All Roads Lead to Babylon : Mystery Babylon Demystified

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posted on Jan, 2 2012 @ 03:01 PM
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nicely researched & laid out. It can be baffling when the dots get so connected.
I'd recommend this book:

"The Secret History Of The World" by Mark Booth

(was recommended to me by mr.graham hancock)

Pretty much follows your original thread post all the way through modern history with "mystery schools". Knowledge of this - like knowledge of Alchemy - is hidden & rampant throughout world history.
Since the world as we know it is an MC Escher painting (up is down, down is out, out is in) I've been going back over some of this myself.
We should all look at current events, and the world around us 'through the looking glass' so to speak.
Life is mythology right now.
We're being told fantasy is reality, so it's worth researching the past in this regards.
I've done some research I can't wait to share with you all the moment I'm past this 20 post freshman hazing.
cheers all.
edit on 2-1-2012 by DresdenCodex because: (no reason given)




posted on Jan, 2 2012 @ 03:04 PM
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I have not logged into my account at ATS since May of last year.

For those who know me or can read between the lines of this post, it should be obvious why I have not logged in as well as why I have chosen to do so to comment on this post.

I will pay respects to this thread, but also offer criticism due to the very obvious (and I will choose to use the word respect) respect paid to the All Roads Lead to Rome thread authored by he who shall not be named.

This topic was one that was argued at length in the afformentioned thread and I was initially on the side of Mystery Babylon; however, it would pay to apply the rule of ockham's razor to this theory.
I do hold your opinion in high regards, muzzleflash, as we have often fallen on the same side of many an argument.

With that said, I find it much more likely, and simple, that Rome and their paid for lackeys have molded the many myths and beliefs of ancient civilations, or history as we have so named it, to fit their version of religion in order to manifest a common religious belief.
And a common religious belief is necessary for the implementation of a world governed by one entity.

The flood myth is a crux to define the validity of either theory because it is found in some odd 800 plus civilations and would have had to have been the product of one of three circumstances.

1- It actually happened.

2- The priests of mystery babylon infiltrated the many world cultures to manipulate their beliefs to match the mythology of the mysteries.

3- Rome's paid historians have manipulated history in order to match each respective civilization's mythology to match that of Rome.

I personally find the 3rd possibility the most likely, and thus the most simple and easily attainable.

The plight of John Allegro and the Dead Sea Scrolls gives one an idea of why.

Link to story of John Allegro
edit on 1/2/2012 by Josephus23 because: (no reason given)



posted on Jan, 2 2012 @ 03:16 PM
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Originally posted by muzzleflash
A very interesting youtube video:


1) That the "Romans" purposely perverted the truth by overwhelming all references to the original thesis of Jesus with overt polytheistic practices/symbolism (in order to subvert the anarchist ideas and regain or maintain control of the masses as the ideals spread).
Or
2) That they invented most of it as a result of paganism in the first place.


I will throw in my lot with #1. The Vatican is all about power. What better way to destroy the people's liberation theology of the time - that being the teachings of the man Jesus Christ - by manipulating it with preexisting pagan and polytheistic sun worship practices?

I would also consider the following:

-The word "Pope" means "Father." The word "Father" as a title was forbidden by Jesus Christ. (Matthew 23:9)
-The antichrist has been here since the 1st century (1 John 2:18, 1 John 4:3) and will be here when Jesus Christ returns (2 Thessalonians 2:8), indicating a 2,000 year lifespan.
-The Vatican is built among 7 hills.
-The Beast's power comes from Rome.
-The Pope is currently calling for a New World Order.
-The Pope has been meeting with several religious authorities recently under the guise of peace, and we could see a one world interfaith religion this year.
-VICARIUS FILII DEI - the official title of the Pope - literally means "in place of/substituting for the Son of God". The letters in the Roman alphabet are also used in the numerical system.

V I C A R I U S
5+1+100+0+0+1+5+0 = 112

F I L I I
0+1+50+1+1 = 53

D E I
500+0+1 = 501

112+53+501 = 666

Coincidence?
edit on 1/2/2012 by DarkKnight21 because: (no reason given)



posted on Jan, 2 2012 @ 04:12 PM
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Been watching a lot of Walter Veith's lectures on the subject of the occult and the new world order.
His presentations are very clear and insightful.
Obviously his angle is that he is a "Protest"ant against the Vatican.
So there is bias. But much can be learned from his series which will provide you with many hours information:

Here is just a few samples:

The Secret Behind Secret Societies


The Islamic Connection (very interesting)


The Wine of Babylon


A New World Order


That All May Be One



He also has some good lectures on health & nutrition



posted on Jan, 2 2012 @ 04:26 PM
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Originally posted by muzzleflash

Originally posted by borntowatch
And the fact that Babylon didnt exist till @ 2000 bc doesnt reflect poorly on it being the foundation all this ANE culture.


