"I'm disillusioned by people who are disillusioned by Obama"

reply to post by 2manyquestions

What we need is Kim Kardashians take on all of this to counter Clooneys'!

Seriously?
This is a perfect example of the mindless drone-following that is our political system.

I totally agree with Clooney's point. Republicans stick together NO MATTER WHAT! Look at who they're putting up as their nominee! Newt Gingrich. They rally behind the party NO MATTER WHAT kind of idiot he is and they sell him like he's the next coming of Christ.

Democrats are much more critical of their leaders.

Originally posted by 2manyquestions
Those who voted for Obama voted for him because he promised many things he hasn't been able to deliver.

Some of you talk as if Obama fulfilled NONE of his promises and that's just partisan blindness. I'm not saying Obama has been a great president. But to act like he's a complete failure is just disingenuous. NO president fulfills ALL his promises. But Obama has filled a lot of them.

Obama Achievements

I don't care if people like Obama or not, so I'm not disillusioned with them, I just think they're not thinking very clearly if they don't see his accomplishments. Clooney's point is that Democrats turn on their own. Republicans don't. And I think it's true. Always have.

Originally posted by Ixtab
Meh he's probably after an Oscar.
Surely no one can be that stupid?

I'm sure there are people who ARE that stupid. Hanger-ons refusing to acknowledge Obama's massive failures and lies and corruption. Refusing to acknowledge that which even Bill Clinton has reportedly acknowledged ... Obama is the worst president ever. You don't have to look far to find them. Just look around for butts sticking in the air and heads stuffed in the sand ...

And i agree with your thought that he's after an Oscar or an acting job ...
Hollywood is so far left and blind that they can't function.

reply to post by FlyersFan


Who has their head in the sand? Those who acknowledge Obama's failures AND his accomplishments? Or those who stubbornly REFUSE to acknowledge ANY of his accomplishments, trying to say that he is a COMPLETE failure and broke all his promises?

Doesn't ANYONE see both sides of an issue any more? Are you all so enamored with your team that you simply cannot see straight? Is this country so polarized that we've lost all ability to see things from another's perspective?

How sad...

Originally posted by Benevolent Heretic
Who has their head in the sand?

Apparently you do. I actually posted that before I got to page two and saw your post. I had to laugh.

those who stubbornly REFUSE to acknowledge ANY of his accomplishments,

He has none. None that are good for this country anyways.

you all so enamored with your team that you simply cannot see straight?

And what 'team' exactly am I so allegedly enamoured with? I've already stated that I highly doubt I'll bother voting because there isn't anyone running - democrat, republican, independent, libertarian, etc - who is qualified or who is worthy of being POTUS. So exactly what team am I so 'enamoured with' that I cant see straight? Don't bother trying to answer that ... you won't get it right.
BTW ... seriously ... YOU are telling others that they can't see straight due to partisanship? That's funny. Really.

How sad...

Backatchya.

Originally posted by FlyersFan
Apparently you do.

I don't see how you can say that when I have acknowledged Obama's failures and where I disagreed with him from before the 2008 election. I see both sides. I notice very few who do. Most are so polarized, they can't think objectively.

He has none. None that are good for this country anyways.

It's a matter of opinion whether his accomplishments are good for this country. Some are, some aren't. It's very sad that some can't see both sides of the coin.

And what 'team' exactly am I so allegedly enamoured with?

I didn't say you were. I asked questions and you cut off part of my sentences to make them look like statements. I'm not buying this typical GOP strategy.

BTW ... seriously ... YOU are telling others that they can't see straight due to partisanship?

That's right. I am. You are aware of exactly ONE vote from my entire life. I voted for the Democrat in that one election. I am not a Democrat and have never been. I have voted for other parties many times. I may vote for Rom Paul this election. I am not a partisan. I can see both sides. I do not belong to a team. Nothing you say will change that.

Originally posted by 2manyquestions
Maybe I'm overreacting to a silly picture with a quote from someone who's political opinions are insignificant, but that's the way I feel, especially when I see people agreeing with him.

I'm curious. What exactly did he say that you disagree with? And what is your alternate view?

