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Two Four Star Generals write New York Times demanding Obama Veto the NDAA

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posted on Dec, 23 2011 @ 08:12 AM
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reply to post by Reaper2137
 


If the TPTB believe the entire US military will be at their beckoned called if AND when they declare Martial Law and the detainment of American citizens under this treasonous act the scum will come to realize there are good men and women of the Armed Forces that will stand with the People and not with them and defend our Constiution and our HOMELAND!!




posted on Dec, 23 2011 @ 08:37 AM
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reply to post by Reaper2137
 


I can see it now. It gets passed and first act of Domestic aggression is launched by the U.S. Army and the U.S. Marines counter and defend the citizens. What a dream it would be.



posted on Dec, 23 2011 @ 08:56 AM
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Originally posted by timetothink
reply to post by vjr1113
 

The full story is, it was passed with rider saying US citizens are exempt from detention...but the word is the Obama administration will only pass it if US citizens are included.

The Obama administration wants US citizens to detained without cause or legal representation.


I wonder if this ties in with the other Bill to restrict Internet access to Americans? What do they call it when you're... gagged! That's the word. No one would know what's going on, within America... except the offical party line, which would make it look as though things are going on as normal.



posted on Dec, 23 2011 @ 08:57 AM
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reply to post by Maigret
 


It would have to be something on a broader base of action. Let's face it, the USA is filled with foreign intelligence operatives. There is no way to hide it really.



posted on Dec, 23 2011 @ 09:07 AM
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Would this Bill be their official Declaration of War against the People of the United States of America then? That's sure what it sounds like to me.! It seems as though the military would possibly side with the American people and.....well I guess we already know what side the Police of this country are on.



posted on Dec, 23 2011 @ 09:07 AM
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reply to post by vjr1113
 


Maybe the POS(TUS) will use this power to detain the GOP front runners so he does not have to look like an arse during a debate in one of the 57 US states... : )



posted on Dec, 23 2011 @ 09:09 AM
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I have relatives in both law enforcement and in the military, high ranking at that. You have to realize that these people are somewhat like you and I, they have morals, intelligence the same as the rest of us, and some cases, more than most. They have families, and friends and neighbors just the same as every one of us in the civilian world. One thing about a president it, that they are transient, the most they can do are 8 years, so policy comes and goes, but the powers that be do not, (the military & law enforcement) their in it for the long haul, more often than not. While the politicians try to weasel around behind closed doors, and corperations try to buy them, the military has every resource at their disposal to keep an eye on them. That is a good thing to because they can then identify threats, foreign or domestic, and it's the domestic ones that are most keenly in the cross-hairs, because their policy directly affects the military. The military will not go down the road of tyrany, it's counterproductive, and ultimatly would pose a threat to the military structure. Were it to come down to obeying an illegal order by the POTUS, I think it more than likely, first it would stall, then be screutanized, and then the choice made as whether or not to comply. The military are not pawns to be played, they are the true power behind the scenes.
Well this can be disputed, but the fact is, they are not going to go killing citizens and taking all the populations liberties if it is contrary to the constitution. Worst case, half would, and half wouldn't.



posted on Dec, 23 2011 @ 09:23 AM
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Originally posted by Reaper2137


Wow.. About damn time, that the military is standing up to Obama. Even retired Generals carry a lot of weight still. Its good to see these fine men standing up for the American people. They need to be working there contacts at the Pentagon to get this B.S pulled as quickly as possible.

This needs to be stopped, This slowly eroding of our freedoms make me sick as a former Military Police officer. I would never as an MP enforce any laws that pertain to indefinite arrest. Its Crap and every one knows it.

How much longer are Americans going to stick their head in the sand? At what cost will it take for them remember they can revolt? Will it take America becoming the 4th Reich?

I hope that these two fine men, Even tho they are Marines I won't hold that against them. Lead the revolt that needs to happen. I see the writing on the wall, I'm pretty sure that most of ATS does too, A civil war is coming. Might not be today but I think it will happen in the next ten years.

theintelh ub.com
(visit the link for the full news article)
"Even though they are Marines" you bring up a great article and then show disdain for the very people you are praising because they are Marines.

