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God cannot love or be Love.

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posted on Jan, 19 2012 @ 04:27 PM
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reply to post by Greatest I am
 

What kind of God would plan and execute the murder of his own son when there was absolutely no need to?
It may be that it was symbolic, meaning the fact that Jesus was killed in the way that he did, created a symbol. John Bowman wrote a book on the Fourth Gospel and the Jews, where he says that it has Jesus being the character, Haman, from the Book of Esther where he had a day planned where he was to be elevated in status by the king of this land that these particular Jews found themselves in, including the person, Esther. Part of Haman's plan was to have this Jew he thought of as his enemy, killed on the same day, so built a high scaffold to have him hung on. As it turns out in the story, Haman's elevation was of the literal sort and was lifted up on his own scaffold and died.
Jesus made some cryptic remarks in the Gospel of John where he mentions being lifted up, something that he associated with his coming into his kingdom, or something.
Bowman takes this and tries to make some sense out of it by having these words by Jesus written in order to make a point which is something like Jesus made himself as this person who was hated by the powers that he at that time, the ones who were killing Jesus. Their villain in the story they worshiped that made themselves out to be the hero, Jesus was willing to take the role of in their play. So he was hated and despised, but by who, the people who worshiped the shenanigans of the so-called heroine of the Esther play, who was doing nothing but self-promotion and using deception and tricks to get it, only to use it to get vengeance on those who formerly opposed them.

edit on 19-1-2012 by jmdewey60 because: (no reason given)




posted on Jan, 22 2012 @ 03:19 PM
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Originally posted by jmdewey60
reply to post by Greatest I am
 

What kind of God would plan and execute the murder of his own son when there was absolutely no need to?
It may be that it was symbolic, meaning the fact that Jesus was killed in the way that he did, created a symbol. John Bowman wrote a book on the Fourth Gospel and the Jews, where he says that it has Jesus being the character, Haman, from the Book of Esther where he had a day planned where he was to be elevated in status by the king of this land that these particular Jews found themselves in, including the person, Esther. Part of Haman's plan was to have this Jew he thought of as his enemy, killed on the same day, so built a high scaffold to have him hung on. As it turns out in the story, Haman's elevation was of the literal sort and was lifted up on his own scaffold and died.
Jesus made some cryptic remarks in the Gospel of John where he mentions being lifted up, something that he associated with his coming into his kingdom, or something.
Bowman takes this and tries to make some sense out of it by having these words by Jesus written in order to make a point which is something like Jesus made himself as this person who was hated by the powers that he at that time, the ones who were killing Jesus. Their villain in the story they worshiped that made themselves out to be the hero, Jesus was willing to take the role of in their play. So he was hated and despised, but by who, the people who worshiped the shenanigans of the so-called heroine of the Esther play, who was doing nothing but self-promotion and using deception and tricks to get it, only to use it to get vengeance on those who formerly opposed them.

edit on 19-1-2012 by jmdewey60 because: (no reason given)


If training man with symbols for right actions, then it would have been a better symbol to have God step up as any good human would, instead of having his son die for him.

Sons are to bury fathers. Not fathers bury sons.

Regards
DL



posted on Jan, 22 2012 @ 03:21 PM
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Originally posted by arpgme

Originally posted by Greatest I am

Originally posted by arpgme
God is an appreciator of his creation. He is like the sculptor which appreciates all of his sculptures and accept them in all their beauty for he has created them. 'Tis a beautiful thing.


Yes except for the fact that your artist God burns and tortures most of his sculptures.
He is quite insane.

Regards
DL
.

Why do you keep implying that I'm worshiping a god like this? My God isn't burning or torturing anyone...


Then how is his reward and punishment doled out?

Regards
DL



posted on Jan, 22 2012 @ 05:41 PM
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reply to post by Greatest I am
 

If training man with symbols for right actions, then it would have been a better symbol to have God step up as any good human would, instead of having his son die for him.

