Greening the Sahara: A Simple Idea

reply to post by HossBog

The diagram you posted is interesting. It is basically the same as a method that is used to get fresh water out of the desert air by condensation overnight, without even including sea water in the process.

I absolutely think this process can work. As far as habitat goes, I see this as a long term process. Just by merely irrigating certain portions of the desert you will start the creation of habitat. Habitat forms naturally around conditions. If you create the conditions, habitat will follow.

Of course it would be great if one could shrewdly hasten the process by judicious planting and by careful strategizing of the process, but I have no doubt whatever that this can be done. I suspect the real imprediments to this are political rather than technical.

reply to post by HossBog


I am not dissing ideas. Nor is it my intention to say it cant be done. What I am saying is that it is not as simple as desalinating sea water. Nor is it as simple as building aquifers for the region the OP designated. It just is not. This done in conjunction with others could work as I stated before.

reply to post by HossBog


why dis the idea because the hills in the sarah move.

reply to post by Doublemint



Yes they do, in the centre. On the edges near the sea it's a lot different. "Aw but but but....."

Lets harvest some ice bergs to get the same result, eh?

reply to post by HossBog


lol the parts close to the sea aren't that bad already thats easy work

reply to post by HossBog

Oh and how does the cost compare to harvesting ice bergs? PFFFFFFFFFFF. Dude.........do you realise how much you sound like a JERK?

Well, because I am attempting to get you and the OP to understand that it is not as simple as a few minutes of a basic eureka moment that makes me a jerk? I could have been rude and put it all on the table or even said something about you being a newbee but I didn't. lets leave these snide comments out of it for now and get back to how simple it is.

Water gathered by nights in the desert are based on less arid regions than the Sahara. This region is free of plant life. It is dunes of sand that are ever changing. This is the main problem. Had the OP designated another region his plan could work but alas he did not. We are not talking about a desert like the southern west of the United States please keep this in mind. Yes there are areas around the Sahara that yours and the OPs ideas could work and maybe in the future it could be expanded further and further into the desert over a few thousand years but it remains without the wind blocks anything you do in the region stated will be lost to the desert.

Why not just sail some water there?

I'd like to form a company to corral icebergs and sail them where they are needed.

Berg harvesters, if you will.

What would be required would be a few ocean-going tugboats, some ice mining equipment, a couple of water tankers, and some detachable motors or sails.

The idea would be to find an iceberg, attach towing lines to it and begin to tow it towards wherever the water is needed, while shaping it into more manageable shapes and sizes through ice mining, creating a flat top for mounting sails and conducting mining operations.

A "shore" team would begin mining the ice and transferring it into the holds of the tankers, which when full would sail to their destinations. Once arrived, they would have three things to sell; water, ice, and a thermal gradient that could be used for heat exchangers, sort of free air conditioning and power extraction.

It would serve multiple purposes: remove hazards from sea lanes, provide a valuable precious commodity, provide scientific data through core samples, and provide a useful thermal gradient.

Any takers?

reply to post by Doublemint


And thats where you start. Move gradually inland. Don't try to green the whole thing in 1 day. It's a gradual process. Good thread OP.

reply to post by HossBog


Beat me to it by a fraction, but my idea is more developed, lol.

Think of the cool job openings for mountaineers.

Seagoing mountaineers, I like it.

Originally posted by HossBog
reply to post by Doublemint

 

And thats where you start. Move gradually inland. Don't try to green the whole thing in 1 day. It's a gradual process. Good thread OP.

right it is gradual process that one day humans should be able to walk away from and have it sutain itself not to keep humans adding water to it. to do this would require influnce in the global weather or to create a weather pattern over the sarah in away that would keep it moist. How many years do you reckon it will take of dumping water on the sand before anything changes?

where do you export the soil and sedmint to grow plants?


How many droughts does it take to reverse it on the coast?

Desalination at the coast and then pumping the fresh water inland is the only soution which may be allowed to be put into practice.

www.magharebia.com...

They will probably never allow any program which may mix saltwater with their existing supplies of fresh water.

reply to post by Doublemint


You got it.

I came upon this today...these permaculture people, Australians, turned a piece of Jordan, a desert, with very little annual rainfall, into an oasis, they had figs growing there after 4 months...the oasis was self sufficient, could look after itself after 3 years...on very little annual rainfall extract from their website..... ....*******teaching communities around them how to begin to tackle at root the massive challenges we now face after decades of short-term profit-based thinking has all but ‘consumed’ our planet and dismantled the social constructs that the human race has always depended on for its survival. Through this work we see desertification stopped in its tracks, and reversed. We see this century’s dire water issues getting resolved. We see productive work for millions in bypassing the irrelevant efforts of our ‘leaders’, to instead build a new kind of culture – a culture based on cooperative effort and learning. It’s a culture where its members have regained a sense of their place in creation, where they become land-based stewards of remaining resources; creating a culture where we at last find ultimate satisfaction – promoting and building peace and low-carbon, relocalised, community-based prosperity..................................................

Hope this helps. Guys?

Greening Jordan

Doublemint?



BTW, I do not intend to offend, but closed minds lead to closed doors. Just trying to open them.

reply to post by HossBog


The soils contents and conditions of Jordan and Australia are much different than those of the Sahara. You are attempting to skirt around the fact that the Sahara is a dune area of loose sand composed of silicon and salt in crystalline form as it was at one time an inland sea. Both Jordan and Australia have compact non shifting sands and a low salt content not to mention in Jordan not only is it along the river but they also bring water in by tanker a few times a week because the water supply is dwindling.

Again I will say the OPs plan COULD WORK but it is not as simple as stated and other things must be implemented as well, your plan included. My entire point is that it is not as simple as stated by the OP.

Now if we are building a more complete plan, COOL, lets do it but again as stated it is too simplified.

reply to post by HossBog


I'm reading your link some interesting things. Like they bring in water by tanker trucks a couple of times of week and the location of it on their map isn't that far away from the river there Idk remember the name

permacultureglobal.com...

here is a link for the map notice how it is green were it is located vs grey

permacultureglobal.com...

reply to post by Agarta


Ahhh, I see. You're expecting some guy on the internet to solve the worlds desert problems, on a public forum. You see the tankers are replaced with a solar still, as far as loose sand and high salt content, you start out with desert plants that can handle the conditions and gradually move into more profitable crops like figs and dates once the sand has started to turn into soil. We aren't going to be growing rainforest orchids straight up. And as I've stated, I'm not going to green the Sahara in 1 day. Wind breaks can be made out of anything from concrete to hesion strung between poles. You know they have roads in the desert, right? How do you think the stop the dunes from rolling over the roads? Have you guys ever lived in a desert? Didn't think so. BTW, yes I'm from Australia. We got a lot. Yes it's different from the Sahara but we have shifting dunes and the rest. Come on guys.

reply to post by Agarta


Lake Ayre covers most of the southern centre of Australia, it was once an inland sea. We have bulk salt. We have plants called Salt Bush. Helps a lot in reducing salinity. Google, dude.

To green anything in Africa, you'd have to get people to stop attacking the projects that are trying to do so.

For example in Somalia, projects like this are under massive attack all the time so that they cannot continue.

So until people are willing to send agencies with weapons to protect these projects of compassion, they are doomed to failure.

reply to post by Aeons


Already sorted bro.



Got plenty of these guys.

reply to post by HossBog


yes google and find that they are not doing this in deserts they are doing this in arid regions.