Does a Sharia-like justice system appeal to you?

no, it does not appeal to me - but it is like a cancer eating at the very core of not only our society but globally -

4. What are some examples of Shariah law? The Reliance of the Traveller, Classic Manual of Islamic Sacred Law is the authoritative Sunni Shariah rulebook (available at www.Barnesandnoble.com).

Offensive, military Jihad is a religious obligation.
Inferior status for all non-Muslims (“dhimma”).
Capital punishment for slandering Islam.
Capital punishment for apostasy (leaving Islam).
Women may not leave the house without husbands’ permission; beating disobedient women, polygamy, forced child marriage, and stoning of adulterers are permitted.
Slavery is legal.
Lying (taqiyya) to infidels is permitted.
Capital punishment for homosexuals and lesbians.

www.stopshariahnow.org...

the following map is of shariah violence around the globe:



we do have companies operating under this islamic law in the u.s. - church's chicken is one - carabou coffee is another - check out arcapita as well - en.wikipedia.org...

ya know, come to think of it - i think the bush administration has opened the door to thte creaping sharia laws in the u.s. -

No, a "Sharia like" justice system doesn't appeal to me, I like our current justice system besides the silly drug schedule classification of a certain plant. (I've seen Waaay too many people in jail for possesion, each one costing the county taxpayers $87 a day to house) but being human there ARE certain crimes that are so heinous that I would have no other choice than to take justice into my own hands , the Petit family killings come to mind.

I'm a prior service Marine , prior Corrections Officer and I'm currently a Firefighter... so I'm pretty Jaded to say the least and not emotionally affected by much that goes on in the news. (I compartmentalize certain things , It helps me keep my work, at work where it belongs) But when that Petit story broke I felt personal grief. I can't imagine what that poor man must have felt during that home invasion. It hit home because of the random senseless nature of the crime. These people did nothing wrong , a couple that works hard to raise their kids the right way , they do everything that society says you're supposed to , and two animals come and take it all away in an instant.

Those oxygen theives don't deserve another heatbeat in this existance , now taxpayers have to foot the bill to support them? I say NO! There is no rehabilitation for people like that , there are certain things that you simply don't come back from.

I understand that there are certain circumstances that lead some people into certain lifestyles , I worked in a jail... I've heard all the sob stories you can imagine , most of them BS some of them genuine , but there is no way you can rationalize what Komisarjevsky and Hayes did that day. I've never wished death upon anyone in my life , but I hope they die a slow agonizing death , preferrably in a fire... that way they can feel the sense of hopelessness and terror that their victims did before they died.

If I was in Dr Petits shoes (He's a stronger man than I) I can tell you now I wouldn't be searching for justice , I'd be plotting vengeance.

And once again for the slow group..
Sharia law ONLY applies to muslims.
Non-muslims are NOT SUBJECT to sharia law.

Originally posted by Expat888
And once again for the slow group..
Sharia law ONLY applies to muslims.
Non-muslims are NOT SUBJECT to sharia law.

ok, i'll bite to this one - so why would, let's say, church's chicken, headquartered in atlanta, georgia operate under sharia law - or i should have said: how would that affect a u.s. citizens working for church's chicken? i need to did a little deeper -

if what you say is absolute truth what was the benefit of a u.s. business operating under sharia law - thanks for the direction - go fishing -

It is obvious by reading most of the posts on this topic that the majority of you have never been in the Middle East or seen the way things work there. A vast majority of these people are living in the stone age and although there are progresive countries there....there is always an undertone of Islamic Law as this is deeply ingrained into the majority of people.

It is hard to lead a house to water that does not want to drink. You cannot compare the West or the United States to these regions or their form of laws and justice. They will have to evolve out of the possition they have placed themselves in.

As far as a threat from terrorists as this topic has an undertone to their form of justice and it's religious fundementalist spred....there is both good news and bad news. The youth who are now becoming very computer savy and using the internet and social communication to fuel their dreams of freedom....will eventually win.

The bad news is Iran has a leadership that will do just about anything to stay in power. If they develop a bomb...Israel will press the U.S. for action or possibly attack. If a bomb is used in the middle east on Israel or any U.S. ally....the U.S. will use Neutron Bombs with ultra low yeild single burst irradiation to elliminate target states and preserve oil reserves. This is a very bad scenario but possible. Split Infinity

reply to post by DAZ21


Lols.

