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Ken Johnston Lunar Cover-Up on Coast-2-Coast 12/25

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posted on Dec, 26 2011 @ 11:00 AM
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I haven't heard the program. If anyone did, did Rense raise any of these issues:


to Jeff Rense // September 28, 2011

Jeff, you've always been a dependable source of fringe items and a bit beyond, for your stories, but I've never seen you so completely taken in by an inveterate confabulator until I listened to the Ken Johnston interview. He's a sweet guy and great theatre, but nothing he claims about his spaceflight career seems to check out with the evidence.
I don't mind weird stories and weird story-tellers, but when they drag in honorable men I worked beside for years, and portray them -- long after they themselves are not able to defend themselves -- as liars and scientific frauds, it does raise my hackles.
Case in point: Dr. Thornton Page and the allegations of photo forgery to suppress evidence of alien activity filmed by Apollo-14 in shadowed regions of Tsiolkovskiy Crater on the back side of the moon. Page comes across in this story as a villain on a planetary scale.
But I worked with him for more than twenty years, visited him and his wife Lou at their home in Nassau Bay, knew their family, interviewed him for television, and delivered the eulogy at his funeral.
So I took the trouble -- as neither you nor anyone else bothered to do -- to just dig into the basics of Johnston's story. It didn't take long to determine, from mission records, that Apollo-14 never flew over Tsiolkovskiy Crater at all -- it was hundreds of miles to the south of their orbit,
And when Apollo-14 was circling the moon, the sun was 30 degrees above the eastern rim of the crater -- which would have left no portion of the floor in shadow, since the topographic relief is so gentle. Doesn't that suggest the story is imaginary? Go verify this.
The story seems internally inconsistent. At one point the film (and I can't find any record of a 16-mm cine camera even aboard the CM during the LM absence period) is called 'Top Secret', and the next day, Johnston is borrowing a copy for general showing to ordinary employees in the Bldg 2 auditorium. Why Page should even ask Johnston for the film is a total puzzle.
Johnston reports 'learning to fly' in the Marine corps. His FOIAed military training records show NO aircraft ratings or any flight school graduation certificates. His entire military duty was as a junior NCO flight line electronics maintenance tech, Go check.
Grumman public affairs official Lon Rains checked their documents on their test pilots for the LM, and you can verify this with him. Johnston is not on the list. Nor is he named in any of the Apollo program histories of the testing of Lunar Modules in the vacuum chamber in Houston or in all other activities with flight vehicles. His name is not mentioned. He appears as a technician in the August 1969 NASA phone book, but not assigned to the astronaut training team, as he claims.
His subsequent job in the Lunar Receiving Lab was as a shipping clerk, who had several sets of Apollo photographs to show to scientists who were being sent the samples. He never had control over the original photos [he seems to have explained that to you ambiguously], and the one set he kept, that he donated to his college, was subsequently lost and he has not been able to locate it, last I've heard. He was never ordered to delete or alter images from the master archives, nor did he even have the access to do so -- he was told to clear the shelves once his team task [and he was an honorable footsoldier in that team, with nobody working for him] ended when moon landings ended.
The "Dr." title you used was also highly suspect, since it traces to a mail-order certificate from a PO Box in Denver that names a non-existent 'Reform Baptist Seminary', signed by a businessman who is still involved in other mail and internet projects.. The 'seminary' was shut down as part of a mid-1980s Colorado Attorney General's task force crackdown on bogus diploma mills.
Decades later, Johnston claimed that PhD on the bio he sent to the volunteer outreach program at JPL. They trustingly listed it in their own website as an example of the education level of their unpaid volunteers. It was my query to them regarding verifiable corroboration of the claim that led to JPL's query to Johnston -- and his immediate offer to resign, which JPL accepted and quickly deleted the offending educational claim. Johnston soon called back to withdraw his resignation but JPL would have none of it -- why should they give him a pass on one the major crash-landings in federal employment, a bogus degree?
You and I have seen more than our fair share of tall tale tellers from all walks of life, and for myself, I rarely detect any signs of deliberate deception. What I often see is an enthusiastic incremental dramatization of original interesting stories into forms so distorted they become useless for indications of genuinely anomalous experiences.... [snip]




posted on Dec, 26 2011 @ 01:59 PM
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The Johnston interview was apparently a live event and not a replay.

www.coasttocoastam.com...

