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Please Explain Weird Islamic Fatwas. I Certainly Can't.

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posted on Jan, 1 2012 @ 01:19 PM
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I'm looking for more information and opinions on fatwas, which I take to be an order or decision made by a Muslim cleric. I'd like to learn more about this aspect of the Muslim religion.

My curiosty was prompted by this story in Alarabiya.

english.alarabiya.net...

One of the weirdest and most controversial fatwas in 2011 was one issued by an Islamist preacher who lives in Europe. According to this preacher, women are prohibited from eating phallic-shaped fruits and vegetables like cucumbers, bananas, and carrots. Touching or consuming those, he argued, are bound to turn women on and make them engage in sinful fantasies.



In Morocco, the head of the Moroccan Association for Jurisprudence Research stirred both outrage and controversy when he issued a fatwa allowing Muslim men to have sex with their just-deceased wives under the pretext that nothing in Islam prohibits sex with corpses. This fatwa followed a series of sex-related ones issued by the same cleric.



The most outrageous fatwa in Egypt was one that came out last June and in which Egyptian preacher Mohamed al-Zoghbi said eating the meat of the jinn is permissible in Islam and left everyone wondering how anyone can get hold of them in the first place, let alone eat their meat.


Is a fatwa only a suggestion? Does it only apply to a few people? Is it a significant part of Islam? Can it be appealed up the chain? What punishment is there for a woman who eats a carrot? Can a fatwa be enforced on a non-muslim living in a Muslim country?

In short, what in the world is going on here? Eating the meat of a bodiless evil spirit is OK, but eating a carrot isn't? Have a good time having sex with a corpse? Will somebody give me some understanding here?




posted on Jan, 1 2012 @ 01:30 PM
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Sorry, I can't explain it. But, I do know that Islam is not issolated in these kinds of taboos, albeit outdated. Take for example the prechrisitian Hawaiians. One king made it "kapu" for women to eat bananas. Insecure much?




Kapu system
Religion held ancient Hawaiian society together, affecting habits, lifestyles, work methods, social policy and law. The legal system was based on religious kapu, or taboos. There was a correct way to live, to worship, and even to eat. Examples of kapu included the provision that men and women could not eat together ('Aikapu religion). Fishing was limited to specified seasons of the year. Common women faced death for eating bananas, coconuts, and other specific foods. The shadow of the aliʻi must not be touched as it was stealing his mana. Violating kapu even by accident was punishable by death. The aliʻi convinced the common people that they had inherited divine power (mana) and were completely chosen by the gods to rule.




posted on Jan, 1 2012 @ 01:37 PM
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Is a fatwa only a suggestion?"

Not suggestions persay , but they are meant as stamps of authoirty by religious leaders.

a.k.a

"We believe this is wrong , this is right based on our interpertation of Quran and Hadiths , therefore we will issue a warning a.k.a a fatwa so the people who believe in our bs , can buy more of our bs "

They do violate no complusion in religion , but most people don't care about that .

When a religious islamic authoirty who is known in the community issues a fatwah , it makes whatever he issues that fatwah too , religiouly illegal . a sin .

Of course it has no substance other then the power people give it .

LIke a dollar bill, worthless paper but its the people who accept it that give it power.

They try and fatwa many things and topics , they do this for more power because they know most muslims don't really read the quran , they just go by what there religious leaders tell them .

They put alot of trust in the religious leaders because they can never lie right?

But some of them are the worst rats of society masking them selfs as representivites of god.

fatwa's are meant to stamp BAD on something that the religious find offensive of against there version and interpertation of the quran.

So many people issue them , thats its becoming a joke now and less and less powerful. Before it had alot of power but people starting abusing it , and giving out fatwa's because they have some beef with someone or something .

Its just anthoer evil branch of the twisted version of islam some of these religious leaders create.


I would "fatwa" all the people who issue "fatwa's" and tell them to shove it up there ....




edit on 1-1-2012 by yourboycal2 because: (no reason given)



posted on Jan, 1 2012 @ 01:52 PM
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reply to post by yourboycal2
 

Dear yourboycal2,

I'm not disagreeing with you for an instant, and I appreciate the video, but now I have a new question. It seems as though fatwas are receiving less and less respect. If the State is based on respect for the Islamic religion, are we seeing the beginnings of the end of Islam?