No offence but have you ever heard of "Gang Stalking," this is the modern day term used to replace the term "Witch hunt." The Witch hunts never ended.

Sorry, if this link does not work correctly.[url=http://gangstalkingworld.com/]

I think people read "Sharia" and lost their damn minds. I think the point that the OP was trying to get across was this.

Originally posted by lampsalot

If put to the vote, would you actually want a system where things like public stoning, hanging, the stocks, whipping, flaying, beheading, etc was re-instated? Or a system where when it came to certain things, like pedophilia, innocent until proven guilty doesn't necessarily apply? IE, essentially a secular version of Sharia justice?

Basically do we want a "street justice" type of system , more of an eye for an eye type deal , or our current system. The OP didn't seem like He/She was trying to convert people to Islam. The question I pose is this... Would you feel comfortable dealing out your own brand of justice if you knew that the offender was 100% guilty and there would be zero blowback to effect you.

I would let the court system take care of Involuntary Manslaughter, simple assaults, civil matters and crimes regarding money and property (Thefts, wrongfull appropriation, larceny and white collar crimes)

Any sort of Forcible Rape , or Murder would be dealt with swift capital punishment.

Of course these are hypotheticals...

I personally don't believe capital punishment works... why you ask? It has to do with the psyche of a criminal and the fact that none of them ever think they are going to get caught , therefore the consequences of their actions don't matter...because they don't believe they'll have to face them.

reply to post by lampsalot


Sharia Law in principal would not be so bad if not for it's extreme nature. There is no proper judgement or judicial system within Sharia Law so I am and will always be appalled by it's use in the extreme barbaric manner in which is evident all over the world.

Sharia Law is just one ideology of so many that have been taken to extremes. I am no expert though and I am sure there are more informed members on here about the subject. I can only assess based on my own experiences as an observer.

Western Civilization has made the best effort of proper judicial behavior but even it has a long way to go. I am unsure if Sharia Law will ever make that milestone. It's scary as hell to imagine living in that kind of social conformity for me as I am a westerner and I imagine that's the ultimate goal with regard to Sharia Law. To scare the hell out of people.

reply to post by SplitInfinity
you are probably right that many who have posted never traveled to the middle east - i lived in iran - i left in '74 - one thing i want to mention is there was very little crime in iran - the penalty for dope is death - i was given simple instructions: do not speak of the shaw period - i've lived in the villages as well -

but you can see where i live now, eh?

i thought this was very pertinent to this thread: in other words, this is the way it gets in through the back door -

7. What are some examples of creeping Shariah? “Creeping Shariah” refers to the incremental adoption of Shariah, in which a single example seems harmless, but taken together, represents a pattern of intention. No-Go Zones. 751 no-go zones in France where police have turned over control to “religious enforcement” following threats of violence. Girls without Islamic clothing have reportedly been raped. Non-Muslim citizens are urged to stay out. Zones exist in Denmark, the Netherlands, and the UK. Shariah Courts. 2008: Official recognition of five courts in the UK and one in Texas, USA, with lobbying to create greater legitimization and authority in Minnesota, New Jersey, and California. The intent is to set up parallel courts, in lieu of secular courts and their judgments, in family and business law. Assault on Freedom of Speech. Feb. 2009: Dutch Parliamentarian Geert Wilders prosecuted for hate speech for his 15-minute film, Fitna.

www.stopshariahnow.org...

i still want to know how church's chicken, h/q'd atlanta, ga, which operates under sharia law, how would this affect it u.s. citizens, say any other employee that is not muslim -

I didn't mean literal Sharia, I said 'Sharia-like'.

Anyway, maybe Americans would prefer the Singaporean model? Where spitting on sidewalks gets you caned and stuff. I'm sure a ton of Americans would love to bring back caning. People are always saying our kids are misbehaved and bratty because we don't abuse them anymore.

A modern style lenient justice system is for people who have 'erred' gone astray, been tempted etc - but there comes a point when an individual simply becomes a 'criminal' an enemy of the people, a menace to society, you might as well dispose of them with as much ceremony as you would a rabid dog.

The same laws should not apply to both categories and discerning which is which is far too difficult for the state.

Perhaps, a Sharia-like justice system (here in America) seems to appeal to me because there appears to be no punishment for immoral or unethical violations on all levels. True, hard-core criminals seem to get away with murder and corrupt lawmakers, politicians/government officials, law enforcement/military and other "network" pals to include universities and religious affliations --- all seem to protect each other by taking advantage of the current systems that seem to have been punishing those "innocent" victims of crimes they didn't/shouldn't have committed. (Whatever.)

