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Jesus is a Hellenistic Invention

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posted on Dec, 13 2011 @ 12:05 PM
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Jesus, the gospels etc were inventions of Greek Hellenistic authors who were in the business of creating a philosophized version of many different traditions and then syncretizing them with Greek Hellenistic ideas.


The three main groups of stories that came from this period was

Corpus Hermeticum - Syncretized with Egyptian
Chaldean Oracles - Syncretized with Persian
Q Document (Basis of Synoptic Gospels) - Syncretized with Judaic

In fact, we know who actually started the syncretism with the Judaic side...

Philo of Alexandria

In the allegory of the gospels, Jesus represents the Hellenistic concept of "The Logos".

The allegory is written in such a way to be practical to the masses, but contains a hidden message for the initiated...


edit on 13-12-2011 by HunkaHunka because: (no reason given)




posted on Dec, 13 2011 @ 12:19 PM
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reply to post by HunkaHunka
 


there is more documented proof of Jesus of nazareth than philos of rome. Great topic for discussion, however your title is of poor taste. Please reword it .



posted on Dec, 13 2011 @ 12:27 PM
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I wish you would have done some research. History says Jesus was real. History records show he was crucified. This is all historical record. Him being the son of God is what everyone questioned.
edit on 13-12-2011 by GoldenRuled because: (no reason given)



posted on Dec, 13 2011 @ 12:35 PM
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Originally posted by GoldenRuled
I wish you would have done some research. History says Jesus was real. History records show he was crucified. This is all historical record. Him being the son of God is what everyone questioned.
edit on 13-12-2011 by GoldenRuled because: (no reason given)


you should practice what you preach
history is written by the victors

example: history says the nazis were defeated
anyone with a brain and open eyes can see that is not true.

i can give you more examples if you like

the point is neither you nor i can claim events from 2k years ago were real/actually occurred or not

and as far as i know there are no roman records of the crucifixion of jesus unless you can point us to a credible source
edit on 13-12-2011 by DerepentLEstranger because: (no reason given)



posted on Dec, 13 2011 @ 12:35 PM
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reply to post by HunkaHunka
 


One question sir...

If Jesus was a creation from older systems... Show me where "love thy enemy" was used in any of those belief systems....

All other previous beliefs included war as a way to peace... not love




posted on Dec, 13 2011 @ 12:40 PM
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reply to post by Akragon
 



The Golden Rule has a long history, and a great number of prominent religious figures and philosophers have restated its reciprocal, bilateral nature in various ways (not limited to the above forms).[2] As a concept, the Golden Rule has a history that long predates the term "Golden Rule" (or "Golden law", as it was called from the 1670s).[2][5] The ethic of reciprocity was present in certain forms in the philosophies of ancient Babylon, Egypt, Persia, India, Greece, Judea, and China.[citation needed]

Statements that mirror the Golden Rule appear in Ancient Egypt in the story of The Eloquent Peasant.[6] Rushworth Kidder states that "the label 'golden' was applied by Confucius (551–479 B.C.), who wrote a version of the Silver Rule. Kidder notes that this framework appears prominently in many religions, including "Hinduism, Buddhism, Taoism, Zoroastrianism, and the rest of the world's major religions",[7] and Simon Blackburn states that the Golden Rule can be "found in some form in almost every ethical tradition".[8]


en.wikipedia.org...

as for loving the enemy perhaps previous religious teachings weren't so fixated on world domination as xtianity
godisimaginary.com...


That seems simple enough. And wouldn't you expect Jesus to love his enemies? Yes you would, unless he is a hypocrite. Therefore, what we find in Mark 16:15-16 is surprising. It shows us how Jesus treats his enemies:

He said to them, "Go into all the world and preach the good news to all creation. Whoever believes and is baptized will be saved, but whoever does not believe will be condemned [to hell].

This is "good" news? Jesus doesn't love his enemies at all. In fact, you don't even need to be an enemy -- even those who would rather not "believe in" Jesus are condemned to eternal torture in a lake of fire. This level of hypocrisy is the kind of thing you expect from a jerk. For further examples of hypocrisy and contradiction, try comparing Matthew 5:16 with Matthew 6:1, or John 14:27 with Matthew 10:34, or 2 Kings 2:11 with John 3:13, or Exodus 33:11 with John 1:18, or Mark 9:40 with Luke 11:23.


Did Jesus really say to love your enemies?evolutionofgod.net...

while i'm inclined to believing jesus was a real person most of what we "know" about him and his teachings are the result of syncretism
edit on 13-12-2011 by DerepentLEstranger because: added edit and comment



posted on Dec, 13 2011 @ 12:49 PM
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Originally posted by HunkaHunka
Jesus, the gospels etc were inventions of Greek Hellenistic authors

They may have been Hellenistic authors, and they probably wrote in Greek. But there's no way they were Greek.

