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Attention Serious Debunkers...I need your Help

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posted on Dec, 19 2011 @ 12:00 PM
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My take on this is that a video or picture alone is not enough as they can be pictures or footage of something else or easily faked as already pointed out. Uncorroborated witness testimony is also makes for a poor case.

The only ones I consider now are ones with multiple supporting evidence. Radar with witness, witness with trace. Multiple witness cases are kind of in the middle for me. I can't think of any with photo or video with radar or trace.

JAL Flight 1628 UFO Incident Over Alaska is one that is interesting.




posted on Dec, 19 2011 @ 12:04 PM
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Hoax, hoax, hoax. Good grief!

This is from one of 10 police polaroids taken in front of witnesses. If it's a hoax, its on the part of those who built and operated it, not the cops or the witnesses.



www.ufoevidence.org...



posted on Dec, 19 2011 @ 12:18 PM
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Originally posted by xpoq47
Hoax, hoax, hoax. Good grief!

This is from one of 10 police polaroids taken in front of witnesses. If it's a hoax, its on the part of those who built and operated it, not the cops or the witnesses.



www.ufoevidence.org...





That is a seriously weird picture...

The link is broken...I would love to read that case.

These cases are great reading...I love cutting through the BS.



posted on Dec, 19 2011 @ 12:40 PM
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reply to post by whyamIhere
 


This link is identical, word for word.
www.icar1.com...



posted on Dec, 19 2011 @ 12:47 PM
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I dont know if im a serious debunker, but im most definitely a serious skeptic. I have yet to come across anything (pictures/video) that makes me go hmmmmmmmm. And witness stories....eh, I find witness testimony (regarding anything) questionable w/out some evidence to corroborate it.

I never believed the Belgium sighting anyways. The story, the photo, everything screamed fake to me.



posted on Dec, 19 2011 @ 01:00 PM
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reply to post by greeneyedleo
 




post by greeneyedleo
I never believed the Belgium sighting anyways. The story, the photo, everything screamed fake to me.

The Belgium UFO wave had more about it than a now debunked photo , multiple sightings were made and unidentified objects tracked on radar and chased by the Belgian Air Force .

Over the next hour the two scrambled F-16s attempted nine separate interceptions of the targets. On three occasions they managed to obtain a radar lock for a few seconds but each time the targets changed position and speed so rapidly that the lock was broken. During the first radar lock, the target accelerated from 240 km/h to over 1,770 km/h while changing altitude from 2,700 m to 1,500 m, then up to 3,350 m before descending to almost ground level – the first descent of more than 900 m taking less than two seconds
en.wikipedia.org...

I believe the Belgium sightings to be real , what I don't know is whether they were ET or not

General Wilfred De Brouwer Video interview
edit on 19-12-2011 by gortex because: Edit to add



posted on Dec, 19 2011 @ 01:10 PM
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Some footage shown on the show Sightings I couldn't explain, too bad that show was cancelled, I can't even find the footage from that show on youtube, it might be worth finding the dvds if they exist.

Occasionally I find a decent saucer video on youtube but it's pretty rare, I had one favorited but it was taken down.



posted on Dec, 19 2011 @ 01:11 PM
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reply to post by gortex
 


Well you make a good point



posted on Dec, 19 2011 @ 01:28 PM
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I consider the "Belgian wave" actually one of the best cases - the fact that ONE single person admitted to hoax a photo doesn't really mean anything.

The Belgian wave has anything you want:

* Observations by trained military personal, cops etc.
* Ufos recorded by aircraft/radar!
* Daylight sightings, clear structure of craft
* MANY various witnesses

Seriously...what else more could you wish? This is as much evidence as you can get.

There was a re-cap recently again in some really good UFO show (i think it was that recent History channel show)..and seeing cops and other "normal" people describing what they saw. I have no doubt there was something!



posted on Dec, 19 2011 @ 01:35 PM
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Well, it's not that the photo was debunked. It passed extensive photo analysis (not that many fakes don't), but the person who took the picture sold it for what he later thought was too little, considering the fame it received. But he was unable to prove he had faked it. He couldn't repeat the process when challenged to do so. It reminds me of the great songwriter Otis Blackwell, who sold All Shook Up and Don't Be Cruel for $200 apiece and later feft cheated when he saw how much money Elvis and RCA made from his work. Fortunately, he was later able to come up with more hit songs and get properly paid.

In the Belgium case, the general did show stills from the radar displays to the press, as you can see in some of the YouTube videos. And the Wikipedia article mentions an estimated 13,500 witnesses on the ground, 2,600 of whom filled out detailed sighting reports, in addition to the dozen or so police plus air force F-16s in pursuit.

