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The Santa Myth: Should we perpetuate the lie to children?

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posted on Dec, 22 2011 @ 05:58 PM
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I really have a hard time with the Santa "Con" I figured out that Santa wasn't real when I was 4, and thats only because i found my dad in the living room where the tree was passed out in the chair from drinking the night before. My childhood from then on went a bit bumpy as my parents insisted that Santa was real, and so i had to play along to make them happy and they played to make me happy but it was all a big joke. What happens when a child finds out Santa isn't real? kicking and screaming and a really rebellious attitude. My Friend's Sister just had a little boy and I'm around a lot to see whats happening, I asked her why she would continue the Santa Story, and She, my Friend and there Mom got on my case about it calling me a Scrooge and a Grinch... Ok what ever but every year i get that from them just as they get the Santa dislike from me. If you want to tell your kids that, Fine, if you don't then I would support you most likly, just keep me out of the Christmas Shopping S*** and chill on the songs and Hallmark movies ( "Christmas is Ruined!!!", (last 15 Min. of the Movie "Christmas is Saved!!!" ) bah Humbug.

topdocumentaryfilms.com...
edit on 22-12-2011 by RobGhost because: (no reason given)




posted on Dec, 22 2011 @ 06:00 PM
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You know I always like to point out that Santa is the same word as Satan.

Its all a lie. Giving gifts is fine.. lying and saying they are from santa is pointless.



posted on Dec, 22 2011 @ 06:02 PM
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If you lie to your kids for this, your kids will not have complete trust in you in later years. I think it is wrong to lie to your kid about it.



posted on Dec, 22 2011 @ 06:03 PM
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reply to post by Whipfather
 


This is exactly how I feel. My father and I were discussing whether or not I was going to start telling my 2 year old about Santa and such. When I told him that I felt perpetuating a lie about what has turned into such a materialistic holiday was wrong, he couldn't understand.

I'm 21 years old and still remember very vividly how I came to know Santa wasn't real.

When I started to ask my parents if he was real or not, at 8 years old , their only answer was "What do you think?" and they would repeat that whenever I would ask. That same christmas I decided I wanted to find out for myself, so I stayed up late, "pretending" to sleep, and saw my parents putting the gifts under the tree. As juvenile as it may sound, I felt betrayed that my parents were lying to me about something when I had been asking them directly for the truth, I felt they had been lying to me my whole life and who knew what else was a lie? I sure didn't. lol

I don't want my son to feel that way, I want my son to appreciate the holiday for what it is. A time to spend with your family you don't always get to see. A time to appreciate the little things that truly matter in life, not hoping that he gets the latest most expensive gadget and him / I feeling like complete crap if I can't afford it. This holiday puts unrealistic hopes into the minds of children, that they can get anything because it's not bought, it's made by some mythological, magical, fat guy working in a sweatshop that can "make" anything for "free."

Christmas can be magical and good, without Santa.



posted on Dec, 22 2011 @ 06:07 PM
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reply to post by calnorak
 


So what's the difference making them beleive in a risen dead guy supposedly the son of God, how is that ok and the holy spirit but the spirit of christmas is a no-no?

Unless you're atheist, then I can see it...because that would be fine, as you wouldn't beleive in anything.



posted on Dec, 22 2011 @ 06:07 PM
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my parents told me from the very beginning that santa wasn't real, and i'm happy they did. santa should be like a bedtime story, he's fun and amusing, but literal belief can be harmful.

i've seen a lot of kids end up crying when they find out santa is a lie. they share the same fate as those who falsely believe in the cake. (it's a lie too)



posted on Dec, 22 2011 @ 06:09 PM
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Originally posted by calnorak
If you lie to your kids for this, your kids will not have complete trust in you in later years. I think it is wrong to lie to your kid about it.



What absolute tosh. It's done generations of kids no harm at all. Nor did it turn us into rampant consumers. Parents these days do that very nicely all by themselves.
What it did was spin a little magic around Christmas. And at the age of 61, some of it is still there for me.
What a dull, grey, politically correct world some of the posters here would have us live in.
There are more important things in this world to worry about.



posted on Dec, 22 2011 @ 06:15 PM
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Oh, please...

Of course Santa Claus exists...

This editorial in the Sun said it best some hundred plus years ago.

Yes, Virginia...

So long as there is innocence in this world, and people willing to give of themselves, there will always be a Santa, or at least the spirit of such.

In this skeptical, and paranoid age, children lose that childlike innocence all too soon, why in such a rush to remove it from them?

This is what Santa should represent to us all. A rebirth, however short, of our childhood wonder that we lose all too soon...

'twas the night before Christmas

May you all have a joyous Holiday season.



posted on Dec, 22 2011 @ 06:18 PM
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reply to post by vjr1113
 


But Santaless cultures have other things that fall into the realm of myth and fantasy. Abstract thought is a very human trait and the development of imagination is important. There is a difference between traditional myth and a lie and children know as they get older that though the legend isn't true, they weren't lied to either.