The ancient Greeks were always a pagan people, and "inventing" a lone 'Son of God' would have undermined their entire history.



posted on Dec, 13 2011 @ 01:26 PM
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Originally posted by Akragon
reply to post by HunkaHunka
 


One question sir...

If Jesus was a creation from older systems... Show me where "love thy enemy" was used in any of those belief systems....



Jesus was also telling his people to love the Pagan. Pagans were usually the enemies. It was Christianity that set a war on other faiths.



posted on Dec, 13 2011 @ 01:55 PM
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Originally posted by Akragon
reply to post by HunkaHunka
 


One question sir...

If Jesus was a creation from older systems... Show me where "love thy enemy" was used in any of those belief systems....

All other previous beliefs included war as a way to peace... not love



Actually that is exactly from the Greek tradition... It is attributed to Socrates at about 400 years BCE


One should never do wrong in return, nor mistreat any man, no matter how one has been mistreated by him.


However, in the essence of full disclosure.. this "Golden Rule" emerges in practically every culture on the globe, including in North America long before it was "discovered" by western civilization
edit on 13-12-2011 by HunkaHunka because: (no reason given)



posted on Dec, 13 2011 @ 01:58 PM
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Originally posted by FOXMULDER147

Originally posted by HunkaHunka
Jesus, the gospels etc were inventions of Greek Hellenistic authors

They may have been Hellenistic authors, and they probably wrote in Greek. But there's no way they were Greek.

The ancient Greeks were always a pagan people, and "inventing" a lone 'Son of God' would have undermined their entire history.


Not at all... remember these were "syncretized". That means they took a tradition, and syncretized it with their own.

In the allegory of Jesus, he represents the Logos.

Also, you should really read up on the Greek Mystery traditions...

But again.. we are talking about Hellenistic people here... not the original Greeks which, btw were initiated into similar concepts during the Eleusinian Mysteries



posted on Dec, 13 2011 @ 02:37 PM
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reply to post by HunkaHunka
 


100% agree.

I'm always saying this, but very few people listen.....

Seneca famously said, in regard to the Jews, that "the conquered have given their laws to the conquerors". At 100 BCE to around 150 CE, the Jewish religion was exerting an inordinate degree of influence on Roman social thinking. And Seneca observed the irony in that; that the Jews - by his time - had been conquered, but their influence continued. How could this influence be countered?? Why of course, the Gnostics knew just how to do that. Usurp Judaism. Create a myth!

And so, the Hebraic scriptures were appropriated by Jewish hellenists, men like Philo and Josephus, and a new religion was created, built around the a Jewish messiah that was forsaken by the Jews.

If one actually understands the esoteric metaphysics of the New Testament, and the representation of the Jew as the enemy of Jesus - whats really being expressed is an esoteric philosophy: The Jew symbolizes what we would today call the "ego", because he looks at things from a moral perspective. Where Jesus symbolizes the divine intellect - logos - which sees beyond the form towards the Void - the Godhead.

The entire new testament is a repudiation of Hebraic philosophy, and HOW MANY PEOPLE KNOW THAT!?

edit on 13-12-2011 by dontreally because: (no reason given)



posted on Dec, 13 2011 @ 02:43 PM
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reply to post by Akragon
 


Love thy enemy is an Eastern idea that can be found in Krishnaism and Buddhism, which of course precedes Christianity...

As for the rest of the ethics Jesus teaches, that can be found in the Talmudic tractate "Pirkei Avoth", which again, precedes the composition of the Christian Gospels.



posted on Dec, 13 2011 @ 03:22 PM
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And Islam, for that matter, is the same thing.

The Arabic calendar, and the supposed "beginning of Islam" is a myth. The Umayyads were Arab-Syrian Christians, following a Monophsyite theology, in opposition to the trinitarian christianity of the Byzantium church....The Abbasid theologians of Baghdad were the ones to write to the Kuran, and the new myth of Islam.

But at bottom, the same hellenistic theme is there.


The perspective which allows the actualization of the relativity of conceptual and moral forms has always existed in Islam- witness the passage in the Quran about Moses and Al-Khidr, and also some ahadith which reduce the conditions of salvation to the simplest attitudes. This perspective is likewise that of primordiality and universality, and so of fitrah; jalal al-Din Rumi expresses it in the following terms: “I am neither Christian, Jew, Parsi nor Muslim. I am neither of the East nor of the West, nor of the land nor of the sea… I have put aside duality, I have seen that the two worlds are one; I seek the One, I know the One, I invoked the One, He is the First, He is the Last, He is the Outward, He is the Inward” - Frithjof Schuon, Understanding Islam, pg. 102

edit on 13-12-2011 by dontreally because: (no reason given)



posted on Dec, 13 2011 @ 04:18 PM
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Ooooh! Ooooh! What's the hidden message? Do you know?? Pleeeeeease please PLEEEASE tell us! I've been dying to know ever since I heard there were hidden messages in the bible....



posted on Dec, 13 2011 @ 05:12 PM
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Originally posted by 3n19m470
Ooooh! Ooooh! What's the hidden message? Do you know?? Pleeeeeease please PLEEEASE tell us! I've been dying to know ever since I heard there were hidden messages in the bible....