It's been blogged -- and debunked -- here:

dorkmission.blogspot.com...

The promo material seems to suggest Johnston is now claiming to have been a UFO contactee:



Ken Johnston, who worked for NASA's Lunar Receiving Laboratory during the Apollo missions, says he was fired for telling the truth. He joined George Knapp to share his contention that NASA knows there is evidence for both modern and ancient artifacts on the moon, as well as an active base there. He explained that in his position as Photo Control Dept. manager, he had access to highly detailed film and negatives taken during the Apollo missions. In viewing 16mm film shot by Apollo 14, they saw a shadow cast in the bottom of a crater, "and as we approached it, in the dark area there were like five domes lit from the inside, and a little plume that looked like steam streaking up above it," Johnston said.
There are also Apollo pictures that show perfectly round holes, which he's concluded are vents rather than craters because they don't have ridges. Photos taken during the Apollo 15 mission show beams stretching across the surface that expose some of the lunar substructure, Johnston noted, adding that during seismic experiments the moon would ring like a bell, possibly indicating it was hollow. One of the more striking anomalous photos was taken by a Russian lunar orbiter which showed a fractured dome on the moon's surface, he commented. Another image (see below) taken by the Lunik 13 Russian craft, looks like a drilling device and definitely appears artificial, he continued.
Johnston also talked about some of his early UFO contact experiences, where he was told he would become an ambassador between humans and ETs. He believes there is a group of ETs called the Watchers that keep tabs on humanity. Interestingly, he learned that Apollo astronauts were warned off by beings at one of the craters, and told not to return to the moon, and subsequently NASA scrapped the rest of its planned Apollo missions.


edit on 26-12-2011 by JimOberg because: add promo material



posted on Dec, 26 2011 @ 04:26 PM
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Originally posted by zorgon

Originally posted by smurfy
Hold on Zorgon,
If Gary McKinnon is a buffoon, why is the US fighting tooth and nail to get hold of him.


Ummm really? He did his crime in 2001, 10 years ago, and he is still on the loose living in the UK... Seriously if they wanted him so bad you think they couldn't have got him by now? Gitmo is full of people that got a free vacation


Can't do that now, he's too public a person.



posted on Dec, 26 2011 @ 05:06 PM
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reply to post by JimOberg
 


Jim the Great Defender,

your name was mentioned a few times


I was really hoping you would call in.





posted on Dec, 26 2011 @ 05:21 PM
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I was a real fan of Ken Johnston before this interview. His story was good and he seemed the real deal, however, as with most situations where you have read about someone, and then hear/see them interviewed live, your perceptions always change in some way.

My evaluation thus:

He does seem to be a bit nervous talking in a huge venue like C2C, but then again many would!
He talks very fast, sometimes garbled and hard to understand, and pauses a lot with uncomfortable silence.
He seems to skirt direct questions and pulls the conversation into a realm that he feels more comfortable with.

I do not find the above comfortable, given the job he held and the demand for good communication skills that that job would require.

I also do not like the fact that al ot of his 'evidence' is destroyed, as well as the bit about giving copies of pictures he was asked to destroy to a public university, when his employer told him to destroy all he had. I do see why he would keep some for himself, but then , after the interview, he really does not have all I thought he had.

Troubling, but we will see if he can pull his act together so he can pass the rigorous debunk he is going to get from this interview. He may not be able to survive it.

Anyway, IMHO, and interested in the comments of others that tuned into this.



posted on Dec, 26 2011 @ 05:21 PM
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Originally posted by freelance_zenarchist
reply to post by JimOberg
 


Jim the Great Defender,

your name was mentioned a few times


I was really hoping you would call in.