With respect,
charles1952



posted on Jan, 1 2012 @ 02:02 PM
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reply to post by charles1952
 


Not end of islam , but the end of controlled tainted islam. More and more muslims are waking up too see how full of $##$ some of these imams , mufti's religious scholars are . Many of them abuse Islam for there own agendas . But thanks to the internet and the age of information that bs espically with fatwa's is coming to an end. More people are actually taking the time to read them selfs whats going on , but for underdevelped countries it will take longer.

The reason fatwa's don't have the power they used too is because , they spit them out like candy now . People are realizing how meaningless they are , and the people who issue them really have no authority , they lead there believers into thinking they did. But That balloon is deflating now , as people are laughing at fatwa's and don't take them seriously. The dark clouds of islam are clearing up , espically with these monsters in sheeps clothing.

After fatwa's are dealt with , hadiths are next
They are another authority set up beside the quran which is in violation of scripture . Many know this , but fear talking about it.

The last guy who was a major contendar in quran only no hadiths , got stabbed multiple times till his death. Thats how serious some of these radicals are brainwashed. But its getting more clearer and clearer as time goes.
edit on 1-1-2012 by yourboycal2 because: (no reason given)



posted on Jan, 1 2012 @ 05:51 PM
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So is there not set authority with Islam at all? I mean really, this religion is worse than Mormonism. Can people really just change their religious text and beliefs based on what a living breath man or woman says?



posted on Jan, 1 2012 @ 06:01 PM
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reply to post by KJV1611
 


The authority is the quran in Islam. Problem is not many muslims speak arabic


So what the religious authorities do is tell people quran is too complicated for you to understand , Let us do it for you .

People hand over trust to them because they don't think no religious leader of islam could ever lie, but now they are waking up to that .

They are learning arabic , and reading the qruan it self for there lifes purposes. The religious scholars have less and less power as the day goes by . Thats why fatwa's are fadinig with there power they once used to have.

Hadiths are next on the list. That's what authorizes many of islams atrocities you see today . Many muslims are busy with hadiths for authority and don't even get to the quran because its "too complicated" for them .

But that is also losing its power , thanks to the information age



posted on Jan, 1 2012 @ 06:04 PM
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reply to post by yourboycal2
 


Sometimes I understand best if I can make some kind of analogy to something I do know..

For example, in some of the more...ummm..Pentecostal branches of Christianity preachers or evangelists are held in a very high regard. They also spew out some real out there stuff from time to time too..

So if one go up behind the pulipit and said to his church - "Any ah ya'll women what wears pants is going straight th' hell!!!"

Would this be kind of like a fatwa if the people held the preacher in such standing they actually believed / followed it?

I picked this particular example because I happen to know lady who won't wear pants for this very reason.



posted on Jan, 1 2012 @ 06:13 PM
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reply to post by Frogs
 


Close , but not all people can issue a fatwa, its mostly high respect people who practice and teach Islam.


Here is an example.

"Ayatollah Ali Khamenei issued a fatwa forbidding the production, stockpiling and use of nuclear weapons on August 9, 2005. The full text of the fatwa was released in an official statement at the meeting of the International Atomic Energy Agency (IAEA) in Vienna.["


Now its a written document in this case , that says production , stockpiling and use of nuclear weapons is against islam it should be regarded as a sin.

Many would agree?

Now muslims hear about this fatwa, and deem nuclear production stockpiling as a SIN , because a high religious scholar says so .


in short ,

If you were a high religious scholar .

You want something to be frowned upon , so you use your religious experince and power to write a note for muslims,

A Fatwa, - Your decleration that its bad. and should be forbidden or avoided.

Say you don't like a person who teaches islam , and you want him out.

You issue a fatwa against him , your authortiative promisary note that this man is bad.

People get the fatwa and consider it .

But not all will listen , most will laugh and call you a hater abusing your power.

others will be like omg avoid that bad guy who the fatwa was issued against.


Think of it as sanctions lol When you piss off someone they will issue these things to bad name you , but if you play by there rules they will lift the sanctions if you will

hope that clears it up :p[



posted on Jan, 1 2012 @ 06:18 PM
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Here is a great example of fatwa's are a joke to the educated.


A cell phone rang in ia mosque.

"The imam turned to the crowd in the Mosque and issued his own fatwa. The fatwa states that the next time somebody allows their phone to go off in the congregation, the imam could throw the guilty person out of the mosque.

After a degree of shouting at the congregation, the imam regained his composure, turned around, and continued with the Taraweeh.

