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Man-made Pandemic Spreading? ...Bioterrorism: What They Don't Want You to Know.

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posted on Dec, 18 2011 @ 09:22 AM

Originally posted by soficrow
[...] we're entering a time when decisions about who lives or dies will be made without any public input or participation.

Mmm yes I agree with what you said.

To continue the hunt: Yes 1840 is when the hollow needle and also opium came online.

The next major link in the chain would be Jacobson v. Mass, 1905 from the hugely powerful "Fuller Court"


Argued December 6, 1904
Decided February 20, 1905

Full case name Henning Jacobson, plaintiff in error v. Commonwealth of Massachusetts

Chief Justice: Melville Fuller
Associate Justices
John M. Harlan · David J. Brewer
Henry B. Brown · Edward D. White
Rufus W. Peckham · Joseph McKenna
Oliver W. Holmes, Jr. · William R. Day
Case opinions
Majority John Marshall Harlan for seven members

In the case of Jacobson v. Massachusetts, 197 U.S. 11 (1905), the Supreme Court of the United States on February 20, 1905, upheld the authority of states to enforce compulsory vaccination laws. The Court's decision articulated the view that the freedom of the individual must sometimes be subordinated to the common welfare and is subject to the police power of the state.

Henning Jacobson, a Swedish immigrant to the United States and a minister, lived in Cambridge, Massachusetts. During an outbreak of smallpox in 1902, he refused to comply with the town's order for all adults to be vaccinated. He claimed a vaccine had made him seriously ill as a child and had made his son and others sick as well. He was ordered to pay a $5 fine. He refused to pay and the Massachusetts courts, including the Supreme Judicial Court, rejected his arguments that the compulsory inoculation violated the state and U.S. constitutions. Jacobsen was supported by the Massachusetts Anti-Compulsory Vaccination Association. Massachusetts was one of only eleven states that had compulsory vaccination laws.[1]

Justice John Marshall Harlan wrote the decision for a 7-2 majority. He granted that the Constitution guarantees individual liberties but that the state can encroach on those liberties when "the safety of the general public may demand."[2]

The anti-vaccine movement mobilized following the decision and the Anti-Vaccination League of America was founded three years later in Philadelphia to promote the principle that "health is nature’s greatest safeguard against disease and that therefore no State has the right to demand of anyone the impairment of his or her health." The League warned about the dangers of vaccination and the dangers of allowing the intrusion of government and science into private life, part of the broader process identified with the Progressive Movement. The League asked: "We have repudiated religious tyranny; we have rejected political tyranny; shall we now submit to medical tyranny?"[3]

The Supreme Court reaffirmed its decision in Jacobson in Zucht v. King (1922), which held that a school system could refuse admission to a student who failed to receive a required vaccination.[4]

So as I have mentioned, it's via the courts, that the main screwings of humanity like war and mass death, get done. Good thread here, let's hope the good people of America listen up and understand their "freedom is subject to the police power of the state." It's all right in plain site.

posted on Dec, 18 2011 @ 10:07 AM
reply to post by undo

some people take echinacea for all manner of infections, viral or bacterial, but i can't take it. my lymph nodes swell up and burst, when i do. people with auto immune problems are not supposed to take it as it actually is an immune system stimulant. and i have some weird residual issues from a mycoplasmic infection that put me in a coma for 5 days, about 17 years ago, and it seems to have some funky immune system complication.

Interesting - and makes sense. Thanks for sharing that. ...continuing on, I grind flax seeds and oat bran in my coffee grinder, and use with psyllium husks in smoothies, to replace flour, more - many and various benefits. Also let broadleaf plantain (plantago) grow in my garden, pick with greens for smoothies; amazing stuff. Meant to experiment with drying and freezing, maybe growing indoors, but haven't yet.

posted on Dec, 18 2011 @ 01:14 PM
Topical here...
Physicians Oppose Mandatory Flu Vaccine for Health Workers
December 18, 2011


In the age of “evidence-based medicine,” AAPS notes that there is surprisingly little evidence supporting the efficacy of influenza vaccine, and evidence of safety is also scant. According to a 2006 article in the British Medical Journal by Tom Jefferson the coordinator of the vaccines section of the Cochrane Collaboration, safety data are reported in only five randomized studies with 2,963 observations. Many repeated doses of similar vaccines likely increase the risk of allergic reactions, and no data exist on the safety of a large number of doses, states Dr. Orient, citing a 2006 article in the Journal of American Physicians and Surgeons.

