FATHER,SON, AND HOLY SPIRIT.......what it means???

All three Persons of the Most-holy Trinity participated in the craetion of the world equally, as the Triune God,
One in essence and Indivisible.
The word '''God'' in this place is written in the plural ELOHIM,that is Gods(the singular is ELOAH or EL-God),
and the word ''created''(bara)-is in the singular.
In this way the original Hebrew text of the Bible, from its very first lines, points to the singular essenceof the Persons of the Holy Trinity, saying as it were,
'''''In the beggining Gods(the three Persons of the Holy Trinity) created Heaven and earth.''''''

The Psalms also clearly speak of this: By the Word of the Lord the Heavens were established, and all the might of them by the Spirit of His mouth (Ps.32: 6).
Here''''WORD '''''means the Son of God,''''Lord'''means God the Father and '''the Spirit (breath) of His mouth''''
means God the Holy Spirit.

The Son of God, Jesus Christ, is plainly called '''''Word''' in the Gospel:In the beginning was the WORD......and the WORD was God....all things were made by Him, and without Him was not anything made that was made (John 1 :1-3 )

IT is especially important for us to know this,
because the creation of the world would have been
impossible if therehad not first been the voluntary will of the Son of God to endure the sacrifice of the Cross
for the salvation of the world.

All things were created by Him(the Son of God )and
for Him: and He is before all things, and by Him all things consist: And He is the head of the body, the church: Who is the beginning,the firstborn from the dead; that in all things He might have preeminence .
For it pleased the Father, that in Him should all fullness dwell; And, having made peace through the blood of His Cross,
by Him to reconcile all things unto Himself;
by Him,whetherthey be things in earth or in Heaven(Col. 1:16 -20 )

''''''The Law of God''''''Holy Trinity Monastery Jordanville, New York .....................

The word '''God'' in this place is written in the plural ELOHIM,that is God

No where in the bible does it say that there were 3 Gods. This is the same argument that the priest of the "Holy Roman Empire" used when Constantine convened them together. He thought that Christianity would unite the empire but it drove a further division in it.

December 25 a pagan holiday, the birth of the sun God. The rays or halo that you see in paintings of Jesus was also reserved for the Sun God too. He mixed these traditions to appease the public and the priest that were making mad money.

Jesus was an extraordinary man. He was trying to stop the violence that has plagued man for centuries. The Romans used to kill for entertainment in the Coliseum. This man was trying to show people a way of life and they turned it into a religion

what's december 25th have to do with anything???


Old Calander( the true church calander)
The Julian.............is actually january the 7th..............


You dont worship the day!

you celebrate Christ's date of birth..........
Like any birth date.......(although othodox christians celebrate ''name day's''' because of their faith in the saints day ........also names are given to each babtized christian relating to a Saint.....(whom we do not worship, but intercede for us.........because of their good works on earth and their prayers we can be saved........

(this in itself is another discussion)


Sorry if im talking too much!

but we don't know when christ was born?

The Father, Son, and Holy Ghost, are 3 forms of God.

Jesus Christ, the Son of God, is also God on earth, who died to save humanity from sins.

They are the three ways we experience God: as a great Father, watching over us, as a Son who was the essence of God in human form and the holy spirit which is how god works in us (in our minds/hearts/souls).

How could the trinity create man when men created the trinity?

Originally posted by Kamikaze X
How could the trinity create man when men created the trinity?

THANK YOU!!! These people are so brainwashed it's sad. I don't know how many times I have said this on this board but I will say it again... The idea of the trintiy was put together 700 plus years after the death of christ. Why was this idea put together you ask?!?!? So the "Holy Roman Empire" wouldn't fall into civil war?!?!?

Constantine assembled the priest of the empire together because they were arguing over this same issue. Some thought that Jesus was the highest GOD while other thought that the father was the GOD. Well in order to solve the bickering of these filthy rich priest with way to much power they carefully worded the idea of the trinity as to say that Jesus was the �transcended form of God the Father� This kept everyone happy because it wasn�t saying that Jesus was GOD himself. Problem solved!!!

By the way why do you think that December 25 was supposedly the day that Jesus was born ?!?!? Well Constantine (The man that was responsible for transforming Christianity from a religion for the oppressed to what we see today) changed a lot of the pagan ideals and holidays to fit his new Christian empire. This was the birthday of the SUN GOD!!!! He was more of a good politician than anything else.

Y�all need to do some research rather than taking what other people say as truth. It�s like I�m talking to a brick wall with some of you!!! Geezz

In 325A>D........................the Julian calander was used..........therefore Constantine used the old Church Calender..........AS is Today used in the Orthodox true Church...........
Early Christianity used the julian calender.....
Gregorian Calendar (named after Pope Gregory XIII, who introduced it into the Latin Church in 1582),


Constantine's vision of the Cross led also, in his lifetime, to two further consequences, equally momentous for the later development of Christendom.

