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Tourist arrested after trying to check in gun at WTC site

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posted on Dec, 29 2011 @ 03:39 PM
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A tourist from Tennessee reportedly thought she could check her loaded gun at New York City's Sept. 11 memorial. The New York Post says 39-year-old Meredith Graves was visiting the memorial at the World Trade Center site on Dec. 22 and noticed a sign that said "No guns allowed." The Post reports that Graves asked police where she could check her loaded pistol. She was arrested on a gun-possession charge.


This kind of story really gets me going. She is a legal gun owner with a license to carry. She also took the right steps to obey the sign and check-in the gun.

Now she is looking at serving jail time?




“You’d think states would reciprocate with the Second Amendment. She has a license to carry in Tennessee,” her mother-in-law told the Post.


We obviously need to ask the states to communicate on 2nd amendment issues and allow some overlap of conceal-carry laws. This woman did the right thing, is not a criminal, and now will possibly be tossed in jail with criminals that are a real threat to society.

Ridiculous!

MSNBC




posted on Dec, 29 2011 @ 03:44 PM
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Stay out of New York. It's not worth going there for any reason whatsoever. Ever.

Now that poor woman has to suffer through legislative hell and for what? So Bloomberg can win over one more hoplophobic moron?
edit on 29-12-2011 by thisguyrighthere because: (no reason given)



posted on Dec, 29 2011 @ 03:45 PM
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Well what are the gun laws in New York?

The idea is that states each have a different set of laws for their citizens. I wouldn't expect to be able to sell Everclear and fireworks in some states because laws are different.

Same obviously applies to guns. Here in TX you can carry your weapon in to many establishments. Doesn't mean you go to California with it and get upset when the bar you're in doesn't like your AR-15


edit on 29-12-2011 by Hawking because: (no reason given)



posted on Dec, 29 2011 @ 03:46 PM
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I do not know the law in New York regarding guns, but I for one feel that she did the correct and honest thing. That she might face possible jail time is beyond belief. It's cases like this that really make me wonder about our world and its laws.



posted on Dec, 29 2011 @ 03:47 PM
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reply to post by Hawking
 


The states didnt all sign onto a document stating that the right to keep and bear fireworks or everclear shall not be infringed.



posted on Dec, 29 2011 @ 03:47 PM
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She has a license to carry in Tennessee but not in New York. But she did do the right thing by trying to check it in. No charges should be placed against her. But if your going to carry in another state check the laws first.



posted on Dec, 29 2011 @ 03:48 PM
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well in all fairness she, as a licensed carrier, has the obligation to know reciprocity laws.

edit.

here's an eye opener for you all to behold. lulz

www.handgunlaw.us...
edit on 29-12-2011 by LittleBlackEagle because: (no reason given)



posted on Dec, 29 2011 @ 03:49 PM
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You know, somebody should ask security at that site how many gang-banging thugs have ever offered to check their guns at the door.

I wonder how many people check sodomy laws before traveling? Wouldnt want to land in prison for getting a BJ in Kentucky.
edit on 29-12-2011 by thisguyrighthere because: (no reason given)



posted on Dec, 29 2011 @ 03:51 PM
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reply to post by sheepslayer247
 


I think this is more of the NYC ordinance than the NY state law. Most state laws do have reciprocity, but NYC has lately been getting a lot of press for their city ordinances. City Ordinances aren't even technically "laws" I don't think?

Anyhow, every responsible gun owner knows you need to check ahead before you travel. If she was immature and irresponsible enough to make this mistake, then she probably shouldn't have been carrying a gun around NYC.



posted on Dec, 29 2011 @ 03:54 PM
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Ignorance of a country's or state's laws is not a valid defence.

That being said, one of the biggest problems with policing and the legal system is that there are too many jobsworths and not enough common sense is applied.

In this case, the woman in question - having done the correct thing when realising she had transgressed the regulations - should have just been allowed to check her gun in and gone away with nothing more than a mild ticking off for not checking the laws before she entered the state.


edit on 29-12-2011 by Sherlock Holmes because: (no reason given)



posted on Dec, 29 2011 @ 03:58 PM
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reply to post by getreadyalready
 


I can agree with your statement, but I was under the impression that the right to bare arms was granted by the federal government and is one of the only few exceptions in which the federal government can supersede state law.

This is about constitutional right, not state law or city ordinance. I could be wrong.

Also, shouldn't the local law enforcement be able to tell the difference between a gun-toting thug, and a law-biding gun owner? Jail time for being honest? Seems a bit too much. A slap on the hand would have taught her a lesson.
edit on 29-12-2011 by sheepslayer247 because: (no reason given)



posted on Dec, 29 2011 @ 03:58 PM
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reply to post by Sherlock Holmes
 


NO. Nobody is going to take possession of a firearm for you. She should have had her bullets confiscated, her background run, and a citation issued, and then the gun returned to her with the caveat that if she were caught with bullets in it, she would be arrested.

I once forgot about my pocket knife walking into a courthouse, and they had a nice little setup for checking in knives and then signing them back out. I asked the deputy what would happen if I forgot about my gun, and he said I would have been arrested on the spot for even attempting to bring the gun into the courthouse. Once I entered the front door, it would have already been too late to do anything about it.