So here is a very simple question:

How can people say the Bill of Rights is inclusive, when the "right not to be poked with hollow needles" could not have been imagined until at least after the civil war?

Could anyone have asserted their right not to be jabbed, when they had not conceived of such thing as "the state-ordered jab"?

How did our founding fathers not forsee that someday someone would invent a hollow tube and poke it into American's bodies? Why didn't they include that simple right not to be poked, in the Constitution? Was it because they could never have imagined such a device? Or was it instead because the Bill of Rights is meant to include any and all rights not enumerated? Is the Bill of Rights meant to be a defense of the people or of the State? These are good questions to ponder.

posted on Dec, 18 2011 @ 01:18 PM
i watched contagion today lol pretty scary haha

posted on Dec, 18 2011 @ 01:43 PM

Originally posted by soficrow
reply to post by timidgal

....for so many years, many have theorized about the potential final downfall of mankind - the most common opinion being that of nuclear annihilation; however, I personally think that something like this - a biological disaster or bioterrorism - is a much greater threat. To think that this potential downfall might be the result of greed over lack of sharing information sends chills down my spine.

Chills, yes. Greed over lack of sharing; greed for profit; greed for more. Too much greed to stop creating disease because - hey! - the world is overpopulated anyway.

Excellent post about very important, albeit disconcerting, information. Even though I'll probably lose more sleep tonight, I rather lose it due to unsettling knowledge as opposed to naive ignorance.

My sentiments exactly. And thanks to you too, timidgal. Great post.

makes me wonder and or confirm the possibly that big pharma is behind the laws governing cannabis. actually it makes a lot of sense when you look at the empirical data on that plant.

Phytocannabinoid scientists unveils lozenge to treat H1N1 swine flu and H5N1 bird flu.

posted on Dec, 18 2011 @ 02:49 PM
reply to post by smallpeeps

Great links.
From a source within your source:

Influenza vaccination: policy versus evidence

The large gap between policy and what the data tell us (when rigorously assembled and evaluated) is surprising. The reasons for this situation are not clear and may be complex. ...

The optimistic and confident tone of some predictions of viral circulation and of the impact of inactivated vaccines, which are at odds with the evidence, is striking. The reasons are probably complex and may involve “a messy blend of truth conflicts and conflicts of interest making it difficult to separate factual disputes from value disputes” or a manifestation of optimism bias (an unwarranted belief in the efficacy of interventions).

Whatever the reasons, it is a sobering thought that Archie Cochrane's 1972 statement that we should use what has been tested and found to reach its objectives is as revolutionary now as it was then.

posted on Dec, 18 2011 @ 02:50 PM
On a more "political note."

The 20 Worst Wall Street Banks Funding Our Filthiest Polluters

……the three biggest offenders are JP Morgan, Citi and Bank of America. What sort of activities are these and other banks specifically financing?

One of the worst companies in the mining sector is Coal India. It is the largest coal mining company in the world in terms of production, and almost every problem connected with the industry you find in this company. That includes use of child laborers (which is against the law in India) and huge environmental problems, including underground coal fires in a heavily populated area. People are constantly confronted with carbon monoxide and huge volumes of toxic fumes.

At the same time, you have Bank of America, Citi, Morgan Stanley and Deutsche Bank who organized an IPO for Coal India. They helped craft the prospectus for the IPO, which in 500 pages doesn't mention the word "environment"…..

posted on Dec, 19 2011 @ 09:57 AM
There is no doubt polluting industries create disease agents, as do common contaminants, additives and more in our food and consumer products. These agents initiate an outward-spreading spiral that starts with protein molecules, moves on to cells and microbes, then tissues, organs, systems and larger organisms.

