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to Jeff Rense // September 28, 2011
Jeff, you've always been a dependable source of fringe items and a bit beyond, for your stories, but I've never seen you so completely taken in by an inveterate confabulator until I listened to the Ken Johnston interview. He's a sweet guy and great theatre, but nothing he claims about his spaceflight career seems to check out with the evidence.
I don't mind weird stories and weird story-tellers, but when they drag in honorable men I worked beside for years, and portray them -- long after they themselves are not able to defend themselves -- as liars and scientific frauds, it does raise my hackles.
Case in point: Dr. Thornton Page and the allegations of photo forgery to suppress evidence of alien activity filmed by Apollo-14 in shadowed regions of Tsiolkovskiy Crater on the back side of the moon. Page comes across in this story as a villain on a planetary scale.
But I worked with him for more than twenty years, visited him and his wife Lou at their home in Nassau Bay, knew their family, interviewed him for television, and delivered the eulogy at his funeral.
So I took the trouble -- as neither you nor anyone else bothered to do -- to just dig into the basics of Johnston's story. It didn't take long to determine, from mission records, that Apollo-14 never flew over Tsiolkovskiy Crater at all -- it was hundreds of miles to the south of their orbit,
And when Apollo-14 was circling the moon, the sun was 30 degrees above the eastern rim of the crater -- which would have left no portion of the floor in shadow, since the topographic relief is so gentle. Doesn't that suggest the story is imaginary? Go verify this.
The story seems internally inconsistent. At one point the film (and I can't find any record of a 16-mm cine camera even aboard the CM during the LM absence period) is called 'Top Secret', and the next day, Johnston is borrowing a copy for general showing to ordinary employees in the Bldg 2 auditorium. Why Page should even ask Johnston for the film is a total puzzle.
Johnston reports 'learning to fly' in the Marine corps. His FOIAed military training records show NO aircraft ratings or any flight school graduation certificates. His entire military duty was as a junior NCO flight line electronics maintenance tech, Go check.
Grumman public affairs official Lon Rains checked their documents on their test pilots for the LM, and you can verify this with him. Johnston is not on the list. Nor is he named in any of the Apollo program histories of the testing of Lunar Modules in the vacuum chamber in Houston or in all other activities with flight vehicles. His name is not mentioned. He appears as a technician in the August 1969 NASA phone book, but not assigned to the astronaut training team, as he claims.
His subsequent job in the Lunar Receiving Lab was as a shipping clerk, who had several sets of Apollo photographs to show to scientists who were being sent the samples. He never had control over the original photos [he seems to have explained that to you ambiguously], and the one set he kept, that he donated to his college, was subsequently lost and he has not been able to locate it, last I've heard. He was never ordered to delete or alter images from the master archives, nor did he even have the access to do so -- he was told to clear the shelves once his team task [and he was an honorable footsoldier in that team, with nobody working for him] ended when moon landings ended.
The "Dr." title you used was also highly suspect, since it traces to a mail-order certificate from a PO Box in Denver that names a non-existent 'Reform Baptist Seminary', signed by a businessman who is still involved in other mail and internet projects.. The 'seminary' was shut down as part of a mid-1980s Colorado Attorney General's task force crackdown on bogus diploma mills.
Decades later, Johnston claimed that PhD on the bio he sent to the volunteer outreach program at JPL. They trustingly listed it in their own website as an example of the education level of their unpaid volunteers. It was my query to them regarding verifiable corroboration of the claim that led to JPL's query to Johnston -- and his immediate offer to resign, which JPL accepted and quickly deleted the offending educational claim. Johnston soon called back to withdraw his resignation but JPL would have none of it -- why should they give him a pass on one the major crash-landings in federal employment, a bogus degree?
You and I have seen more than our fair share of tall tale tellers from all walks of life, and for myself, I rarely detect any signs of deliberate deception. What I often see is an enthusiastic incremental dramatization of original interesting stories into forms so distorted they become useless for indications of genuinely anomalous experiences.... [snip]
Ken Johnston, who worked for NASA's Lunar Receiving Laboratory during the Apollo missions, says he was fired for telling the truth. He joined George Knapp to share his contention that NASA knows there is evidence for both modern and ancient artifacts on the moon, as well as an active base there. He explained that in his position as Photo Control Dept. manager, he had access to highly detailed film and negatives taken during the Apollo missions. In viewing 16mm film shot by Apollo 14, they saw a shadow cast in the bottom of a crater, "and as we approached it, in the dark area there were like five domes lit from the inside, and a little plume that looked like steam streaking up above it," Johnston said.
There are also Apollo pictures that show perfectly round holes, which he's concluded are vents rather than craters because they don't have ridges. Photos taken during the Apollo 15 mission show beams stretching across the surface that expose some of the lunar substructure, Johnston noted, adding that during seismic experiments the moon would ring like a bell, possibly indicating it was hollow. One of the more striking anomalous photos was taken by a Russian lunar orbiter which showed a fractured dome on the moon's surface, he commented. Another image (see below) taken by the Lunik 13 Russian craft, looks like a drilling device and definitely appears artificial, he continued.
Johnston also talked about some of his early UFO contact experiences, where he was told he would become an ambassador between humans and ETs. He believes there is a group of ETs called the Watchers that keep tabs on humanity. Interestingly, he learned that Apollo astronauts were warned off by beings at one of the craters, and told not to return to the moon, and subsequently NASA scrapped the rest of its planned Apollo missions.