Originally posted by EyesWideShut

Any sort of Forcible Rape , or Murder would be dealt with swift capital punishment.

isn't death a little bit harsh for rape? i mean, rape is awful, but it's not like rape victims are irreparable damaged goods and that being raped is impossible to recover from. if i were kidnapped and raped id be happy i wasn't murdered.

id say a decade in prison is proportional to the damage rape causes, ie it fits the crime if that's what your idea of good punishment is. i mean prison is hell, even a month in there would be horrible, i think 10 years is a huge punishment and one suitable for something as serious as rape. it might be even a bit too harsh. i can't speak for everyone but unless i got AIDS i would endure a rape rather than spend 10 years of my life in jail.

Originally posted by AlreadyGone
No, there has to be a common law that applies to all irregardless of religion.

There is only one Law, the divine Law to love one another.

Any other law derives from man.

Who do you serve, man or God?

A man cannot serve two masters. He will love the one and hate the other.

With Love,

Your Brother

Originally posted by yourmaker

Originally posted by charles1952
reply to post by yourmaker

 

Human laws suffice based on sound science.

This subject fascinates me. I'm asking seriously, because I want to know, what science will give us laws? . . . Which?

How would a science do this? By experimentation? Formulas? Theorems?

I know this might sound critical, but I'm only trying to learn here.

psychology or social sciences. one could write the laws around the behaviour expectations of the human mind.

Evidently you are unaware of such quotes as the following by some of the historical famous traitorous globalists:

From such links as:

riffenberg.wordpress.com...

www.paulmcguire.org...

Bertrand Russell

“I think the subject which will be of most importance politically is Mass Psychology…It’s importance has been enormously increased by the growth of modern methods of propaganda…Although this science will be diligently studied, it will be rigidly confined to the governing class. The populace will not be allowed to know how its convictions were generated.” Diet, injections, and injunctions will combine, from a very early age, to produce the sort of character and the sort of beliefs that the authorities consider desirable, and any serious criticism of the powers that be will become psychologically impossible. Even if all are miserable, all will believe themselves happy, because the government will tell them that they are so.”

“It is to be expected that advances in physiology and psychology will give governments much more !!!CONTROL!!! over individual mentality than they now have even in totalitarian countries.”

–“ a revolt of the plebs will become as unthinkable as an organized insurrection of sheep against the practice of eating mutton”

--The Scientific Outlook, 1951 by author Bertrand Arthur-William Russell, philosopher, educator and mathematician

Herman Van Rompuy, The first president of Europe

"Herman Van Rompuy



in front of the stars of the European Union in a suit"

Herman Van Rompuy ,The first president of Europe:

2009 is also the first year of global governance, with the establishment of the G20 in the middle of the financial crisis. The climate conference in Copenhagen is another step towards the global management of our planet.”
--Herman Van Rompuy
The first president of Europe

-----------------------------------

Obama's Science Czar and author of Ecoscience, John Holdren

Obama’s Czar John Holdren, Planetary Regime:
“Perhaps those agencies, combined with UNEP and the United Nations population agencies, might eventually be developed into a Planetary Regime—sort of an international super agency for population, resources, and environment. Such a comprehensive Planetary Regime could control the development, administration, conservation, and distribution of all natural resources, renewable or nonrenewable, at least insofar as international implications exist. Thus the Regime could have the power to control pollution not only in the atmosphere and oceans, but also in such freshwater bodies as rivers and lakes that cross international boundaries or that discharge into the oceans. The Regime might also be a logical central agency for regulating all international trade, perhaps including assistance from DCs to LDCs, and including all food on the international market.”
.
“The Planetary Regime might be given responsibility for determining the optimum population for the world and for each region and for arbitrating various countries’ shares within their regional limits. Control of population size might remain the responsibility of each government, but the Regime would have some power to enforce the agreed limits.”
--“Ecoscience”, pages 942 and 943

Aaron Russo and Nick Rockefeller
The following quote in red was told to Aaron Russo, the Hollywood producer of “The Rose”, “Trading Places”, “Wise Guys” and “America, Freedom to Fascism”.
He was the founder of “Restore the Republic”
(www.restoretherepublic.com...)
He attempted to start the Constitution Party in 1994. Aaron died in 2007 of bladder cancer.
The following quote by Nick Rockefeller (David Rockefeller’s brother) is paraphrased by Russo.

