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Notification of a Human Case of H5N1 Bird Flu in Shenzhen

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posted on Dec, 31 2011 @ 08:25 AM
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Originally posted by soficrow

This is the latest in a new wave of human H5N1 Bird Flu cases that appear to be airborne. Flu news from Asia and Africa has warned about dangerous new strains for some time; nations like Indonesia are prepping for a pandemic.

What's especially interesting is that this news was released on New Year's Eve day - when no one is paying attention, and after all the dire warnings about the two flu research teams that created airborne strains. Looks to me like our corporate handlers saw this coming and positioned to take the heat off industrial farming by blaming the scientists and terrorists.


And oh yeah, the guy is a bus driver.



China suspects bus driver infected with bird flu

BEIJING —
Local health authorities say a bus driver has tested positive for the deadly H5N1 bird flu virus in the southern Chinese city of Shenzhen, which borders Hong Kong where two birds were confirmed to have the same virus last week.

The 39-year-old man surnamed Chen was hospitalized with a fever on Dec. 21 and tested positive for the highly pathogenic H5N1 on Friday, said a statement on the websites of the Shenzhen city and Guangdong provincial health authorities.



7thspace.com
(visit the link for the full news article)
edit on 30/12/11 by soficrow because: (no reason given)


I know alot of people do not believe this but...virus' can and do mutate, take a look at HIV and Ebola.




posted on Dec, 31 2011 @ 09:34 AM
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How stupid do they think we are? I guess the majority of us ARE pretty stupid. Believing the stories they all tell us. Ugh. This is more of a rant. I was having a conversation with a family member about something like this happening after watching that movie Contagion and how the flu in the movie was a mix of pig/bat/human.
Any person who has an education in anything animal related knows that genetically (in a natural environment) the odds of viruses from different species mixing to create a super virus that can infect more than one species at a time is nearly impossible. I say nearly because I believe nothing is impossible.
Now, I can see it happening once in a lifetime. But multiple times?
This family member said, "Well my doctor said that every few years or so, viruses mutate. That's why some years I'm really sick and other years I'm not." So that's it?! You just believe your doctor because he's a doctor? He must know everything? Yes, viruses mutate. EVERYTHING on the planet changes and adapts/evolves. But these viruses are extremely powerful.
My "conspiracy" thoughts about viruses didn't exist 5 years ago. After myself and my kids became extremely ill with the swine flu, to me it felt like something manufactured so to speak. I had never been so sick in my life. I was in the hospital for 2 days. My kids as well. And it turned into one thing after another. It seemed to attack every system in my body. With a vengeance! And it was interesting how it picked and chose who got sick with it. My parents didn't catch it. Neither did my ex or his adult family. His nieces and nephew caught it. We were all close and it was suppose to be easily contracted. So I started looking stuff up. And have continued from there.

If someone can give me a logical explanation as to how this man who hasn't had any contact with poultry became infected, maybe I'll bite. An explanation other than "it could be airborne now". But until then, I'm sticking with my "population control" theory.
I am sad we live in the world that we do. It's frightening to live somewhere that you can't be safe no matter what you do.
edit on 31-12-2011 by PassedKarma because: (no reason given)



posted on Dec, 31 2011 @ 10:21 AM
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reply to post by TrueBrit
 


If this strain has pandemic potential, it's too late for a lock down. ...Hong Kong reported cases in chickens and a seagull over the past couple of weeks, and most likely the bus driver was infected by a passenger coming from Hong Kong. As Hong Kong is a major hub for travel and trade, and the strain has been circulating for at least a week, it's gameover.

Prevention required regulating factory farms in the West and East. The FAO has been pushing prevention for years - because industrial and factory farming practices are creating new diseases that jump species barriers and even kingdom barriers with increasing regularity. But corporate industry successfully fought all efforts to regulate - despite repeated warnings. Most recently:

Mutant, deadly H5N1 strain of bird flu emerges in Asia and could sweep the globe this fall

Importance of New H5N1 (Bird Flu) Variant Downplayed

In fact the decision was made to quarantine people instead of animals back in 2005. The die was cast, and the outcome was totally predicatble. Even if this bus driver is NOT the index case for the next pandemic, there will be one. Sooner rather than later.


Bush Signs Quarantine Orders for Bird Flu

In August of 2003, Fukuda stated that traditional efforts like quarantine would not work to control bird flu.