What a magnificent act of hypocrisy.



posted on Dec, 23 2011 @ 09:25 AM
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Originally posted by FreedomKnight
reply to post by Reaper2137
 


If the TPTB believe the entire US military will be at their beckoned called if AND when they declare Martial Law and the detainment of American citizens under this treasonous act the scum will come to realize there are good men and women of the Armed Forces that will stand with the People and not with them and defend our Constiution and our HOMELAND!!

Does the "TPTB" include the President? If so that is exactly what they will believe and they will be right. Because the President is the Commander-in-Chief of the military and they are at his command. It is not for each and every individual soldier to determine whether an executive order is or not constitutional. The President and the members of the Congress have taken the same oath that the members of the military have taken. Why should the military people believe their knowledge/understanding of the constitution is any better than those in the Congress and the President?

If the law is unconstituional, it is for the US Federal Supreme Court to declare so.

If the military top brass seriously believe the constitution has been subverted, they won't be risking court martial by simply refusing to obey orders, they would engage in a coup to throw out the entire political power structure and may be restore democracy after a period of martial law.

So get ready for martial law one way or another



posted on Dec, 23 2011 @ 09:37 AM
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There are moral people with a conscience within the military - Bradly Manning for a start.

However, they are not the people calling the shots. Those calling the shots have vast amounts of intelligence and access to all sorts of channels. They are the ones who will see a "threat" (ie, civil unrest) and decide that all those protesting can now be called "terrorists".

They will also know that there would need to be acts to support their operations against civilians. Look at what is happening in Syria, it's believed that the government just bombed their own security services to consolidate support amongst their defecting uniforms and try to sway public opinion. And this kind of thing works.

Just look at how many millions of Americans were supporting the invasion of Iraq, without the evidence for WMD's. And even after it was shown that there were none, the military kept on shooting, with the support of their people.

The government knows how to play you, and they know how to play their military.

The idea that people would suddenly wake up and realize what the game is is frankly laughable. There will be those who abandon their post when they are able to think for themselves and see what's really happening (like these generals and people like Manning) but the vast majority really couldn't give a rats ass about the constitution, the rights of their fellow Americans, the defense of their country... they care about who they are told is the enemy, and they'll go after them.



posted on Dec, 23 2011 @ 09:58 AM
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Originally posted by Reaper2137

Originally posted by vjr1113
reply to post by Reaper2137
 

lol such a drama queen lol
worst mistake of my life...
america fell because of him...
do you only have a memory limit of 4 years?
AAAAANYWAYS
someone must have written this thing, im off to find names


Drama queen? Its truth, weather a small minded person such as your self sees that or not is irrelevant. Maybe instead of bringing another poster down to make your self feel like a better person,( I feel bad for people such as your self) You should do some thing more productive with your time. (such as pulling your head out of your 4th point of contact).



What's the truth? That you think Obama is the reason this bill was passed? You do realize he has a term limit, right? What happens when he's out of office and the same trend continues with the next President? Will the next President also be the one that caused the USA to collapse?

You sound misinformed or uneducated. Probably both. Obama is just a puppet. He's doing as he is told, as he admitted to the French PM about dealing with Israel and Netanyahu. Does that absolve him of his part? Of course not, but you sound like a shill to attempt and throw all guilt upon him alone. He's part of the problem, but not the entire problem.

Perhaps that was your agenda all along. Further disinformation in an attempt to publicly criticize a temporary figurehead, meanwhile the Bush family continues what they've been doing for decades.



posted on Dec, 23 2011 @ 10:21 AM
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reply to post by Observor
 


Is it my imagination or is there a sector of the military that deals with law?



posted on Dec, 23 2011 @ 10:29 AM
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reply to post by yourignoranceisbliss
 


Well, he certainly is a puppet I would say, but we are hearing reports that he doesn't take advice from his advisors or cabinet, he only meets with Jarrett and Axelrod. These are the people who give him his orders it seems. He has pulled against many traditional positions that even Bill Clinton didn't. He does have his own ideas, or at least he is trying to convince Americans he is a strong President with his own views. From what I have seen and read, he seems to be the most radical, the most Marxist, the most socialist person ever to hold the office of the President. I don't think he cares at all about Americans, only his ideological positions. I think everything he says on the campaign trail now is like what he did in 08, that is he says lots of things his base wants to hear.

