Secrecy - The Road To Distrust, Annihilation and Self-Destruction, page 2

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reply posted on 31-12-2011 @ 04:40 PM by TheMindWar

reply to post by YoQuieroTheTruth

Why do you need secrecy? I dont understand, you say GW was a freemason, probably so, but TPTB had no choice but to produce a declaration of independance. The good people of the USA had just won the war, the forefathers were in no position to introduce anything but the DoI. If they would have tried to impose what they are doing now they would have been hung.

TPTB are now in a position to introduce tyranny and this was born from secrecy and secret meetings.

I am certainly not saying GW was a bad guy, it could have been that the secret society he was part of was a good one at the time. But things change as do societies, and for this very reason they are a bad thing.

reply posted on 31-12-2011 @ 04:43 PM by TheMindWar

reply to post by KSigMason

Lol, secrecy doesnt breed trust, honesty breeds trust. Courage is an asset, someone who is not brave will not become brave because they belong to a secret society

edit on 31-12-2011 by TheMindWar because: Info add

reply posted on 31-12-2011 @ 04:44 PM by AugustusMasonicus

Originally posted by TheMindWar
I dont understand, you say GW was a freemason, probably so...

There is no 'probably', he was a Mason.

...but TPTB had no choice but to produce a declaration of independance. The good people of the USA had just won the war, the forefathers were in no position to introduce anything but the DoI.

Huh? Where did you learn history? The Declaration of Independence was written prior to the Revolutionary War being won.

reply posted on 31-12-2011 @ 04:46 PM by TheMindWar

reply to post by AugustusMasonicus

I said introduce

not produce.

reply posted on 31-12-2011 @ 04:48 PM by AugustusMasonicus

Originally posted by TheMindWar
I said introduce not produce.

Either way it still would not make sense.

reply posted on 31-12-2011 @ 04:48 PM by YoQuieroTheTruth

reply to post by TheMindWar

You have no proof that the societies have changed, only speculation.

George Washington WAS a Mason... A member of an organization whose secrets rituals are the same today as they were in his time.

People often fear what they do not understand and try to paint it as evil. That is what you are doing here.

reply posted on 31-12-2011 @ 04:51 PM by TheMindWar

reply to post by AugustusMasonicus

Please explain to me when has secrecy produced stability, honesty and peace? The only reason we had peace with Russia was through MAD.

reply posted on 31-12-2011 @ 04:56 PM by AugustusMasonicus

Originally posted by TheMindWar
Please explain to me when has secrecy produced stability, honesty and peace?

Keeping my credit card information secret certainly produces a stable and peaceful household for me.

On a larger scale, keeping the company at which I work proprietary information secret helps keep us stable.

On an even larger scale, the United States keeping its satellite access secret prevents them from being accessed by enemies of the country.

You could list example all day. Not everyone needs to know everything about everyone or everything, to posit otherwise is rather infantile.

The only reason we had peace with Russia was through MAD.

So? Do you think by the United States telling them, "Well, we're working on this nuclear program here, we have some ICBM's stockpiled there and, oh, by the way, there's a ballastic missile submarine parked off of Petropavlosk." would suddenly make them have a profound idelaogical shift and turn them into Western Capitialists? Or the opposite, if the Soviets had decided to clue us in on all of their secrets we would have suddenly shouted, "Spasiba, Comrades, throw us one of those nifty hammer and sickle flags and make room on the breadlines"?

edit on 31-12-2011 by AugustusMasonicus because: networkdude has no beer.

reply posted on 31-12-2011 @ 05:00 PM by YoQuieroTheTruth

reply to post by TheMindWar

Well... the launch codes for America's nukes are a secret.

The end.

reply posted on 31-12-2011 @ 05:07 PM by JoshNorton

Originally posted by TheMindWar
I find it very difficult to understand the mentality of carrying out secret agendas and secret projects.

Secret societies are no different, people conspiring for thier own selfish needs. For in an open and free society there is no room for conspiracy and therefore no room for distrust among countries.

I truely believe, the long and secret agendas carried out by a selfish few who consider themselves rulers of the world whom are entitled to have slaves, are the scum of the earth. We have allowed this to carry on for so long now amd what we are seeing in todays society is a direct result of secrecy, nothing more.

So, I guess you don't believe in intellectual property either? Rights of a creator to profit from his creative output?

Do you believe Coca-Cola keeping their recipe a secret from the competition is bad? I mean, I guess I can see some idealist maybe believing that anyone should be able to make and sell their own Coke, but it seems like a pretty unrealistic wish.

JFK knew this to be true and made a speech regarding creating a "free and open" society, and this meant no more secrets. This obviously lead to his assasination.