Quarantine: A Standard Depopulation Strategy


Quarantine Until Death: The Pandemic Policy Now on Trial in the Court of Public Opinion

Scientists have long known that industrial activities - like factory farming and chemical pollution - cause micro-environmental changes, which in turn force microbes to mutate and create new diseases. But despite scientific knowledge and the overwhelming evidence, industrial practices known to create new diseases have not changed.

Why not?

Because corporate rights to profit override public health risks, and cancel out individuals' and society's rights. As a result, the world is facing a host of emerging untreatable, incurable and potentially deadly diseases.



posted on Dec, 31 2011 @ 10:45 AM
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reply to post by decussation
 




Originally posted by decussation
[url=reply to post by chocise
 


It is the amino acids that are left handed in the bio chemistry of proteins. An interesting side note is that bacteria form proteins from right handed amino acids. It is an interesting question you ask and I will have to look into it further. Sorry for butting in if unwarranted. I Tried to add the link to but it placed it along the header instead of the post box. My bad.


Thanks decussation.


Another interesting link on "mirror proteins." ....I changed the title to FAMOUS LAST WORDS:



Mirror molecules aren’t tuned to our biochemistry. That’s why the 1960s controversy over the antinausea drug thalidomide was such a surprise [tsk] — the right-handed version calmed morning sickness in pregnant women, but the left-handed version caused birth defects. Usually, though, the mirror image of biological molecules are weaker or have no effect. They can’t shake hands with our proteins.


Think infectious proteins, aka prions. And how diseases aren't supposed to cross species barriers, never mind kingdom barriers. They never did before. But they do now. With increasing regularity. Wonder why.






edit on 31/12/11 by soficrow because: (no reason given)



posted on Dec, 31 2011 @ 10:48 AM
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reply to post by this_is_who_we_are
 


Thanks for the link.
More....

The bus driver died of multiple organ failure, the end result of a cytokine storm. China reports that "120 people who had contact with the man had developed no signs of sickness."

….I find it impossibly difficult to believe that a bus driver in one of the world's largest cities had contact with only 120 people.

We need to watch closely, wait - and recognize that few governments in the East or West are likely to tell us the truth.


Man dies from bird flu in southern China

BEIJING — A man in southern China's Guangdong province died of bird flu on Saturday a week after being admitted to hospital with a fever, state media reported.

…..He died in the early afternoon of multiple organ failure, having tested positive for the H5N1 virus…

He had no direct contact with poultry in the month prior to getting sick and had not left the city, Xinhua said.

Guangdong's official newspaper, the Southern Daily, said separately that 120 people who had contact with the man had developed no signs of sickness.



posted on Dec, 31 2011 @ 11:03 AM
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reply to post by PassedKarma
 



Any person who has an education in anything animal related knows that genetically (in a natural environment) the odds of viruses from different species mixing to create a super virus that can infect more than one species at a time is nearly impossible. ...
Now, I can see it happening once in a lifetime. But multiple times?


Zoonoses - diseases that cross species barriers - have become a HUGE public health problem over the past decade or so. New diseases even cross kingdom barriers - they get into plants roots, stems and leaves to infect us when we eat them. All unheard of 20-30 years ago - scientifically impossible - now common.

Why is it happening? Because corporate industry creates synthetic chemicals, proteins and other molecules - and lets them loose in the world. Now, they've changed the biological basis of life on our planet. The rules have changed, and our scientists do not know what the new rules are, partly because said rules keep changing as new compounds and biochemical relationships are formed with all the new additions in the wild. ......and everyone who knows better plays ignorant, asking, "Problem? What problem?"


I am sad we live in the world that we do. It's frightening to live somewhere that you can't be safe no matter what you do.


Me too. Makes me think of that old Chinese curse, "May you live in interesting times."

But let's not forget Michael Chrichton either, "Life WILL find a way."





edit on 31/12/11 by soficrow because: (no reason given)



posted on Dec, 31 2011 @ 11:06 AM
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Originally posted by soficrow
reply to post by this_is_who_we_are
 


….I find it impossibly difficult to believe that a bus driver in one of the world's largest cities had contact with only 120 people.

We need to watch closely, wait - and recognize that few governments in the East or West are likely to tell us the truth.


You can say that again he would be the perfect first host, in the perfect country, at the perfect time of year I agree 110% Sofi any news out of the area around that guy, needs to be watched very very closely for an few weeks.