First, in 324 he decided to move the capital of the Roman Empire eastward from Italy to the shores of the Bosphorus. Here, on the site of the Greek city of Byzantium, he built a new capital, which he named after himself, 'Constantinoupolis'. The motives for this move were in part economic and political, but they were also religious: the Old Rome was too deeply stained with pagan associations to form the centre of the Christian Empire which he had in mind.
In the New Rome things were to be different: after the solemn inauguration of the city in 330, he laid down that at Constantinople no pagan rites should ever be performed. Constantine's new capital has exercised a decisive influence upon the development of Orthodox history.

Secondly, Constantine summoned the first General or Ecumenical Council of the Christian Church at Nicaea in 323. If the Roman Empire was to be a Christian Empire, then Constantine wished to see it firmly based upon the one Orthodox faith.
It was the duty of the Nicene Council to elaborate the content of that faith. Nothing could have symbolized more clearly the new relation between Church and State than the outward circumstances of the gathering at Nicaea.


more from this web .......

link below.....

orthodoxinfo.com...

orthodoxinfo.com...

Originally posted by helen670

Secondly, Constantine summoned the first General or Ecumenical Council of the Christian Church at Nicaea in 323. If the Roman Empire was to be a Christian Empire, then Constantine wished to see it firmly based upon the one Orthodox faith.
It was the duty of the Nicene Council to elaborate the content of that faith. Nothing could have symbolized more clearly the new relation between Church and State than the outward circumstances of the gathering at Nicaea.

That's baacially what I said. Why follow what a bunch of bickering old men said. A unified country is a powerful country. Plain and simple.

P.S i was a little off on my dates but I could of sworn I was right...oh well thanx helen

[Edited on 19-4-2003 by abstract_alao]

The Fathers of the early Church........

The Apostles followed the words of Lord Jesus Christ who is God .....

Father,Son and Holy Spirit............It was not a MAN made thing ...........

Throughout the Old Testament to the New Testament ........The Book '''The Bible''' is one and not alone........
Both of the Old Testament and the New Testament is WHOLE...........
Throughout the Bible there is Prophecy of The redeemer of Mankind ............Jesus Christ............

Most of my writing in here is not of my Knowledge......but that of people whom credit is due..........

www.orthodoxinfo.com...

Originally posted by helen670
The Fathers of the early Church........

The Apostles followed the words of Lord Jesus Christ who is God .....

Father,Son and Holy Spirit............It was not a MAN made thing ...........

Throughout the Old Testament to the New Testament ........The Book '''The Bible''' is one and not alone........
Both of the Old Testament and the New Testament is WHOLE...........
Throughout the Bible there is Prophecy of The redeemer of Mankind ............Jesus Christ............

Most of my writing in here is not of my Knowledge......but that of people whom credit is due..........

www.orthodoxinfo.com...

What about the books of the bible that are left out??!?!

what about um? who gives a sh i t. Jesus is still savior of all mankind and is God in human form. nothing anyone ever says will be able to wipe away that solid truth illustrated so well in the old and new testament. you think its false... fine... good for you. you will be held accountable for your belief.... as will I... because when it all comes down to it in the end i dont give a sh i t about mohammed, buddha, christianity, islam, Catholicism, or whatever the hell.. i put my full trust and care into Jesus... plain and simple. w3rd!




[Edited on 19-4-2003 by krossfyter]

God=Love

Jesus=Peace

Holy Spirit=Happines

True Peace and Happiness cannot exist without
Real Love and while this may seem on the surface
allegorical. Consider that upon a higher realm
what we call emotions, may be concrete
in every sense that we define the term

The above relationships offered in respect to biblical text.

quote from Abstract-alao/////
What about the books of the bible that are left out??!?!



The books???

All Scripture is inspired by God and profitable for teaching, for reproof, for correction, for training in righteousness; that the man of God may be adequate, equipped for every good work. (II Tim 3:16)

link for more info on the ''books that were left out!!!

orthodoxinfo.com...

21/4/03....
and would like to add.........archeology and the Bible.......link.....below.....

www.roca.org...


[Edited on 21-4-2003 by helen670]

Originally posted by helen670
quote from Abstract-alao/////
What about the books of the bible that are left out??!?!



The books???

All Scripture is inspired by God and profitable for teaching, for reproof, for correction, for training in righteousness; that the man of God may be adequate, equipped for every good work. (II Tim 3:16)

link for more info on the ''books that were left out!!!

orthodoxinfo.com...

This site says nothing about the lost boks of the bible or the lost books of edan!!! My point is that King James left them out for a reason. It would have contradicted what the beliefs were at the time

Here is a link, it may be the lost books that you are alluding to.

www.carm.org...

