Swiss Government Declares Downloading for Personal Use Legal

Those who download are nothing less than common thieves.

Personally I wouldn't trust none of them not to not steal from my back pocket if they thought they could get away with it.

I prefer the solution used in arab countries for those that steal - cut their thieving arm right off.



Just kidding guys, don't you just hate those types of people who think like this, they are out there!

So yes, kudos to Switzerland.

reply to post by freethinker123


Dear lord man, you very nearly copped an earbashing (eyebashing?) from me hehe, until I read the last bit.

Does this apply to torrents? In that case you are not only downloading, but also uploading to others.

Anyway, is it stealing? I wouldnt steal a car, but I would probably download one, if I could..

But I also do think that creators of content deserve some compensation, too.

reply to post by Maslo


They need to find a way to add advertising to the downloads. That way they make their money and we get our free movie.

i say everyone and their mothers should download illegally. just like paying taxes, if everyones doing it, they cant do a damn thing about it. stick it to those corporate M/Fs

Originally posted by coyote66
They have the world famous "swiss army knife" although they dont posses any army. But the guys guarding Vatican are called "the swiss guard". Not to mention the also world famous Swiss banks. Dont u think they might serve the purpose being the central seat of TPTB? Just wondering.

Wow, you've got a lot of sh# wrong. Switzerland has forced conscription - meaning every Swiss citizen, with some education-based exceptions, MUST join the military at age 18 I believe. And every citizen must have their weapon for state militia use ready and maintained IN THEIR HOME, if they're of fighting age.

Switzerland is one of the gold mines of liberty left in the world. They're completely logical and liberal in their thinking. Basically a libertarian paradise, minus the exploitation of the weak. City-states have always been the most liberal, democratic, and peaceful government structures in the world. That country will never collapse. The US on the other hand...

reply to post by Rekrul


I would say the world is well on their way to achieving that already mate

Most people I know download movies/tv/music. I have even got my mother and Aunty doing it. My sister (an actress - no you've never heard of her she can't act to save her life hehe) was always anti-piracy until I started downloading episodes of her favourite shows. Now she comes downstairs to my PC and sets up the downloads herself.

Downloading is quickly becoming the most popular way to watch or listen to media.

Everybody should learn from the Swiss.

Fighting internet downloading is ridiculous, and the Swiss show us the right way.

Hopefully, every countries should follow the Swiss example.

Here in Holland they (TPTB and media companies) had this wonderful idea. If you buy blank cd's or dvd's to record at home, every disc you buy is taxed and that tax went to the media moguls as a sort of contribution just in case you making copies of commercial music or software. Even if you were using the discs to say backup your computer for safety purposes you still paid that tax.

Downloading for personal use was completely legal, only uploading was not. You were legally allowed to go to the local library, loan a music cd or other disc based media and make a copy for yourself. You were also allowed to borrow a friend's cd and copy that for yourself.

While reporting record profits they suddenly wanted to do an about turn and ban all copying while still leaving the "blank media tax" in place. In other words, they wanted to have their cake and eat it. I don't know if that tax is still in place but then I don't really copy stuff. As research shows, if you like a band you will buy the original. Downloaders buy more than people who don't.

Times change but people don't, so now they are trying to close all the download sites such as torrent sites, usenet "spotting" or linking forums etc. Some bright spark wrote a new decentralised "spotting/linking" program which cannot be shut down as there is no central server or database anymore.

Realistically.
The people who make movies, and make music make millions of dollars per year anyways, and the amount the lose from piracy is very little. Movies for example, you go see a movie in the theatre, and you pay 10 or more dollars to see it. If a million people see the movie. They just made 10 million dollars, and thats just one time each. Movies like Avatar where people would go 4 or 5 times in a week to see it over and over.

They already made their investment and enough to pay everyone their million dollar paycheques.
If i want to download a movie and save 20 dollars so i can spend that money elsewhere, then im going to.
Same with music,
Metallica came and played in my town with Coheed & Cambria and some other bands, and the tickets were 150 bucks a pop, and there were 25,000 of them. 3.75 million dollars in one night. Multiply that by 100+ shows a year and well, there you go.

Most musicians don't give a damn about people downloading their music, or else we'd have more bands flipping out like metallica back when they sued napster. When its all about money, then people give a #.

From what i understand, music isn't really about the money, most musicians play because they love to play music. Of course, thats not all of them.

And by the way, AVATAR grossed over 2 billion dollars. $2,782,275,172 to be exact. So who gives a damn if 50,000 people download the movie.. they already made their dues, and everything else is just gravy.

reply to post by Vitchilo


This is awesome and just the way it should be,I mean you can record VHS and tapes and it is ok so what is the problem- there is not one it is just the wrong laws being passed and pushed on us for all the wrong reasons.This is just what the USA needs to do !!

reply to post by patmac573


Difference with VHS and Tapes is, that the price you pay for them, a share of the money goes to the RIAA (or Gema in Germany) or whatever company, that then spreads those money across the movie actors, musicians and other people. So they get money.