In the post you responded to, I was using the method of the execution of Jesus as a demonstration against the idea currently promoted at the time, which was a God who did to their enemies what happened to Haman and anyone who appeared to be associated with him, in the Esther story, where once they had God backing them (by way of the local, persuadable king), they swept through the city killing thousands of otherwise innocent people.
This is the sort of thing the Jews in the time of Jesus were looking forward to in the person of their Messiah, to do a lot of wholesale murder on their behalf. Him being lifted up shows he would rather die himself than to act the way they wanted him to.
edit on 22-1-2012 by jmdewey60 because: (no reason given)



posted on Jan, 22 2012 @ 06:09 PM
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Originally posted by Greatest I am

Originally posted by arpgme

Originally posted by Greatest I am

Originally posted by arpgme
God is an appreciator of his creation. He is like the sculptor which appreciates all of his sculptures and accept them in all their beauty for he has created them. 'Tis a beautiful thing.


Yes except for the fact that your artist God burns and tortures most of his sculptures.
He is quite insane.

Regards
DL
.

Why do you keep implying that I'm worshiping a god like this? My God isn't burning or torturing anyone...


Then how is his reward and punishment doled out?

Regards
DL


I never said that there was a reward and punishment...



posted on Jan, 23 2012 @ 01:46 PM
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Originally posted by jmdewey60
reply to post by Greatest I am
 

If training man with symbols for right actions, then it would have been a better symbol to have God step up as any good human would, instead of having his son die for him.

In the post you responded to, I was using the method of the execution of Jesus as a demonstration against the idea currently promoted at the time, which was a God who did to their enemies what happened to Haman and anyone who appeared to be associated with him, in the Esther story, where once they had God backing them (by way of the local, persuadable king), they swept through the city killing thousands of otherwise innocent people.
This is the sort of thing the Jews in the time of Jesus were looking forward to in the person of their Messiah, to do a lot of wholesale murder on their behalf. Him being lifted up shows he would rather die himself than to act the way they wanted him to.
edit on 22-1-2012 by jmdewey60 because: (no reason given)


video.nationalgeographic.com...

His warfare against others is not the way I or this link understand what the messiah was to do.

Regards
DL



posted on Jan, 23 2012 @ 01:47 PM
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Originally posted by arpgme

Originally posted by Greatest I am

Originally posted by arpgme

Originally posted by Greatest I am

Originally posted by arpgme
God is an appreciator of his creation. He is like the sculptor which appreciates all of his sculptures and accept them in all their beauty for he has created them. 'Tis a beautiful thing.


Yes except for the fact that your artist God burns and tortures most of his sculptures.
He is quite insane.

Regards
DL
.

Why do you keep implying that I'm worshiping a god like this? My God isn't burning or torturing anyone...


Then how is his reward and punishment doled out?

Regards
DL


I never said that there was a reward and punishment...


No reward or punishment then?
Ok.

Regards
DL



posted on Jan, 23 2012 @ 01:55 PM
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reply to post by Greatest I am
 


Yup, in love there is no punishment - love is patient - that is true - and God is indeed Love.



posted on Jan, 23 2012 @ 01:59 PM
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Originally posted by arpgme
reply to post by Greatest I am
 


Yup, in love there is no punishment - love is patient - that is true - and God is indeed Love.


All those he is shown to have murdered do not see that love.

Love is as love does.

Regards
DL



posted on Jan, 23 2012 @ 05:31 PM
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Originally posted by Greatest I am

Originally posted by arpgme

Originally posted by Greatest I am

Originally posted by arpgme

Originally posted by Greatest I am

Originally posted by arpgme
God is an appreciator of his creation. He is like the sculptor which appreciates all of his sculptures and accept them in all their beauty for he has created them. 'Tis a beautiful thing.


Yes except for the fact that your artist God burns and tortures most of his sculptures.
He is quite insane.

Regards
DL
.

Why do you keep implying that I'm worshiping a god like this? My God isn't burning or torturing anyone...


Then how is his reward and punishment doled out?

Regards
DL


I never said that there was a reward and punishment...