_____________________________________________
Be Cool
K_OS

All three Persons of the Most-holy Trinity participated in the craetion of the world equally, as the Triune God,
One in essence and Indivisible.

This is made up fantasy gods that the Bible teaches not.

The word '''God'' in this place is written in the plural ELOHIM,that is Gods(the singular is ELOAH or EL-God),
and the word ''created''(bara)-is in the singular.

The word �El� denotes someone who is a �Mighty One.�

The word �Elohim� denotes someone who is �All powerful over the situation that someone is ascribed to.� The Hebrew word �Elohim� is a homonym; it changes its meaning on the situation.

The word �Eloheynu� only seems plural because it uses Elohim as the base from which to conjugate a possessive. When we use Elohim, and wish to say �our Elohim�, we say �Eloheynu� as if conjugating a plural noun; only because that�s the form it occurs in. Conjugate a noun into a possessive from Elohim: Eloheynu. It retains plural form, but not plural meaning.

Let us now show some examples to help the reader get a better grasp of these simple and yet complicating Hebrew words.

Example #1:

1. Governor � El.
2. President of the United States of America � Elohim.
3. Ruler over the Universe � Elohim.

Conclusion: Neither �El� (Governor) nor �Elohim� (President) in this situation is �The Most High Almighty Elohim� (in other words, neither are the true God even when the titles �El� and �Elohim� are applied to them). Governor is �El� because he is a Mighty One, while the President of the United States of America is �Elohim� since he is all powerful in his situation. Who can be considered as �The Most High Almighty Elohim� is the �Ruler over the Universe.�

Example #2:

1. A crystal glass that is eight inches with the water amount only to the size of a penny � El.
2. A crystal glass that is eight inches with the water amount of � full to the top � Elohim.
3. Owner of the crystal glass and water; the glass that is eight inches with the water amount of having the water overflow out of the glass.

Conclusion: Neither �El� (the water amount only to the size of a penny) nor �Elohim� (with the water amount of � full to the top) in this situation is �The Most High Almighty Elohim� (in other words, neither are the true God even when the titles �El� and �Elohim� are applied to them). Who can be considered as �The Most High Almighty Elohim� is the �Owner of the crystal glass and water; the glass that is eight inches with the water amount of having the water overflow out of the glass.�

[font color=blue]Deuteronomy 10:17-18 For YHVH your God is God of gods and Lord of lords, the great God, mighty and awesome, who is not partial and takes no bribe, who executes justice for the orphan and the widow, and who loves the strangers, providing them food and clothing.

Joshua 22:22-23 YHVH, God of gods! YHVH, God of gods! He knows; and let Yisrael itself know! If it was in rebellion or in breach of faith toward YHVH, do not spare us today for building an altar to turn away from following YHVH; or if we did so to offer burnt offerings or grain offerings or offerings of well-being on it, may YHVH Himself take vengeance.[/font]

As we can see YHVH (Yod-Hey-Vav-Hey; four Hebrew letters for the name of the true God) is God of gods. This means no one is above YHVH, but instead everyone is below YHVH. When someone has the title �Elohim� and has a �Elohim�, this someone who has a �Elohim� is not the true God. Why? Because the true God does not have a God.

[font color=blue]Genesis 1:4 God[/font] (Elohim) [font color=blue]saw that the light was good, and God[/font] (Elohim) [font color=blue]separated between the light and the darkness.

Exodus 20:3 You shall not recognize the gods[/font] (Elohim) [font color=blue]of others in My presence.[/font]

We know that the Hebrew word �Elohim� is in plural, and the explanation why it is in plural was given up (All powerful over the situation that someone is ascribed to). We see in [font color=blue]Genesis 1:4[/font] it does not mean �Gods� but �God�, why is this? Because in Hebrew, what makes a the word �Elohim� to mean either God or gods is singular verbs and plural verbs. In [font color=blue]Genesis 1:4[/font] a singular verb was used, while in [font color=blue]Exodus 20:3[/font] a plural verb was used. In place like in poetry it works under a different function since it is poetry.

To further the correct understanding, we point to the words �shamayim� and �mayim� just for two quick examples.

Shamayim means heaven/s. How can you tell if it is �heaven� or �heavens�? There is no two ways to spell it in Hebrew, it is just �shamayim.�

Mayim means water/s. How can you tell if it is �water� or �waters�? There is no two ways to spell it in Hebrew, it is just �mayim.�

I advice those who think they are experts by reading some lexicon or by thinking they actually have learned correct understanding to answer the two above questions about �shamayim� and �mayim.�

[font color=blue]Genesis 1:1 B�reshiyt bara Elohim eth hashamayim eth harets.[/font]

For those that might want to know the difference between bara and baru; bara is singular and baru is plural. In Hebrew when we have a plural Noun like Elohim, the verb to the noun must also be in the plural. When the verb is not in the plural but the noun is, we understand the noun is to be understood as singular.