He is like the most fanciable host for an virus success, very scarey if it has mutated or become airborne whilst he was infected.

Kind Regards,

Elf



posted on Dec, 31 2011 @ 11:29 AM
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reply to post by MischeviousElf
 



...any news out of the area around that guy, needs to be watched very very closely for an few weeks.

He is like the most fanciable host for an virus success, very scarey if it has mutated or become airborne whilst he was infected.


Problem is, it looks like it was already airborne when he caught it. ...Hong Kong seems to have been pretty good about reporting H5N1 bird flu cases, but not sure how China/Shenzhen will handle it.

Even so, new strains have been popping up all over Asia. Indonesia has a huge problem with endemic H5N1 and new strains, plus isolated airborne outbreaks - and India is seeing massive crow deaths, meaning there's at least one new vector.

....Speaking as the proud mom of 1 finch and 4 cockatiels, I intend to follow the Hong Kong governments advice to it's citizens:


....remain vigilant against avian influenza infection and to observe the following measures:

* Avoid direct contact with poultry and birds or their droppings; if contacts have been made, they should wash hands thoroughly with soap and water;

* Poultry and eggs should be thoroughly cooked before eating;

* Wash hands frequently;

* Cover nose and mouth while sneezing or coughing, hold the spit with tissue and put it into covered dustbins;

* Avoid crowded places and contact with sick people with fever;

* Wear a mask when you have respiratory symptoms or need to take care of patients with fever;

* When you have fever and influenza-like illnesses during a trip or when coming back to Hong Kong, you should consult doctors promptly and reveal your travel history.

For further information on avian influenza, please visit the CHP website: www.chp.gov.hk.


edit on 31/12/11 by soficrow because: (no reason given)



posted on Dec, 31 2011 @ 12:55 PM
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Hong Kong raised it's H5N1 bird flu response level from "alert" to "serious" after a chicken carcass sample tested positive of the highly pathogenic H5N1 avian influenza virus last week. The next level is "emergency," and is used only when a pandemic is identified by the World Health Organization.

Hong Kong's only response to this bus driver's death from bird flu is to ban poultry imports from Shenzhen for 3 weeks. A bit lame if the bus driver caught airborne flu from a passenger. But then again, New Year's is a busy and profitable time, and we don't want people to panic unnecessarily.


HK to suspend import of poultry products from certain places in Shenzhen

In view of a confirmed human case of highly pathogenic avian influenza (HPAI) (H5N1) in Shenzhen, the Centre for Food Safety (CFS) of the Food and Environmental Hygiene Department yesterday (December 31) announced that the area of 13 km radius from usual residence of the patient within 14 days of disease onset is designated as the "import control zone". The decision was made after communicating with the Mainland authorities concerned in accordance with established guidelines.

The import of live poultry and poultry products (including chilled and frozen poultry, and poultry eggs) from this area will be suspended for 21 days, taking effect from today (January 1).



posted on Dec, 31 2011 @ 03:08 PM
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reply to post by lonewolf19792000
 



I know alot of people do not believe this but...virus' can and do mutate, take a look at HIV and Ebola.


Oh yeah. They do. And they are.

S'n



posted on Dec, 31 2011 @ 10:45 PM
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reply to post by Wrabbit2000
 



I'd say this is definitely something to watch. I'll need to see a whole lot before I believe there is anything artificial released though. Only the totally and utterly insane release a viral weapon.

Sure, they could make a vaccine and stock enough to cure 'NWO' personnel. Unfortunately the first major mutation of an artificial strain which can't be well predicted in the wild to begin with, and they die with everyone else.


AGREED!
...But some human psychology just seems to require a bogeyman, someone to blame. Fact is, it's our economy and our way of life - but that's too nebulous for the sheeple. It's easier to blame the terrorists.



I figure Spanish Flu was a time before anyone could dream of induced mutation, and it killed more than World War I. Pandemics come fairly regularly in history it seems..and we are about due for one, to be frank about it. Could it be this year? Oh geeze, why not? Can anything else possibly be added to 2012, before it's even begun? lol....