When was the last time any of us adults layed in bed with hopes and dreams and the idea of a supernatural bing coming to our homes to give us something? The world takes it away soon enough. I say let them be children.
edit on 22-12-2011 by steveknows because: (no reason given)



posted on Dec, 22 2011 @ 06:19 PM
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I think there is nothing wrong in leading your kids to believe in santa to begin with, but as they age it becomes a bit of a problem.

Having said that, I am managing to get around the problem, by when my son doubts his existence, I simply say whether you believe in him or not, don't let onto me, because allowise santa doesn't come to you anymore.

It's kind of an admission, without spoiling the magic, more a game of lets pretend, for mummy's sake lol.

Oh and this year, we have totally embraced the digital age, by e-mailing santa, getting a santa video message, and earlier I had to explain to my 4 year old why we don't have to worry about having no chimney......Father Christmas can teleport in, just like on Star Trek !



posted on Dec, 22 2011 @ 06:19 PM
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reply to post by FlySolo
 


There is nothing wrong with believing in father christmas when you are a child, and there is nothing wrong.with parents saying he is real. It done me no harm whatsoever. If you are going to take that stance, then if you have children, tell them that every weird and wonderful non- human children tv characters are just people in suits.
Why dont you get it over and done with and also tell them about the horrors of this planet.



posted on Dec, 22 2011 @ 06:25 PM
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I, personally, don't remember ever believing in Santa as a child. The first Christmas I spent with my parents that I remember (they're not my biological parents), they tried, but my mom has VERY distinctive handwriting, and I caught on. I pretended to believe 'cause they got a kick out of it. I had already lived a lifetime it seems by the time I lived with them... I wish I had a chance to believe.

My own children, at 9 & 11, still believe. I asked them about it this year. Because I believe in letting children have magic in their lives until they decide it's "not real." Reality hits them on a daily basis already. They told me they still believe in Santa. I asked why, and they both said that they know we have no money (true), and yet they still get what they asked for every year. They can't fathom it. Which means, I've succeeded, in my opinion, at keeping the magic going. I don't break the bank. I get used/secondhand, and I am one stellar bargain hunter. I refuse to go into debt for a holiday. And I bring back certain traditions year after year, which adds to the magic.

My thing is - I believe in the Spirit of Christmas. There have been many years when I didn't know HOW I was going to prepare a Christmas dinner, much less have any gifts, and plenty of Charlie Brown sad little trees - yet something ALWAYS happens that allows it.

If my kids remember being poor, and I think they will, but they remember the magic of Christmas happening anyway? I think that's a wonderful thing. I believe that there is magic, and goodness, and miracles to be found in this life. The Christmas season, and Santa, I think give personification to the concept, and make great teaching opportunities to kids if done "right." I feel that those who don't want to "lie" to their children, or only want to be "realistic" totally are missing the point.

So what is the point? We're discussing Christmas, after all, so I would definitely say Christ's birthday celebration. I have an advent calendar the kids get a kick out of keeping up with. I tell them the Christmas story each year, and after Christmas dinner, we have birthday cake - and even sing Happy Birthday to Jesus. I told them that since we can't give gifts to Him on His birthday we give them to each other. In addition, things we cannot explain can be real. They are a real gift to cherish and remember. And when they're older and really don't believe in Santa anymore, we'll tell them about those times that random things occurred so that we could give them Christmas.

My husband and I? Still believe in Santa. I think he just takes a different form for the adults. I like to call them miracles.



posted on Dec, 22 2011 @ 06:29 PM
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Originally posted by QUANTUMGR4V17Y
reply to post by Whipfather
 


This is exactly how I feel. My father and I were discussing whether or not I was going to start telling my 2 year old about Santa and such. When I told him that I felt perpetuating a lie about what has turned into such a materialistic holiday was wrong, he couldn't understand.

I'm 21 years old and still remember very vividly how I came to know Santa wasn't real.

When I started to ask my parents if he was real or not, at 8 years old , their only answer was "What do you think?" and they would repeat that whenever I would ask. That same christmas I decided I wanted to find out for myself, so I stayed up late, "pretending" to sleep, and saw my parents putting the gifts under the tree. As juvenile as it may sound, I felt betrayed that my parents were lying to me about something when I had been asking them directly for the truth, I felt they had been lying to me my whole life and who knew what else was a lie? I sure didn't. lol

I don't want my son to feel that way, I want my son to appreciate the holiday for what it is. A time to spend with your family you don't always get to see. A time to appreciate the little things that truly matter in life, not hoping that he gets the latest most expensive gadget and him / I feeling like complete crap if I can't afford it. This holiday puts unrealistic hopes into the minds of children, that they can get anything because it's not bought, it's made by some mythological, magical, fat guy working in a sweatshop that can "make" anything for "free."

Christmas can be magical and good, without Santa.