It was expected that you would know I was referring to Ancient Sumeria.

Sumer was first settled between 4500 and 4001 BC

That's 6000+ years ago.

Also I said explicitly this isn't what I believe but instead what the Occult Orders / Organizations believe as far as I can tell. I wanted to use the name Babylon because in the Occult they all call it "Mystery Babylon" as does the Bible and other references. It is a cool way to name the thread too, and easily identifiable.
edit on 2-1-2012 by muzzleflash because: (no reason given)


Honestly I find your title misleading and piggy-backing on an already popular topic. Plus it is a theory based on some cult.
Not sure how this is a conspiracy if it's proven this is their belief. What exactly are we discussing if anything? The theory?

General discussions are not dictations such as your posts and responses, with all due respect.
edit on 2-1-2012 by EspyderMan because: (no reason given)



posted on Jan, 2 2012 @ 04:34 PM
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Originally posted by Josephus23
I have not logged into my account at ATS since May of last year.

For those who know me or can read between the lines of this post, it should be obvious why I have not logged in as well as why I have chosen to do so to comment on this post.

I will pay respects to this thread, but also offer criticism due to the very obvious (and I will choose to use the word respect) respect paid to the All Roads Lead to Rome thread authored by he who shall not be named.

This topic was one that was argued at length in the afformentioned thread and I was initially on the side of Mystery Babylon; however, it would pay to apply the rule of ockham's razor to this theory.
I do hold your opinion in high regards, muzzleflash, as we have often fallen on the same side of many an argument.

With that said, I find it much more likely, and simple, that Rome and their paid for lackeys have molded the many myths and beliefs of ancient civilations, or history as we have so named it, to fit their version of religion in order to manifest a common religious belief.
And a common religious belief is necessary for the implementation of a world governed by one entity.

The flood myth is a crux to define the validity of either theory because it is found in some odd 800 plus civilations and would have had to have been the product of one of three circumstances.

1- It actually happened.

2- The priests of mystery babylon infiltrated the many world cultures to manipulate their beliefs to match the mythology of the mysteries.

3- Rome's paid historians have manipulated history in order to match each respective civilization's mythology to match that of Rome.

I personally find the 3rd possibility the most likely, and thus the most simple and easily attainable.

The plight of John Allegro and the Dead Sea Scrolls gives one an idea of why.

Link to story of John Allegro
edit on 1/2/2012 by Josephus23 because: (no reason given)


It is much more likely religion is a side-show of politics, more-so then a driver of it. The church and most religious organizations have lost more power in the past 25 years then ever before, leading one to conclude religious holds little significance in today's power structure.

This basically decimates the "All Roads Lead to Rome" theory.

Sure there is a lot of facts that might support this theory but not one fact that proves it, why that topic got so much heat/popularity is beyond me. Simple people like complex explanations I guess.



posted on Jan, 2 2012 @ 04:39 PM
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VERY GOOD THREAD and I am sooooo glad I logged in today! I really love this type of discussion and so far not a lot of trolls....just a lot of information and I really appreciate the work you have put forth!!!

Everyone who takes a journey of Truth is highly commendable in my book and I have enjoyed reading all the information from you and other posters. ;-)

Peace and love!!! xoxoxo

Jenn



posted on Jan, 2 2012 @ 04:45 PM
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reply to post by muzzleflash
 


Just to clarify some things. Saying everything in regards to an ideal is from a single source is by default, true. Of course they did. One idea grew into 2 ideas, which branched out into more ideas, all evolving from the first.

I am not sure what the point is in showing this? You have failed to prove the correlation of these ideas are in fact premeditated from their inception up until today. That these ideas were purposefully grown from their creation into a huge conspiracy to make a one world government falls on the side of absurdity, rather then logic.

Not to insult you but this is grasping for straws, this is why this kind of assumption belongs on ATS and not in a science/history book.

It's far more plausible some people took advantage of these systems to benefit from them. Nothing human can last, not even a conspiracy theory.
edit on 2-1-2012 by EspyderMan because: (no reason given)



posted on Jan, 2 2012 @ 04:54 PM
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Originally posted by EspyderMan

It is much more likely religion is a side-show of politics, more-so then a driver of it. The church and most religious organizations have lost more power in the past 25 years then ever before, leading one to conclude religious holds little significance in today's power structure.

This basically decimates the "All Roads Lead to Rome" theory.

