Facing Ophiuchus-

Interesting! David's theory is that the Earth used to be in perfect harmony (as in heaven on earth) 360 day orbit..a perfect cirlce. Once the great "catastrophe" happened...most likely coinciding to the "Fall from Grace", Earth then had an eliptical 365 day orbit....Not at all harmonic!

It makes perfect sense!!! Wow!

Yes, in the book he only grazes over this concept...But it seems like the best hypothesis i've ever come across, and i'm glad you agree. A very very small percentage of his book is his genuine opinion, but his opinions are always founded on his 3,000 scientific studies and articles that make up the bibliography.

Literally 95% of the book is just a layman's explanation of the hundreds of studies that he gives the reader...and only maybe 5% is really written by David. But when he does make a comment about something, it's right on the money, and all the studies compiled make one hell of a convincing argument for David's scientific/spiritual philosophy.

And i hadn't really thought about the "fall of man" being connected to this catastrophe, but I bet you're right!

I highly encourage you to read his book, once mainstream scientists are able to catch up with his theories and piece everything together as he was able to do, I have no doubt whatsoever that his book will be a great summation of what science will be like in the future.

Just for conversation...why do others see that we are fallen? What is it that makes you think something is wrong or is not as it should be, or even things in the past that you feel should of not been?


I believe the only thing that is out of its harmonic nature, is man. I dont think planets and moons need perfect circular orbits or that this world of flesh is meant to be perfect, in mans terms of what perfect is. Who is to say that all is not perfect, it what is needed, in the expression of what is, the IAM?

I think the closest understanding we can come to understanding why things are like they are...is due to what some call the 'braking of the vessels'.

When something, being, expresses of itself...a push outwardly and a stiring inwardly occurs. To be, to constantly and consistenly be being (God, IAM, what ever you wish to call Thee) there must be expression. To be is to express. To express is to manifest, create, emanate...the self. A braking of the vessels then occurs...everything that comes through the expression is a part of a greater whole of expression, everything starts to seem seperate, seperation causes many facets, then onwardly those vessels brake, express, while being, then onward and onward. The further of the braking...the less the facets know the self, the one that expressed, the one that they are of, the IAM then finds its way, see's its true nature through concious facets, through things/expressions/facets, like us. No mistakes, for the whole of the design is perfect for what is needed to be and become. No shame we should carry, for being here now, we should not feel mankind is here through any wrongs or errors.

Just for conversations sake...no right or wrongs...but I would love to hear why any of you may feel there has been a 'fall'. Is this fall something negative, something that should not of happened, that does not have its place in the design of life that this expression holds>

Love to all!!

reply to post by blazenresearcher


but what if the cycles and orders of the spheres are as they should be? surely the earth will not always have the 365 day orbit it has right now as well, dont ya think? How can we say that all planets and moons should orbit the same way?

Originally posted by LeoVirgo
Just for conversation...why do others see that we are fallen? What is it that makes you think something is wrong or is not as it should be, or even things in the past that you feel should of not been?


I believe the only thing that is out of its harmonic nature, is man. I dont think planets and moons need perfect circular orbits or that this world of flesh is meant to be perfect, in mans terms of what perfect is. Who is to say that all is not perfect, it what is needed, in the expression of what is, the IAM?

I think the closest understanding we can come to understanding why things are like they are...is due to what some call the 'braking of the vessels'.

When something, being, expresses of itself...a push outwardly and a stiring inwardly occurs. To be, to constantly and consistenly be being (God, IAM, what ever you wish to call Thee) there must be expression. To be is to express. To express is to manifest, create, emanate...the self. A braking of the vessels then occurs...everything that comes through the expression is a part of a greater whole of expression, everything starts to seem seperate, seperation causes many facets, then onwardly those vessels brake, express, while being, then onward and onward. The further of the braking...the less the facets know the self, the one that expressed, the one that they are of, the IAM then finds its way, see's its true nature through concious facets, through things/expressions/facets, like us. No mistakes, for the whole of the design is perfect for what is needed to be and become. No shame we should carry, for being here now, we should not feel mankind is here through any wrongs or errors.

very good question. and very appropriate, when we think about the mythologies that mankind has built up over the years.

right now i'm reading "the mystical qabalah" by Dion Fortune, and it is a study of the Qabalistic "Tree Of Life", a perfect example of the "breaking of the vessels".