We are due - and there are several really horrific bugs in nature's pike.



posted on Jan, 1 2012 @ 01:11 AM
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Originally posted by soficrow
Problem is, it looks like it was already airborne when he caught it


Great thread, and thanks for all the great links, but this one part is still VERY unclear---I can think of at least 5 ways a passenger who *is* in contact with poultry might transfer his fluids to the bus driver. Not saying it *couldn't be* or *isn't* airborne, just saying the jury is still waaaay out on that one as yet. Let's not claim that it already looks airborne when we have no evidence of that yet----people get scared and do stupid s##t.



posted on Jan, 1 2012 @ 09:48 AM
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reply to post by 00nunya00
 



can think of at least 5 ways a passenger who *is* in contact with poultry might transfer his fluids to the bus driver. Not saying it *couldn't be* or *isn't* airborne, just saying the jury is still waaaay out on that one as yet. Let's not claim that it already looks airborne when we have no evidence of that yet----people get scared and do stupid s##t.


Great points.
...And it's quite interesting that this is the only H5N1 human case that's been reported in the area, don't you think?

Meanwhile, both Hong Kong and China have committed to doing everything in their power to contain the outbreak, and Taiwan has admitted it has a flu epidemic.


The flu epidemic is becoming increasingly dangerous and may come to a peak during the upcoming New Year countdown events, presidential and legislative elections and the Chinese New Year holidays…


Government-subsidized anti-viral flu medicines such as Tamiflu and Relenza are now available in Taiwan. The B-Yamagata virus strain is most prevalent in Taiwan, but is not covered by 2011 flu vaccines - authorities say this is why the government vaccination program is not working.

Patients with H5N1 bird flu are on the priority list for getting anti-virals.


Access to anti-viral drugs expanded to fight flu outbreak

In an effort to contain the spread of the epidemic, government-subsidized anti-viral flu medicines such as Tamiflu and Relenza have been made available to family members, classmates or colleagues of patients with confirmed influenza since Dec. 1, he said.

Eight other categories of patients with flu-like symptoms are also eligible for the drugs. ….those who have developed serious complications, pregnant women determined to need immediate medication, those who have displayed dangerous symptoms, obese people and those who suffer from immunodeficiency, diabetes, or cardioplumonary, liver or kidney disease, along with other serious diseases.

Others include those affected by an infection cluster, those suspected of or confirmed to have contracted the H5N1 virus, and those who have come down with a high fever for 48 hours.


Don't forget - the FAO sounded the alarm about the new H5N1 Bird Flu strain back in August - the new strain was spreading in China and Vietnam - existent animal vaccines did NOT protect domestic flocks - and the new mutation was getting closer to spreading human-to-human.


U.N. Food and Agriculture Organization Warns of 'Possible Major Resurgence' of Avian Flu (H5N1) in Asia and a New Vaccine-Evading Strain in Vietnam and China

The possible combination of influenza strains H1N1 (high infectivity) and H5N1 (high lethality) is a matter of global concern …the Replikin Counts of the two virus strains have risen simultaneously …to their highest levels in 50 years (H1N1, 16.7; H5N1, 23.3) …clinical outbreaks of each strain are now occurring. These simultaneous conditions may increase the risk that the two virus strains might come into contact with each other more frequently, facilitating transfer of genomic material to form a hybrid.

See figures: www.ereleases.com...




edit on 1/1/12 by soficrow because: (no reason given)



posted on Jan, 1 2012 @ 10:56 AM
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reply to post by soficrow
 


Totally agree! (And more great links, right on!) I think that in a country like China, the willingness to go to the hospital might be a little different, especially with a pandemic scare going on when people really need to keep going to work and not lose wages. Perhaps they're scared that they will be quarantined for long enough to lose their arses at home with the bills. Regardless, it is interesting that he's the first patient so far----a good amount of time has passed since *his* first symptoms; if others gave it to him they'd be dead now probably. At least ailing.

The other thing is that if they were keeping the pandemic quiet to give it time to spread (a la a conspiracy), why would they make the drugs so available, especially to the infirm? Confusing, to say the least. Makes it look like it's just the pandemic of fluid-transmitted flu that they expected, no nefarious elements.

I definitely think we are facing a winter of bird flu, but if it stays non-airborne, all the better. Matter of time, though, really.



posted on Jan, 1 2012 @ 02:22 PM
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reply to post by 00nunya00
 



The other thing is that if they were keeping the pandemic quiet to give it time to spread (a la a conspiracy), why would they make the drugs so available, especially to the infirm?