Originally posted by zorgon
Originally posted by smurfy
Hold on Zorgon,
If Gary McKinnon is a buffoon, why is the US fighting tooth and nail to get hold of him.
Ummm really? He did his crime in 2001, 10 years ago, and he is still on the loose living in the UK... Seriously if they wanted him so bad you think they couldn't have got him by now? Gitmo is full of people that got a free vacation
Originally posted by freelance_zenarchist
reply to post by JimOberg
Jim the Great Defender,
your name was mentioned a few times
I was really hoping you would call in.
Originally posted by Human_Alien
I base most of my opinions on: evidence, deliverance (vocally speaking), body language and overall vibe.
Originally posted by LiveToSpendIt
Originally posted by Human_Alien
I base most of my opinions on: evidence, deliverance (vocally speaking), body language and overall vibe.
There are three terms/phrases that don't belong with the others. Can you spot which is which?
Originally posted by Human_Alien
I base most of my opinions on: evidence, deliverance (vocally speaking), body language and overall vibe.
Originally posted by LiveToSpendIt
There are three terms/phrases that don't belong with the others. Can you spot which is which?
Originally posted by Human_Alien Not sure why you're following my threads but it's obvious that you don't agree with my style. That's fine.
Originally posted by Saucerwench
I subscribe to Coast podcast and I listened to Ken's interview with the wide eyed George Knapp this evening. Oh gawd. Firstly, this Ken guy has the most disconcerting speaking cadence. It's like he doesn't know when and where to pause and or emphasize, go up, go down, stop, go, just, mumblemumble. Terrible interviewee. Well George is salivating on about how verifiable this dude is, "unlike many whistleblowers that have been on here who's backgrounds you cant verify" ---What the H P Lovecraft F***?!--- right off the bat, I recall 2 "whistleblowers" and one was a verrrry long time ago, being Cliff Stone, and another was an even more verrrry long time ago before that, being Bob Lazar, who Georgie told anyone who'd listen, that he believed Lazar, thats why he put him on TV.
I corresponded with George Knapp back in the early 1990's. I told him about my own (very documented) ufo-military story when I was stationed, um, sorta near where Lazar um, was. It was a super serious and traumatic affair, and I'd been given an access debriefing warning form.
Many years later, one day, I thought to myself, "I wonder if Knapp would find me an interesting guest idea, after all, it's only like three decades went by, after all. Knapp remembered me and expressed it this way. "I know you." Um...Okay. That felt like I got spit at. Yet another ufo clique ufo elitest snot. I've encountered too many of those. I should have went on like Kenny did, saying things like, "Well, I know there's human aliens with bases and doing things here and there, and I know theres a secret space program, cuz I heard it whispered about by different ufo buffs here and there." Maybe better yet, "My Eben friend gave me a crystal gift, which I foresee 2012 as the year the giant pink glittering spacieship comes whooshing down the rainbow, like Santa to your rooftop, and all the different ET races will hold hands (and other appendages) singing kumbaya." Also, I need to have a YouTube channel and I'm wearing open blouses, to show off my silicone work. Yeah. Thats the ticket.
You'd think these Ufology Elitests were noc spooks with a hidden agenda.
(Hmmmm..........)
Originally posted by Saucerwench
reply to post by thetiler
LMH has been fooled by hoaxers, but I don't have hard facts in front of me just now, about those stories. This one abductee Jim Sparks, who LMH was touting very much, I don't believe, I think he's a hoaxer.
Originally posted by LiveToSpendIt
Originally posted by Saucerwench
reply to post by thetiler
LMH has been fooled by hoaxers, but I don't have hard facts in front of me just now, about those stories. This one abductee Jim Sparks, who LMH was touting very much, I don't believe, I think he's a hoaxer.
If you hang around long enough, making decisions about people who spill tales, then you are going, by definition, to get fooled. Attempting to "read" people's truthfulness, that you do not know, is impossible, hell, it's nigh impossible to get a bead on those people you know very well.
That is not to say Howe and her ilk don't perform services to the UFO (and similar communities), they do. The problem is that people's ability to discern fact from hearsay is at an all-time low. This is not her fault, at least she's not Kerry "FUBAR" Cassidy.
The fault lies with people, God only knows where the hell their brains are most of the time.
Originally posted by thetiler
For Jim Oberg
-----------------------
I am just trying to learn about this whole thing,
I can understand if Ken wanted to emphasis his position of importance during some of the apollo missions. That he could of had access to some of the pictures. He did stress that he had a certain charge of photographs.
Here is a document that I found on the web.
[Bara] states something of importance here:
*************
"Furthermore, it wouldn’t matter if Ken had been merely the janitor at the LRL during the Apollo Program, much less “in charge” of anything. All that matters is that he was, in fact, in a position to have access to the official Apollo photographs he has now provided to the world (as Dr. Warner’s memo, among many other documents, clearly establishes); that he was subsequently ordered to destroy these photographs (a story we recount in “Dark Mission”), and that he chose instead to preserve some of the images — to the ultimate betterment of mankind."
************
I am just trying to understand this whole thing Jim.
Do you think Jim, that Ken could of had access to those particular moon photos he states has in his possession under lock and key a (thousand photos) at yesterdays C2C show ? Are they legit photos? The robot head ?
But I think it is important to understand what you are saying Jim. That Ken was not the head of that dept. not sure if he even mentioned that. But he seemed to think that he had legit access to special apollo moon photos!
Again Jim, could Ken of had access to moon photos that had artifacts in photos he said he had?
Just trying to understand the truth what ever it is.