I mean, I disagree that we should support whomever we elect, no matter what they do... That's common sense to me. But what else did he say that's so objectionable?

reply to post by Benevolent Heretic


I tried to think of one good thing that Obama has accomplished.. he ended the War.. but on Bush's time table... killed Osama then destroyed the evidence (I still believe it was a fabrication ..) he increased the national debt by 50% .. oh wait, that's only good for bankers sorry.. Obama care was passed.. I always enjoy tax increases.. two local hospitals are laying off 800+ people because of provisions regarding medicare and medicaid payments..

I get that some people agree with his agenda.. but personally I feel that anyone who supports any of his supposed accomplishments doesn't fully understand what they are talking about. Whether with the War(s) he started and or ended.. the Fascist monstrosity that is Obamacare, saving GM (yay more Fascism!) blah.. makes me sick.

The funny thing is .. the guy is NOT a Liberal .. every single thing he's done served a major campaign donor and corporate interest. He's a Fascist .. but people support him because he's blue. Same reason people supported Bush (also a Fascist) because he was red .. till people woke up. Then went back to sleep.

Originally posted by Rockpuck
I get that some people agree with his agenda.. but personally I feel that anyone who supports any of his supposed accomplishments doesn't fully understand what they are talking about.

So, the fact that I agree with SOME of the things he's done means I don't know what I'm talking about?

Whether with the War(s) he started and or ended..

What wars did Obama start?

Some of the stuff he did makes me sick, too. But I really wonder why people can't see things more objectively.

I know Obama's not a liberal. I tried to tell people here that in 2008... It's one thing I liked about him.

reply to post by Benevolent Heretic

So, the fact that I agree with SOME of the things he's done means I don't know what I'm talking about?

Nope, don't be so sensitive. If you support what he does, good on ya mate.. personally I was sick of Bush and this extra 4 years of Bush has been hell.

What wars did Obama start?

Bombed Libya, has had several strikes on Pakistan that resulted in our relationship deteriorating, launched military operations into Kenya and increased the war effort in Afghanistan. Not to mention the constant sabre rattling against Iran.

And lets not forget to add the SOPA legislation declaring the USA a battlefield and granting the Federal Government the right to indefinitely detain Americans.

Some of the stuff he did makes me sick, too. But I really wonder why people can't see things more objectively.

I try to be objective, and I had high hopes for that "change" we were promised .. at the very least for God's sake a change from Bush era policies of fear mongering and warring.. instead we got the same with monetary policies aimed at decimating the middle class. But it was actually when he covered all bases for a foreign oil corporation and watched from afar as the Gulf was destroyed. I thought at the very least he'd push an environmental agenda, I thought he'd at least tear BP apart .. nope .. he rolled over and did a trick for his treat like a good dog should.

reply to post by 2manyquestions


I'm a Republican, but I was thinking earlier this morning that I will probably vote for Obama in 2012. (I guess that is the ultimate evidence of his betrayal of his 2008 supporters if a Republican likes him ) Maybe Obama should run for the Republican nomination.

Seriously though, Obama delivered on healthcare reform and he delivered on Iraq and Afghanistan. There was strong opposition from Republicans on both those issues. Those are HISTORIC achievements - especially healthcare. Obamacare may be a mess, but eventually it will turn into something like Social Security or Medicare that nobody will want to give up.

I wish Obama would do something on immigration reform, because I think we need more immigrants to invigorate the economy. Also we can't have people who are Americans for all practical purposes except they don't have any official rights.

What more could Obama have delivered?

reply to post by cloudyday

Obamacare may be a mess, but eventually it will turn into something like Social Security or Medicare that nobody will want to give up.

Because those two programs are working wonders.. at least his insurance corporation donations will keep flowing. Seriously people have no idea what's even in that bill.. height of stupidity.

Can you retire on SS? No. I can't. Don't plan on it. The maximum SS payment I'll get will pay for a few nights out each month.. it's institutionalized poverty for the elderly.

What more could Obama have delivered?

How about comprehensive health care that benefited people before corporations? If he didn't at the time completely control the government it never would have stood a chance.. as it is, we are stuck with it and all the horrible effects it will have on the people.

Originally posted by Rockpuck
reply to post by cloudyday

 

Obamacare may be a mess, but eventually it will turn into something like Social Security or Medicare that nobody will want to give up.

