The world is a big place, and frankly, some ATS members need to remember where they came from.

Originally posted by CynCritter
When I joined 3 years ago, I thought I could bring some new thoughts and personal experiences to this forum.

Recently, the attacks - against me as a woman, and as a respectful, educated individual - have caused me to look at new topics and see who has been posting before I make any comment. I am not normally a defensive person. I worked hard all my life to achieve the retirement and happiness I enjoy. But to be "bullied" because a particular individual seems to be threatened by nearly everything I post, regardless of how innocent it's intended, makes me want to NOT post again in any thread wherein that individual has any interest. And if, later in the thread, that person rears his ugly head, I bow out and don't post in that thread anymore, regardless of whether or not I think I have something germane to add.

A little civility goes a long, long way...

I see where you're coming from, however out of the quarter million people that the moderator talked about, how many of those people would like to hear what you have to say? Deny ignorance is the ATS motto, however the ignorance I've seen lately is ignorance of sheer and utter ego. Like part of the title of this thread states,"ATS members need to remember where they come from". Alot of members have become or always have been closed minded to the fact that they're view is the be all and end all. When in reality some things aren't easily explained. They then revert to that person that they were before ATS, which is thinking in one direction. The only difference is that instead of thinking in the previous extreme, they think in another extreme and anchor themselves in that extreme without letting other ideas in.

So don't be intimidated by people who think they know everything, see yourself as an opened minded person who can contribute to the true idea of ATS. Maybe your thought, idea or theory maybe another persons piece of the puzzle. That's how I look at ATS, a giant arena where people share there theories where I take people's theories and add a possible piece to the puzzle. Sometimes I might think I have the right piece and then later on I find out that piece doesn't fit in to the puzzle.

Anyway I hope you read this because like I said there are alot of people on this site that remain open minded and who knows, you might hold the last piece of the puzzle for them. Hopefully he/she would share they're finished piece with the rest of us.

While we're at it, can we have a crackdown on those posts where if you dare to go against a conspiratorial view, you are immediately ganged up on and accused of being a shill, a 'disinfo agent' etc etc? There is no defence against this sort of thing as you can hardly prove what you are or aren't.

It's a very one sided 'debate' where only one point of view is accepted.

I can not agree more,

As one of the older members as such, I am not sure if I would be a member now if I had joined over the last few years, esp last year or two for the very reasons outlined by Nefomore.

I feel I may have dabbled, got very frustrated at the comments and replies, almost pack like mentality this is overtaking ATS and scarpered, thinking my time is not worth it and only causing angst anyhow.

Especially with the patience needed by readers, staff, mods, with my first BB code attempts lol multiple edits on every thread before could be read....

Maybe Nef can give the Digital ID thread a bump as this explains a lot of what happens imho

Thank you for bringing this to ATS maybe some members will post after reading this, or not leave too soon after seeing that the majority on ATS are a good, polite and kind bunch.

Kind Regards,

Elf

Originally posted by neformore

So when a new member - one of the 2 billion, comes knocking on ATS's door the very LAST thing they need to be treated to is sarcasm, rudeness and downright ill mannered petulance from members who simply cannot get over their own ego's fast enough in the race to dismiss a question as foolish, stupid or tell someone that they should "use the search function"

Just because you know something, it doesn't mean that someone else does

Let me say that again

Just because you know something, it doesn't mean that someone else does

People learn, and find things out all the time, and treating new people who come onto the board with rudeness and contempt is a sure fire way to make damn sure that their first visit is their last.

Let's take a quick look at the psychology of WHY someone would do this to another person. Better yet, why does ANYONE put someone else down? Well, to feel better about themselves...to be able to "compare" themselves in a positive light that ranks them above the "idiot" who doesn't know what they know. (I'm NOT calling anyone an idiot, by the way.) It's a very opportunistic, preying, bullying concept, which is also a very empty illusion. The new guy/girl makes a rookie mistake, or asks a question that is obvious to most everyone else, or makes a post that is important to them but sounds silly to others, only to be feasted on by the school of sharks waiting for the moment to devour their victim and claim victory over the "idiot" and feel superior for that insignificant moment of cyber time. There are two victims here....those who were bullied and became bullies, and those who are being bullied and have not become bullies yet. I see this type of behavior at every age group now, and it's disheartening.

Maybe their parents bullied them? Maybe their peers bullied them? Maybe they just have really, REALLY low self esteem issues? Maybe they lack confidence in the real world, and choose to gain it by asserting themselves here? Who knows?? It really is a vicious cycle that parents, teachers, mentors and adults everywhere should be helping to mend whenever and wherever they see it. It's a general lack of empathy for their fellow human beings...the inability to empathize with being on the receiving end of how they are treating another. Perhaps they CAN empathize, but choose not to because "it was done to them, and that's life, and life isn't fair".