It's always sad to see such news and than the lowlife pirate scumbags having a field day, celebrating "Yeah, it's not pirating, it's sharing, it's great it should be legal...# the people who work hard to make those movies and music, they don't deserve money!"
You know, it IS stealing, doesn't matter if it's for personal use only. Companies invest money to create that stuff and they want to get the money back, that's how it works and the people working for the companies want to make money so they can survive.

You pirates should ask yourself, who you would feel if you had to work without getting paid because it's "sharing" and should be legal.
And if you're too por to buy the stuff, than you don't get it. You don't need movies or music to survive, it's a luxtury. Get a job and stop pirating

I was reading up on 3d printers and stumbled into a realm of physics and engineering papers and research and according to some folks at MIT and some other engineers in their group the world should expect Star Trek style replicators within 20-30 years.

Maybe not in every home by then but at least in a working form.

What will the copyright police do then? As it is you can machine products from schematics at home that you didn't invent or pay for with computer controlled mills for under a grand.

This is what these folks should be focusing on because within our lifetime a downloaded CD is going to become pretty damn insignificant.

I imagine some sort of mandatory participation into the "cloud" will be the first line of monitoring and limiting what people replicate and I'd expect it to be circumvented about ten minutes after implementation.

This is a fight that is impossible for them to win. It's like drug prohibition without the violent enforcement......so far.


Posted Via ATS Mobile: m.abovetopsecret.com

Originally posted by eNumbra
In theory, an artist could sell a single album which could be shared 6 billion times and everyone has a copy and only one sale was ever made.

Boo freaking hoo. In what other industry does a person perform an act ONCE and then recieve money for it over the lifetime of the object?

If you are an "artist" go make your "art" to get paid.....i.e. concerts. Don't just record it and want to sit around all day and make money from it.

That's why I refuse to buy a record. But, I will go see a show.

BTW, when I listen to the radio....is that stealing the song too?

I won't sit here and defend the actions of the corporations because they overreach like all hell; but neither will I sit here and defend the countless amounts of piracy. It may not be "theft" but you are taking something for free that would otherwise have cost you money.

Recordings of your art should not cost money to begin with.

Get out and perform said art and we'll talk.

But, don't sit around doing drugs all day and want a paycheck from me because you made a song 20 years ago.

reply to post by HandyDandy


Chill out, and get over yourself.

You are not entitled to the things you think you are entitled to.

Originally posted by Xcathdra

According to the appeals court, "Music is neither recited, rendered, nor played when a recording (electronic or otherwise) is simply delivered to a potential listener." US Solicitor General Donald Verrilli agreed with the appeals ruling and that just because a song was transferred over the Internet did not mean that it was being performed, reports Reuters.

edit on 17-12-2011 by Xcathdra because: (no reason given)

edit on 17-12-2011 by Xcathdra because: (no reason given)

My thoughts exactly.

Originally posted by eNumbra
You are not entitled to the things you think you are entitled to.

Nor are "musicians". Play your music to get paid. You're the one who wanted to be in a band right?

Not "you" as in eNumbra.......the colective "you" of all the whining "artists".

I have a band and we do music and in the near future will start playing shows. If we are ever famous and I find out my music is being illegally downloaded without us getting profit, I'll hold that thought and when the times comes I would sue the snip out of every download provider.

And yes, they are fighting a useless war.
There will always be downloading unless the internet goes. Always.
IT doesn't matter what countermeasures company produces, there will always be at least one person to find a way around it and spread the love to all others. The amount the lose to piracy is tiny in comparison to the amount of money they make. Music isn't just CD sales, its concerts, advertising, it costs money to play them on radio too, and to download from itunes. iTunes itself is a money cow for them too, thats how they circumvented what could have been multiple thousands of more people downloading for free,
Dont wanna download music, use itunes then. A dollar a song is hard to pass up. As for me, i will always be a pirate of the internet sea. I am barely making it without spending money on entertainment, and im not sacrificing entertainment because i can't 'afford it'.

I've already justified it to myself, and my justification makes perfect and absolute sense, we are not criminals. Lol, far from it. For every argument against piracy, i have one countering it.

Originally posted by HandyDandy

Originally posted by eNumbra
You are not entitled to the things you think you are entitled to.

Nor are "musicians". Play your music to get paid. You're the one who wanted to be in a band right?

Not "you" as in eNumbra.......the colective "you" of all the whining "artists".

edit on 17-12-2011 by HandyDandy because: (no reason given)

Wait a second. Was it you who invested emotions and thought to produce the song's worth?

That's what I thought. If you want the song, you pay me or the record label.