No reward or punishment then?
Ok.

Regards
DL


If there is reward, im sure there is also punishment....

19Lay not up for yourselves treasures upon earth, where moth and rust doth corrupt, and where thieves break through and steal:

20But lay up for yourselves treasures in heaven, where neither moth nor rust doth corrupt, and where thieves do not break through nor steal:

21For where your treasure is, there will your heart be also.

22The light of the body is the eye: if therefore thine eye be single, thy whole body shall be full of light.





posted on Jan, 23 2012 @ 05:59 PM
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Originally posted by Greatest I am

Originally posted by arpgme
reply to post by Greatest I am
 


Yup, in love there is no punishment - love is patient - that is true - and God is indeed Love.


All those he is shown to have murdered do not see that love.

Love is as love does.

Regards
DL


Again, God is Love so he doesn't kill / murder. That is Life that does that.



posted on Jan, 25 2012 @ 09:13 AM
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Originally posted by arpgme

Originally posted by Greatest I am

Originally posted by arpgme
reply to post by Greatest I am
 


Yup, in love there is no punishment - love is patient - that is true - and God is indeed Love.


All those he is shown to have murdered do not see that love.

Love is as love does.

Regards
DL


Again, God is Love so he doesn't kill / murder. That is Life that does that.


If God does not kill FYPOV, then you have not read your bible.

Regards
DL



posted on Jan, 25 2012 @ 09:21 AM
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God is the cause of love, and us humans who can love. Read consciouslivingfoundation.org... for a different perspective on Jesus and why he was sent to earth. Also I couldnt tell you why God made the universe, in which it seems things evolve and that the reason for suffering is to learn from it and evolve.

God is the cause of good and bad, which are really just two poles of the same thing. For example hot/cold, love/hate, up/down. If you are floating in space, which way is up and which way is down? The terms only have meaning when used relative to something. For example water is colder than steam, but hotter than ice.

The question as to why the causeless cause caused the universe as we know it has also been called the 'riddle of the universe'.
edit on 25-1-2012 by MoeSantana because: Above posts


There would be no killing or murder unless the causeless cause of everything there is caused it to be, so God (causeless cause) is the reason for killing, but us also the reason for love and happiness.
Also there is the idea that you are punished by your actions, not for them. (karma) (what comes around goes around)
edit on 25-1-2012 by MoeSantana because: Had to reread above posts



posted on Jan, 25 2012 @ 09:27 AM
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Originally posted by MoeSantana
God is the cause of love, and us humans who can love. Read consciouslivingfoundation.org... for a different perspective on Jesus and why he was sent to earth. Also I couldnt tell you why God made the universe, in which it seems things evolve and that the reason for suffering is to learn from it and evolve.

God is the cause of good and bad, which are really just two poles of the same thing. For example hot/cold, love/hate, up/down. If you are floating in space, which way is up and which way is down? The terms only have meaning when used relative to something. For example water is colder than steam, but hotter than ice.

The question as to why the causeless cause caused the universe as we know it has also been called the 'riddle of the universe'.
edit on 25-1-2012 by MoeSantana because: Above posts


Evolve your thinking with this.

www.youtube.com...

www.youtube.com...

It was God's plan from the beginning to have Adam and Eve eat the forbidden fruit. This can be demonstrated by the fact that the bible says that Jesus "was crucified from the foundations of the Earth," that is to say, God planned to crucify Jesus as atonement for sin before he even created human beings or God damned sin.

If God had not intended humans to sin from the beginning, why did he build into the Creation this "solution" for sin? Why create a solution for a problem you do not anticipate?

God knew that the moment he said "don't eat from that tree," the die was cast. The eating was inevitable. Eve was merely following the plan.

What kind of God would plan and execute the murder of his own son when there was absolutely no need to?

Only an insane God. That’s who.

The cornerstone of Christianity is human sacrifice, thus showing it‘s immorality.