What is my point in all this? My point is that from the very beginning of the Torah we see God is singular.

In [font color=blue]Genesis 1:26-27[/font] makes it abundantly clear God cannot be a compound deity, or plural deity in any fashion.

In [font color=blue]Genesis 1:26[/font] it says �[font color=blue]vayomer Elohim na�aseh adam b�tsalmenu kidmutanu�[/font]�

Who is God talking to? Why does He say in our image, and after our likeness? We must first understand that God cannot be talking with himself, because it says �vayomer Elohim� and not �va�omrim Elohim� or any other form of the verb. God must be talking to someone else, other than a part of himself.

Before we figure out who it is He is speaking with let�s read what happened in the action of this command. God speaks, then it happens, this is what we have seen in [font color=blue]Genesis 1[/font].

In [font color=blue]Genesis 1:27[/font] it says �[font color=blue]vayivra elohim eth haadam b�tsalmo...[/font]�, did you see it? This is amazing, the action when brought about says God made man in His image, not in their image. The plural was dropped in the action, teaching us the persons He was speaking to had nothing to do with creating man. This might seem strange to you, but nonetheless it is common in English, and even more common in eastern languages, like Hebrew, Aramaic, Arabic.

If you look up US at www.dictionary.com you will see it can be used by kings a sovereign way, and by authors, meaning one person, �I�.

[font color=blue]Gen 5:1[/font] makes it that much more clear. It says, �[font color=blue]bayom baro elohim adam.[/font]� In the day God created adam. But notice �baro� means He created, but not translated here because followed by the noun Elohim. This cannot be understand as a plural deity. If so it should of told us by saying an untranslatable form �baru�, then we would understand Elohim is not just one person, but more than one.

In this way the original Hebrew text of the Bible, from its very first lines, points to the singular essenceof the Persons of the Holy Trinity, saying as it were, '''''In the beggining Gods(the three Persons of the Holy Trinity) created Heaven and earth.''''''

This is a lie. Try reading careful what I said above about Elohim, don't let peole who do not understand Hebrew Grammar deceive you. And it is not "In [the] beginning" but "In [a] beginning." It says "b�reshyt bara elohim" (In [a] beginning God created) not "barashyt bara elohim" (In [the] beginning God created).

The Psalms also clearly speak of this: By the Word of the Lord the Heavens were established, and all the might of them by the Spirit of His mouth (Ps.32: 6). Here''''WORD '''''means the Son of God,''''Lord'''means God the Father and '''the Spirit (breath) of His mouth'''' means God the Holy Spirit.

This is also a lie. The speech (logos) of God is not a person.

The Son of God, Jesus Christ, is plainly called '''''Word''' in the Gospel:In the beginning was the WORD......and the WORD was God....all things were made by Him, and without Him was not anything made that was made (John 1 :1-3 )

This is also a lie. Koine Greek: En arch hn O logos, kai O logos hn pros ton qeon, kai qeos hn O logos. Translation: In [a] beginning was the speech, and the speech was towards the God, and the speech was God. The speech of God is not a person, don't be deceived by lies that it is a person. When you speak, does a person come out of your mouth or do words come out of your mouth?

(Col. 1:16 -20 )

Read 1st Corinthians 8:6 and Hebrews 1:2, God by/through His representation created the universe. The Messiah didn't create a fly.

The Trinity teaching is based on myths, imaginations of the mind. The Messiah himself denied the existence of a Trinity: John 17:3.

John 17:3...''And this is life eternal, that they might know thee the only true God , and Jesus Christ , whom thou hast sent.

John17:4....''I have glorified thee on the earth:I have finished the work which thou gavest Me to do.

John17:5...And now, O Father, glorify thou Me with thine own self with the glory which I had with thee before the world was.

John17:6...I have manifested thy name unto the men which thou gavest Me out of the world:thine they were,and thou gavest Me; and they have kept thy word.

John17:7....Now they have known that all things whatsoever thou hast given Me are of thee.

John17:8....For I have given unto them the words which thou gavest Me;and they have received them, and have known surely that I came out from thee, and they have beleived that thou didst sent Me.

John17:9.....I pray for them: I pray not for the world , but for them which thou hast given Me;for they are thine.

John17:10...And all mine are thine , and thine are mine; and I am glorified in them.

John17:11...And now I am not in the world , but these are in the world, and I come to thee .Holy Father , keep through thine own name those whom thou hast given Me , that they may be one, as we are.

Wow, you can paste passages, I didn't know that...