“The end goal is to get everybody chipped, to control the whole society, to have the bankers and the elite people control the world”

Nick (Rockefeller)offered Russo membership in the CFR. Russo turned him down.

.
.

reply to post by BO XIAN

Dear BO XIAN,

Thanks very much for supplying those quotes and the international perspective. I really agree with your identification of those international problems caused by a "rehabilitation" world.

Whenever an individual would show tendencies that the leaders didn't approve of, that individual would be sent to "rehabilitation" for however long it took to get that person thinking along approved lines. I believe those rehabilitation centers were most recently called "re-education camps."

Sociology and psychology are very soft sciences indeed, 50 years ago homosexual attraction was a mental disorder. Then in the face of pressure the APA took a vote and, presto, it's not a disorder anymore. There is currently a working group within the American Psychological Association putting forth the idea that sex with minors should not be a crime, it's a mental problem. Maybe 50 years from now, sex with children won't be a disorder either. What kind of science is that?

If I screw up, give me my 40 lashes and let me go. Don't "rehabilitate" me until I think like society wants me to think. There are people on ATS that think religion is a form of insanity, shall we rehabilitate all the believers?

With respect,
Charles1952

Originally posted by charles1952
If I screw up, give me my 40 lashes and let me go. Don't "rehabilitate" me until I think like society wants me to think. There are people on ATS that think religion is a form of insanity, shall we rehabilitate all the believers?

How about I forgive you my friend. I forgive you and help you find what caused you to stumble, then helped you remove that obstacle. What kind of society could we build on that premise?

With Love,

Your Brother

In a single word. NO!!!!

reply to post by IAMIAM

Dear IAMIAM,

Thank you very much for taking the time to take note of my post. You are a unique (Please, no "we're all unique.") individual with gentleness and kindness as your signature.

I fear however that there may be a misunderstanding between us. Please allow me to paint a picture of my confusion with some questions.

How about I forgive you my friend

But, what if my offense wasn't against you? Wouldn't I need the victim's forgiveness? And if the victim was dead or in a coma? And if the victim was society, wouldn't I need society's forgiveness? Can you offer that?

help you find what caused you to stumble

And if I don't believe I stumbled? If I thought my act was justified? Would you change my mind to see it as a stumble? Would that be the plan for OWSers who broke laws?

then helped you remove that obstacle

If that obstacle is poverty? Limited mental ability? Twenty years of abuse? The sight of friends dying in war? Or just simple, pure evil? Will you erase all those?

Please know that I have nothing but respect for you. My words are not for attack, but to express my emotions and thoughts. Take them only as a disturbed pool.

With respect,
Charles1952

Originally posted by charles1952
Dear IAMIAM,

Thank you very much for taking the time to take note of my post. You are a unique (Please, no "we're all unique.") individual with gentleness and kindness as your signature.

I fear however that there may be a misunderstanding between us. Please allow me to paint a picture of my confusion with some questions.

But, what if my offense wasn't against you? Wouldn't I need the victim's forgiveness? And if the victim was dead or in a coma? And if the victim was society, wouldn't I need society's forgiveness? Can you offer that?

Where are your accusers?

As far as society goes, well I am one, and you are one. Together that makes two. We can build a society that forgives one another off of this, if you are sincere about it.

And if I don't believe I stumbled? If I thought my act was justified? Would you change my mind to see it as a stumble? Would that be the plan for OWSers who broke laws?

My friend, every blind man can tell when he falls in a ditch. You do not need me to tell you you have fallen. I will listen for your pleas of relief. That is what Brother's do. Warn of approaching danger, and help one another up when we fall down.

If that obstacle is poverty? Limited mental ability? Twenty years of abuse? The sight of friends dying in war? Or just simple, pure evil? Will you erase all those?

What obstacle?

Please know that I have nothing but respect for you. My words are not for attack, but to express my emotions and thoughts. Take them only as a disturbed pool.

With respect,
Charles1952

I can only speak for what I will do my friend.

But what I would do is the light I bring into the world.

If you see it, then light your torch from it and shine it.

If you do not see it, then shine the light you have been given in this world.

I may be unique, but I am no greater than any man.

With Love,

Your Brother

edit on 25-12-2011 by IAMIAM because: (no reason given)