Sure there is a lot of facts that might support this theory but not one fact that proves it, why that topic got so much heat/popularity is beyond me. Simple people like complex explanations I guess.


The Vatican is far removed from its power.

Your scope of reasoning is greatly limited to the New World.
And, in fact, it would pay to stick to the premise in the OP.
If you have anything that detracts from the All Roads Lead To Rome thread, then I would suggest posting it in said thread.
People have spent over a year and 200 pages trying to do so.
While failing, I might add.

Again, I would suggest posting comments in this thread that are relative to the premise in the OP.

My comment was both in support of the OP but yet also critical of it.

Much of what was promoted as the state's ideology/religion/mythology of Sumeria was adpoted and transfomed by Rome.
The same Rome that has slowly transmorgified the religion of Abraham into the worship of the Sun God.
The same sun God that was the primary God of Troy, Apollyon.

The same Troy that was part of the triumvirate of Greek states that served as a blueprint for the Empire of Rome.

Troy- Religion. (Vatican)
Sparta- Military. (USA inc.)
Athens- Law and Banking (London Corp.)

Mystery Babylon is a watered down version of this triumveriate lacking the military tradition, but one must always remember that ALL that we know about the culture of Sumeria is gleened from translations of thier language.

And all translations of their language are highly contested.

Sitchin is just one of many translated versions.
And most mainstream (Roman) scholars do not agree with his translations.

edit on 1/2/2012 by Josephus23 because: (no reason given)



posted on Jan, 2 2012 @ 05:09 PM
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reply to post by Josephus23
 


Thank you for your posts and I apologize I did not actually read more than 20-30 pages of the ARLR thread, but perhaps I should go devote a week towards that goal. I am kind of getting overburdened with all of these books, websites, videos, and threads to read, plus rl issues as well.

However I have a very important question and that is how is it possible that the American tribes were creating these carvings and the particular details of their religions without there being an ancient pre-Rome link to explain it?

I linked the Crespi collection but that is only one of countless references or examples of these extremely distant civilizations participating in what is a nearly identical practice as those in the 'old' world.

How could these engravings be so similar? How could the structure of their beliefs be so similar? Their traditions etc?

It just seems to me that the 'Sumerian connection' is the only reasonable explanation. To attempt to say that Rome was behind all of it and somehow faked all of this stuff (while at the same time famously destroying and desecrating the evidence or covering it up and ignoring it) just doesn't seem to make any sense to me.



posted on Jan, 2 2012 @ 05:20 PM
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Originally posted by something wicked
reply to post by muzzleflash
 


Wow, you surmised all this in a week? Interesting. There's a lot you have posted here that I will look over, but the Mona Lisa piece? It's historically known who he was painting and I'm afraid that is a little bit of a weak link. Whether you think this is a coincidence is a little pointless - he was commissioned to paint a lady and did so, anything else is nothing but speculation - would you agree?


Yes I agree it's speculation. However I dispute the claims that it was innocuous and not important for various reasons.
And again that was just my personal opinion.

1) It looks just like the other iconography.
2) It's the 'most famous painting in the world', for no apparent reason.
3) The 'authorities' made it into what it is today, and maintain it's famous prestige. (why?)
4) These are the same people that build a pyramid and put countless references to the same figure everywhere around the location where the painting is kept. ( Musée du Louvre )

There are other reasons as well. I don't know it just seems totally unreasonable to think that such a mundane painting became the most famous one in history. There are so many other great paintings that get no attention and I find that odd.

It was just something I thought of while comparing the painting to the Statue of Liberty, and those noses looked so similar. Maybe I am wrong, but at the same time, since we don't exactly have photographs to prove otherwise, there is a slight chance I am right.



posted on Jan, 2 2012 @ 05:22 PM
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Originally posted by EspyderMan


Not to insult you but this is grasping for straws, this is why this kind of assumption belongs on ATS and not in a science/history book.


Sure, that's what you want to believe.

Explain the Crespi collection. And when you are done with that, I will have 10 more extremely baffling finds for you to explain away.

Not to insult you either but I am afraid you are grasping at straws, while I am grasping at ancient stone carvings.



posted on Jan, 2 2012 @ 05:39 PM
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I've just been through all of the posts and the links and also watched most of the videos. All of the links make many points that I cannot disagree with. Although others I think take the central points off track.

Just to pick up on Lucifer - that was a term for the King of Babylon. "The shining one" Satan is not called Lucifer in the Bible as already explained.

Lucifer refers to a descriptive designation applied to the “king of Babylon.” (Isa 14:4, 12) The Hebrew expression thus translated (NW, Ro, Yg) comes from a root meaning “shine.” (Job 29:3) The rendering “Lucifer” (KJ, Da) is derived from the Latin Vulgate.