Not a conspiracy - just good business. 'Tis the biggest season for big spending, and they're not really sure they have a pandemic strain - so why kill travel, celebrations and profits? ...Chinese New Year festivities will start on January 8th this year, and run to New Year's day on January 23. I suspect our corporate leaders want to pull as much cash as they can from the populace before they pull the plug - we probably won't get any accurate information until the end of January.

....fyi - only Taiwan is offering government-subsidized anti-virals - it's a fair distance from Hong Kong / Shenzhen, and yet another separate government.

Also of note: Zimbabwe's Health Minister is denying knowledge of H5N1 bird flu in that country after an elected official died this weekend, reportedly of bird flu. Check out the H5N1 bird flu hazard warning published with the announcement of her death.


Zimbabwe Health Minister unaware of Bird Flu outbreak

Zimbabwe’s Health Minister on Friday expressed that he is not aware of any disease outbreak in the country.

His statement also follows news that a parliamentarian from his own party, MDC-T, died of bird flu this week.

The Epidemics and Disease Control centre has not informed me about any outbreak, but they are closed and we can only know that after the holidays,” Health minister Henry Madzorera said today.

This week the MDC-T party’s Bulawayo Women’s Assembly chairperson and Senator for Mabutweni, Gladys Dube Gombami, 48, died of bird flu, according a report by the MDC-T party.


Biohazard name: A/H5N1

Biohazard level: 4/4 Hazardous

Biohazard desc.: Viruses and bacteria that cause severe to fatal disease in humans, and for which vaccines or other treatments are not available, such as Bolivian and Argentine hemorrhagic fevers, H5N1(bird flu), Dengue hemorrhagic fever, Marburg virus, Ebola virus, hantaviruses, Lassa fever, Crimean-Congo hemorrhagic fever, and other hemorrhagic or unidentified diseases. When dealing with biological hazards at this level the use of a Hazmat suit and a self-contained oxygen supply is mandatory. The entrance and exit of a Level Four biolab will contain multiple showers, a vacuum room, an ultraviolet light room, autonomous detection system, and other safety precautions designed to destroy all traces of the biohazard. Multiple airlocks are employed and are electronically secured to prevent both doors opening at the same time. All air and water service going to and coming from a Biosafety Level 4 (P4) lab will undergo similar decontamination procedures to eliminate the possibility of an accidental release.





Confusing, to say the least. Makes it look like it's just the pandemic of fluid-transmitted flu that they expected, no nefarious elements.


All the summer reports warned about new vaccine-resistant H5N1 strains ready to jump human-to-human. ...Given the conflicting reports, and the gaps in reporting, it's clear something is happening. But who knows what?

...We do know businesses around the world did not do well with Christmas, and they needed to catch up their profit margins. If there is a pandemic strain behind the outbreaks, I doubt we'll be told before the season's celebrations and spending are over.

Perhaps this coming week's news releases will tell the tale, once authorities come back to work from their holidays. Most likely though, we won't be informed until after Chinese New Year, if at all.





edit on 1/1/12 by soficrow because: (no reason given)



posted on Jan, 1 2012 @ 02:42 PM
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Originally posted by soficrow ...Chinese New Year festivities will start on January 8th this year, and run to New Year's day on January 23. I suspect our corporate leaders want to pull as much cash as they can from the populace before they pull the plug - we probably won't get any accurate information until the end of January.


Now that makes sense. What a debacle; so many Chinese ex-pats go home for this holiday. And will then bring it back, if it's spreading. Sigh.



posted on Jan, 1 2012 @ 03:13 PM
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reply to post by 00nunya00
 


I could be wrong, but I think a lot of Chinese people living in Shenzhen (China) have jobs in Hong Kong. Does anyone know for sure? ....also, I think it is a mistake to assume the suspect strain originated in China - could be Hong Kong, or brought in via trade, or tourists. Who knows?

...The blame-game isn't really that productive - sorta like calling the 1918 Flu the "Spanish Flu" when all that happened was Spain was the first to go public about the pandemic; the evidence indicates that the 1918 pandemic actually started in a US Army barracks in the central USA. Just like the 2009 H1N1 Swine Flu Pandemic did NOT originate in Mexico - it started in US factory hog farms.