Regards
DL



posted on Jan, 25 2012 @ 09:31 AM
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See if you can find the thread were someone asked about the whole idea of original sin and God sending his son to atone for our sins. By the way I detest the idea that 'ask jesus for forgiveness and you will go to heaven', the born again christian thing.


edit on 25-1-2012 by MoeSantana because: (no reason given)

edit on 25-1-2012 by MoeSantana because: trying to insert that thread somehow



posted on Jan, 25 2012 @ 09:43 AM
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Originally posted by jmdewey60
reply to post by sHuRuLuNi
 

. . .an Omnipotent Being . . .

Not according to the Bible or any legitimate philosophy, only in fairy tales.


God is omnipotent, as it would be the cause of all power that exists. That is if your idea of God is that he is the causeless cause of everything.

“Reality” is a term used by philosophers to designate that
Something which is fixed, eternal, and unchangeable, and
which underlies the universe of changing forms, shapes, and
conditions of things, and which is the primal cause of them.
Perhaps the best and clearest definition of Reality—as the
term is used in philosophy—is the following:—“Reality is that which does or may exist by itself, and is not
considered as forming part of any other thing.”
Anything that does not answer the above definition is held
by philosophy to be non‑reality, or mere appearance.

Source: www.yogebooks.com...
edit on 25-1-2012 by MoeSantana because: (no reason given)



posted on Jan, 25 2012 @ 09:58 AM
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And for good measure from same source as above:

Reason.
While there have been some who have held that man can
never hope to know aught regarding Reality by the exercise of
his reason, nevertheless the wise in all ages and all lands have
held the inquiry to be legitimate and proper, maintaining that
there is no finite limit to the reach of the human reason. This
has been the report of the reason of the wisest of the race, as
we may discover by a study of the philosophic thought of the
past and present.
“There is no scientific problem which we may dare to say the
mind of man will never solve; no mystery so deep or profound;
no question has or ever will be asked but a mind or brain will be
evolved capable of solving and answering.”—Haeckel.
“If it becomes essential for mankind to know, infinite nature will
evolve an organ of mind that can comprehend.”—Stevens.

Also keep in mind there is no way you can be smarter than God, as that brain your using an everything that passes through it was created by it.



posted on Jan, 25 2012 @ 10:13 AM
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reply to post by MoeSantana
 

God is omnipotent, as it would be the cause of all power that exists. That is if your idea of God is that he is the causeless cause of everything.
But who actually thinks that, and why?
I don't pretend to be a philosopher or actually know a lot about philosophy, but look at aspects which correspond to Christianity, including some Stoicism, some Platonism, and a little Epicurean. Also other religions which existed at the time Christianity was born and also which influenced the evolution of Judaism.
I think the idea of a Christian God who is omnipotent is a product of Medieval thinking which substituted for philosphy at that time.
edit on 25-1-2012 by jmdewey60 because: (no reason given)



posted on Jan, 25 2012 @ 10:21 AM
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All religions pertain to the same God, just thier own version of it. If you read the 98pg book, you will find out that Jesus teachings, which were the basis for christianity, are voicing the same truth that has been passed along for ages.

You are correct christianity was influenced by all those. If you read the book it explains that in those years of Jesus life which the bible is silent, Jesus was travelling to various countries and learning from them. All religions seek to express the same truth, which is why thier are the similarities.

I will try and answer 'who actually thinks that and why'.

Anyone who thinks that there must be an eternal cause of of everything caused. Why must there be an unchangeable eternal cause of everything? Because if there wasnt a cause then everything would have had to have come from nothing. Somewere along the chain of cause and effect there must be a causeless cause, or else the chain of cause and effect would have to be infinite. So instead of believing in an infinite cause and effect chain, I believe somewere along the line there is an eternal causeless cause. It is infinite because there is nothing to bound it or limit it.



edit on 25-1-2012 by MoeSantana because: (no reason given)



posted on Jan, 25 2012 @ 10:26 AM
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reply to post by Greatest I am
 


I'm not talking about The Bible, I'm talking about GOD! GOD does NOT kill.



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