So many times, I've seen moderators state that ATS is a microcosm of the world, and if this is the case, we should be very concerned about the aggressive behavior and general lack of care and concern for other members. ..that seems to be what we see every time we turn on the TV, isn't it? Making fun of others is big time "funny" on the late shows, and viewers think it's OK. I don't. Why is it OK to laugh at a celebrity being bullied and made fun of by a comedian, but not OK here or in our daily lives, regardless of how crazy their behavior might have been? See what I mean? There's a very real disconnect straight across the board that we consistently ignore. As long as it's not "us" that is on the crap end of the stick, it's OK.

Well sorry for the rant, but you touched on something that's been bothering me lately, and I appreciate you mentioning it. I hope that the decent members of ATS will embrace the concept of respect and learn how to debate a topic without taking it personally. Perhaps THAT is what is missing as well. Too many folks don't know how to properly debate. The moment it gets personal is the moment in which the debate ended. But then again, look at our politicians...it seems to be OK with them, right? WRONG. It's not OK. It's not OK there, and it's not OK here, and people need to not be afraid to politely correct it when they see it. Tolerance for another's differences is one thing, but tolerance for ill behavior is quite another.

Originally posted by Fractured.Facade
Also, too often, too many here take this all WAY too seriously and place entirely too much importance and value on their own contributions here....

Question is, when does the average person stop seeing this as all pixels on a screen and begin to believe it is their own reality?

Indeed...some people get way too caught up in all this.
Some people who like to think they are important here or have a reputation and seem to have a following, some of these people act like they are something special.

You have to laugh at some of them.

Some of the comments I've seen from some members on here regarding their status and/or reputation is at best cringe-worthy and at worst down right arrogant delusions of grandeur
As you say... this is all just pixels on a screen

Although I think it is good to say it and to hope to encourage a few to be more compassionate in these cases,
I do feel a somewhat fatalistic part of me that sees this as the inevitable nature of social interactions as a group or community is formed!

Things like status and rank begin to enter the picture, and with it the behaviors such as hazing as part of the entrance ritual. It's not here, it's anywhere a community forms- with humans as well as other social animals.
I've gotten to where I expect it and am ready for it when I first decide to join an internet community. I come in armed and ready for battle, and not even taking it personally- because it has nothing to do with me personally. It is the order of social entities, and it is inscribed in our evolved instincts.

In studying social animals, I've also noticed that often when going through the hazing period, the newcomer gets "sponsors". Sometimes only one, sometimes a couple, that decide to jump in and be protective of them.
In some ways it is just another form of gaining power over them, as the new member continues to be their immediate inferior in hierachy once the placing has been established. But it is something that newcomers often appreciate much more than the outward challenge.

But it is also a way for the newcomer to discern who is interested in teaching them, rather than just enforcing their power only for the pleasures of the status, and without regard to the responsibilities that go with it.

When I first came to ats I would post a thread and members would snivel it was old news. Well sorry! I dont remember getting a moderator sponsored thread in my honor. I was simply told to use the search function. So, if you want to know if people are interested in a topic shouldnt we be informing them of where the search bar is? I know its hard, I had trouble navigating the website at first too. P.S. You won't find my name anywhere on the yesterdays thread in question because I knew it would be overheated.

reply to post by blupblup

Some of the comments I've seen from some members on here regarding their status and/or reputation is at best cringe-worthy and at worst down right arrogant delusions of grandeur

I'm right with you on this point. It's in double-figures the number of banned or ex-members who've gone down this route of believing their own hype. Partly it's the way they are and partly it's taking flattery seriously.

I guess we'll all stop posting one day and within a minute of that moment we'll be forgotten and our contributions worth zilch...quite right too!!

reply to post by neformore


GREAT thread!
Thank you for reminding us of this
We can all get carried away sometimes...call it ummmm....PASSION!
lol

I JUST made a thread (before I saw this one) in the same spirit- remembering the Golden Rule kinda stuff- so instead of retyping all my thoughts on this matter-

"EVERYBODY'S FREE"- A Dedication- I Sing For You ATS! [VIDEO]

The opposite can also be said.

Maybe new members should be encouraged to read and study a little bit, and appreciate the insight of those who know that topic.And eat some humble pie when they are wrong.

Instead of coming in with arrogant topics, acting is if they are the first, starting a thread with guns blazing, and getting hostile when they learn they don't know as much as they thought.

reply to post by MischeviousElf


I joined in September of 2010- having lurked for about 6 months or so prior to that,
and I actually liked the feistiness!
Bring it on baby! I don't take anything personally on here- because well, first of all, nobody on here knows me personally!
But that's just the way I am- I still recognize and respect that others may not share my perspective.
As much as political correctness gets on my nerves, being polite and kind should be the first priority. Especially on a site/forum like this- ATS wants cred, and that requires professionalism and courtesy.