Admitting the truth about where and how the 1918 and 2009 pandemics originated shows that cramming people or animals together creates diseases. Is that such a bad thing for people to know?




posted on Jan, 1 2012 @ 05:32 PM
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reply to post by soficrow
 


Wait, who's blaming whom? I'm lost, LOL. Where do you think they originated from? If this was engineered, surely China is complicit, and if not, they're still complicit for allowing their poultry farming practices, right? It could happen anywhere they do that, but point of origin is pretty much "who gets the blame" right? Not that they deserve scorn for it, necessarily, but surely responsibility.



posted on Jan, 1 2012 @ 08:58 PM
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reply to post by 00nunya00
 



…I'm lost, LOL. Where do you think they originated from? If this was engineered, surely China is complicit,


Not sure where to start! …I said "I think it is a mistake to assume the suspect strain originated in China - could be Hong Kong, or brought in via trade, or tourists. Who knows?"

1. I seriously doubt this strain was engineered, but if it was, why on earth would China infect their own people and nation?

2. Hong Kong is a major hub, right 'next door' to Shenzhen and over the past few weeks, reported several H5N1 bird flu cases in chickens and wild birds - quite possibly, the bus driver was infected with the strain now circulating in Hong Kong.

3. H5N1 bird flu is endemic and mutating in several Asian nations, as well as Egypt and Indonesia - and has been for more than a decade.

* The FAO and other international organizations started warning the world last summer that new H5N1 strains were appearing in Vietnam, Thailand, Cambodia, Malaysia and the Koreas, and looked ready to jump human-to-human: Mutant, deadly H5N1 strain of bird flu emerges in Asia and could sweep the globe this fall.

* But - no one listened - Importance of New H5N1 (Bird Flu) Variant Downplayed.

* Except Indonesia - Indonesia Readies for Airborne H5N1 Bird Flu

4. Then, a few weeks ago when Fouchier in the Netherlands and Kawaoka in Wisconsin were set to publish their research about airborne H5N1, US bioterrorism "experts" flipped out and the issue went public in a big way. It was clear the two researchers were being set up as scapegoats for the predicted pandemic: Bird Flu Research Rattles Bioterrorism Field.

[Now, it looks like the target has shifted and China is being scapegoated to take the fall instead.]

5. Several nations reported flu pandemic hazards this week, not just China and Hong Kong:

* Patients with H5N1 bird flu in the Taiwan epidemic are on the priority list for getting government-subsidized anti-viral medicines: Access to anti-viral drugs expanded to fight flu outbreak

* Indonesia put on avian flu alert. 2011-12-30.

* Epidemic Hazard in Zimbabwe - Saturday, 31 December, 2011.

Description
Gladys Gombami-Dube the mainstream MDC senator for Mabutweni died of bird flu



…and if not, they're still complicit for allowing their poultry farming practices, right?


The ongoing protests in China are all about industrial pollution and contamination. Yeah China!



It could happen anywhere they do that, but point of origin is pretty much "who gets the blame" right?


H5N1 bird flu first emerged in Scotland in 1959, disappeared into a corporate lab, then reappeared in China in 1997. According to conspiracy theorists, the 1997 H5N1 strain was a corporate-funded genetically engineered agricultural bioweapon designed to decimate China's poultry industry and economy.

….Evolution being what it is, H5N1 bird flu has been mutating, adapting and evolving "in the wild" - and in factory farms in the USA and Canada as well as elsewhere since then. H5N1's evolution into a strain easily transmissible between people was predicted long ago, and its mutations monitored. We're just approaching the long-expected and totally inevitable biological crisis.



Not that they deserve scorn for it, necessarily, but surely responsibility.


Maybe, but they're way at the end of the line!



edit on 1/1/12 by soficrow because: (no reason given)

edit on 1/1/12 by soficrow because: (no reason given)



posted on Jan, 1 2012 @ 11:22 PM
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Originally posted by soficrow

1. I seriously doubt this strain was engineered, but if it was, why on earth would China infect their own people and nation?

[...]

[Now, it looks like the target has shifted and China is being scapegoated to take the fall instead.]


Okay, that's where I'm confused----on the one hand, you imply that this was planned and engineered and they already had patsies for it, but then on the other hand you say you don't think it's engineered and it's nobody's fault. The thread doesn't really make any sense in that light-----you've posted a lot of stuff to conspiracies about this being engineered and an intentional release, which I can get on board with, but then you post that you don't think it's a conspiracy, yet the country where it would have *naturally* mutated and had devastating effects due to horrible farming practices isn't to blame? I'm just trying to figure out what angle you're coming from. I feel like you're just contradicting whatever is presented, regardless of which side it supports? Maybe I'm missing something?



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