It's really interesting that Mystery Babylon appears to be a centre piece of Occult worship through the ages. If the Occult is based on the worship of Satan then according to Biblical history Eve was told by Satan that she "postively would NOT die" making Jehovah out to be a liar, because he had clearly stated that the punishment for disobedience was death. It wasn't a diffcult command to follow. Adam & Eve could eat anything & everything they wanted in the Garden of Eden. It was just ONE tree. However Satan clearly envied their relationship with their Creator and tried to interfere, slander God and have the glory himself. The words Satan & Devil translates as slanderer or false accuser The Greek di‧a′bo‧los means “slanderer.

Mystery Babylon has ever since starting with Nimrod after the flood been absolutely obsessed with religions that promote the false doctrine that humans actually don't die when they die... they have an immortal soul that simply moves onto another spirtiual realm or they are reincarnated to live again. We can see that from all over the globe with almost EVERY religion which has it's roots firmly in the worship of the original Trinity - Semiramis, Nimrod & there son Tammuz.........as Isis, Horus & Osiris in Egypt and so forth.

I am in the camp that the The Council of Nicae deliberately decided to incorporate Babylonish symbolism and structures within the New State Religion of Rome, to make it more acceptable to more people. Rome gained more power the more numbers IT controlled and what's more they would get richer by extracting donations from a much larger flock. I thought it particularly enlightening in one of the videos to see that the Romans worshipped Saturn as well as the Sun. The Roman festival of "Saturnalia" fell on 25th December in mid winter and was heralded with wild orgies and drunken parties! ........ Still people can't see the wood for the trees about Christmas though!

What doesn't appear to have been mentioned is the horrible practices these ancient Babylonish religions had regarding child sacrifices etc. It's appalling how beleif systems in God's like Baal, Molech. Dagon et al demanded that their worshippers sacrfice by passing through the fire children as well as adults. There is evidence that this heinous practice like the Pyramids and the Ziggurats & general tenets spread right around the world.

You can see in the British Museum in London a model of Molech the Bull god where babies and children were trollied along a rack of moving thin cylinders making an ancient conveyor belt that dropped them through his massive mounth into a fiery furnace below. Music was played by a band nearby to drown out any screams.

Apparently the mother had to sacrifice her first born son to Molech or Baal completely of her own free will without regret...If she showed one moment of hesitation or reluctance, then she had to sacrifice the next son and so on.

No wonder Jehovah condemned the Canaanite nations that surrounded Israel. On occasions even they turned to this dreadful practice. The God of the Hebrews lamented at Jeremiah 7:31) . . ."And they have built the high places of To′pheth, which is in the valley of the son of Hin′nom, in order to burn their sons and their daughters in the fire, a thing that I had not commanded and that had not come up into my heart."

Therefore yet again how could the pagan teaching of "hellfire" be from a God where burning a person in a fire had not even come up into his heart? It is yet another Babylonish beleif that was adopted with glee by the Romans as a sure way to control people's behaviour. ie "Do as we say while you are alive or burn in hell!"

The Bible records that King Josiah removed all of these pagan practices including child sacrifice and banished them from the Hebrew nation. (2 Kings 23:10-11) . . ."And he made unfit for worship To′pheth, which is in the valley of the sons of Hin′nom, that no one might make his son or his daughter pass through the fire to Mo′lech".

However it's surely not right to simply label Catholicism with the mark as Babylon The Great. It's not just the Roman Catholic Church where these false doctrines have polluted Christian worship. Nearly all Christendom worship the Cross, Christmas etc and do not seperate themselves from Babylonish practices. Protestants, Baptists, Pentecostalists alike. eg the Archbishop of Canterbury wears a Dagon "fish head" hat just like the ancient priests of Nimrod.

edit on 2-1-2012 by JB1234 because: (no reason given)



posted on Jan, 2 2012 @ 05:40 PM
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Wow Star for at least all the work you put into this. I suspect this has taken you awhile to put together.

If it hasn't then I suspect you are a paid shill and after conversations and reading a few of your threads I doubt the later holds any water.