Uh yes... I do... all the initiates do...

I would ask you to study the gospels in tandem with the Corpus Hermeticum and then perhaps the Chaldean Oracles... all were written by people with the same goals...



posted on Dec, 13 2011 @ 05:57 PM
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Originally posted by HunkaHunka
Jesus, the gospels etc were inventions of Greek Hellenistic authors who were in the business of creating a philosophized version of many different traditions and then syncretizing them with Greek Hellenistic ideas.


The three main groups of stories that came from this period was

Corpus Hermeticum - Syncretized with Egyptian
Chaldean Oracles - Syncretized with Persian
Q Document (Basis of Synoptic Gospels) - Syncretized with Judaic

In fact, we know who actually started the syncretism with the Judaic side...

Philo of Alexandria

In the allegory of the gospels, Jesus represents the Hellenistic concept of "The Logos".

The allegory is written in such a way to be practical to the masses, but contains a hidden message for the initiated...


edit on 13-12-2011 by HunkaHunka because: (no reason given)


And in each of these cases, you are speaking of men recording actual events and impressions from God. We cannot read the Corpus Hermeticum apart from the realization that Hermes was relating the same gospel and truth of the Bible. He knew of the Son of God and the connection shared with rebirth. Why? Enoch likely built the monument to the Lord (Isaiah 19:19). There is no explanation for the Pyramids apart from divine insight. It's a pre-flood revelation of God. Joseph then comes after the flood to start the process of investigation and translation. Moses takes what was there and moves it to Jerusalem. The thread we see in the Bible is the thread we see across all the lands of the captivity. There were reasons God moved his people to each location. Nothing about the sources you notice scream anything to us other than God is sovereign.

The reason you see counterfeit models of salvation is easy to see. There are dark forces wanting to keep people in the dark. Mimicry and twisting of truth has always been the method used. Truth is mirrored in reverse.

Here is an example:

Theosophy says: Do what thou Wilt shall be the whole of the Law.

God says it this way:

Matthew 7:12

So in everything, do to others what you would have them do to you, for this sums up the Law and the Prophets.

The reflection of Biblical truth is stretched across the world by many perspectives of the same. Trade routes have much to do with this. Spotting the counterfeit is seeing the one that bears fruit for the self only. The one that bears fruit for others, in deference to God, is true. There is only one that demands the highest truth possible with the clearest evidence we can examine.




edit on 13-12-2011 by SuperiorEd because: (no reason given)



posted on Dec, 13 2011 @ 06:10 PM
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reply to post by SuperiorEd
 




Do what thou Wilt shall be the whole of the Law.


Thats actually what Thelema says; not Theosophy.



posted on Dec, 13 2011 @ 07:03 PM
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reply to post by SuperiorEd
 


Have you studied Eastern religions and philosophies? They are incredibly similar to Middle Eastern and Greco-Egyptian theologies.

This bizarre idea you have of the truth 'migrating' from region to region, doesn't account for the Krishnaism in India, or non-theistic Buddhism in Tibet and China.

The fact of the matter is probably what all the metaphysical writers on the subject have said: there is one spiritual reality, and human beings tend to interpret it along similar lines. Thus, the archetype is what's real; not the form it takes on. Jesus is just a more anthropomorphized incarnation of a traditional archetype. The dynamic is pretty much the same everywhere.

If you want to enlighten people with a profound idea, show me something revolutionary, not a slightly different shade of the same color.



posted on Dec, 13 2011 @ 09:14 PM
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Originally posted by dontreally
reply to post by Akragon
 


Love thy enemy is an Eastern idea that can be found in Krishnaism and Buddhism, which of course precedes Christianity...

Well of course he picked it up from the Far East while he was visiting there during his 'missing years' from age 12 to 30! (Maybe. I wasn't there so how should I know. How could any of us know, really. Right???)



posted on Dec, 13 2011 @ 09:39 PM
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Originally posted by dontreally
reply to post by SuperiorEd
 




Do what thou Wilt shall be the whole of the Law.


Thats actually what Thelema says; not Theosophy.



Technically correct, but Thelema and the views of Blavatsky's Theosophy were nearly indistinguishable. They are both based on the esoteric underbelly of reality. If we were comparing them to the study of programming, we would call them hackers. Their main aim is the same: figure out the code of reality to live forever and steal power.

Go back to Genesis 3 and you see the same wish from all societies that followed the fall of mankind. God wishes to give us the fruit of knowledge. We choose to take. Pride causes this passion. Remember, Satan was jealous of man in the ordering of man over Angels. We were to be free, while Angles are servants. Man has been used as a proxy against himself ever since. Satan wants to rule over man to keep himself from being ruled by man. I have news for him.




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