Because those two programs are working wonders.. at least his insurance corporation donations will keep flowing. Seriously people have no idea what's even in that bill.. height of stupidity.

Can you retire on SS? No. I can't. Don't plan on it. The maximum SS payment I'll get will pay for a few nights out each month.. it's institutionalized poverty for the elderly.

What more could Obama have delivered?

How about comprehensive health care that benefited people before corporations? If he didn't at the time completely control the government it never would have stood a chance.. as it is, we are stuck with it and all the horrible effects it will have on the people.

edit on 12/18/2011 by Rockpuck because: (no reason given)

I have a different perspective. Obama committed America to universal health care - that is a historic achievement ranking him with FDR and LBJ. Obamacare is going to need drastic changes, because otherwise it will bankrupt the insurance companies, employers won't be able to afford group health coverage for their employees, etc. But eventually they will find a way to make it work. It works in other countries, so why can't it work here? The important thing is that Obama started us down the road to universal health care.

Originally posted by Benevolent Heretic
I am not a partisan.

Yeah .. okay. Keeeeeeep telling yourself that. In the mean time ... we'll review from this thread -

Originally posted by Benevolent Heretic
. Republicans stick together NO MATTER WHAT! Look at who they're putting up as their nominee! Newt Gingrich. They rally behind the party NO MATTER WHAT kind of idiot he is and they sell him like he's the next coming of Christ.
Democrats are much more critical of their leaders.

No .. that's not partisan at all.

- Newt is smarter than Obama; more quallified to be POTUS than Obama; and understands the world better than Obama, etc etc . If Newt is an Idiot .. then Obama is something far worse than an idiot. Newt isn't an idiot .. he's corrupt opportunist ... but he's no idiot.

- Republicans aren't sticking together 'NO MATER WHAT!'. The polls for the Republicans who want to be POTUS show that very well. The flavor of the week this week is Newt because Republicans want someone other than Romney who is being shoved down their throats by Carl Rove.

- Certain democrat demographics stick together - democrat- 'no matter what'.
Are you really going to deny that and try to stick that on republicans alone?
that's not partisan at all ...

- If Republicans were treating Newt like he was the 'next coming of Christ', his poll numbers would be better. You are confused. It's segments of the democrats that are treating Obama LITERALLY like he is the next coming of Christ.

Quotes by O-bots here

"Obama is, of course, greater than Jesus."-- Politiken (Danish newspaper)

"No one saw him coming, and Christians believe God comes at us from strange angles and places we don't expect, like Jesus being born in a manger."--Lawrence Carter

"Many even see in Obama a messiah-like figure, a great soul, and some affectionately call him Mahatma Obama."
-- Dinesh Sharma

"We just like to say his name. We are considering taking it as a mantra."-- Chicago] Sun-Times

"A Lightworker -- An Attuned Being with Powerful Luminosity and High-Vibration Integrity who will actually help usher in a New Way of Being"-- Mark Morford

"What Barack Obama has accomplished is the single most extraordinary event that has occurred in the 232 years of the nation’s political history"-- Jesse Jackson, Jr.

"This was the moment when the rise of the oceans began to slow and our planet began to heal."-- Barack Obama

"Does it not feel as if some special hand is guiding Obama on his journey, I mean, as he has said, the utter improbability of it all?"-- Daily Kos

"He communicates God-like energy..."-- Steve Davis (Charleston, SC)

"Not just an ordinary human being but indeed an Advanced Soul"-- Commentator @ Chicago Sun Times

"I'll do whatever he says to do. I'll collect paper cups off the ground to make his pathway clear."-- Halle Berry

"A quantum leap in American consciousness"-- Deepak Chopra

"He is not operating on the same plane as ordinary politicians. . . . the agent of transformation in an age of revolution, as a figure uniquely qualified to open the door to the 21st century." - Gary Hart

"Barack Obama is our collective representation of our purest hopes, our highest visions and our deepest knowings . . . He's our product out of the all-knowing quantum field of intelligence."-- Eve Konstantine

"This is bigger than Kennedy. . . . This is the New Testament." | "I felt this thrill going up my leg. I mean, I don't have that too often. No, seriously. It's a dramatic event." -- Chris Matthews

