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Finland Launches Probe into China-Bound Missiles

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posted on Dec, 22 2011 @ 02:15 PM
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Looks like Tiawan bought them.
www.spacedaily.com...




posted on Dec, 22 2011 @ 02:21 PM
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Originally posted by earthdude
Looks like Tiawan bought them.
www.spacedaily.com...


Perhaps but:


Work under this contract will be performed at Raytheon's Integrated Air Defense Center, Andover, Mass.; El Paso, Texas; and Huntsville, Ala.


Seems to indicate that this purchase isn't related to the missiles (which were apparently undeclared) in the container ship in Finland right now....



posted on Dec, 22 2011 @ 02:24 PM
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reply to post by earthdude
 


No, that contract was just announced. That's work that will get underway later. This shipment was already long in the works. Defence contracts are not overnight transactions.

Why is it impossible to accept what has already been reported?



posted on Dec, 22 2011 @ 02:25 PM
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I am a few blocks away from one of those Raytheon facilites. Should I go over there and ask them if they were sending any missiles that got busted? I think I still have security clearance. I wonder why Taiwan got a better deal on them than us Americans did? They don't even work right anyway.



posted on Dec, 22 2011 @ 02:27 PM
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reply to post by CosmicEgg
 


Reporters have been known to lie or be mislead.



posted on Dec, 22 2011 @ 02:28 PM
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reply to post by earthdude
 


Seriously? Why would you have security clearance because you live around the corner? You must be joking. Sure. Go ask. lol Should be good for a laugh. o________o



posted on Dec, 22 2011 @ 02:34 PM
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reply to post by CosmicEgg
 


Yes, I was joking. I used to work with someone who worked with them. I never asked for top security and was astounded when I was told I had it. I could have rubbled elbows with the president. The system is at least 30 years old. Why would any country want it.



posted on Dec, 22 2011 @ 02:54 PM
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reply to post by earthdude
 


Sorry but that's the most absurd thing I've heard for a while. You don't get any security clearance without being vetted. You don't have access to info of any description, except maybe a brochure or two in the lobby. The defence industry is incredibly high stakes. No one just "gets" anything. :/

It may have been a joke but...



posted on Dec, 22 2011 @ 03:21 PM
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reply to post by earthdude
 


Well clearance is one thing access is another story. But it would be interesting to know what they think about the whole affair - after all these things have serial numbers .....

I'm sure the standard protocols apply "No comment."



posted on Dec, 22 2011 @ 04:21 PM
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reply to post by Maxmars
 

I'm really temped to go over there and ask them, as a concerned citizen. I bet the swat team would beat the hell out of me as I dialed 911.



posted on Dec, 22 2011 @ 04:24 PM
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reply to post by CosmicEgg
 

I suppose they checked me out. This was 30 years ago. I did learn some things about the Patriot system, but I don't know if they are top secret.



posted on Dec, 22 2011 @ 05:11 PM
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" The German Defense Ministry on Thursday said the confiscated Patriot missiles were being shipped to South Korea under a bilateral deal between Berlin and Seoul, CNN reported. "

Source

Two Ukrainian nationals have been taken into custody from a ship found at a port in Finland to be carrying 69 Patriot missiles and 160 tons of explosive material, the Associated Press reported on Thursday.

The men, the vessel's captain and first mate, were detained on suspicion of violating arms trade regulations in Finland, according to Detective Superintendent Timo Virtanen of the National Bureau of Investigation. "The missiles did not have the appropriate transit papers," he said.

The other 11 crew members, who are also from Ukraine, are being interviewed, Virtanen said.


Finland detains crew in mystery missile shipment

Seized patriot missiles are legal shipment, Germany says



posted on Dec, 23 2011 @ 12:37 AM
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Originally posted by SpaDe_
So, was this a back door deal from Raytheon, or is this the way we are paying off our debt? Not sure why we would willingly hand over our tech, unless it was to partially satisfy debt owed.


You may have to ask one specific board memeber who works for Raytheon.



posted on Dec, 23 2011 @ 08:08 AM
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reply to post by Daedal
 


I love how this works....

The ship had no documentation to justify the presence of US Patriot Missiles and Pyric Acid on board.

The ship had these items improperly labeled at any rate.

No one could answer any questions about how they got on board the ship..

The ship's 'destination' is clearly registered and expected at Shanghai.

.....

But CNN reports that "Germany says it's OK" and Finland is supposed to (and will?) simply shrug their shoulders and say "Oh, OK then, it must be legal because this other country 'says' that it is."

