Who Is this Serpent Pharaoh?, page 2

reply to post by Byrd

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Do you think that what you've referred to as a leg could possibly be one of those false beards with which Paraohs were often depicted?

Originally posted by IAMTAT
reply to post by Byrd

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Do you think that what you've referred to as a leg could possibly be one of those false beards with which Paraohs were often depicted?

No, I don't. They were placed directly on the chin, and not that far back. Based on what I see in the photo, an appendage is more likely.

Although the beard IS a part of the determinative sign for 'god' in hieroglyphs and demotic writing, few of the deities are shown with beards. I don't know of any references to a serpent deity with a beard (ancient Egyptian images) and none of my books show this kind of depiction.

reply to post by Byrd

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I appreciate this, Byrd. Thank you.
The figure seems more serpent-like, as opposed to crocodilian. The appendage is somehow out of place.

reply to post by Byrd

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Look at the image of a serpent wearing both crowns (with beard) posted by ISEYEYE...7 postings down...on this thread:
www.abovetopsecret.com...

reply to post by IAMTAT

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Uhmm... okay?

That's the Kom el Shoqafa and is Roman and Hellenized Egyptian culture and dates to far later than your piece (by at least 500 years), after the culture collapsed under Greek rulers and after it was completely destroyed by Rome.

Although the family was "practicing the ancient religion" ((TourEgypt citation), the images really aren't comparable to the real Old Time Religion -- the serpents (this is one of a pair guarding a doorway) carry the caudeucus of Mercury and the staff of Dionysus. There's a lot of Roman and Greek mythology mixed in this "religious site."

If your piece is from Alexandria and is dated to 200 AD or later, then it's probably a serpent from this site (and cultural interpretation will be very muddied because this really isn't the ancient Egyptian religion here.) At Kom es Shouqa, the serpents may represent any number of things -- including simple guardians (the tombs are being guarded by Medusa and appear (to my eye) to be linked to the Dionysian Mysteries.

DISCLAIMER: I'm not an Egyptologist, nor am I an expert in Middle Eastern relics. The above is opinion only.

The problem with undated and undocumented relics -- if it's from one site (Heliopolis) then the interpretation is much different than if it's from Abydos (and is 300 years older) or from Alexandria (and is a thousand years younger than the other two.) I know the age and workshop cities of my three Bast amulets, so it's easier to put them in context and to confirm authenticity by seeing the exact same amulets (carved MUCH better, I should add) at museums.

I'm sorry that I can't be any more specific than that -- as I said, this isn't a field I've been studying in great depth for decades and I've only had my hands on a few hundred items. It'd be really cool if it was from the Alexandrian catacombs!

...and maybe one of these days I'll take a class and sign up as a shovelbum for a season in Egypt.

reply to post by Byrd

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Thank you again, Byrd...and I agree with all of your thoughts regarding the similarity of this piece to the twin serpents flanking the entrance to the Alexandria catacombs.

I get the Dionysus/Hermes cult symbolism, but I still can't help but wonder where the sculpture got the inspiration for the serpent/Pharaoh reference.

Like you, I would love to oneday join an Egyptian dig; fascinating but dangerous.
Happy Holidays, Byrd.

Originally posted by IAMTAT
reply to post by Byrd

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Thank you again, Byrd...and I agree with all of your thoughts regarding the similarity of this piece to the twin serpents flanking the entrance to the Alexandria catacombs.

I get the Dionysus/Hermes cult symbolism, but I still can't help but wonder where the sculpture got the inspiration for the serpent/Pharaoh reference.

No clue, though it may be sort of a stand-in for Wadjet (the cobra goddess who protected the divinity and royals.) I haven't seen any images of these wearing the double crown.

Like you, I would love to oneday join an Egyptian dig; fascinating but dangerous.

And happy holidays to you, too! Iset and Hathor's feast days are coming up soon (the ancient Egyptians loved a good excuse for a party!)

reply to post by Byrd

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...and lets not forget Horus' birthday on the 25th. Heckuva coincidence, that.

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