It would be interesting to identify the culprits at the top of the economic food chain. Some of the work already has been done:

* The 20 Worst Wall Street Banks Funding Our Filthiest Polluters

* Maxmars threads: Study shows powerful corporations really do control the world's finances

Why Do People Defend Unjust, Inept, and Corrupt Systems?

.......Anyone here interested in mapping the octopus?

edit on 19/12/11 by soficrow because: (no reason given)

posted on Dec, 19 2011 @ 11:20 AM
A sprinkle of stars
and an Flag Bump

Thank you again Sofi

I dont often reply to your threads, but I do read them all.

I always learn, unfortunately because of the depth of your research and facts presented, usually become worried to, but I know you are not fear mongering just bringing all things on this subject to a suitable academic, non biased (except maybe against drug companies but we all should be) and very well collated and presented OPs and for others to see.

As I cant really add to the depth of the research, or add any thing further as I agree I often pass by without contributing, but as said having learnt and become more aware, so thanks again.

What you present here is very concerning and certainly seems to have legs and truth behind it.


edit on 19-12-2011 by MischeviousElf because: spelling

posted on Dec, 19 2011 @ 08:23 PM
Dear soficrow,

I haven't read all your threads, so apologies in advance for repeating something you may have already talked about.

Have you any idea whether legal action has been tried? I'm thinking about a reckless endangerment action, or perhaps failure to obtain informed consent?

I don't know if vaccines have received special proection against these kind of claims, but it might be fun to look into.

With respect,

posted on Dec, 19 2011 @ 09:05 PM
reply to post by Chamberf=6

Trust me on this I am not picking a fight, I just want to say that soficrow is an outstanding member, and has been for some time. Bad members who post garbage do not stick around as long as sofi.

When it comes to trusting sources I trust sofi. Could this lead to a disaster sometime? Possibly, but sofi is usually quick with sources.

I understand what you are talking about and asking for though, but people are not going to be long standing members if they are not good members.

On topic thanks for the thread sofi.


posted on Dec, 19 2011 @ 09:21 PM
reply to post by MischeviousElf

Thanks MischeviousElf - much appreciated. Love your threads, and you too.

reply to post by charles1952

Originally posted by charles1952
Dear soficrow,

I haven't read all your threads, so apologies in advance for repeating something you may have already talked about.

No need to apologize - or read all past threads. Sorry if I seem prickly at times about that.

Have you any idea whether legal action has been tried? I'm thinking about a reckless endangerment action, or perhaps failure to obtain informed consent?

The legal game seems to require going after 1 chemical at a time, and precludes multi-factorial sources and impacts. Only the US system seems sympathetic to class action suits - at least one South American(?) community sued an American company in a US court for offshore breaches. ...India stood up against Monsanto - Africa is standing up against some other corporation. As I recall, a number of suits have gone to the international court in the Hague. I suspect the whole "Green Revolution - Global Warming" scare was a backdoor to deal with these same issue from a different perspective (effect on climate instead of health impacts). Problem is, all the fights are isolated and piecemeal - while global development and corporate colonization is coordinated.

...One of the reasons the Occupy movement has so much global momentum is because of these issues - it could be focused and directed, but I'm not sure that wouldn't kill the movement.

...Governments often run interference to protect polluters etc. - to protect jobs and revenue streams. It's a catch-22 - jobs or health.

If we take the OP analysis as accurate, then it opens up several new cans of worms - and any coordinated public response would, of necessity, have to re-design the global economy. (I think.)

...This is the analysis I would like to see ATS pick up on: if the analysis is correct, then what are the larger, other implications? What next? What should we do? What can we do?

I don't know if vaccines have received special proection against these kind of claims, but it might be fun to look into.

