .. inflation by supply.
Gold Pegging. By Pegging a currency you are saying our currency is either going to be worth a specific ounce of Gold or else saying that the currency represents physical Gold. What we used (after WWII) was a Pegging system, however it in no way controls inflation .. in fact .. it's relationship to Gold is quite distant because the Government or Central Bank can simply revalue the currency at any moment. Which when we Pegged to Gold we did quite often.



Basically if you put $30 under your bed for 40 years it should still be worth $30 in 40yrs That has nothing to do with limiting currency


That only works when you compare a currency not pegged to Gold to Gold. Relative purchasing power.. via Gold to a "Fiat" currency. Under a Gold Standard it's entirely dependent on the actual supply of Gold within the economy, or under a Pegged currency the pre determined valuations.



Quite the opposite, as we move more and more towards technology under a FIAT currency governed by the FED money is dust to elected officials.


Huh? Yes that's what I said .. fiat currency you create the illusion of wealth without wealth, allowing more of the population to focus on the development of technology. Hence under a Gold based currency that function would be severely limited, thus crippling the economy.



A gold standard keeps the govt. in check


Right.

By stopping inflation unless supply is increased, which indicates prosperity.
By stopping foreign debt because excessive debt with Gold = bankruptcy.
By forcing the Government to consolidate economic power using a Protectionist model to retain jobs, technology and capital.

Everything I said.



Then you are for a one-world currency


Gold IS A ONE WORLD CURRENCY. Doesn't matter if it has Obama's face plastered on the coin or Ayatollah Khomeini .. an ounce is an ounce is an ounce.


That makes absolutely no sense


Basic Classical Economic principle: You cannot have wealth if you produce nothing. We produce ideas, while consuming manufactured items made elsewhere. This means we circulate an internal portion of the currency and use a portion to purchase outside our economy. This creates huge trade imbalances.. but we can just print more, via inflation we keep the economy together. This cannot be done with Gold .. once you are out of Gold, you are out of Gold. Hence, for our economy, if we want big TV's, cheap Big Macs, SUV's, and 3000sqf homes .. we need a fiat currency. Personally I'd love to see our lifestyle change with the implications of a Gold Standard, but it's highly unlikely.

Thanks for knit picking but not really countering anything I said.



posted on Jan, 4 2012 @ 10:33 PM
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Like I said, I like Ron Paul and most of his views. Out of a team of the same 'ole same 'ole political duds in this upcoming horse race, I put my bets on Ron Paul. He seems the only candidate with a real vision. I understand other points made in regards to fractional reserve banking, it is a cancer that eats at the system. But, even a gold standard as applied by the US constitution (or any commodity backed currency) can still be messed with by the power brokers.

I would hope that if a gold and/or silver standard is eventually put into place, the laws would be tightened up on auditing reserves as we don't need inflation caused by gold plated titanium bars, right? What should really be done in the interim to any kind of conversion is to clamp down on Wall Street and the other criminals using existing laws that are supposed to work against ponzi schemes, war profiteering, malfeasance and criminal conflicts of interest. As well, it might be a plan to make lobbying illegal, these would all be steps in the right direction.

If a gold standard is put in place, as long as the money is issued/printed based on set values and at no interest to the government or people, I don't see a problem.

Cheers - Dave



posted on Jan, 4 2012 @ 10:57 PM
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His views on a world currency and initiating a gold standard are a little bit scary when you consider the painful austerity that will follow when the world's fiat monetary system is imploded. I know that it may be inevitable but why rush it when we can undergo some meaningful austerity now and hopefully commit to reining in govt spending? The system we get will probably be gold + a basket of storage commodities (ie, crude oil) and then that basket will be maintained as a "reserve" (like current bank reserve requirements) and get lent out 9x just like how fiat money is created.



posted on Jan, 5 2012 @ 12:23 AM
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reply to post by CosmicCitizen
 


lol, half of this forum can't wait for a revolution and/or government implosion to start over and you're afraid of the gold standard?


Embrace the real money! look up the definition of 'real money' on blacks law dictionary.



Like I and a few others have said in this thread though, Ron understands the economy and business cycles, he understands we can't go back on a gold standard because it scares many people.



posted on Jan, 5 2012 @ 09:06 AM
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reply to post by Rockpuck
 



Ron Paul is against Free Trade, believes in strict Tariffs

Total lie!



Ron Paul is a strong proponent of free trade and rejects protectionism..... you can Google this stuff instead of just making crap up and putting words into his mouth, you know?



You cannot for instance have a "Free Market" economy with the Gold Standard, because the direction of equity investment dictates the movement of precious metals from region to region, consequently, outside of the Nation.

There is a great book called economics in one lesson written by Henry Hazlitt...... I suggest you read it.

edit on 5-1-2012 by Rockdisjoint because: (no reason given)



posted on Jan, 5 2012 @ 09:28 AM
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Originally posted by bobs_uruncle
Now, personally I like Ron Paul as he appears to be a bit of fresh air when it comes to politicians, however, he does seem to support standards that do not move toward a social credit system, but rather a gold standard system that would have the same effects as fiat currency, they both share interest.


That is preposterous.

A 100% reserve gold standard has no central bank setting interest rates.

A 100% reserve gold standard has no government printing money.

A 100% reserve gold standard has no inflation.

A 100% reserve gold standard reduces the ability of speculators to use leverage to manipulate futures prices.

The two systems are not even remotely similar, and the results are the exact opposite of one another.

The fiat central banking that we have today results in new money flowing into the hands of bankers and government, which centralizes wealth and power in their hands. Under a gold standard, the exact opposite occurs.



posted on Jan, 5 2012 @ 09:36 AM
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reply to post by Rockdisjoint
 




Ron Paul is a strong proponent of free trade and rejects protectionism..... you can Google this stuff instead of just making crap up and putting words into his mouth, you know?


You're right .. he says he supports free trade and has voted against every free trade agreement that has come through the House. Saying "It increases the size of Government". Oxymoron .. "I believe in Free Trade but won't vote for it!"
His views of "Protectionism" is strictly limited to the proactive actions of Government to manipulate trade to better serve American interest. Which, ironically, under a true Gold Standard .. the Government would have to, else wise the wealth of the nation (Bullion) would be gone very fast.



There is a great book called economics in one lesson written by Henry Hazlitt...... I suggest you read it.


Hazlitt (And Hayek for that matter) knew the power of production and representation of wealth through means of production. It doesn't go into the Gold Standard as a key component of an economy, if it did however it would read much like my own statements here. GOLD is key. For the sake of this thread, that is all that matters .. using Gold as a currency within our own economic model and the theoretical economic models that work with a true Gold Standard (physical Bullion).
edit on 1/5/2012 by Rockpuck because: (no reason given)



posted on Jan, 5 2012 @ 11:11 AM
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reply to post by Rockpuck
 


If you can't see the difference between genuine free trade and free trade agreements then there is really no point in discussing this with you.


edit on 5-1-2012 by Rockdisjoint because: (no reason given)



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