And finally, we have seen it reported in the news that Obama did indeed demand to include US citizens in the bill. Even the sponsor of the bill said so. And a Democrat.
edit on 23-12-2011 by ThirdEyeofHorus because: (no reason given)



posted on Dec, 23 2011 @ 10:44 AM
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I thinkObama is really the first totally artificial construct that those who are running the show have managed to place before the people.....
I believe that up to now the POTUS has had some leeway in terms of lattitude for personality quirks which caused them to deviate however slightly from the teleprompted scripts.
This is now a thing of the past, and from theis presidency onward there will be no perceptable changes in the agendas already set forth......
The presidency has become a show for the people to gawp at,and the soap opera quality of the reportage will continue to be devoid of meaningful content unless the PTB wish to reveal some new twist in the tentacles of dictatorship as it spawns further inroads into the US Constitution.
I sure hope all you Promise Keepers are ready to step up and lead the nation back to its roots.
Thats where the real hope for the country rests as i see it.
Its those same people that have to convince now serving military to come to the aid of the American Republic, and its soveriegn people. God willing they are up to the task.....................
In turn i wish to add that many people around the free world are with you....the job will have to be an internationally coordinated effort to free us all from the cancerous stranglehold which has crippled progress for the good of all mankind.
These weasels are just wrinkled old fogies after all....sure its a matter of stripping them of their power and arresting them.
Common sense tells most that it needs doing.They are just reluctant to be the ones in the front line.....and who could blame them?
It will take youth and daring, and dedication beyond normal peoples ability to provide......
Promise Keepers has to access that resource, and i hope they have liaison with groups ;ike OWS.
If America really wishes to take itself back to the constitution the time has definately come the moment this bill has been signed by the traitor.
Those in the Congress and Senate who voted FOR this bill should be arrested and held indefinately as domestic terrorists......those who would tear down the lawful constitution of the USA.



posted on Dec, 23 2011 @ 11:18 AM
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reply to post by stirling
 


The version they voted for exempted US citizens from detention....I repeat, the Obama administration want sit changed to include citizens or he won't sign it. So let's hope he doesn't sign and they don't change it...then I think it will be law by default? The citizen's exempt version I mean. Hope I made sense, still groggy.



posted on Dec, 23 2011 @ 11:35 AM
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I find very interesting how this bill has been allowed to pass both house and senate during this time of the year when most American's mind are into the stupor and frenzy of the holiday season to even take the time to sit and actually understand what our corrupted government is trying to do, when a government find ways to concoct bills like the NDAA and force then into their own citizens is time for all of us Americans to star thinking if this is the type of nation that we want our children to grow up and if our dirty politicians are even worth to hold the power they have in their hands that is affecting every aspect of our nations democratic due process.

States knows that they have the power to accept or not federal bills, but as the federal government they are just as corrupted, so do not expect any state to side with the people either on this one.

Washington policraps are building a fence around them to protect themselves from us the people that elected them to begin with and I wounder why . . .



posted on Dec, 23 2011 @ 11:37 AM
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reply to post by stirling
 


Then I wonder why we are not longer able to hang traitors.
if we could it would not be any corrupted politicrap to take the job.



posted on Dec, 23 2011 @ 11:39 AM
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Sorry about the one liner but, ABOUT DAMN TIME!

-SAP-
edit on 23-12-2011 by SloAnPainful because: (no reason given)



posted on Dec, 23 2011 @ 12:40 PM
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Originally posted by Vitchilo
They should say OR ELSE we'll tell all our troops to refuse any new order from Obama.

That would be neat.



No Officer in the United States Military has to follow an order of the President.


The oath Officers take in the US Military has the sentence REMOVED that says they have to follow the orders of the President.

Only the Enlisted in the US Military have in their oath, that they will follow the orders of the President.



posted on Dec, 23 2011 @ 12:45 PM
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reply to post by Pervius
 


The president is "Commander and Chief" though. Doesn't that make him the "shot caller" of the U.S Military?

-SAP-
edit on 23-12-2011 by SloAnPainful because: (no reason given)





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