TOTALLY protected now - absolutely no liability under new contracts. ...Big Pharma tried to pull out of vaccine production - not enough money in it, too risky - so they negotiated a pile of free passes and infinite 'get out of jail' free cards. ...governments would be 100% liable for any lawsuits.

edit on 19/12/11 by soficrow because: (no reason given)

edit on 19/12/11 by soficrow because: (no reason given)

posted on Dec, 19 2011 @ 11:54 PM
Dear soficrow,

Please allow me to turn back for a moment to the opening post and the question of open access v. security.

I've just run across an article from the UK Independent that bears directly on this. Basically it's an update on the Fouchier work. Here's the link: Bioterrorism risk Some excerpts:

A deadly strain of bird flu with the potential to infect and kill millions of people has been created in a laboratory by European scientists – who now want to publish full details of how they did it.

The discovery has prompted fears within the US Government that the knowledge will fall into the hands of terrorists wanting to use it as a bio-weapon of mass destruction.

Some scientists are questioning whether the research should ever have been undertaken in a university laboratory, instead of at a military facility.

The US Government is now taking advice on whether the information is too dangerous to be published.

What makes H5N1 so dangerous, though, is that it has killed about 60 per cent of those it has infected, making it one of the most lethal known forms of influenza in modern history – a deadliness moderated only by its inability (so far) to spread easily through airborne water droplets.

Scientists are in little doubt that the newly created strain of H5N1 – resulting from just five mutations in two key genes – has the potential to cause a devastating human pandemic that could kill tens of millions of people.

The details of the study are so sensitive that they are being scrutinised by the US Government's own National Science Advisory Board for Biosecurity, which is understood to have advised American officials that key parts of the scientific paper should be redacted to prevent terrorists from using the information to reverse-engineer their own lethal strain of flu virus.

In an unprecedented move, the Biosecurity board is believed to have told the US Government that there is a serious possibility of potentially dangerous information being misused if the full genetic sequence of the mutated H5N1 virus were to be published in open scientific literature.

Ron Fouchier

The Dutch virologist started as an expert in HIV, having received his PhD from the University of Amsterdam in 1995. After research at the University of Pennsylvania School of Medicine, he began a new career in the virology department at Erasmus Medical Centre in Rotterdam, studying the molecular biology of the influenza A virus.

At a conference in Malta in September, he described his work as something that was "really, really stupid," but ultimately useful for the development of vaccines.

I am now taking suggestions. Which is more appropriate crying, or screaming?

With respect,

posted on Dec, 20 2011 @ 11:10 AM
reply to post by charles1952

You need to recognize that this sort of research is routinely conducted without fanfare or publication. We know about Fouchier and Yoshihiro Kawaoka at the University of Wisconsin only because they wanted to publish - and make their findings available to ALL flu scientists, not just those on salary with Big Pharma.

UW scientists under scrutiny over bird flu research

Starting with the virus that causes bird flu, two scientists have created a highly contagious version in the laboratory that one calls "probably one of the most dangerous viruses you can make." ...

...The two scientists--one in Europe, the other--Yoshihiro Kawaoka at the University of Wisconsin--genetically altered wild bird flu so it could easily be transmitted from person to person.


* On-salary scientists routinely create chemicals, compounds and biological products that are dangerous to public health - for industry and their corporate employers.
* Industrial corporations routinely release dangerous chemicals, compounds and biological products that threaten public health into the environment, and in consumer products.
* The only real difference is, salaried scientists are constrained by confidentiality agreements, and do not expect their work to be published to benefit the public. the focus on THIS experiment serves to deflect attention from the real dangers of routine but patented work, and routine research protected by Intellectual Property Rights - and distracts attention from the fact that factory farming has contributed greatly to H5N1 bird flu's mutation and evolution in the wild.

The real message is: anything goes, as long as scientific information is not published for Open Access, or available to scientists with financially competitive affiliations. Threats from bioterrorism and accidental release have dick-all to do with the real agenda here.

A recent thread highlights another aspect and contributing factor: radiation exposure. Note that radiation fatalities are only the tip of the iceberg - exposure to radiation causes protein mutations that in turn cause debilitating chronic disease in complex organisms like humans. Perhaps more importantly, viruses and microbes exposed to radiation mutate like crazy. ...and the wheels turn.