The Tree of Life is an illustration of all divine creation, from the whole and infinite I AM to the tiny and measly human. It has at it's top, the sphere of Kether (I AM in Hebrew), which is The One, the creator. it shares no other space with anything but itself. then the energy of kether multiplies itself in order to make Chokmah and Binah, Wisdom and Understanding. Chokmah and Binah also represent positive and negative, male and female, yin and yang, kinetic energy and potential energy.

since the infinite energy of Kether divides itself, it must therefore compartmentalize part of it's consciousness in order to recognize part of itself as separate. we have to inherently believe that in order for two things to be different from each other, they must not be the same. Kether realizes that in order to further evolve it's knowing of all that is possible, it must temporarily hypnotize part of itself into believing in separation. (David Wilcock makes the point that Time is what hypnotizes us)

And this is where man has "fallen". At the top of the Tree of life is Kether, the One, the I AM. as kether's energy goes down the tree it is immediately divided, and then balanced again (In Daath), further divided, balanced, divided, balanced, then comes the manifestation of the physical world, all the way at the bottom of creation.

the lowest sphere, Malkuth or the Kingdom, is Earth. You can liken consciousness in a state of "grace" as an all-knowing consciousness, a consciousness that knows all of creation to be a whole and can be one. this "state of grace" is the sphere of Kether, the I AM, the undivided.

human consciousness has "fallen from grace" in the sense that we are forced into thinking in opposites, we've had a "veil of forgetting" that hypnotizes us into believing we are separate from everything else that is. This is because our sphere falls far behind the "first priorities" of creation. The great I AM had to sort out a whole lot of different spheres of creation before manifesting the physical world, one of these being the sense of division.

and since the earth is our mother, as long as we inhabit physical bodies incarnate on Earth ... passing through time ... we are hypnotized into separation.

i could go on and on about this subject, and it's interesting to think about our "separated" relationship to all other spheres of creation and forms of "life". (Like plants and animals, who, despite the fact that they incarnate on Earth, do not seem to be convinced that they are separate from the Earth) ((maybe it's because humans have a bicameral brain? i'm too tired to think about this but it makes me think of "the origin of consciousness in the breakdown of the bicameral mind" by Julian Jaynes.)) ... anyway there's a plethora of knowledge like this imbued in the Tree of Life, i'd recommend the work by Dion Fortune to anyone.

reply to post by metalshredmetal


I can go along with all of what you said and you put it much better then I can. The way I understand it is that a 'fall' is not something bad, negative, mistake, or error...unlike many that think of a 'fall' do look at it as a mistake, something that was not supposed to happen.

Maybe I have just become accustomed to looking at a 'fall' as a negative way to describe, what was and is, meant to be.

reply to post by metalshredmetal


Thanks...I will read it. It's on my list with about 100 other books that I want/need to read. Somedays I wish I was a professional reader! LOL...

Metal, I read your comment on the Fall of Man. Seems like you read some of the same stuff that I do....

reply to post by blazenresearcher


yes i definitely know how you feel, i'm usually reading anywhere between 2-4 books at the same time, discriminating which subject i want to read depending on my mood.

I'm about to start "the last hours of ancient sunlight" by tom hartmann. looks very promising.

are you into the esoteric stuff, blazen? I can't get enough of it. actually, the "mystical qabala" is one of the best esoteric texts that i've read in a long time, I wish i read it years ago.

Dion Fortune was in close circles with Aleister Crowley, and had her own mystery school, of which "mystical qabala" is required reading for the initiates.

and once again, "the source field investigations" resonates very much with all of the esoteric knowledges i've read, I know i'll be re-reading it for at least a year until i finally put it up on the book shelf. highly recommended.

what are you reading these days? / what's something awesome to look up?

Your my new best friend Metal! LOL I would have answered sooner, but I was out of town with no computer.

I'm reading Kabalistic Healing. Just finished with the Kybalion and yes I'm all about learning everything I can with regard to Esoteric Knowledge. I have hit the jackpot...I think... on Esotericonline.net. I could spend month's or more with all the books and papers in their library alone. I don't like reading on the computer though, so I either print it or try to find it at the used book store.

Have you seen the latest videos re: David Wilcock...I'm sure you have. Anyway, would love to chat more off this thread.

reply to post by blazenresearcher


i went to your profile page to send you this:

i was going to send you a link to a Rosicrucian esoteric text that has been online for a few years, but it must have been taken down...it was called the Temple of Objective Life Studies aka T-o-o-l-s.net
in the process of looking for the site i found these youtube videos that MUST be made by the same person who made the website i remember seeing.

I stumbled across TOOLS on lightworkers.org, it was a lot of pdf files that had almost no words at all, mostly glyphs, numerology, diagrams and different strange pictures that somehow read like a lesson, of which the person in the youtube vid does an awesome job explaining...it's very very interesting stuff, a lot of info that i've never found before i met TOOLS.

the info rings with a lot of intuitional truth, and has vast vast implications if you were to put it in correct contexts.

"activate" your "comments" section so I can pass on more goodies someday

Comments activated!

That vid was interesting to say the least. All that is....I get it, it is all numbers. Every single thing can be broken down to a number sequence...does it not make you think that we live in a literal Matrix...like the movie?

What the guy was doing in the vid though was also the Kabal or Qabal...different spellings but the same. The Force and the Form...you could see it in his drawings. The numbers seemed to get a little confusing though.

Did you look at the site I suggested? If you look around in there, you will find a lot.