You mean the speech where he told the press to keep more secrets? Yeah, that was like two and a half years before he was killed. If that was the reason he was assassinated, his killers sure were slow to react.

The current criminal super rich and super secret societies coulld never allow this to take place, for it would undoubtedly lead to their immediate downfall from grace.

We're not in grace to begin with, so I'm not sure what you're getting at...

Anyone who is suspected of being involved in any secret society must be banned from leadership, that would be a good start.

So you'd be perfectly fine condemning people who were merely suspected without actually having a burden of proof on the accuser? Who's the tyrant now?

It will be Secrecy that leads to the downfall of mankind, nothing else.

And yet as long as there have been individuals, there have been secrets kept. Conservatively, what, 4000 years of civilization? And yet we haven't fallen yet...

reply posted on 31-12-2011 @ 05:16 PM by YoQuieroTheTruth

reply to post by JoshNorton

I am still having a hard time seeing where he shows that secrets are bad, evil or destructive.

What are these secrets he thinks are so bad anyway?

OP, do you have any idea what these evil secrets are?

reply posted on 31-12-2011 @ 05:50 PM by Avatar777

Originally posted by TheMindWar
reply to post by Avatar777

If there were no secrets there would be no reason to require a secret sect against tyranny. For tyranny would never appear. The only reason IMO tyranny exists is because of secrecy and conspiracies born from secret meetings such as the builderberger.

And what about greed, ambitions, control, desire to be above others. Aren't these real factors which breed tyranny?

reply posted on 31-12-2011 @ 05:50 PM by Rockpuck

reply to post by TheMindWar

What makes you worthy of such knowledge?

Nothing.

Only those willing to obtain it are worthy, and you my friend ... are not worthy.

reply posted on 31-12-2011 @ 07:01 PM by KSigMason

reply to post by TheMindWar

Yes, naive. I was just making a simple observation. You think that disclosing all secrets and abolishing secrecy will establish peace which is not only naive, but illogical. Plus Russia is not the only threat to this country and disclosing all our national security secrets would only open us up to an attack and make us an easier victim.

You and your wife have no secrets between each other? Something you don't tell your friends about your wife? Or do you disclose every intimate detail about her to your friends?

It you disagree, please give me an example of when secrecy has lead to trust between people?

Just look at the Founding Fathers. They had to meet in secret to bring about a revolution against a tyrannical monarch.

Secrecy breeds trust and courage. There are many reasons we may love our spouses, but believing we can share anything with them is an important aspect to a healthy relationship. The idea that your closest companion will not share your private moments with anyone else is what allows you to trust them. The idea that we can trust them gives of the courage to share with them.

---

When the leaders of the Church (or anti-Masons in general) claim there should be no secrecy, what they are really claiming is that they fear they would not be able to manipulate information if they did not have access to it.

SOURCE

NOTE: I added the bolded words in parentheses.

reply to post by TheMindWar

You are a drone. Read the ENTIRE thing. He was addressing the Press. That is fact.

reply to post by TheMindWar

This is an invalid argument. You need to prove how secrecy leads to tyranny.

People should really be required to take at least a basic Logic course before making posts.

reply to post by TheMindWar

Everyone has secrets and secrecy is not a bad thing.

Who were these TPTB during Revolutionary times?

The good people of the USA had just won the war, the forefathers were in no position to introduce anything but the DoI. If they would have tried to impose what they are doing now they would have been hung.

WAIT? What?! You're saying that the Declaration occurred after the war?! HAHAHAHAHAHA

reply to post by TheMindWar

I never said one will be brave by just being a member of your "secret societies". Secrecy and honesty are not exclusive from one another. One can be both secret and honest at the same time. Not disclosing information because it is a secret is not lying nor dishonest. In fact, disclosing a secret would be dishonest of me as I have made a promise to keep that secret and then broke it.

reply posted on 31-12-2011 @ 08:21 PM by RUNSILENT

every one has a secret of some sort
i do not have a problem with secrecy just the extent that it is used today to protect corruption
the problem is secrecy breeds mistrust in certain situations
and mistrust breeds paranoia paranoia breeds evil thought processes which in turn leads to violence
i dunno i think if every one met every one else we would find more similarity than difference
governments start wars not people and they have to justify the means by secret lies that will only be found by much work and many years of research
sad state of affairs all aroumd

reply posted on 31-12-2011 @ 08:46 PM by 46ACE

The military keeps and collects secrets because new capabilities,strengths and weaknesses can be exploited to your own advantage.or turned against you by an enemy,

Contrary to the"everybody is a winner society"taught in schools today: When your butt is on the line (and there is no "participation trophy")you want as many advantages on your side as possible.
But that's pretty obvious...