14,000 deaths in US tied to Fukushima! = More To Come!

In short, we already have a chronic disease NCD Pandemic - radiation pollution that's virtually guaranteed to have caused another major spike in chronic disease - a looming flu pandemic that's already evolving rapidly in the wild, due primarily to factory farming, and mutations now accelerating from the radiation exposure - and when it hits, the flu pandemic will probably kill off the young and healthy, leaving survivors with more disabling chronic disease triggered by non-fatal inflammation.

But all eyes are on two researchers who just wanted to share their findings with other flu scientists. ...It's just a distract and deflect PR campaign.

When the scientifically predicted and (now) unavoidable flu pandemic hits, the world has a scapegoat - and no one will blame industry, factory farming or the global corporate economic system that makes it all inevitable.

edit on 20/12/11 by soficrow because: (no reason given)

edit on 20/12/11 by soficrow because: (no reason given)

posted on Dec, 20 2011 @ 12:34 PM
It's on purpose, that stories like this are suppressed and ignored, across the board.

Yes, long range artillery and the hollow needle and opium are all weapons, but all could also be used for good. But also for bad. It's up to the people to control this power, not some church or administrator of some government agency. If we leave it to them, we're toast.

‘Accidental’ Contamination Of Vaccine With Live Avian Flu Virus Virtually Impossible

Paul Joseph Watson
Thursday, March 5, 2009

Czech newspapers are questioning if the shocking discovery of vaccines contaminated with the deadly avian flu virus which were distributed to 18 countries by the American company Baxter were part of a conspiracy to provoke a pandemic.

The claim holds weight because, according to the very laboratory protocols that are routine for vaccine makers, mixing a live virus biological weapon with vaccine material by accident is virtually impossible.

“The company that released contaminated flu virus material from a plant in Austria confirmed Friday that the experimental product contained live H5N1 avian flu viruses,” reports the Canadian Press.

Baxter flu vaccines contaminated with H5N1 – otherwise known as the human form of avian flu, one of the most deadly biological weapons on earth with a 60% kill rate – were received by labs in the Czech Republic, Germany, and Slovenia.

Initially, Baxter attempted to stonewall questions by invoking “trade secrets” and refused to reveal how the vaccines were contaminated with H5N1. After increased pressure they then claimed that pure H5N1 batches were sent by accident. This was seemingly an attempt to quickly change the story and hide the fact that the accidental contamination of a vaccine with a deadly biological agent like avian flu is virtually impossible and the only way it could have happened was by wilful gross criminal negligence.

posted on Dec, 20 2011 @ 05:04 PM
reply to post by smallpeeps

It's on purpose, that stories like this are suppressed and ignored, across the board.

....It's up to the people to control this power, not some church or administrator of some government agency. If we leave it to them, we're toast.

I tend to agree. As it stands, "science" is used for profit - and without regard for public safety. Doesn't make much sense.

posted on Dec, 20 2011 @ 06:32 PM
That the lab created the flu is scary enough, but if PANIC was not their goal, they would have kept the news out of the limelight. Openly publishing the details would all but give the instructions to bad actors as well as genuine researchers. It would also create plausible denyability that it was released by terrorists... I think this is a prelude to a false flag of epic proportions. Especially when all the gross negligent acts of world governmental bodies, financials, market activities, and pending legislation, are all taken into account.

The home remedy cure is a colloidal silver inhaled through a nebulizer, (attacks the virus directly in the upper respiratory tract) and 250-400mg of mixed harmal alkaloids. The cheapest natural source is Syrian Rue, this is 4-7 grams of the seeds, extracted twice with water, boiled down, and taken as a shot of very bitter tea. (taken early gives a mild fever, as well as mood lift, helping the body's own immune system fight it.)

posted on Dec, 20 2011 @ 07:20 PM
reply to post by eywadevotee

...this is a prelude to a false flag of epic proportions. Especially when all the gross negligent acts of world governmental bodies, financials, market activities, and pending legislation, are all taken into account.