A fatwa, is a legal pronouncement in Islam made by a mufti, a scholar capable of issuing judgments on Sharia (Islamic law)." www.cellular-news.com...

Do you see how easily a fatwa can be created ? even with no reason or logic but just because hes mad ?

He has the religious power to do so , but nobody took him seriously because these kinda things happen alot .

Fatwa's = the dillusion of religious scholars thinking they have more power over your average folk because they put years and years of research into Islam.

But its just there way of being power hungry , most people fear fatwa's just by hearing it . But now a days , they are waking up to its powerless meaning.



posted on Jan, 2 2012 @ 11:42 PM
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reply to post by charles1952
 


Hello Charles.

After Prophet Muhammad died, it was left to his successors (Caliphas) to make judiciary decisions about any aspect of life or society that was not addressed by Muhammad during his life. Centuries ago the Muslims were more unified under a single Caliph, so any verdict given was followed. But as time went by the Muslim Empire was split up and divided amongst itself. Now Muslims are separated under different nationality, tribe, and different Islamic sects. No longer does one person nor one group speak for or represent all Muslims. Nowadays, if a Fatwa is announced, only followers of that Imam (religious community leader) obey or acknowledge it.

The Florida Preacher Terry Jones burns Qur'ans. He does not represent Christianity.
Westboro Baptist Church pickets and protests funerals. They do not represent Christianity.
Crazy fatwas are only followed by Muslims that actualy attend that specific Imam's mosque.

I hope this helps Charles. Peace.



posted on Jan, 3 2012 @ 06:29 AM
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As far as I am aware, even in traditionalist understanding, fatwas are not binding at ALL. With the singular exception of Iran, where the Ayatollahs technically rule the country, no fatwa is considered legally binding on anyone except its author. They are merely the opinion of a particular person with regards to a particular situation, backed up with their reasoning (and the relevant scripture, if applicable). The very definition of "fatwa" is "legal opinion".

So if you respect the opinion of a particular mufti, and follow their writings, you might accept a fatwa they issue. Unfortunately, in modern times, everyone thinks they can issue fatwas, while in older times it took stringent requirements like 7 years religious study and all.

A notable example is how Osama bin Laden had issued a fatwa claiming it was okay to kill American civilians. Osama had never had proper religious education, and his pronouncements went against what was clearly laid out in the Holy Scripture, so obviously, nobody (except maybe his underlings in Al-Qaeeda) accepted it at all.

As far as the cucumber fatwa thing, it turned out to be all nonsense, as the website that originally posted the article about the fatwa issued a correction:
bikyamasr.com...

I'm also fairly suspicious about the Moroccan fatwa about necrophilia. I cannot find any references to this supposed "Moroccan Association for Jurisprudence Research" OR the author "Abdelbari Zamzami", outside of articles about that particular fatwa.
That is not to say, of course, that ridiculous fatwas don't exist. A couple years ago in Egypt, some scholar gave a fatwa saying that women could get around problems of workplace segregation by breastfeeding their co-workers, thus inducting them into their "family". Of course, the author of this fatwa was subsequently reprimanded, and was made to retract the fatwa by the Islamic University he was part of.


As far as the secondary discussion on authority figures in Islam goes, I have to say, I'm kinda happy with the way it is now, without any Pope-like authority figure telling everyone what is wrong and what is right. See, unlike other so-called "Organised" religions, Islam doesn't have an organisation or hierarchy at all. The required information is all meant to be obtained from the scripture itself (although of course, people who don't have the time or inclination to research it defer to the opinions of scholars). If it was any other way, then there would be great potential for abuse (as can be seen from the examples of some of the Caliphs back when there was such a thing).

People complain about catholicism because of the power of the Pope, yet they want something similar for Islam?



posted on Jan, 3 2012 @ 10:02 AM
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reply to post by yourboycal2
 

thanks for your answer, star for you! (for whatever good that does for you)
____________________________________________________________



posted on Jan, 3 2012 @ 11:29 AM
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reply to post by Sahabi, yourboycal2, and babloyi
 


I am very grateful for the knowledge you have passed on in this thread. You have helped me take the first step in learning, getting rid of the wrong information I thought was correct. I still don't see how Islam can work in a world where few can read the teachings and the words of the teachers can be ignored, but I'll probably find out in another thread.

I'd give you hearty handshakes and a pat on the back if I could. This is what I think ATS should be.

With respect,
Charles1952



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