And a very similar craft seen in Texas was confirmed by FOIA-obtained FAA radar data, prompting the local USAF base commander to back off on his claim that there were no F-16s in the air at the time after witnesses said they saw two fighters chasing the large black triangle, thanks to good work by a MUFON investigator.



posted on Dec, 19 2011 @ 02:44 PM
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Originally posted by flexy123
I consider the "Belgian wave" actually one of the best cases - the fact that ONE single person admitted to hoax a photo doesn't really mean anything.

The Belgian wave has anything you want:

* Observations by trained military personal, cops etc.
* Ufos recorded by aircraft/radar!
* Daylight sightings, clear structure of craft
* MANY various witnesses

Seriously...what else more could you wish? This is as much evidence as you can get.

There was a re-cap recently again in some really good UFO show (i think it was that recent History channel show)..and seeing cops and other "normal" people describing what they saw. I have no doubt there was something!


This is why this is such a difficult subject.

There are sightings all over Belgian.

Then one person either hoaxes something or attempts to sell their story.

It discredits the entire event...



posted on Dec, 19 2011 @ 02:47 PM
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reply to post by whyamIhere
 




post by whyamIhere
Then one person either hoaxes something or attempts to sell their story.
It discredits the entire event...

How does it discredit multiple visual sightings by witnesses including police and ground and air radar confirmation



posted on Dec, 19 2011 @ 03:09 PM
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Originally posted by gortex
reply to post by whyamIhere
 




post by whyamIhere
Then one person either hoaxes something or attempts to sell their story.
It discredits the entire event...

How does it discredit multiple visual sightings by witnesses including police and ground and air radar confirmation


It does not discredit the other evidence.

What I mean is...Any time fraud comes into the picture. It creates some doubt.

Kind of the the Rendlesham Forest case when the guy added little creatures to the story to sell his book.

It slimes the whole event (in some people's minds).

At least that is my opinion.



posted on Dec, 19 2011 @ 03:13 PM
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Kind of the the Rendlesham Forest case when the guy added little creatures to the story to sell his book.



...And the binary code stuff



posted on Dec, 19 2011 @ 03:17 PM
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I think the Rendlesham case is pretty good...other than those two items. I think in those large case with multiple witnesses you will always have scammers. Just have to filter them out



posted on Dec, 19 2011 @ 04:08 PM
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reply to post by xpoq47
 



estimated 13,500 witnesses on the ground, 2,600 of whom filled out detailed sighting reports, in addition to the dozen or so police plus air force F-16s in pursuit

And the only available photographic evidence turned out to be a fake. I mean over 10,000 witnesses and no video/photo evidence. Not a single one of them had a friggin camera in reach?



posted on Dec, 19 2011 @ 04:34 PM
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I'll pass on to you one and only one vid to watch . As much as you dislike all the screaming crap out there , this one doesn't have that . If your looking for the space craft then this vid is not for you . If your looking for your own re-confirmation that there is ET life out there then please do watch it .

It does not look anything like us humans do , and it comes from the PTB . They have left it online I believe for others to see but some of those others either passed it off because they did not see it or wrote it off completely . Give it your best intentions from an open mind , and do play it more than once from the time mark I will give to you .

I honestly suggest that you make a copy for yourself and that way you can go back to it when ever you have a hard time understanding it again . If you still cannot see it please message me and I will pin point it out , but would rather you find it within your own watching the vid clip .

From the 10:50 time mark of the top replay events clip in the link here spacevids.info...

Not sure if you want to be seated for it but that is up to you ? No big Hollywood production of the Sci Fi sort .
edit on 19-12-2011 by watchdog8110 because: (no reason given)



posted on Dec, 20 2011 @ 10:02 AM
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reply to post by watchdog8110
 


Do you have any idea what that thing is?

It seems to be under it's own power...



posted on Dec, 20 2011 @ 10:40 AM
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Originally posted by whyamIhere
reply to post by watchdog8110
 


Do you have any idea what that thing is?

It seems to be under it's own power...


Ideas yes , concrete info on the object no . It is NASA that a person has to deal with by the way . I do not suspect that they will give a reply when asked directly .

It is a bit hard to spot , since i feel that some may not be expecting something like that to be existing in 0 gravity environment . Nasa had issues with some of their equipment at the time of the mission on the ISS .

edit on 20-12-2011 by watchdog8110 because: (no reason given)



posted on Dec, 20 2011 @ 10:50 AM
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It is an alien life form non the less correct ? Like I mentioned , people are looking for the shiny space ship to legitimize the existence ETs . Sad but true . Have to smile at the de-bunkers for their lack of seriously wanting to admit to it or go near it to use their skills as de-bunkers .

edit on 20-12-2011 by watchdog8110 because: (no reason given)


Is it news worthy , hell yeah it is . Is CNN going to run with it ? Nope because they have not replied to the info sent to them .

edit on 20-12-2011 by watchdog8110 because: (no reason given)




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