Is it really that difficult to accept what this discovery potentially indicates? And is it really that easy to present 'after-the-fact' gestures to make it seem like "there's nothing to see here... pay no attention to the man behind the curtain."

The "it was bound for South Korea" story is likely to be repeated until it is believed by the talking heads isn't it? Is this how social engineering works? Apparently so.



posted on Dec, 23 2011 @ 11:49 AM
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reply to post by CosmicEgg
 


First of all those missiles were properly packed. It was the explosives that weren't in containers as per rules that weren't packed right. Also as I pointed out in another thread they were correctly labelled as "rockets" and Finnish customs made the mistake of thinking it means fireworks rockets.

[Edit to add] Explosives meaning Nitroguanidine

edit on 23/12/2011 by PsykoOps because: (no reason given)



posted on Dec, 23 2011 @ 11:57 AM
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reply to post by PsykoOps
 


OK, tried to reply to you on the conspiracy form, but a mod shut it down right after my reply....I'll repost here


reply to post by PsykoOps


Theory (after all this is the conspiracy forum)
Drug smugglers do this type of stuff often. So why wouldn't some one smuggling arms use similar tactics?

Since they were not in a container, wouldn't that make them a bit easier to
Off load to a smaller vessel under cover of darkness
chuck overboard if there is a threat of getting caught
?


And yes....I realize its a bit off topic now since the topic was removed from conspiracy forum.
edit on 23-12-2011 by vogon42 because: (no reason given)



posted on Dec, 23 2011 @ 12:03 PM
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Yeah if you belive the misinfo of what happened. Contrary to many posts and articles the goods were legal and labelled correctly. The only problem is that they shipping company didn't request for permission to ship the missiles through our waters. That and the acknowledgement of the shipment by Germany and all other info points to a simple mishap. I doubt drug dealers would just forget to file proper paperwork



posted on Dec, 23 2011 @ 12:22 PM
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" Seoul’s Defense Ministry said Friday that there will not be any problem in safely transporting to South Korea the 69 secondhand surface-to-air missiles impounded earlier this week by Finnish authorities. "

South Korea to Receive Delayed Missile Interceptor Shipment: Defense Ministry

Source / Alternative source

South Korea on Friday indicated it would receive a delivery of 69 Patriot missiles seized by Finland this week, the Korea Herald reported.

Authorities at Finland's Kotka seaport took control of the interceptors and 160 tons of combustible material from the British-flagged vessel M/S Thor Liberty, which on Dec. 13 left Emden, Germany. The shipping vessel was expected to dock in South Korea before terminating its route in the Chinese city of Shanghai.


This part is interesting because the German Ministry said:

Source

“Those patriot guided missiles are from the Bundeswehr’s stocks and have been shipped to South Korea” according to an intergovernmental treaty, he said, declining to be named in line with government policy.

He said no explosives were part of the shipment and he didn’t have any information on that part of the impounded cargo.


The Germans acknowledge the missiles as originating from their country under the arms agreement, but doesn't know where the explosives on board came from...Hhmmm.
edit on 23-12-2011 by Daedal because: Spelling



posted on Dec, 23 2011 @ 12:40 PM
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Another interesting aspect to this story is from the original source used in the OP, in which it stated about 32 men were captured along with the impounded cargo.

Source

The customs official said that there were about 32 crew members on board the vessel, and that questioning could continue into Dec. 23.


And now according to this source their were only 13, two of which were Ukranian Nationals who were taken into custody while the 11 others were being interviewed.

Source

Two Ukrainian nationals have been taken into custody from a ship found at a port in Finland to be carrying 69 Patriot missiles and 160 tons of explosive material, the Associated Press reported on Thursday

The men, the vessel's captain and first mate, were detained on suspicion of violating arms trade regulations in Finland, according to Detective Superintendent Timo Virtanen of the National Bureau of Investigation. "The missiles did not have the appropriate transit papers," he said.

The other 11 crew members, who are also from Ukraine, are being interviewed, Virtanen said.


So we're missing some 19 crewman or Finnish authorities can't count very well...Also the explosives aboard can't be accounted for by German authorities.

China rejects links to patriot missiles in Finland


edit on 23-12-2011 by Daedal because: Added source



posted on Dec, 23 2011 @ 05:37 PM
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Here is a picture from the cargo hull. 160 tons.



There is a one kilometer safe zone around the ship and the explosives are put into containers. Captain and the other guy was relased by police but they are not allowed to leave the country.

www.hs.fi...
edit on 23-12-2011 by kankkura because: added stuff

edit on 23-12-2011 by kankkura because: added stuff


Im from Finland so i can read all our local news.
edit on 23-12-2011 by kankkura because: added stuff



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