On Christmas? Hey, years ago, when somebody told me to 'get a life'. I did!

Care to share what fantasies Ken wove this time? Did he REALLY, as the teaser text indicated, now say he was a UFO contactee?

And did he identify anybody else out of seven billion people, as documented on the WWW, who claims as he does to have a genuine PhD from a 'school' with no campus, no faculty, no library, and of course, no accreditation? Has anybody EVER located a single other person via search engine who lists that 'alma mater' on any credentials available on line?

I
wonder
why
not
.
.
.



posted on Dec, 26 2011 @ 05:41 PM
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reply to post by JimOberg
 


Well you didn't miss much, I didn't find it very entertaining, which is why I was hoping you were going to call in.

UFO contactee? His story was kind of hard to follow, first he saw a whooping crane, then years later he's dreaming and see's a craft land. If you see a spaceship in a dream are you really a contactee? He did say that the aliens in his dream wanted him to be an ambassador and negotiate between our race and their race, then coincidentally years later his title at NASA was Solar System Ambassador.


He does mention his doctorate in metaphysics but I can't recall the details of the story.

It's around 53:30 in the Youtube video I posted above that they first mention you.
edit on 26-12-2011 by freelance_zenarchist because: (no reason given)



posted on Dec, 26 2011 @ 05:45 PM
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In answer to the question why did the Apollo 14 astronauts not notice the "Blue Ship" above them, Ken replied (not verbatim) "They had a lot to do. Their heart rates were 140, 160... they didn't have a whole lot of time to look around."

Well, that ignores the fact that they spent hours and hours being trained by Gene Shoemaker and Farouk El-Baz, among others, to do just that -- look around. As the "Emoluments of Mars" blog states, a major hazard in the sky above the landing site would have got their attention. Count on it. Stick a fork in it.



posted on Dec, 26 2011 @ 05:56 PM
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Originally posted by Human_Alien

I base most of my opinions on: evidence, deliverance (vocally speaking), body language and overall vibe.


There are three terms/phrases that don't belong with the others. Can you spot which is which?



posted on Dec, 26 2011 @ 06:14 PM
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For Jim Oberg
-----------------------
I am just trying to learn about this whole thing,

I can understand if Ken wanted to emphasis his position of importance during some of the apollo missions. That he could of had access to some of the pictures. He did stress that he had a certain charge of photographs.

Here is a document that I found on the web.

Is this legitimate? I am sure you would know better than I being that you are an insider.
bp3.blogger.com...

Mike Bara seems to think that document is legit.
From his site:
www.mikebara.com...

He states something of importance here:
*************
"Furthermore, it wouldn’t matter if Ken had been merely the janitor at the LRL during the Apollo Program, much less “in charge” of anything. All that matters is that he was, in fact, in a position to have access to the official Apollo photographs he has now provided to the world (as Dr. Warner’s memo, among many other documents, clearly establishes); that he was subsequently ordered to destroy these photographs (a story we recount in “Dark Mission”), and that he chose instead to preserve some of the images — to the ultimate betterment of mankind."
************
I am just trying to understand this whole thing Jim.

Do you think Jim, that Ken could of had access to those particular moon photos he states has in his possession under lock and key a (thousand photos) at yesterdays C2C show ? Are they legit photos? The robot head ?


Also what do you think of Linda Moulton Howe? Do you think there are some legitimate whistleblowers she has interviewed?
I really think she is the real deal, but I can not say for sure every whistleblower is who they say they are. She usually requires a very strict understanding of their military qualifications. I love listening to her and think she is quite intelligent. She has a degree in communications at Stanford University, Calif.

But I think it is important to understand what you are saying Jim. That Ken was not the head of that dept. not sure if he even mentioned that. But he seemed to think that he had legit access to special apollo moon photos!

Again Jim, could Ken of had access to moon photos that had artifacts in photos he said he had?