We don't really want somebody checking in firearms on the spur of the moment do we? If they have some elaborate system for it, then fine, but not on the spur of the moment.



posted on Dec, 29 2011 @ 04:09 PM
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Originally posted by sheepslayer247
reply to post by getreadyalready
 


I can agree with your statement, but I was under the impression that the right to bare arms was granted by the federal government and is one of the only few exceptions in which the federal government can supersede state law.

This is about constitutional right, not state law or city ordinance. I could be wrong.

Also, shouldn't the local law enforcement be able to tell the difference between a gun-toting thug, and a law-biding gun owner? Jail time for being honest? Seems a bit too much. A slap on the hand would have taught her a lesson.
edit on 29-12-2011 by sheepslayer247 because: (no reason given)


Unfortunately, the Constitutional Rights only encumber the Federal Government, not necessarily the States. Although, that is an emerging debate, and perhaps it should encumber all forms of law enforcement to be held to that document first and foremost? I could support that!


I agree with the common sense and human element. The cops involved should have been able to handle it differently considering the circumstances.



posted on Dec, 29 2011 @ 04:11 PM
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reply to post by getreadyalready
 


It certainly isn't desirable for someone to hand in their gun on the spur of the moment, especially in areas like the WTC site or a courtroom, where police and security would be understandably jittery about someone carrying a loaded firearm.

But, in this case, common sense should be applied. The woman went out of her way to obey the laws once she became aware of them. Yes, she should get a telling off and possibly even a small fine, but a potential 3½ year jail sentence for an apparently honest mistake of this nature is beyond absurd.



posted on Dec, 29 2011 @ 04:17 PM
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Yes - NYC has their own gun laws...think you have to check into the nearest police precinct immediatley upon arrival in the city regardless of your state permit.



posted on Dec, 29 2011 @ 04:22 PM
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reply to post by Sherlock Holmes
 



But, in this case, common sense should be applied. The woman went out of her way to obey the laws once she became aware of them. Yes, she should get a telling off and possibly even a small fine, but a potential 3½ year jail sentence for an apparently honest mistake of this nature is beyond absurd.




100% agreed!!

This is the problem with our current legal system. There is supposed to be a human element, but it has gone away. An officer, or a sheriff should have some discretion. A Judge and Jury should have some discretion. Each case is unique and should be handled as such. There is too much "cookie cutter" policy and procedure these days, and too many penalties for veering from standard protocol. We have removed all human elements from law enforcement and corrections, and this is the result.



posted on Dec, 29 2011 @ 04:24 PM
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I think something else to pay attention to in this story is the fact that this is a woman from TN visiting NYC. I can at least understand why should would feel the need for protection. NYC can be a very brutal and violent place, and concern about her safety is understandable.

She should have checked on the laws concerning guns before traveling, but those is positions of authority, such as police officers, should use common sense in cases like these. The woman obviously meant no harm, and was trying to comply with the law. Sometimes there is middle ground in law, and it takes understanding and education on both sides to make the system work.
edit on 29-12-2011 by isyeye because: (no reason given)



posted on Dec, 29 2011 @ 04:27 PM
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reply to post by getreadyalready
 


Everybody is too stupid for things like "discretion" and the "spirit" of laws.

Because somewhere somebody who walked due to "spirit" or "discretion" went ahead and did a bad thing and everyone got sued to high holy heaven and all the plebes cried and cried fearing their safety so now every last one of us is viewed guilty until proven innocent with absolutely no room for discretion and the spirit of the law has left this realm for greener pastures.



posted on Dec, 29 2011 @ 04:31 PM
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reply to post by thisguyrighthere
 


Yep. I blame the frivolous lawsuits and blameless society as well. Everything is somebody elses fault until you reach a patsy with no good defense and nowhere to pass the buck.


This thread just went up with a nice story though!



posted on Dec, 29 2011 @ 04:39 PM
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Ive read a bunch of articles on this and the contrast is awesome.

The write up in the NY Post goes on to mention out of state guns being used in NYC crimes:

Mayor Bloomberg, with the help of the five district attorneys, has crusaded against the flow of illegal guns, especially from the South.

Out-of-state weapons have been used in a slew of homicides, including the murder of NYPD cop Peter Figoski on Dec. 12.

Sources don’t believe Graves’ intentions were sinister. link


While a TN paper focuses on the inconsistent application of the 2nd Amendment and the need for reciprocity reform:

The case illustrates the patchwork of gun laws across the nation. While most states have gun permit reciprocity laws that recognize permits in other states, many municipalities like New York City have special rules that can lead to trouble for unknowing gun owners.

“It’s the same problem when our citizens travel to other states, it’s this quagmire of what I call ‘Thou shalt nots,’” said John Harris, a Nashville attorney who serves as the volunteer director of the Tennessee Firearms Association. “The problem is, there’s such vast inconsistency about what you can and can’t do. Think about what would happen if that level of inconsistency existed with the operation of motor vehicles.” link


America really is too damn big and the culture shifts too dramatically from one region to another to pretend there is any real unifying ideals other than the peoples propensity to be taken by politicians and bend to tyranny as though such submission included sexual gratification.



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