Yep. ...BTW - the new pandemic flu's like H5N1 bird flu and H1N1 swine flu hijack the immune response, push it into overdrive and kill with a "cytokine storm." ...You need to be really careful about bumping your immune response.


Angela L. Petrosino, MPH, CHES (Northwest Ohio Consortium for Public Health)

A cytokine storm is the systemic expression of a healthy and vigorous immune system resulting in the release of more than 150 inflammatory mediators (cytokines, oxygen free radicals, and coagulation factors). Both pro-inflammatory cytokines (such as Tumor Necrosis Factor-alpha, InterLeukin-1, and InterLeukin-6) and anti-inflammatory cytokines (such as interleukin 10, and interleukin 1 receptor antagonist) are elevated in the serum, and the fierce and often lethal interplay of these cytokines is referred to as a "Cytokine Storm". The primary contributors to the cytokine storm are TNF-a (Tumor Necrosis Factor-alpha) and IL-6 (Interleukin-6). The cytokine storm is an inappropriate (exaggerated) immune response that is caused by rapidly proliferating and highly activated T-cells or natural killer (NK) cells. These cells are themselves activated by infected macrophages. The cytokine storm must be treated and suppressed or lethality can result.

posted on Dec, 21 2011 @ 01:09 PM
This is an aside, but a topical one.

The easiest way to program a soldier, to choot his fellowman, is to invoke the "contaminado" meme, inside him. As we see in the fine Hollywodd film "Resident Evil" and also "That Other Movie". The soldier who fears infection, becomes a perfect kill-crazy tool. Truth.

And I have mentioned 1840 war tech like artillery, hollow-needles, and opium.

But I have not mentioned 1990 war tech like programming child soldiers a la the fine book "Ender's Game". And of course, when a soldier is in a child state, a dissociative state, they are even more likely to follow the program. The tech of "programming" rose also with the 1990s era of web convergence, which we are participating now.

I do predict soficrow's thread here may "go viral". Hehe, in the good way I mean.

Tom Clancy game casts 99 Percent as domestic terrorists
By Stephen C. Webster
Wednesday, December 21, 2011


Developers also said they were working on incorporating moral decisions into the gameplay, where players will have to weigh the lives of the many over the few, making decisions that will influence how the story plays out.

In an example of how the game will challenge players’ ethics, another preview features a woman bound and gagged by terrorists, who accuse her husband, the player, of cashing in on numerous foreclosures. The lead terrorist threatens to “field dress” the player’s wife and child “like a deer” if they don’t cooperate. The character is then strapped with a suicide bomb vest fitted with a dead man’s switch, then transported to the Brooklyn Bridge.

In a tense segment of gameplay that follows, the player is challenged to handle the situation and avoid as many unnecessary deaths as possible, with one of the results including tossing the man into the water and letting the bomb detonate. Developers have said that the game will be chalk full of similar life-or-death decisions set in familiar urban environments.

posted on Dec, 21 2011 @ 02:44 PM
Topical here:

Genetically Modified HIV Vaccine Approved - Human Tests to Begin Shortly

Natural Society
Wed, 21 Dec 2011 13:05 CST
© Natural Society

At a further attempt to halt the spread of HIV, the United States is making a bold and extremely risky decision. Researchers from the University of Western Ontrario developed a new vaccine, and the Food and Drug Administration announced its approval on Tuesday for use in the US. Not only should you be weary of this vaccine due to negative history revolving around vaccines, but the fact that it is made with a genetically modified virus adds even more concern over its approval. While the researchers are delighted by the creation, individuals are being sought out for human trials - but you won't want to volunteer.

The researchers have been studying HIV and AIDS for 20 years and have spent the last 10 developing the vaccine. Starting in January, the vaccine will undergo three phases of human clinical trials.

Phase I - The first phase is meant to analyze the vaccine and determine if it is toxic in the human body.


To add to the potential dangers of this new vaccine, the fact that it contains a genetically modified virus simply can't be overlooked. The insurmountable evidence linking genetically modified substances with both the downfall of public health as well as the ruin of the environment shows that there is no room for extreme genetic modification in our lives. I

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