Just trying to understand the truth what ever it is.



edit on 26-12-2011 by thetiler because: had to mention who I am responding to



posted on Dec, 26 2011 @ 06:23 PM
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Originally posted by LiveToSpendIt

Originally posted by Human_Alien

I base most of my opinions on: evidence, deliverance (vocally speaking), body language and overall vibe.


There are three terms/phrases that don't belong with the others. Can you spot which is which?




Not sure why you're following my threads but it's obvious that you don't agree with my style. That's fine. As far as what doesn't belong, so far it's been you on my threads.

Unfortunately I don't have the opportunity to have hands-on experience with objects (photos etc) or even one-on-one interviews with certain people so the way I ascertain a level of credibility is: evidence (even from the disadvantage of a computer monitor)...their deliverance (if their affect sounds right)....their body language (especially in an interview mode) and the vibe they give me.

Don't like it my style? Not to worry because I won't miss your presence.



posted on Dec, 26 2011 @ 06:30 PM
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Originally posted by Human_Alien
I base most of my opinions on: evidence, deliverance (vocally speaking), body language and overall vibe.



Originally posted by LiveToSpendIt
There are three terms/phrases that don't belong with the others. Can you spot which is which?



Originally posted by Human_Alien Not sure why you're following my threads but it's obvious that you don't agree with my style. That's fine.


Gee thanks for allowing me to post on your thread.


I could care less about your "style" what I care about it that you haven't a clue what you are babbling on about.

Btw, the answer is "deliverance (vocally speaking), body language and overall vibe.".



posted on Dec, 26 2011 @ 07:35 PM
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I subscribe to Coast podcast and I listened to Ken's interview with the wide eyed George Knapp this evening. Oh gawd. Firstly, this Ken guy has the most disconcerting speaking cadence. It's like he doesn't know when and where to pause and or emphasize, go up, go down, stop, go, just, mumblemumble. Terrible interviewee. Well George is salivating on about how verifiable this dude is, "unlike many whistleblowers that have been on here who's backgrounds you cant verify" ---What the H P Lovecraft F***?!--- right off the bat, I recall 2 "whistleblowers" and one was a verrrry long time ago, being Cliff Stone, and another was an even more verrrry long time ago before that, being Bob Lazar, who Georgie told anyone who'd listen, that he believed Lazar, thats why he put him on TV.

I corresponded with George Knapp back in the early 1990's. I told him about my own (very documented) ufo-military story when I was stationed, um, sorta near where Lazar um, was. It was a super serious and traumatic affair, and I'd been given an access debriefing warning form.

Many years later, one day, I thought to myself, "I wonder if Knapp would find me an interesting guest idea, after all, it's only like three decades went by, after all. Knapp remembered me and expressed it this way. "I know you." Um...Okay. That felt like I got spit at. Yet another ufo clique ufo elitest snot. I've encountered too many of those. I should have went on like Kenny did, saying things like, "Well, I know there's human aliens with bases and doing things here and there, and I know theres a secret space program, cuz I heard it whispered about by different ufo buffs here and there." Maybe better yet, "My Eben friend gave me a crystal gift, which I foresee 2012 as the year the giant pink glittering spacieship comes whooshing down the rainbow, like Santa to your rooftop, and all the different ET races will hold hands (and other appendages) singing kumbaya." Also, I need to have a YouTube channel and I'm wearing open blouses, to show off my silicone work. Yeah. Thats the ticket.

You'd think these Ufology Elitests were noc spooks with a hidden agenda.

(Hmmmm..........)



posted on Dec, 26 2011 @ 08:03 PM
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Originally posted by Saucerwench
I subscribe to Coast podcast and I listened to Ken's interview with the wide eyed George Knapp this evening. Oh gawd. Firstly, this Ken guy has the most disconcerting speaking cadence. It's like he doesn't know when and where to pause and or emphasize, go up, go down, stop, go, just, mumblemumble. Terrible interviewee. Well George is salivating on about how verifiable this dude is, "unlike many whistleblowers that have been on here who's backgrounds you cant verify" ---What the H P Lovecraft F***?!--- right off the bat, I recall 2 "whistleblowers" and one was a verrrry long time ago, being Cliff Stone, and another was an even more verrrry long time ago before that, being Bob Lazar, who Georgie told anyone who'd listen, that he believed Lazar, thats why he put him on TV.

