Government Motors Volt Costs Taxpayers $250,000 per Vehicle

reply to post by TheImmaculateD1

If that was happening in your home city you would have every right to complain

There is one entity to blame....Our Government...NAFTA ring a bell? I voted for Bush under the guise he would repeal it. He didn't come through with it, and it is a big cause of the Tea Party. Thank Clinton, then Bush for wavering on all of it, including the housing debacle.
I trust no one in our government, and rightly so. I watched over half of a company I worked for go to Mexico within 6 months after NAFTA. If they are not going to repal it, then they need not be voted into office.

I would love to see, in any debate, a real question, as would you repeal NAFTA? Any Hee-Hawing, stay away.
And the media wonders why people are going to Ron Paul....simple to figure out if you use your brain.

Originally posted by mugger
If they are not going to repeal it (NAFTA), then they need not be voted into office.

I would love to see, in any debate, a real question, as would you repeal NAFTA? Any Hee-Hawing, stay away.
And the media wonders why people are going to Ron Paul....simple to figure out if you use your brain.

edit on 12/28/2011 by mugger because: sp.

Be careful of what you wish for. Be very careful.

You may just get it.

reply to post by macman


The one houseifre that gutted the place was as a direct result because dude would not install a 2nd circuit breaker box and decided like a moron to run the charger into his house's breaker box which overloaded the circuit which caused the fire as you are supposed to install a second breaker box and run the charger to the second box and that line run directly to the outside line. Doing anything else will cause a fire risk.

reply to post by mugger


NAFTA is pretty well on its last legs as what we are seeing in Europe as we don't want that happening here as we retake control of our central bank at the end of next year kills NAFTA cold!

reply to post by Rad22


Thank you! Congrats on your Volt, hope it's the best car you'll ever have (Until the 2nd Gen hits obviously!, )!

It is the future! That's all there is to it!

Star for you for being based in reality and Kudos for helping us get off of the tit of oil and more praise to you is you employ only Americans in America regardless of race, political persuasion, sexual preference!

BTW, you are a 99%'r as you are not a multi millioniare!

Originally posted by Rad22
I don't really care about the particulars of the GM loan (bailout, gift, grant, bribe or whatever you want to call it)...

This is the crux of the thread and is entirely relevant to the discussion so you disregarding it shows a greater bias then what you are accusing others of having.

It is all well and good that you love your Volt but for the subsidized cost of $250,000 (if I were forced to spend it all on a car) I would opt for something other than a short life cycle, enviornmentally unsound power-sourced, tax payer-funded crap-box. A Ferrari costs $250,000, a 40 mile electric car should not. I am waiting for the General Motors $75,000 moped.

reply to post by AugustusMasonicus


There is long range plans to have it bottom at a msrp of $25,000 as the current msrp is $40,000 before tax credits!

Originally posted by TheImmaculateD1
There is long range plans to have it bottom at a msrp of $25,000 as the current msrp is $40,000 before tax credits!

Your overuse of exclamation points does nothing to negate the fact that General Motors produces a highly-subsidised piece of crap. Whether it is in its first iteration or second is irrelevant, the tax payers are footing the bill for this sad-sack car company.

reply to post by AugustusMasonicus


Go schedule a test drive and see for yourself and until you do don't talk yap on it!

reply to post by TheImmaculateD1


Then be prepared for the price increases.

I am more tha prepared for the boost in income.

Originally posted by TheImmaculateD1
Go schedule a test drive and see for yourself and until you do don't talk yap on it!

I do not need a test drive of a $250,000 subsidised, enviornmentally power source-challenged, 40 mile per charge step-up from an electric bike, marginally useful excuse for a vehicle from a car company which only avoided necessary debt restructuring (and cheated it lawful bondholders in the process) due to politcal expidency and crony capitalism. Just like I do not need to test ride a donkey to know I do not want to buy one. I will talk as much 'yap' on this garbage car and the failed entity that produced as frequently as I want, who are you, the General Motors thought police?

reply to post by AugustusMasonicus


Then you forfeit your right to complain about it! Simple as that!

Originally posted by TheImmaculateD1
Then you forfeit your right to complain about it! Simple as that!

Considering part of my tax dollars went to pay for that hunk of useless garbage and the failed company that produced it, no, I think I am actually well within my rights to complain. Just like how I can complain about my town's lousy school system (but not the neighboring towns) as I pay taxes here (and not there). It really is simple, that is why I am surprised that you continue to not get it.

reply to post by AugustusMasonicus


Failed company? What are you talking about?

reply to post by TheImmaculateD1


General Motors.