Great job bookmarking, because this will take more then one look over.



posted on Jan, 2 2012 @ 06:13 PM
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A bit more information on Molech or Moloch the Sun or Fire God of the Biblical Ammonites:

Molech

Moloch has often been identified with Milcom, the god of the Ammonites. He was probably also identified with Baal, and as a sun or fire god, as he was also identified with the Assyrian/Babylonian "Malik", and at Palmyra "Malach-bel". Moloch is also identified with Baal Hammon in Carthaginian religion. Milton writes of him in Paradise Lost "First, Moloch, horrid King, besmeared with blood Of human sacrifice, and parents’ tears; Though, for the noise of drums and timbrels loud, Their children’s cries unheard that passed through fire To his grim idol. Him the Ammonite Worshiped in Rabba and her watery plain, In Argob and in Basan, to the stream Of utmost Arnon. Nor content with such Audacious neighbourhood, the wisest heart Of Solomon he led by fraud to build His temple right against the temple of God On that opprobrious hill, and made his grove The pleasant valley of Hinnom, Tophet thence And black Gehenna called, the type of Hell." - Paradise Lost, i. 391-405


Molech is also associated with Ashtoreth and the veneration of the Owl.



Why would ANY President of the US wish to be dressed up in robes akin to the Klu Klux clan at Bohemian Grove, let alone be in anyway associated with the worship of a representation of a God who made families sacrifice their first born son by passing them through the fire?!!


Bohemian Grove Employee Blows the Whistle on Inside Events: "Described as the 'Greatest Men's Party on Earth,' the members of the Bohemian Club and international elites have been gathering in their redwoods for over 100 years. Regular visitors include the Bushes, Henry Kissinger, Colin Powell, Newt Gingrich, whilst past luminaries have included Former Presidents Regan and Nixon, together BEFORE they had even taken office.... [P]ast luminaries have included Former Presidents Regan and Nixon, together BEFORE they had even taken office.... "The most famous ritual that occurs at the Grove every year is the Symbolic Pagan Worship of Molech – the ‘god’ of Child Sacrifice. ... [P]olitical figureheads from around the world attend this sacrifice ceremony. German Chancellor Helmut Schmidt wrote of his fondness for the Grove ceremonies in his Biography 'Men and Power'.... Former President Richard Nixon is on record questioning the activities at the Grove, making reference to the debase, decadent attitude as well as the homosexual activity there." See A Twist of Faith - Chapter 7


edit on 2-1-2012 by JB1234 because: (no reason given)



posted on Jan, 2 2012 @ 06:41 PM
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reply to post by FoosM
 


Thank you for these great videos, I have never heard of this speaker before.
I started watching the "Wine of Babylon" video while eating dinner and I am about an hour into it now, and I must say this guy has got some really good stuff to talk about. I am going to share these with others they are quite insightful.

This Semiramis stuff really has something to it, the more I look into it the more correlations I keep finding. It's mind blowing for sure.

Thank you very much for sharing this and thank you for turning me onto this well spoken individual. I will now go try to finish the video as I am a little more than halfway through it.



posted on Jan, 2 2012 @ 06:53 PM
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reply to post by muzzleflash
 


You have been busy eh muzzleflash...But ya Semiramis is full of #, and her mystery's is anything but that, but the processes still do go on today only under different guises. And history and all these mysteries be they of Babylon or whatever else are just rewrites of the same old # over and over again.

The whole of history has been no sense or nonsense taken seriously.



posted on Jan, 2 2012 @ 07:15 PM
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Yes...It is the same story of Isis and Osiris and Seth....Osiris was put in a box and then thrown into the river Nile. Isis...his sister/wife...found him eventually...but when she did Seth tore him into 14 pieces and spread him about the land. Isis eventually found all the pieces ...but the penis...(lol)....she then fashioned one from gold and from there night of togetherness....begot a sun/son...HORUS....and so on and so on...

Like I said same old story...however

In occult terms....Isis is the undying and inevitable consciousness....Osirius...(which by the way is O Sirius)...Is the Sun(Son) God...the Logos...Although he does have an evil twin Seth...(Satan, Lucifer, Snake)...

Same old story...different characters...



posted on Jan, 2 2012 @ 07:21 PM
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Well, to point out one thing the freeman guy is wrong about: "helicopters" in Egyptian hieroglyphics. Those are not at all what they appear to be. They look that way due to the process of overwriting, when one symbol was composed over another to reuse space.

One could just as easily say the "submarine" looks like a human bladder or stomach too. It's a case of seeing what you are looking for.

Perhaps he's right about some things, but I stop immediately when I catch a fault because I do not have time to sort through all the information he should have before making the video. Who knows how many more errors abound in the video.

Sorry if that offends anyone, but that's my perspective.



posted on Jan, 2 2012 @ 07:29 PM
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One small point - It was mentioned about the name Virginia. The name actually comes from the land being named after Queen Elizebeth 1, the Virgin Queen. The Virgin Islands were named by Christopher Columbus who named the islands Santa Ursula y las Once Mil Vírgenes, shortened to Las Vírgenes, after Saint Ursula and her 11,000 virgins.





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