I corresponded with George Knapp back in the early 1990's. I told him about my own (very documented) ufo-military story when I was stationed, um, sorta near where Lazar um, was. It was a super serious and traumatic affair, and I'd been given an access debriefing warning form.

Many years later, one day, I thought to myself, "I wonder if Knapp would find me an interesting guest idea, after all, it's only like three decades went by, after all. Knapp remembered me and expressed it this way. "I know you." Um...Okay. That felt like I got spit at. Yet another ufo clique ufo elitest snot. I've encountered too many of those. I should have went on like Kenny did, saying things like, "Well, I know there's human aliens with bases and doing things here and there, and I know theres a secret space program, cuz I heard it whispered about by different ufo buffs here and there." Maybe better yet, "My Eben friend gave me a crystal gift, which I foresee 2012 as the year the giant pink glittering spacieship comes whooshing down the rainbow, like Santa to your rooftop, and all the different ET races will hold hands (and other appendages) singing kumbaya." Also, I need to have a YouTube channel and I'm wearing open blouses, to show off my silicone work. Yeah. Thats the ticket.

You'd think these Ufology Elitests were noc spooks with a hidden agenda.

(Hmmmm..........)


What do you think of Linda Moulton Howe? It seems she goes to great extremes to verify everybody she interviews.



posted on Dec, 26 2011 @ 08:18 PM
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reply to post by thetiler
 


LMH has been fooled by hoaxers, but I dont have hard facts in front of me just now, about those stories. This one abductee Jim sparks, who LMH was touting very much, I dont believe, I think he's a hoaxer. Yeah, my post here is more lame an answer than I'd like to give, but if anyone of you wants to see each and every ufo case that comes up, deconstructed one molecule at a time, as-it-were, go to Reality Uncovered. Word of warning, dont even whisper anything pro et over there or they'l shred ya to bits. But I've never encountered such thorough documented debunking in my existence, it's supremely formidable.
edit on 26-12-2011 by Saucerwench because: x



posted on Dec, 26 2011 @ 08:33 PM
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Originally posted by Saucerwench
reply to post by thetiler
 


LMH has been fooled by hoaxers, but I don't have hard facts in front of me just now, about those stories. This one abductee Jim Sparks, who LMH was touting very much, I don't believe, I think he's a hoaxer.


If you hang around long enough, making decisions about people who spill tales, then you are going, by definition, to get fooled. Attempting to "read" people's truthfulness, that you do not know, is impossible, hell, it's nigh impossible to get a bead on those people you know very well.

That is not to say Howe and her ilk don't perform services to the UFO (and similar communities), they do. The problem is that people's ability to discern fact from hearsay is at an all-time low.
This is not her fault, at least she's not Kerry "FUBAR" Cassidy.

The fault lies with people, God only knows where the hell their brains are most of the time.



posted on Dec, 26 2011 @ 08:39 PM
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reply to post by JimOberg
reply to post by freelance_zenarchist
 

It looks as though you short conversation has saved me 53 minutes of my life, probably more than 2 hours 30 minutes.

Any doubts folks had before.... Contactee ET ambassador too now!


edit on 26/12/11 by Pimander because: (no reason given)



posted on Dec, 26 2011 @ 09:34 PM
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Originally posted by LiveToSpendIt

Originally posted by Saucerwench
reply to post by thetiler
 


LMH has been fooled by hoaxers, but I don't have hard facts in front of me just now, about those stories. This one abductee Jim Sparks, who LMH was touting very much, I don't believe, I think he's a hoaxer.