The company that 'apparently' could not restructure themselves a la Ford, Toyota in the 70's, or Honda in the 80's.

If they can't survive on their own, they will eventually fail, regardless of taxpayer input.

The government is just wasting money.

Originally posted by TheImmaculateD1
Failed company? What are you talking about?

Seriously? You can not be that oblivious to General Motor's recent history. They took United States tax payer's money to prop up their company, cheated their rightful bondholders, unjustly gave part of their company to other taxpayers and continued to produce mediocre automobiles. All of this instead of using the bankruptcy laws that were on the books designed just to prevent United States citizens from bailing out their self-created fiasco. They are no better then Goldman Sachs, Wells Fargo, Bank of America, etc.

reply to post by AugustusMasonicus


GM never threatened the nation that if they didn't get money the economy would tank.

Banks pulled underhanded tactics in order to get what they wanted.

Originally posted by TheImmaculateD1
GM never threatened the nation that if they didn't get money the economy would tank.

Banks pulled underhanded tactics in order to get what they wanted.

Who cares? They all are a bunch of vile money-grubers who should have seen the inside of a bankruptcy court for their poor business decisions, not taxpayer handouts.

Originally posted by Indigo5
Right Wing "think tank" literally funded by Koch and a dozen other oil companies..Exxon Mobile etc.

And I use the word "Think tank" very loosely since most agree the research and reporting they do would get a seventh grader tossed from school if they tried to pass it off as legitimate.

Seriously??? SO Koch, Exxon Mobile et al want to mock up numbers to crush alternate fuels?

Riiight...More BS from the greediest men on earth.

When I was in school, my evidence professor reminded us that, "if the facts are on your side, argue the facts; if the law is on your side, argue the law; and, if neither the law nor the facts are on your side, shoot the messenger."

While you can take shots at the source all you want, you will have a hard time getting by the fact that TWO independent GM "spokespeople," including their chief of governmental affairs, acknowledge the accuracy of the "simple math," and had absolutely no complaint about the calculations.

It doesn't matter whether it is a think tank or GM itself, $250,000 in subsideis per car is accurate and perhaps a bit low.

Try harder.

Deny ignorance.

jw

reply to post by Rad22

The Volt does what it was DESIGNED to do and does it flawlessly. It provides 40 miles of gasoline-free driving with great performance and comfort and has an extended range for trips of up to about 380 additional gasoline-powered miles at about 45 mpg by my calculations with my REAL-WORLD experience.
...

I guess what it boils down to is that I am sick and tired of reading all the negativity about what is a superbly engineered AMERICAN product for our current day and time. The politics have become intermingled with the product...and if I didn't know better, I'd say there might be a "conspiracy" amongst some of you to have it fail just to satisfy whatever agenda you seem to be promulgating.

I have no qualms about someone finding a vehicle or any other product to their tastes and making the best use of it.

I have a real problem with the government subsidizing your self-satisfaction at my expense.

Would you have paid the true cost of this vehicle: $263,000? Give or take a few dollars.

When I began to drive, I had a '64 Fairlane with a 260c.i.V-8. No sibsidies, no rebates, no incentives.
When I started college, I got a '73 Torino with a 350C V-8. First year of government emissions regulation, it got 17 mpg, until I ripped out all of the choking hoses and mechanics mandated by the feds. It still passed every emissions test and mileage improved 25%. Voided gov't interference, no sibsidies, no rebates, no incentive; it cost me all of $2,300, loaded. When I began private practice, I indulged myself in a BMW L7, 5.4L V-12; no rebate, no subsidies, no incentives. I only get about 11 mpg at 100mph on the highway. I still drive it, and it still meets all emissions testing.

My point is that I have no objection to anyone buying what they want, how they want and doing with it whatever they want.

You will see in my posts through this thread that I do not quarrel with the concept of an EV or hybrid or whatever fuel combo a driver wants. My theme throughout this thread is that the gov't has no business using tax dollars to make an otherwise unworkable and un-sellable idea part of the marketplace at everyone else's expense.

I hope you continue to enjoy your Volt for years to come.
Are you willing to give back our subsidy through a $257,000 donation to the charity of your choice? Maybe "Meals on Wheels" would be appropriate. Yeah; I didn't think so.

deny ignorance

jw