Glad to see that I'm not the only one who sees it this way.

I did notice though, it appears as if more of my American friends believe that you should encourage the absolute, non-questioning belief in Santa, than my German friends. I wouldn't be surprised if it was a very culturally-based thing.

During Christmas time in the US I noticed that everything from billboards or advertisements to songs on the radio, seems to be about Santa Claus and buying presents in bright, colorful neon lights. Whereas in Germany, instead of seeing posters with Santa, you'd see candles, Christmas trees, snowy forests, more of the homey and warm imagery than the very plastic and bright imagery than in the US. That might just be my cultural bias, though.



posted on Dec, 22 2011 @ 06:42 PM
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It depends on your perception of who Santa is. I did for a while as it is hard to burst beautiful little bubbles, and my youngest has quite the memory of very tall Santa from the Church supper, singled him out when he was 3 and made a big deal over him, even gave him an extra gift and carried him in his arms. So he was hard to let down, since he really loved Santa and said Santa was his friend.

But alas, all their evil Saturn coding in addition the Siberian Reindeer thingy found coded in most religious artwork. Anyway, I say, let them down gently.



posted on Dec, 22 2011 @ 06:48 PM
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reply to post by Whipfather
 


I don't know why no one starred your post. I did. It's exactly what I'm talking about.

Gimmie_some_Truth:


What harm does it do? None. Who can sit here and honestly say they were harmed by believing in Santa?

Kids have great imagination. It is fun and helps to teach the spirit and goodness of giving.



There's no harm in kids having imagination. Heck, a stick ranked no# 1 for toys at the end of the local news and that's no bull. But why do we have to say he's real? It's just the same as Peter Pan or any other Fairy tale. Children still learn about giving regardless. It's woven into the fabric of our society anyway.

I also agree this is a great point considering the site I'm on. Healthy Skepticism. But when they begin to utilize that part of the brain, it is quashed with magical explanations. I question if the magical aspect is really meant for the kids, or for the adults? Then why don't we create a magical character for every day of the year if it's really not that bad?



posted on Dec, 22 2011 @ 06:49 PM
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When I was growing up, Santa brought my sister and I one present each, The rest were from my parents. The gifts with Santa's name were the biggest and only things we wanted. My very last gift from Santa was a puppy since this was the last year that I truly believed in him.

Prior to that Christmas, my parents told me if I wanted a puppy, I had to write a letter to Santa and ask him because they weren't going to get me one. Well, I wrote that letter and poured my heart out saying how much I would love and care for it. I didn't sleep at all Christmas Eve and the next morning, I found he'd brought my puppy.

Years later when we were moving, my mom showed me the letter I'd written to Santa. It was funny to be reading what I'd written so many years before.

So, in conclusion, the myth that is Santa is not only special for kids, but it's the same for parents, too.

I still get a gift from Santa every year, but it's just because it's tradition.

The main problem is when parents give kids everything they want and instill in their kids that that's what Christmas is about. There's a right way and a wrong way to do everything.

On the other hand, my great aunt still believes in Santa. About ten years ago, she was having some extreme financial problems. On Christmas morning, she found a package on her back porch. Upon opening it, she found $5000 and a note inside said "Merry Christmas! - Santa". She still has no idea who left her the money and nobody's ever come forward.

Merry Christmas, everyone!



posted on Dec, 22 2011 @ 06:55 PM
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Originally posted by ldyserenity
reply to post by calnorak
 


So what's the difference making them beleive in a risen dead guy supposedly the son of God, how is that ok and the holy spirit but the spirit of is a no-no?

Unless you're atheist, then I can see it...because that would be fine, as you wouldn't beleive in anything.


Because we know Santa is not real This is a fact. All the religious stuff is a whole different ball game
edit on 22-12-2011 by FlySolo because: (no reason given)



posted on Dec, 22 2011 @ 07:02 PM
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Originally posted by Jay-morris
reply to post by FlySolo
 

why dont you get it over and done with and also tell them about the horrors of this planet.


That's a bit excessive don't you think? I just don't see the point in convincing children that he's real. What point does it server really? Children have imagination anyway. And their innocence. So what's lost?



posted on Dec, 22 2011 @ 07:05 PM
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I got over the Santa myth a lot quicker then I caught onto the Jesus myth. They aren't equally as dangerous.



posted on Dec, 22 2011 @ 07:20 PM
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Originally posted by FlySolo

Originally posted by Jay-morris
reply to post by FlySolo
 

why dont you get it over and done with and also tell them about the horrors of this planet.


That's a bit excessive don't you think? I just don't see the point in convincing children that he's real. What point does it server really? Children have imagination anyway. And their innocence. So what's lost?


Not, it is not excessive. If you are going to tell the truth about father christmas, why stop there? Children find out when they are older, just like they find out their fav tv character is a person in a suit.

In fact, why dont you tell them that jesus was not born on christmas day. You see what getting at?





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