If you hang around long enough, making decisions about people who spill tales, then you are going, by definition, to get fooled. Attempting to "read" people's truthfulness, that you do not know, is impossible, hell, it's nigh impossible to get a bead on those people you know very well.

That is not to say Howe and her ilk don't perform services to the UFO (and similar communities), they do. The problem is that people's ability to discern fact from hearsay is at an all-time low.
This is not her fault, at least she's not Kerry "FUBAR" Cassidy.

The fault lies with people, God only knows where the hell their brains are most of the time.


After hearing her for a lot of hours I will lay odds that she has been more correct than not ! She is the most accurate of any speaker i've ever heard and I've hear quite a few. I do think she could be fooled, obviously as anybody can. But I seriously don't think there has been a scholar on the ufo subject that has peaked my interest as much as she has. But you never know what is around the corner. When I hear her talks on coast to coast, I have to say, she has generated a great interest on the subject for me. I just can't recall anybody in all the tons and tons of shows (C2C) I've listened to that is so incredible. But have to say that is were I "cut my teeth" is through her knowledge". Then added from there.
That and a few other Coast to Coasters.

But I certainly understand how Coast to Coast can have topics that just don't interest me and and some don't have as much knowledge on their subject.

But I have to say Linda Moulton Howe really blows me away with some of the servicemen, policemen that talk about what they have seen. Then tapes her interview with them.
To be honest I just love her tightness in the way she lays out her ideas and presentations on C2C. Just incredible to me. She even states that she has an great memory and has good recall. I think she does, not that she is perfect, who is that is mortal?



posted on Dec, 27 2011 @ 12:32 AM
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Originally posted by thetiler

For Jim Oberg
-----------------------
I am just trying to learn about this whole thing,

I can understand if Ken wanted to emphasis his position of importance during some of the apollo missions. That he could of had access to some of the pictures. He did stress that he had a certain charge of photographs.

Here is a document that I found on the web.


I have no reason to doubt it's authentic. Ken was the HS grad contractor who replaced Dr. Warner after the first moon landings, once the job became routine. There was nobody in any department to be in charge of -- just Ken at his desk.


[Bara] states something of importance here:
*************
"Furthermore, it wouldn’t matter if Ken had been merely the janitor at the LRL during the Apollo Program, much less “in charge” of anything. All that matters is that he was, in fact, in a position to have access to the official Apollo photographs he has now provided to the world (as Dr. Warner’s memo, among many other documents, clearly establishes); that he was subsequently ordered to destroy these photographs (a story we recount in “Dark Mission”), and that he chose instead to preserve some of the images — to the ultimate betterment of mankind."
************
I am just trying to understand this whole thing Jim.


There is no evidence that Johnston had exclusive authority over any photos that he could unilaterally remove from public purview. He was an end-user of the real photo lab, which sent him sets of photos for his use, as they sent the same phots to the public, to the press, and to scientistsd all over the world.




Do you think Jim, that Ken could of had access to those particular moon photos he states has in his possession under lock and key a (thousand photos) at yesterdays C2C show ? Are they legit photos? The robot head ?


The photos are the same as those publicly available for decades. What you SEE in them depends on your imagination. Well, not always -- the 'corer' thingie in the Russian photo is a piece of that spacecraft itself, NOT an alien artifact.



But I think it is important to understand what you are saying Jim. That Ken was not the head of that dept. not sure if he even mentioned that. But he seemed to think that he had legit access to special apollo moon photos!

Again Jim, could Ken of had access to moon photos that had artifacts in photos he said he had?

Just trying to understand the truth what ever it is.


Ken had the same access to Apollo photos that you do. And as much ability to 'edit' and 'delete' any of them, that you do. No more.


edit on 27-12-2011 by JimOberg because: fix quotes



posted on Dec, 27 2011 @ 01:05 AM
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reply to post by JimOberg
 


What do you honestly in (your) heart think Jim.
Are their (alien made) artifacts on the moon or not?

A yes or no answer will do. If you care to comment on that. Thanks



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