"[Obama is ] creative imagination which coupled with brilliance equals wisdom . . . [He is] the man for this time."
-- Toni Morrison

"Obama's finest speeches do not excite. They do not inform. They don't even really inspire. They elevate. . . . He is not the Word made flesh, but the triumph of word over flesh . . . Obama is, at his best, able to call us back to our highest selves."-- Ezra Klein

"Obama has the capacity to summon heroic forces from the spiritual depths of ordinary citizens and to unleash therefrom a symphonic chorus of unique creative acts whose common purpose is to tame the soul and alleviate the great challenges facing mankind."-- Gerald Campbell

"We're here to evolve to a higher plane . . . he is an evolved leader . . . [he] has an ear for eloquence and a Tongue dipped in the Unvarnished Truth." -- Oprah Winfrey

“I would characterize the Senate race as being a race where Obama was, let’s say, blessed and highly favored. That’s not routine. There’s something else going on. I think that Obama, his election to the Senate, was divinely ordered. . . . I know that that was God’s plan." - Bill Rush

Yeah .. democrats are soooo much more critical of their leaders and aren't treating Obama like 'the second coming of Christ' at all.

reply to post by 2manyquestions


your avatar is a horse, well for years people concerned about the slaughter of horses fought to end this practice.
the obama administration resumed the slaughter of horses for meat.
during his election campaign he made the people concerned with animal rescue and wellfare that he was their candidate, he failed.
that is one group he will not fool again.

your actions speak louder than words.

his tax cut on the social security tax means that the system will run out of money even faster, and his administration couldn't come up with a better stimulus program.

of course the election could turn out to be a choice between very bad and much worst.
in which case i'll vote for neither.

That title made me laugh. Pretty sure it would have been the first pro-Obama thread I have seen on here.

It would be pretty audacious to write anything positive about Obama.

Clooney is insulting. What a jerk.

Originally posted by citizen6511
his tax cut on the social security tax means that the system will run out of money even faster, and his administration couldn't come up with a better stimulus program.

This is a minor point, but FICA is just a tax like any other tax. They pretend that Social Security has assets and is separate from the general fund, but I believe that is just accounting.

So would we rather collect the revenues through a regressive tax like FICA that hits the working poor or through a progressive tax like income taxes that hits the high income people? Many low income people are better off financially to be unemployed and live on welfare and FICA taxes just hurt those people who want to work.

Anyway, I think people are being way too hard on Obama. I don't like some things he does, but I'm a Republican. Democrats should love him.

Originally posted by 2manyquestions
Clooney's point is that Democrats turn on their own. Republicans don't. And I think it's true. Always have.

So you're admitting that all the smears and accusations against Cain, Perry, etc were instigated byDemocrats.

reply to post by cloudyday


You do realize you are not a Conservative right? Damned Neocons..

Income taxation hurts one group only: The Middle Class. The poor end up getting back more than they pay in, and get several 1000% more in return for what taxes they do pay by collecting goods and services only rendered to low income people. The rich have a lower percentage of taxation than the Middle Class and have methods to hide income and assets the Middle Class does not.. thus their returns are several 1000% more than the Middle Class because Federal Monetary Policy usually results in high inflation resulting in huge wealth growth for the top 10% of wealth holders.

Middle Class gets #### every which way. All while paying everyone elses way.

You sir are no Conservative.. you might be a Republican, most are not really Conservative, but you're no Conservative.

Originally posted by Rockpuck
reply to post by cloudyday

 

You do realize you are not a Conservative right?

Damned Neocons..

Income taxation hurts one group only: The Middle Class. The poor end up getting back more than they pay in, and get several 1000% more in return for what taxes they do pay by collecting goods and services only rendered to low income people. The rich have a lower percentage of taxation than the Middle Class and have methods to hide income and assets the Middle Class does not.. thus their returns are several 1000% more than the Middle Class because Federal Monetary Policy usually results in high inflation resulting in huge wealth growth for the top 10% of wealth holders.

Middle Class gets #### every which way. All while paying everyone elses way.

You sir are no Conservative.. you might be a Republican, most are not really Conservative, but you're no Conservative.

You're probably right.