Originally posted by blupblup
As you say... this is all just pixels on a screen

edit on 29/12/11 by blupblup because: (no reason given)

That is what I use to think.

It is not just pixels on a screen though.

Well in all general practice of using a computer
is seeing pixels on a screen, but there are REAL PEOPLE
behind those pixels. Looking at others on the net as just *pixels on a screen*
helps some people dehumanize others online
because there not dealing with *real people* there just dealing with *pixels on screen*.

Originally posted by Kandinsky

I'm right with you on this point. It's in double-figures the number of banned or ex-members who've gone down this route of believing their own hype. Partly it's the way they are and partly it's taking flattery seriously.

I guess we'll all stop posting one day and within a minute of that moment we'll be forgotten and our contributions worth zilch...quite right too!!

Indeed, It's not only banned or ex members though, there are many, many current members who have some serious issues regarding how important they think they are on and to ATS.

And yes you're right, when we leave or whatever, that's it... and so it should.

Unless it's the likes of Jedimiller and Dan Tanna and then they should definitely be remembered for their hilarity and ability to keep a straight face while saying the things they did

Originally posted by AussieAmandaC

Originally posted by rubbertramp
on one hand, ats should be proud of the growth and how many members sign up.
on the other hand there is always a point where things get too big for their britches and become difficult to control and an unwanted element arizes.
the bigger this site gets, the more uncontrolable it will become.

So is that a reason for us to lose our own self control, sheer numbers?
That doesn't make sense to me at all, sorry.

A nicely worded reminder for everyone OP nice heart and the sentiments should be shared when ever the opportunity arises, so thanks for that

It actually takes less effort as the opposite

i never said lose slf control.
personally i have never once intentionally insulted anyone on this board.
many have claimed i have just because i may contradict or disagree.
it's almost like a small town compared to a city.
a small town only need minimal law enforcement. [mods]
a city needs large amounts.
maybe it's a matter of not enough mods to delete what most of us find as attack posts and replies quicker?
maybe there should be more bannings, even those who generally arecpleasant posters but get outta' hand at times.?
maybe posters like me who tend to avoid threads that become what i consider rude, should join and defend those who are being attacked?
i do believe that only escalates things, but maybe not?
maybe i should stop leaving threads that get out of hand and defend those being attacked?
i'll read the mumbers in the op again, i'm wondering what the mod per poster ratio is.
there's been only one time, which was yesterday that i even questioned the actions of 3 mods in a thread.
i said my peace and left it be, but i could see why others push the envelope.
personally i'm not looking for confrontation and the majority here i think agrees and do not either, but it's only a handful that actually disrupts.

Originally posted by popsmayhem
That is what I use to think.

It is not just pixels on a screen though.

Well in all general practice of using a computer
is seeing pixels on a screen, but there are REAL PEOPLE
behind those pixels. Looking at others on the net as just *pixels on a screen*
helps some people dehumanize others online

Well I don't mean it in a bad way or as a means to dehumanize anyone... seriously.
The point is though, we could just turn off our computers and it all goes away.... someone annoys you at ATS or ATS does something you don't agree with and you want to bitch and moan.... then don't, just turn of your computer and don't come back.

THAT is what I mean by pixels on a screen.

It's as real as you make it.

The people at work who annoy you or your boss who makes rules you don't like... you HAVE to deal with, you have to accept and you just get on with it or change jobs.
With ATS the solution is even easier, you just log off and all your troubles are over,.

I never just think of anyone online as just "Pixels on a screen" that's not what I meant.

But those who swagger around ATS using their titles and reputation or number of threads or stars or "fans" or whatever, as some measure of their importance...and some reason to attack and belittle people..

To THOSE people I would remind.... this is all just pixels on a screen.... you are NOT important.

That's all I'm saying.

Not dehumanizing or saying people's problems and issues aren't real or the things we discuss here aren't important.

Im a bit confused about this threads position (which I agree with) compared to the first few seconds of this video

Which mocks the very same person but in video form

Very good point. One of my pet peevs is exactly that, being rude to people new to the site because their thoughts have already been "debunked" or someone in 17th century has already come up with some theory that they wanted to express etc..

We should encourage our community to accept as many people as possible because this site has tons and tons of need to know info. We need especially the young minds that will truly make a difference in this world.

reply to post by davespanners




God I tried watching that

So awkward and odd.... is that serious or a kinda comedy thing ATS does?

I'm confused...

reply to post by neformore


I want to say, in honor (honour) of the thread's title and point, that this has given me much to ponder.

Certainly has "struck home" (as 'they' say) and will forever hover in the back of mind henceforth.

reply to post by davespanners


By "mock" do you refer to the pronunciation of "Igor"?

Oh dear.....what a funny movie that was...."Young Frankenstein". My favorite ("favourite") to pull out every Hallowe'en....

Or, did the joke pass you by, Sir Dave?? (just kidding, or as the kids type, 'j/k').